The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Vandelay_Industries]

8 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Colts OL pass protection #s suffered because Wentz likes to hold on to the ball. They've got two studs in their line in Kelly and Nelson. Our OL got worse with Scherff and Flowers departing. 

PFF tries to make the grades as isolated as possible. When evaluating the O-line, the play of the quarterback should be factored out. Their O-line was rated the best in run blocking, but also the 3rd worst in pass pro.

 

The Colts had one of the worst left tackles in the league, which caused big problems for the O-line (he was coming off a serious achilles injury and was cut after the season). Some others struggled repeatedly with injuries, including Nelson and Kelly (plus Kelly's wife had a miscarriage near the end of the season, which caused him to miss several games).

Edited May 5, 2022 by Vandelay_Industries

[JSSkinz]

Listened to Cooley on Sheehan, its great to hear Cooley gushing over Dotson, he was emphatic about Dotson being a 1st rd. talent and the film seemed to make an impression on him.  He recognized he can run any route and was impressed the way he plays in bad weather, Cooley said it was obvious Dotson is as fast on the field as he is in shorts running the 40.  I've never really heard him so excited about Washington WR and that's including Terry.  To me it sounded as if he thinks Dotson may develop into a better player, said he could make an impact day 1.

 

Howell, not so much. All the comps Cooley was using were career backups.  Maybe others will hear it differently but he seemed to be underwhelmed by Howell.

[Mrshadow008]

3 hours ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

It doesn't really matter what Ron did with the Panthers. Shanahan won 2 Super Bowls for the Broncos. So What? What did he do here under Doofus Dan? That is really the only thing that matters. Gibbs was the winningest coach in NFL History the first run. What happened the 2nd time? Not much but it looked hopeful in 2005 until Doofus Dan and Vinny the Clown decided to start messing around. 

 

Don't worry though. Kyle Shanahan wouldn't have even gone to a NFCCG or a SB in Washington. 

Still missing the point I’m trying to make here. Kyle was 10-22 his first 2 years in San Fran. Ron is 14-19 with a yes questionable nfc East title through two years. My point is people call Kyle a genius when his first two years in San Fran ARE worse than Rivera’s HERE of all places. And people would’ve wanted to run Kyle outta town here after two years if he had the same record here through 2 years as he did through 2 in San Fran

[HigSkin]

If anybody gets to watch GMFB on NFL network, there's a good piece that Torrey Smith does call "Defense of Wentz".  The video isn't available yet.

[Andre The Giant]

40 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

If anybody gets to watch GMFB on NFL network, there's a good piece that Torrey Smith does call "Defense of Wentz".  The video isn't available yet.

Here’s a link:

 

 

[Est.1974]

Well after months of debate, we end up with Wentz and Howell at the draft pick cost of what is more that likely to be a 2022 3rd and 5th and a 2023 2nd.

 

Wentz and Howell for a 3,5,2

 

How is that not a complete win in our circumstances?

[CommDownMan]

4 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Well after months of debate, we end up with Wentz and Howell at the draft pick cost of what is more that likely to be a 2022 3rd and 5th and a 2023 2nd.

 

Wentz and Howell for a 3,5,2

 

How is that not a complete win in our circumstances?

 

History rewrite:

 

A 2022 3rd and 5th for Wentz. 

 

A 2023 2nd to move back into 2022 draft for Howell.  

 

🤔  

 

Win indeed. 

[Est.1974]

1 minute ago, CommDownMan said:

 

History rewrite:

 

A 2022 3rd and 5th for Wentz. 

 

A 2023 2nd to move back into 2022 draft for Howell.  

 

🤔  

 

Win indeed. 

Can’t rewrite history....

[CommDownMan]

2 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Can’t rewrite history....

 

Honestly,  if we didn't get Wentz, we likely would have spent more to get Howell.  I doubt we're waiting until the 5th to address the position. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Agree with EB.  I didn't really realize it until we acquired him but I think Wentz might be the most hated QB in the league as far as national media and to some extent some of our local media.  It's really wild and over the top.  Yesterday, Chris Russell was saying (and I like Russell more than most) that he's talked to people who were in the locker room with Wentz last year and they were just brutal in their takes about Carson.   Sheehan said on a recent podcast, that he was told Wentz is "uncoachable" .  Really? 

 

I really don't get all the hate.  You'd think we just acquired Jeff George's personality on steroids.  Even though those who covered him and some who played with him describe him as a nice guy.

 

 

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Ghost written by @KDawg?

 

 

 

[D’Pablo]

17 hours ago, JSSkinz said:

Howell, not so much. All the comps Cooley was using were career backups.  Maybe others will hear it differently but he seemed to be underwhelmed by Howell.

This is not quite what I heard from Cooley. The comps he mentioned were Josh Allen and Mayfield (also mentioned young Grossman, strong armed Heineke, and Drew Lock). He mostly blamed Howell’s supporting cast, and also mentioned he didn’t watch last year’s film. Biggest negatives were size and “extra movement” in the pocket. There’s a part of me that thinks Cooley puts a lot of stock in QB size. I thought it was interesting that Cooley believes Howell is the starter if Wentz goes down.

[KDawg]

7 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Ghost written by @KDawg?

 

 

 

 

Conquering one back up at a time. Right now the target is on Heinicke. Wentz is a secondary target. But the Howell Pack is coming to circle soon. 

[KDawg]

14 minutes ago, D’Pablo said:

This is not quite what I heard from Cooley. The comps he mentioned were Josh Allen and Mayfield (also mentioned young Grossman, strong armed Heineke, and Drew Lock). He mostly blamed Howell’s supporting cast, and also mentioned he didn’t watch last year’s film. Biggest negatives were size and “extra movement” in the pocket. There’s a part of me that thinks Cooley puts a lot of stock in QB size. I thought it was interesting that Cooley believes Howell is the starter if Wentz goes down.

Thats what I heard, too. But I didn’t want to reply to that first because the President of the Howellers replying to the criticism can be viewed as suspect.

[Skinsinparadise]

23 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Thats what I heard, too. But I didn’t want to reply to that first because the President of the Howellers replying to the criticism can be viewed as suspect.

 

Yeah me too.  I listened to Cooley, while I was working, so I wasn't fully paying attention but the vibe i got was he liked him overall, he didn't think he was top 10 potential but he liked the pick.  I recall his main criticism was he had too much wasted movement in the pocket; he won't get away with the runs he had in college, and while he hits WRs in stride with the deep ball, he thought he struggled with that on the first and 2nd level.  He loved his deep ball, thought he had a good arm, loved his toughness, he didn't agree with the criticism that he regressed last year from the previous season -- he cited the poor O line protection and help he got from his WRs.

Edited May 6, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

 

Heinicke going to be released soon?  

 

 

 

 

[CommanderInTheRye]

Wow! This is the most full throated non-equivocating defense of Carson Wentz as a player, person and teammate that I've seen this off season...

 

EDIT:  

 

I now see that the 2 minute edited short version was posted earlier. This is the entire 9 minute segment and well worth a view imho.

 

 

 

Edited May 6, 2022 by CommanderInTheRye

[Skinsinparadise]

I hope all of this is fuel for Carson.  Ballard could just easily just say, look Carson is with another team, we wish him the best and we don't want to keep talking about him.  But instead he keeps burying him.   Ditto Irsay.  Reich has been much nicer.  But I used to think Ballard lived up to his reputation as being all class.  But he certainly not acting that way with Wentz.  I used to think the matchup with the Eagles would be the most fascinating from the Wentz perspective.  But now am thinking the indy game has even more juice.

 

 

 

 

[Wafers]

Colts GM went after Carson Wentz again ("mistake, not a good fit" etc etc).  I have never seen an organization is so obsessed with a former player.  This is crazy and not even funny any more.  The last time I checked, the guy led Colts to a 9-3 (including two OT losses) before COVID hit him and the whole team.  The guy was 27-7 last season while Colts' new savior has not had anything better in last four years. 

 

I am not saying Wentz would be Stafford 2.0, but the criticism in him is getting a little too ridiculous.

Edited May 6, 2022 by Wafers

[CommanderInTheRye]

In reference to both Ballard and Irsay two quotes immediately come to mind.

 

One, with a slight gender adjustment, is from the great bard...

 

"Me thinks the laddy doth protest too much."

 

And one is a lesson learned long ago from the eternal playground of life...

 

"The one that smelt it, dealt it."

 

Your choice as to which one best captures the true essence of the situation.

 

.

 

 

Edited May 6, 2022 by CommanderInTheRye

[Skinsinparadise]

20 minutes ago, Wafers said:

Colts GM went after Carson Wentz again ("mistake, not a good fit" etc etc).  I have never seen an organization is so obsessed with a former player.  This is crazy and not even funny any more.  The last time I checked, the guy led Colts to a 9-3 (including two OT losses) before COVID hit him and the whole team.  The guy was 27-7 last season while Colts' new savior has not had anything better in last four years. 

 

I am not saying Wentz would be Stafford 2.0, but the criticism in him is getting a little too ridiculous.

 

 

Agree and in a weird way I like it.  Maybe its wishful thinking on my end but my two thoughts are

 

A.  Even if some of what they are saying is true, maybe it becomes the ultimate wakeup call for Carson if he needs it -- basically so many in the media are parroting that Carson is some kind of bum.  

 

B.  It just pisses Carson off and it serves as fuel.

 

The way the Colts have openly pissed on Wentz is over the top.  And in a way disrespectful to this team.  If you are trading a player to another team show some respect to that player.  What Ballard and company are doing is in effect crapping on the Commanders judgement for making a trade with them.  Why would I want to trade with the Colts again if they in effect ridicule this team for making the trade.  A big part of the narrative for why the media has crapped on this deal is because they think Indy crapping on Wentz says it all and the Commanders were duped.  Ballard is adding to that narrative IMO -- I take it beyond being disrespectful to Wentz, I take it as being disrespectful to this team and out of bounds.

 

Even if they don't feel that way internally, teams tend to be respectful to the players they dealt.  

Edited May 6, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Forever A Redskin]

The way I see it, we already recouped the draft capital traded for Wentz in this year's draft by trading back from pick 11. Not only that, we turned it into 4 players likely to contribute immediately.

 

With our comp pick for Scherff, that softens the blow of the lost draft capital in the 2023 draft. Who knows maybe we trade down again in 2023 and really erase the deficit given up for him.

 

If he plays well enough to cost us our 2nd rounder, we won the trade. Worst case scenario he makes us competitive enough to be the perfect bridge QB for either Howell or a future rookie.

 

I hope Wentz lights up both the colts and the eagles twice.

[wit33]

14 minutes ago, Forever A Redskin said:

The way I see it, we already recouped the draft capital traded for Wentz in this year's draft by trading back from pick 11. Not only that, we turned it into 4 players likely to contribute immediately.

 

With our comp pick for Scherff, that softens the blow of the lost draft capital in the 2023 draft. Who knows maybe we trade down again in 2023 and really erase the deficit given up for him.

 

If he plays well enough to cost us our 2nd rounder, we won the trade. Worst case scenario he makes us competitive enough to be the perfect bridge QB for either Howell or a future rookie.

 

I hope Wentz lights up both the colts and the eagles twice.

I also like Howell in the event Wentz blows up in a bad way, it doesn’t preclude Washington drafting a first round QB next year. All options are open to continue the hunt for the elite, a rookie, or veteran next season.