The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[redskinss]

3 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

Am I the only one who wouldn’t mind seeing Wentz again? I am, aren’t I?…

 

 

**** all y’all lol 🤬

Nope, not at all.

I would be just as concerned with him at quarterback as I am with heinicke for reasons that are extremely well documented but his ceiling is so much higher there is intrigue for me too.

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

We're not going anywhere with Heinicke, but Wentz needs the Oline to be fixed if he'll be any good at all.

Pretty much.  I can absolutely see Wentz giving us a nice deep pass or two, some lasers/tight window darts, and heck, he might even shock us with a 5 yard scramble… but I have trouble seeing any sort of consistency behind this oline (while facing the upcoming slate of D’s).

Of course, Heinicke had (I believe) his best statistical game of the year against the Giants, and yet that game was a struggle.

Here’s hoping Schweitzer steps up in a big way at center and the group stays healthy enough to find some consistency.

1 hour ago, HigSkin said:

Reference "will go from there" IMO Ron is being motivationally shrewd by not committing to Heinicke because Taylor plays better in an underdog role and not being a named starter.

Agreed.  Probably helps with the locker room too when/if he decides to make a change.  My concern is that he waits for a loss, and that loss deflates the team - and/or Wentz, while a far better passer than TH, really struggles, particularly against some good pass rushing teams.  

[Ball Security]

1 hour ago, Conn said:

 

 

 

This is where I got it, based on the time it looks like this must be from around halftime

Oh okay.  I thought we were talking about Tampa and Leftwich’s play calling as we were talking about Brady.

[Est.1974]

6 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

But there’s no gaurantee. His last experience with a shiney new owner got him fired. The new owner will eventually want his own guy and he may want his own guy in year 1; even if he takes over later in the offseason.

 

 

I agree. I’m personally in favour of starting over, top down. Who the Hell knows where the QB situation ends. I’d say high cost veteran is incoming.

[Koolblue13]

49 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

Am I the only one who wouldn’t mind seeing Wentz again? I am, aren’t I?…

 

 

**** all y’all lol 🤬

I'm down for Wentz again for three reasons.

 

1- Heinicke is about maxed out and fading.

 

2- Cowboys will do the same thing they did last year (9ers too) and just load the box and attack the run game and force Heini to throw it. Can't do that as well if Wentz is back there.

 

3- I had surgery yesterday and am hopped up on the good drugs again.

[Professor_Nutter_Butter]

9 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I'm down for Wentz again for three reasons.

 

1- Heinicke is about maxed out and fading.

 

2- Cowboys will do the same thing they did last year (9ers too) and just load the box and attack the run game and force Heini to throw it. Can't do that as well if Wentz is back there.

 

3- I had surgery yesterday and am hopped up on the good drugs again.

First off, hope the surgery went well. That said, with this Wentz talk: 

[Koolblue13]

25 minutes ago, Professor_Nutter_Butter said:

First off, hope the surgery went well. That said, with this Wentz talk: 

First of all, any time Wentz is brought up it seems like there needs to be a disclaimer about not saying he's the dynamic savior that our team needs. I'm saying that if the Oline is playing better and we stay a run first offense and don't put it all on him, our offense is capable of averaging over 19.5 points a game.

 

and thanks. I aspirated and feel like hammered **** today.

Edited December 14, 2022 by Koolblue13

[Conn]

1 hour ago, Ball Security said:

Oh okay.  I thought we were talking about Tampa and Leftwich’s play calling as we were talking about Brady.

lol that’s a massive brain fart on my end, due to the decades-long Brady/Patriots connection I did indeed read that tweet as being about Brady. Oddly enough the same sort of criticisms apply for the Bucs this season but you’re right that they don’t fit in his last game. You must have been so confused by wtf I was saying, thanks for sticking with me long enough for me to catch up to my own idiocy 

[DJHJR86]

10 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I'm saying that if the Oline is playing better and we stay a run first offense and don't put it all on him, our offense is capable of averaging over 19.5 points a game.

 

In the two games where they relied on the run game and rushed for over 100 yards the offense scored 10 points and 12 points.  6 of those 12 points in the Bears game came from a fumble courtesy of the Bears on special teams.  And the starting center is out for the year.  This mythical thought that Wentz just being re-inserted into the lineup magically making the offense better is baffling to me.  

[SoCalSkins]

I don’t think Wentz would survive against the 49ers pass rush. Cleveland with Miles Garret can get after the Qb too and Dallas ate up Carson pretty well. I don’t see how Ron makes a switch barring injury. 

[Koolblue13]

1 minute ago, DJHJR86 said:

This mythical thought that Wentz just being re-inserted into the lineup magically making the offense better is baffling to me.  

Because you are making it up, so that you can get angry. It's baffling to me why you'd do that.

 

I even did the obligatory disclaimer just to stop you from making nonsensical ranting posts, but yet here we are.

[CommanderCarson]

1 minute ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

In the two games where they relied on the run game and rushed for over 100 yards the offense scored 10 points and 12 points.  6 of those 12 points in the Bears game came from a fumble courtesy of the Bears on special teams.  And the starting center is out for the year.  This mythical thought that Wentz just being re-inserted into the lineup magically making the offense better is baffling to me.  

I gave up on trying to argue it haha. It comes from nothing logical I’ll tell you that.

 

Id be intrigued with a Mac Jones, Heineke, Howell QB room next year if we could make a reasonable trade for Jones. Let the 3 duke it out. Or add a rookie to Howell/Heine. Do not waste $28M on another QB that may have a big arm, but needs everything around him working to lead the team to first half points. 

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

Because you are making it up, so that you can get angry. It's baffling to me why you'd do that.

 

I even did the obligatory disclaimer just to stop you from making nonsensical ranting posts, but yet here we are.

Yeah you’re hopped up real good lol.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I’d prefer to get Wentz for this game on Sunday as opposed to the Niners.  I don’t see any of our QBs having a good day against that defense.

 

My gut has been telling me all along that the wheels fall off for Heinicke in December and Wentz gets inserted once again.  He probably won’t be great either, and we’ll be litigating that decision the entire offseason.

[Koolblue13]

2 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I’d prefer to get Wentz for this game on Sunday as opposed to the Niners.  I don’t see any of our QBs having a good day against that defense.

 

My gut has been telling me all along that the wheels fall off for Heinicke in December and Wentz gets inserted once again.  He probably won’t be great either, and we’ll be litigating that decision the entire offseason.

This place will be pretty unbearable if Wentz comes in for any reason and flounders against two of the leagues best defenses.

[NickyJ]

It's gonna be weird if Wentz steps in and is immediately a bigger threat with the RPO than Heinicke is.

[Koolblue13]

4 minutes ago, CommanderCarson said:

Mac Jones, Heineke, Howell QB room next year

And I'm the one that hopped up on goofballs, eh?

[Fan since a Fetus]

The only thing that gives me hope about Wentz is the fact that he has had these last few weeks to hopefully get into the playbook and learn. That’s what I would of done, but who knows. I don’t think he’s the future, but neither is Heinicke. I think Wentz with better knowledge of this system will improve the qb play. But, I don’t know how hard Wentz hits the books

[skinny21]

Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I’d prefer to get Wentz for this game on Sunday as opposed to the Niners.  I don’t see any of our QBs having a good day against that defense.

 

My gut has been telling me all along that the wheels fall off for Heinicke in December and Wentz gets inserted once again.  He probably won’t be great either, and we’ll be litigating that decision the entire offseason.

Timing-wise, benching TH for Wentz going into SF is just asking for trouble in terms of people (and the team) second-guessing the decision.  Unless Heinicke is horrendous this week, I’d almost be inclined to wait until the Browns game to try Wentz (if I were RR).  Or I’d have just gone ahead and prepped Wentz for this week, assuming Schweitzer was ready to step into the center role and Turner or Cosmi were ready to start at RG.  Of course, I still have major reservations that Wentz can operate this offense with any kind of consistency, particularly in terms of getting the ball out quickly.

 

Much like the end to last year though, depending how it shakes out, I might be hesitant to put too much of the blame on Heinicke (beyond the normal amount via some risky throws, some sailed passes, etc) - it’s a tough slate of D’s and I expect our oline to be pretty suspect.

[Est.1974]

18 minutes ago, Fan since a Fetus said:

The only thing that gives me hope about Wentz is the fact that he has had these last few weeks to hopefully get into the playbook and learn. That’s what I would of done, but who knows. I don’t think he’s the future, but neither is Heinicke. I think Wentz with better knowledge of this system will improve the qb play. But, I don’t know how hard Wentz hits the books

Unfortunately that won’t help his mobility

[Warhead36]

After this week we might be facing the three best edge rushers in the entire league in Bosa, Garrett, and  Parsons. Not exactly the ideal situation for Wentz.

[goskins10]

Play TH till he loses then play Howell. Not interested in Wentz, now, later, or ever. 

 

I understand those who say play him and to be fair it's probably the more prudent thing to do. Howell has not played a down in the NFL. Wentz has had some success. But again his problems are not due to a poor oline. A poor oline does NOT make you consistently miss easy checkdowns or make bone chillingly stupid decisions when it matters most. 

 

TH is only hanging on by a thread but Wentz burned the thread completely off. Give Howell a chance. He is more mobile than either Wentz or TH by mile. He is used to being chased a round a lot having to run for his life most of last year. But he can throw the ball a long way - not like Carson but much much better than TH. 

 

Having said all that I expect if the coaches make a change it will be for Carson. 

 

Just beat NY and put it to rest. This is a huge game. I get it's not do or die, but it may as well be. The road gets very easy if they beat NY and exponentially more difficult if they lose to them. 

Edited December 14, 2022 by goskins10

[CommanderInTheRye]

Some Tupelo honey for the hive...

 

 

 

[zCommander]

16 minutes ago, CommanderInTheRye said:

Some Tupelo honey for the hive...

 

Saw this like weeks ago lol

 

But you also have to watch this one to balance things out as well. 

 

 

Here is another good one too. All pass and run plays by TH in the Eagles game. 

 

Edited December 14, 2022 by zCommander

[Fan since a Fetus]

26 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Unfortunately that won’t help his mobility

Agreed, but my thought is that it would help his decision making and being able to get the ball out quicker. I think Heinicke has a huge advantage because he has been in this system and has worked with Turner for years. Heinicke knows where his guys are supposed to be. He just doesn’t have the arm. 
 

no arm and knows the system vs no mobility and learning the system. 

[DJHJR86]

9 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

our offense is capable of averaging over 19.5 points a game

 

Because you are making it up

 

You said the offense would score more than 19.5 points a game with Wentz.  I made it up by quoting you.

 

But lets dig into the numbers.  Last year, the Colts had a decent offensive line and Jonathan Taylor at running back.  In games where they rushed for over 100 yards and Wentz had less than 25 pass attempts, the team was 4-0.  For that 4 game stretch, his numbers were:

 

43/74 

58% Completion

5 TDs

1 INT

544 yards

7.6 average AY/A 

 

Heinicke, in his last 17 starts, has had 3 such games with the same scenario, and the team is 3-0.  His numbers:

 

39/63

62% Completion

5 TDs

1 INT

464 yards

8.2 average AY/A

 

The Colts averaged 32.5 points over that 4 game span with Wentz.  Washington averaged 22.6 points per game over the 3 game stretch with Heinicke.  So why is that if Heinicke's stats are very similar to Wentz when the offense relies on a strong run game and limits the passing?  The Colts leading rusher (Taylor) averaged 161 rushing yards, whereas the leading rushers (Gibson/Robinson) averaged 115 with Heinicke.  And this is with a better offensive line that the Colts had than the one operating right now in Washington.

 

Conclusion: without a homerun rusher and a patchwork offensive line, Heinicke put up similar numbers to Wentz when the main focus of the offense was to limit throws and pound the rock.