The Politics Sexual Assault Thread

[Kosher Ham]

36 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said:

 

The numbers are the reflection of the number of women in positions of power, and the number of women who demonstrate that power through sexual harassment and assault.  I'm guessing this number is smaller than the numbers associated with men in similar positions.

 

 

The numbers are a reflection of men who actually make an assault claim in comparison. 

Yet, women are not ostracized as men are. 

 

You have to be able to admit that. Even the few number of women that are called out...no one really cares. 

[Dan T.]

10 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

Any particular reason?

 

Given the current environment, it's easy to lump together all of these allegations against public persons, when there needs to be some sort of continuum in terms of egregiousness.

 

I just don't think the two accusations against Franken rise to the level of firing offense, especially since the Tweeden accusation is looking less and less accurate.

 

 

 

[LadySkinsFan]

So you say. I care. Sexual assault is no joke no matter who the victim is. I personally haven't known a man who was subjected to sexual assault or harassment, at least no one who said anything. 

 

I know plenty of women, including myself, who have been subjected to sexual harassment or assault. 

 

And I bet that a woman accused of sexual assault or harassment has her career curtailed much faster than a man in the same position.

 

 

Edited November 20, 2017 by LadySkinsFan

[PleaseBlitz]

4 minutes ago, Dan T. said:

 

Given the current environment, it's easy to lump together all of these allegations against public persons, when there needs to be some sort of continuum in terms of egregiousness.

 

I just don't think the two accusations against Franken rise to the level of firing offense, especially since the Tweeden accusation is looking less and less accurate.

 

 

For me this is about winning seats.  I 100% agree that the conduct of Moore vs. Franken are not in the same ballpark, and Franken's response was appropriate while Moore's was and is disgusting.  I'm not exactly sure what you mean about Tweeden's accusation looking less and less accurate.  I think it is problematic that she just happens to be a regular guest on Hannity, but there is a picture of Al Franken with his hands literally on her tits, which is a bad look.  

 

However, bigger picture, this is about one party (R's, obviously) being the party where sexual misconduct is tolerated and not disqualifying at all, and the other party (D's) being the party where it is not tolerated.  Dems should take the opportunity to plant their flag on this issue, not only is it consistent with their brand of being the party of equality among men/women, white/nonwhite, straight/gay, etc, but it also happens to put them on the right side of history (hopefully).  

 

If Al Franken has to lose his job, well, he's a millionaire, he'll be fine. 

[Kosher Ham]

You don't though, and have shown it. Heck, most men feel the same way. 

 

Men are tools it seems, not worthy of equal rights or even equal respect. 

 

 

[No Excuses]

2 minutes ago, Kosher Ham said:

 

Men are tools it seems, not worthy of equal rights or even equal respect. 

 

 

 

LOL okay dude.

 

The hot take this thread had been missing. 

[PleaseBlitz]

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2017 by PleaseBlitz

[Kosher Ham]

1 minute ago, No Excuses said:

The hot take this thread had been missing. 

 

Hardee harr harr...

 

You might be a part of why men are secondary citizens. 

 

[No Excuses]

1 minute ago, Kosher Ham said:

 

Hardee harr harr...

 

You might be a part of why men are secondary citizens. 

 

 

 

God I hope you're being sarcastic.

[Llevron]

1 minute ago, Kosher Ham said:

 

Hardee harr harr...

 

You might be a part of why men are secondary citizens. 

 

 

You a clown

[Predicto]

3 hours ago, Kosher Ham said:

Why don't men have rights when it comes to accusations from women ? 

Not saying that any of these men are innocent...most likely they are guilty. 

 

How often are men harassed by women ?  Folks ignore it. 

 

I knew this post was coming.   And who it was going to come from. 

 

I was 100 percent sure of it.

 

 

Edited November 20, 2017 by Predicto

[visionary]

 

[Predicto]

22 minutes ago, Kosher Ham said:

You don't though, and have shown it. Heck, most men feel the same way. 

 

Men are tools it seems, not worthy of equal rights or even equal respect. 

 

 

and this one too.   lol

[Dan T.]

1 minute ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

For me this is about winning seats.  I 100% agree that the conduct of Moore vs. Franken are not in the same ballpark, and Franken's response was appropriate while Moore's was and is disgusting.  I'm not exactly sure what you mean about Tweeden's accusation looking less and less accurate.  I think it is problematic that she just happens to be a regular guest on Hannity, but there is a picture of Al Franken with his hands literally on her tits, which is a bad look.  

 

However, bigger picture, this is about one party (R's, obviously) being the party where sexual misconduct is tolerated and not disqualifying at all, and the other party (D's) being the party where it is not tolerated.  Dems should take the opportunity to plant their flag on this issue, not only is it consistent with their brand of being the party of equality among men/women, white/nonwhite, straight/gay, etc, but it also happens to put them on the right side of history (hopefully).  

 

If Al Franken has to lose his job, well, he's a millionaire, he'll be fine. 

 

Re: Tweeden's accusation looking less and less accurate:

http://www.newsbehavingbadly.com/2017/11/19/twitter-suspends-three-more-accounts-tied-to-roger-stone-as-questions-about-credibility-of-leeann-tweedens-franken-claims-emerge/

 

 

 

Re: the rest of your post, I'm going to be brutally honest.  Ideally, the dems could do as you say and take the high ground.  In today's current environment, that will gain them nothing except the loss of seats. So I'll continue to argue for trying to carve out some sort of moral continuum of offenses.  Here's a crack at it. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being send them to jail and 1 being give them a slap on the wrist.

 

Bill Cosby 11

Harvey Weinstein 10

|

|

Roy Moore 8 (would be higher, but there's the pesky Statute of Limitations)

|

Louie C.K. 6 (he claims he asked for consent, but there's the power dynamic. And also, ick.)

|

|

George H.W. Bush 4

Al Franken  3

(The difference in those two are only in the number of accusers.)

|

|

Jimmy Carter 0 (He only lusted in his heart. We aren't the Moral Thought Police.)

___________

 

On a more serious note, my preference, at this point, would be to let Minnesotans decide Al Franken's future as their representative.

 

[Llevron]

Just now, Predicto said:

 

and this one too.   lol

 

How much you wanna bet its white men in particular who are second class citizens now. And its liberal professors we have to blame for all of this ****. 

[PleaseBlitz]

9 minutes ago, Dan T. said:

 

 

Re: the rest of your post, I'm going to be brutally honest.  Ideally, the dems could do as you say and take the high ground.  In today's current environment, that will gain them nothing except the loss of seats. So I'll continue to argue for trying to carve out some sort of moral continuum of offenses.  Here's a crack at it.

 

 

All of this is a reasonable position.  I disagree with it gaining them nothing except the loss of seats.  I think drawing a clear contrast with the party of Trump & Moore will win you some votes.  I think I'm just more willing to jettison individuals than you.  

 

Plus, who is to say the list of Franken accusers will stop at 2.  Dems lose their shot at drawing any kind of distinction until they wait until accusers 3, 4, 5 etc come out of the woodwork.  

[Llevron]

2 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

All of this is a reasonable position.  I disagree with it gaining them nothing except the loss of seats.  I think drawing a clear contrast with the party of Trump & Moore will win you some votes.  I think I'm just more willing to jettison individuals than you.  

 

Plus, who is to say the list of Franken accusers will stop at 2.  Dems lose their shot at drawing any kind of distinction until they wait until accusers 3, 4, 5 etc come out of the woodwork.  

 

Agree with this. They need to drop dude before he actually becomes a problem for them. You know Trump and his group are going to run with it. Dont give them the chance. 

[Predicto]

4 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

All of this is a reasonable position.  I disagree with it gaining them nothing except the loss of seats.  I think drawing a clear contrast with the party of Trump & Moore will win you some votes.  I think I'm just more willing to jettison individuals than you.  

 

Plus, who is to say the list of Franken accusers will stop at 2.  Dems lose their shot at drawing any kind of distinction until they wait until accusers 3, 4, 5 etc come out of the woodwork.  

 

Yep.  One of the biggest problems we face as a country right now is lazy both-sides-ism.  You don't want to encourage it any more than you possible can.  

[tshile]

i feel bad for dude eating the sub 

no one looks good in pictures of them eating. he's all over the place now

[tshile]

seriously that's a mouth full of sub

cheeks all puffed out

[Predicto]

 

[No Excuses]

LOL@Predicto

[DogofWar1]

I have longer thoughts on the new accusation against Franken, but I'm at work and tired because Prince William General District Court is a black hole from which there is no escape so I'll just say that the most peculiar thing about it would be if it was the only one.

 

A person who is brazen enough to do that at a public event in front of the husband, while a sitting senator, is very likely to be someone who did it numerous other times.

 

If there aren't other accusations, I'm not saying it's not credible, indeed at this point I think it's MORE credible than the Tweeden stuff, but if it ultimately becomes a battle of this single incident vs. Franken saying it was an honest mistake, in the absence of other accusers, I don't think I could make a determination that this was not an honest mistake.  It's rather weird to think that a person would do this once, in that set of circumstances, and not do it on other occasions.

[TradeTheBeal!]

28 minutes ago, tshile said:

seriously that's a mouth full of sub

cheeks all puffed out

 

Whats the problem?

 

[Destino]

3 hours ago, LadySkinsFan said:

So you say. I care. Sexual assault is no joke no matter who the victim is. I personally haven't known a man who was subjected to sexual assault or harassment, at least no one who said anything.

 

I've had this discussion with my friends over the years and as far as I can tell there isn't a single one of my male friends that hasn't been sexually assaulted by the definitions we're using today.  The difference, and it's a very significant difference, is that when we were grabbed, kissed, or even climbed on without consent none of us experienced fear or intimidation.  As a result none of us felt like we had been assaulted, still don't, and I can't imagine any of them tweeting out a #metoo. 

 

Pretty much every guy I know has also experienced things that would technically be considered domestic abuse as well.  In most of those cases, there was no fear present either.  There are some notable exceptions, someone trying to run you over is damned frightening, but nothing that extended beyond the moment.  No fear regarding our ability to leave that relationship.  None of these guys would call it domestic abuse though, because again there is no feeling of being a victim. 

 

My point however, isn't to say that I believe you're wrong in your thinking that men haven't experienced these things.  My point is that I believe this vastly different way of experiencing the same situations is often more significant.