2024 Rookie camp/OTA/Training camp thread.

[Koolblue13]

13 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

I was not beating on him, I was simply questioning the love showered on him by so many of our fans.  

You have an odd take and you are wrong. He's a good player, good person and has a good story, that's why people are high on him.

 

Our offense was hot trash last year and not because of personnel. Now we have Anthony Lynn building the run game, in an offense that is going to feature PAP and the run game.

 

I'd easily bet that BRob finishes the year closer to the top 10, then the bottom.

[Going Commando]

2 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I'd easily bet that BRob finishes the year closer to the top 10, then the bottom.

 

If he stays healthy, agreed.  He's been very durable, so it's a good bet.  My expectation for him is 1400 scrimmage yards, and I think he can hit 1500 in this offense too.  1500 would have been top ten among all backs and receivers last year.  Don't know what to expect for our red zone offense because Ekeler has typically been a TD culture, but I think Robinson will carry the load down the field.

 

Biadasz is a difference making A gap run blocker.  Having his consistent presence up front should be a big boon for our backs.  Couple that with Lynn and Kingsbury building around Robinson, and Jayden's run threat helping us win numbers, and BRob is set for a big season.

[Warhead36]

I just wish we could find an explosive game breaking type RB. Did you know that our last RB to break a 40+ yard run was Derrius Guice? 

[CommanderInTheRye]

You can say what you want about Forbes size, but he has one skill that just might keep him in the league for a while-- dude knows how to intercept passes!

 

Here's a video of him stealing a pass from JD5 in OTAs last week...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bb

 

 

.

[Chump Bailey]

25 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I just wish we could find an explosive game breaking type RB. Did you know that our last RB to break a 40+ yard run was Derrius Guice? 

 

I'm more than a little surprised we did not look that way in the draft at some point. We could have used just such a back I agree.

[Warhead36]

6 minutes ago, Chump Bailey said:

 

I'm more than a little surprised we did not look that way in the draft at some point. We could have used just such a back I agree.

This was an awful RB class so I can't blame them. Last couple of years had some real talent though and of course braindead Ron couldn't find one.

[Darrell Green Fan]

43 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I just wish we could find an explosive game breaking type RB. Did you know that our last RB to break a 40+ yard run was Derrius Guice? 

Again I happen to believe Eckler still has something left.  He could very well provide the explosiveness we obviously do not get from Robinson which again is why I am not that high on him.  I would expect them to continue to try to upgrade the RB position next offseason.  Rodriquez is nothing more than a bottom of the roster player, those players are easy to find or replace and I've already posted my thoughts on Robinson.  We can do better.

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

Yes that was me.  And to be clear as I had posted I am actually higher on this roster than most here.  But if you are going to die on the hill that Quan, who is totally unproven, and Forrest who has played enough for us to have a read on him, are a good starting safety tandem well I have to respectfully disagree.  

 

 

If you are down on the defense. And down on the likely bell cow RB, how high can you be on this roster compared to most?  You are certainly not as high on it as I am.

 

As far as dying on a hill for Quan.  I keep hearing that's the dude that this coaching staff is very high on among those they inherited.  Looks like a good shot he's going to be the starting FS.  And in Quinn-Whitt's scheme which typically play a lot of single high -- that FS is a key component of the defense.     

 

He played well towards the end of the season.  Coaches seem to be high on him.   I am not going on a leap that there is a good chance he's a good safety.  He was a very good college player, high pick, and played well towards the end of the season.

 

I'd add Whitt is known to be a bit of whisper for players in the secondary.  If he is high on Quan, and that's the vibe I get when I hear that the coaches are, then I gather there might be something to it.

Edited May 30 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

Nothing makes me get a feel at least in my own mind about this roster more than rooting against them like i did for the 2nd half of the season and Chris Rodriguez was a pain in the butt when he came into the game.  I was actually glad he got hurt -- considering it wasn't serious enough for surgery but bad enough to keep him out for the home stretch.

 

Even if someone doesn't want to believe it or didn't feel that way.  It's not like its some position from Mars.  He also had a good PFF score.   

 

He was top 10 in yards after contact -- top 10 in the league.  He also had almost 5 YPC.  For those here (me included) who like to watch these players college games, he was a baller in college -- tough runner, who ran over dudes.  Tone setter.  And yeah in his limited snaps he was the same guy in the NFL.

 

Looks there is a shot he might be the kick returner this year based on some camp reports so far. 

 

 

Edited May 30 by Skinsinparadise

[woodpecker]

15 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

If you are down on the defense. And down on the likely bell cow RB, how high can you be on this roster compared to most?  You are certainly not as high on it as I am.

 

As far as dying on a hill for Quan.  I keep hearing that's the dude that this coaching staff is very high on among those they inherited.  Looks like a good shot he's going to be the starting FS.  And in Quinn-Whitt's scheme which typically play a lot of single high -- that FS is a key component of the defense.     He played well towards the end of the season.  Coaches seem to be high on him.   I am not going on a leap that there is a good chance he's a good safety.  He was a very good college player, high pick, and played well towards the end of the season.

Would be nice to have one of Ron’s high draft picks actually pan out! And I agree it sounds like he will. Glad to know that you really liked him coming out of college, because I certainly don’t trust Ron’s judgment on the matter. I really hated the pick at the time, but I was still so angry about the previous pick of Forbes that I probably would’ve been pissed at anything they did at that point 😁

 

As for Chris Rodriguez… Those grades look great as a runner, but what about his receiving skills? Also, there doesn’t seem to be a grade at all for blocking. Do you see him as being adequate in those areas? Because otherwise seems like a pretty one dimensional profile.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

I just wish we could find an explosive game breaking type RB. Did you know that our last RB to break a 40+ yard run was Derrius Guice? 

 

Explosive backs in the NFL aren't what matches the hype. They're often guys with good vision, good contact balance, and just enough wiggle to force poor tackle attempts.

 

If we check the prospects scouting reports from college, a lot of the runners who have broken longer runs regularly were listed as "not a gamebreaker". Nick Chubb, Alfred Morris, Arian Foster, Derrick Henry, Maurice Jones Drew, DeMarco Murray.

 

Rarely do we see the speedster with moves actually be a more frequent game breaker than the above listed guys. Saquon Barkley is a good back, but he's not the game breaker he was hyped to be. Chris Johnson was an anomaly. The rest aren't guys who can carry a load and usually break runs from being on a stacked roster to begin with.

 

Our own Antonio Gibson was billed as a gamebreaker. But he lacked the tools the slower and less athletic guys had.

16 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Nothing makes me get a feel at least in my own mind about this roster more than rooting against them like i did for the 2nd half of the season and Chris Rodriguez was a pain in the butt when he came into the game.  I was actually glad he got hurt -- considering it wasn't serious enough for surgery but bad enough to keep him out for the home stretch.

 

Even if someone doesn't want to believe it or didn't feel that way.  It's not like its some position from Mars.  He also had a good PFF score.   

 

He was top 10 in yards after contact -- top 10 in the league.  He also had almost 5 YPC.  For those here (me included) who like to watch these players college games, he was a baller in college -- tough runner, who ran over dudes.  Tone setter.  And yeah in his limited snaps he was the same guy in the NFL.

 

Looks there is a shot he might be the kick returner this year based on some camp reports so far. 

 

 

 

He flashed for sure...but is that Fumble stat right? For some reason I thought he had more than 1. I must be misremembering then.

[Skinsinparadise]

5 minutes ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

 

 

He flashed for sure...but is that Fumble stat right? For some reason I thought he had more than 1. I must be misremembering then.

 

Don't know.  Most have fumbles as lost fumbles versus overall fumbles.  I recall he lost one against NY.  I think there was another but its escaping me.

[Conn]

54 minutes ago, woodpecker said:

As for Chris Rodriguez… Those grades look great as a runner, but what about his receiving skills? Also, there doesn’t seem to be a grade at all for blocking. Do you see him as being adequate in those areas? Because otherwise seems like a pretty one dimensional profile.

Even if that’s the case, I think having a one-dimensional (but effective) banger as your 3rd RB is perfectly fine. Especially if we’re getting ST’s value out of him. Not every player can be well-rounded, he has a role. Bringing him in fresh in the 4th quarter when you have the lead, and still having the option of a quick PA pass working off of the threat of his running ability killing the clock, is a fine option to have. 

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, woodpecker said:

Would be nice to have one of Ron’s high draft picks actually pan out! And I agree it sounds like he will. Glad to know that you really liked him coming out of college, because I certainly don’t trust Ron’s judgment on the matter. I really hated the pick at the time, but I was still so angry about the previous pick of Forbes that I probably would’ve been pissed at anything they did at that point 😁

 

As for Chris Rodriguez… Those grades look great as a runner, but what about his receiving skills? Also, there doesn’t seem to be a grade at all for blocking. Do you see him as being adequate in those areas? Because otherwise seems like a pretty one dimensional profile.

 

When on the draft thread we listed our top favs...Quan was on my guys list 2 drafts ago, one of my top 20 favorite players in that draft.

 

Illinois had him playing everywhere, FS, SS, nickle CB, outside corner.   Leader. Great tackler who plays bigger than his size.  Good blitzer.  Smart by reputation. Hard worker.  Good athlete.

 

Played well IMO at every spot aside from outside corner in college.

 

And yeah judging by Keim, Paulsen and others around the team, I got the vibe that they get the vibe that the coaching staff is very high on him.  I definitely don't get the best vibes about Forbes on that same front. But Quan at the moment, hearing just good things.

 

He didn't really start until the last 4 games.  In all of them had a 60 plus grade from PFF, mid 70s the last game.  A sack and 2 picks.

 

Look I probably crapped on Rivera's draft and off season as much as anyone.  But Quan specifically I loved.  

 

https://dailyillini.com/sports-stories/2023/04/28/former-illinois-quan-martin-selected-by-washington-commanders/

 

Along with that, Martin was a human highlight reel at the 2023 NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis. Amongst all safeties, Martin had the highest vertical jump at 44 inches, was the third fastest in the 40-yard dash, at 4.46 seconds and fastest in the 10-yard split, at 1.47 seconds.

 

 

 

https://www.commanders.com/news/illinois-dc-never-had-a-defensive-back-as-versatile-as-quan-martin

That's why Illinois defensive coordinator Aaron Henry sees Quan Martin as such a unique commodity. 

"I've never had a player like him ever," Henry said. 

It's hard to stand out in a secondary as talented as the one Illinois boasted last year. The Illini allowed the eighth fewest passing yards in college football, and three of the key players in that defensive back group -- Martin, Devon Witherspoon and Sydney Brown -- were taken in the first three rounds of the NFL draft. 

Illinois likes to say they recruit players as defensive backs and find out where they fit later. Witherspoon, cornerback, and Brown, safety, both had more established positions last year and didn't deviate from them as often. Martin, however, was moved all around Illinois defensive backfield with snaps at wide corner, slot corner and safety among several others. 

His ability to thrive at all of them is what makes him so special. 

"There's not much that he can't do," Henry said. "I've been doing this for 12 years. I have never had a defensive back as versatile as him."

 

 

Edited May 30 by Skinsinparadise

[Going Commando]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

He was top 10 in yards after contact -- top 10 in the league.  He also had almost 5 YPC.  For those here (me included) who like to watch these players college games, he was a baller in college -- tough runner, who ran over dudes.  Tone setter.  And yeah in his limited snaps he was the same guy in the NFL.

 

Looks there is a shot he might be the kick returner this year based on some camp reports so far. 

 

Is the YAC stat a rate stat, or volume?  Because I don't see how it could be volume with only 50 carries.  Kick returns would actually be a really good opportunity for him to get on the field this year, I hope he wins that job.  The problem for CRod isn't ability, but opportunity.  Bringing in Ekeler kind of kills his chances to get carries unless the 1 or 2 get hurt, and BRob in particular has been durable.  Ekeler is too good in the passing and goal line games for Rodriguez to get those touches to spell Robinson.

[woodpecker]

11 minutes ago, Conn said:

Even if that’s the case, I think having a one-dimensional (but effective) banger as your 3rd RB is perfectly fine. Especially if we’re getting ST’s value out of him. Not every player can be well-rounded, he has a role. Bringing him in fresh in the 4th quarter when you have the lead, and still having the option of a quick PA pass working off of the threat of his running ability killing the clock, is a fine option to have. 

Would be nice if we had some leads to salt away, and hopefully that’s going to start happening soon! I don’t disagree that it’s nice to have a banger for those situations. But is it the best use of the roster spot? If he’s able to contribute on special teams as well, then I’m good with it. I just have a little bit different philosophy on RBs. A lot of fans like to have a bulldozer to pair with a home run hitter speed back. Specialty backs if you will. I prefer to rotate interchangeable well rounded running backs who can run, catch, and block. I feel like it keeps the entire playbook open, regardless of who’s in the game. Either of these philosophies has its strengths and weaknesses, so contributions on special teams is probably more important than specific traits to me for an RB3.

22 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

When on the draft thread we listed our top favs...Quan was on my guys list 2 drafts ago, one of my top 20 favorite players in that draft.

 

Illinois had him playing everywhere, FS, SS, nickle CB, outside corner.   Leader. Great tackler who plays bigger than his size.  Good blitzer.  Smart by reputation. Hard worker.  Good athlete.

 

Played well IMO at every spot aside from outside corner in college.

 

And yeah judging by Keim, Paulsen and others around the team, I got the vibe that they get the vibe that the coaching staff is very high on him.  I definitely don't get the best vibes about Forbes on that same front. But Quan at the moment, hearing just good things.

 

He didn't really start until the last 4 games.  In all of them had a 60 plus grade from PFF, mid 70s the last game.  A sack and 2 picks.

 

Look I probably crapped on Rivera's draft and off season as much as anyone.  But Quan specifically I loved.  

 

https://dailyillini.com/sports-stories/2023/04/28/former-illinois-quan-martin-selected-by-washington-commanders/

 

Along with that, Martin was a human highlight reel at the 2023 NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis. Amongst all safeties, Martin had the highest vertical jump at 44 inches, was the third fastest in the 40-yard dash, at 4.46 seconds and fastest in the 10-yard split, at 1.47 seconds.

 

 

 

https://www.commanders.com/news/illinois-dc-never-had-a-defensive-back-as-versatile-as-quan-martin

That's why Illinois defensive coordinator Aaron Henry sees Quan Martin as such a unique commodity. 

"I've never had a player like him ever," Henry said. 

It's hard to stand out in a secondary as talented as the one Illinois boasted last year. The Illini allowed the eighth fewest passing yards in college football, and three of the key players in that defensive back group -- Martin, Devon Witherspoon and Sydney Brown -- were taken in the first three rounds of the NFL draft. 

Illinois likes to say they recruit players as defensive backs and find out where they fit later. Witherspoon, cornerback, and Brown, safety, both had more established positions last year and didn't deviate from them as often. Martin, however, was moved all around Illinois defensive backfield with snaps at wide corner, slot corner and safety among several others. 

His ability to thrive at all of them is what makes him so special. 

"There's not much that he can't do," Henry said. "I've been doing this for 12 years. I have never had a defensive back as versatile as him."

 

 

Thanks, as always for sharing your vast knowledge. At the end of the day if Peters and Company are on board with Quan then so am I!

[skinny21]

The thing I liked about Rodriguez spelling Robinson was the difference in how fast he hit the hole.  That’s not a knock on BRob, I dug how patient he ran last year (he looked different on that front than his rookie year in my eyes).  But that change seemed to catch defenders off guard.  And of course Rodriguez ran really aggressively.  Overall, I think the rotation was somewhat of a pain in the butt for defenders.  Barring injury, I don’t expect we’ll see much of him this year, but I could see an average of 3-5 runs a game and 1 passing target/game.

 

I seem to recall reports he looked better in pass pro than BRob, but I could be misremembering.

Edited May 30 by skinny21

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Going Commando said:

 

Is the YAC stat a rate stat, or volume?  

 

per attempt

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, woodpecker said:

 

As for Chris Rodriguez… Those grades look great as a runner, but what about his receiving skills? Also, there doesn’t seem to be a grade at all for blocking. Do you see him as being adequate in those areas? Because otherwise seems like a pretty one dimensional profile.

 

So so to below average receiving grade from PFF last year, in college he had decent hands and was a good pass protector. 

 

He's a physical back, tone setter.    I agree with those here who think Robinson will have a big season -- I also think Rodriguez is sneaky good.

 

https://www.on3.com/college/kentucky-wildcats/news/will-levis-highlights-chris-rodriguez-strength-as-blocker-multiple-ways-he-contributes/

Will Levis highlights Chris Rodriguez strength as blocker, multiple ways he contributes

Rodriguez was one of the most explosive running backs in the nation last year, named First-Team All-SEC by the Associated Press and USA Today. He enters this season as the conference’s leading returning rusher, a team captain, and ranking sixth all time in career rushing yards for the Wildcats. He has a lot of tools to his game, and Levis spoke about what he believes is his biggest strength.

 

“I’d just say his vision in the run game, I think there’s certain concepts that he can see blocks and set up blocks before they happen, and that just comes with experience and his cognitive ability to understand defenses. It’s cool to watch, just to kind of see him make moves before anyone else can even see them there,” Levis explained. “He’s not the shiftiest dude, but he just makes stuff happen, can’t really explain it, it’s cool to see.”

 

...“You see him run the ball, you know he’s physical and he’s just like that in pass protection too. It’s not fun when a guy’s coming free and he has to meet Chris in the backfield when he knows his stuff and is on it in the pass protection game,” Levis smile and said. Which he was all of last year and which we know he will be from here on out. He’s an asset for us where defenses know it’s not going to be easy to get around him and he takes pride in that for sure.”

[The Rook]

3 hours ago, woodpecker said:

As for Chris Rodriguez… Those grades look great as a runner, but what about his receiving skills? Also, there doesn’t seem to be a grade at all for blocking. Do you see him as being adequate in those areas? Because otherwise seems like a pretty one dimensional profile.

 

To be fair, it is hard to evaluate his NFL-level receiving skill when he was only targeted twice last year.

 

He did catch both of them though.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

[Skinsinparadise]

7 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

If he stays healthy, agreed.  He's been very durable, so it's a good bet.  My expectation for him is 1400 scrimmage yards, and I think he can hit 1500 in this offense too.  1500 would have been top ten among all backs and receivers last year.  Don't know what to expect for our red zone offense because Ekeler has typically been a TD culture, but I think Robinson will carry the load down the field.

 

Biadasz is a difference making A gap run blocker.  Having his consistent presence up front should be a big boon for our backs.  Couple that with Lynn and Kingsbury building around Robinson, and Jayden's run threat helping us win numbers, and BRob is set for a big season.

 

Yeah I think this will be a 4 headed monster run game -- Robinson, Daniels, Ekeler, Rodriguez.   I think the right side of the line Biadasz, Cosmi and Wylie are all above average run blockers.  And Sinnott should help too on that front from the slot.

 

I am sort of expecting if you forced me to guess a so so season on the aggregate.  Daniels being the tipping point one way or another as to how quickly he progresses.

 

But every early indication is they will pound the rock and I think we have the horses to do it.  

 

I don't expect a RO dominated offense like 2012 where Morris and RG3 went nuts in tandem on the ground.  But I do think Daniels legs will be a factor in the offense and it will be a heavy run team. 

[NoCalMike]

I don't think guys like Eckler or Wagner are any more long in the tooth than Vernon Davis was when he was signed here in what  most thought would be a mentor role for the young TE group and look how he ended up producing.  A lot of it is going to be how they are used situationally.  Their experience is going to be just as  valuable as any actual stats they put up on the field in this first season under Campbell. The vets are going to be like coaches on the field.

 

I am also interested in how Jayden Daniels's legs will factor into his early career.  The man can flat out fly, but it doesn't mean there will be a ton of read option, just that the threat of him running will always be on the mind of the defense.  I could definitely see situational RPO formations.

[NoVaSkins21]

Looks like this team avoids Hard Knocks again, although it would've been nice this year with Quinn, Daniels, and Wagner

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/bears-training-camp-will-be-featured-on-hard-knocks

[Darrell Green Fan]

9 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

If you are down on the defense. And down on the likely bell cow RB, how high can you be on this roster compared to most?  You are certainly not as high on it as I am.

 

As far as dying on a hill for Quan.  I keep hearing that's the dude that this coaching staff is very high on among those they inherited.  Looks like a good shot he's going to be the starting FS.  And in Quinn-Whitt's scheme which typically play a lot of single high -- that FS is a key component of the defense.     

 

He played well towards the end of the season.  Coaches seem to be high on him.   I am not going on a leap that there is a good chance he's a good safety.  He was a very good college player, high pick, and played well towards the end of the season.

 

I'd add Whitt is known to be a bit of whisper for players in the secondary.  If he is high on Quan, and that's the vibe I get when I hear that the coaches are, then I gather there might be something to it.

I never said I was down on the defense, just the secondary. I think the LB change alone will make a huge difference and the DL is much deeper with a potential impact DT from the draft.

 

No I seriously question how anyone can claim at this point in time that Quan and Forrest are a good duo when compared to the rest of the league. Since when do we use coach's comments in mini-camp to make an evaluation?  Coaches always talk up their players, we all know thus 

Edited May 30 by Darrell Green Fan

[Conn]

21 minutes ago, NoVaSkins21 said:

Looks like this team avoids Hard Knocks again, although it would've been nice this year with Quinn, Daniels, and Wagner

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/bears-training-camp-will-be-featured-on-hard-knocks

Next year opens the Hard Knocks window imo (and it’ll be once our facilities have been prettied up a bit). We couldn’t be forced to do it this year with a new staff and of course weren’t gonna volunteer. The Bears drafted a potential superstar, weren’t a terrible team, and didn’t fire their staff so they were squarely in the bullseye for this thing. Should be interesting