lavar1156 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 But that's just it. McCloughan doesnt want this team to end up like the Colts and Ravens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Barbour Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 1 hour ago, lavar1156 said: Mike Jones said this morning there are some people inside Redskins Park that wonder how much of a drop off there would be with Colt McCoy. The main factor being that Cousins isn't throwing enough TD passes. WaPo needs to make clicks. it's the Bye week and Redskins are not playing . Best way to get articles read is to start drama and follow it with articles being "subjective" That way. You get both sides of the discussion to read. Journalism 101....Don't be a peon folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar1156 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Here's a good recap of what he said. http://washington.cbslocal.com/2016/11/02/mike-jones-kirk-cousins-colt-mccoy/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncr2h Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Just now, lavar1156 said: But that's just it. McCloughan doesnt want this team to end up like the Colts and Ravens. Paying Kirk $18-20M per year won't turn us into the Colts or Ravens. Every team in the league that doesn't have a rookie contract QB is paying their QB at least $16M per year (except dumpster fire teams like the Jets and Browns). 12 teams - nearly half the league - pay their QBs at least $20 million per year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Kirk is not worth more than $16 million per, let him walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 32 minutes ago, Gizmo 3squire said: We will more than likely keep Kirk, but he's not getting some large pay day as folks on this site predicted. Even if we do make the playoffs. Only way that happens is if we make it to the Superbowl AND win. Hell, if we do that, I'm sure half this board would throw in $500 each to give Kirk money. Just now, spjunkies said: Kirk is not worth more than $16 million per, let him walk. I don't know why some people are willing to overlook the type of QB play we are getting. It's been forever since we've even had back-to-back years that look like 2015 and 2016. I'm fine if the team doesn't want to make him the highest-paid QB in the league, but I would be open to exceeding $16M. We finally have an entrenched, top-10ish QB who is entering his prime. Sign him and move on to addressing other needs!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 There's no way around it. The Skins are going to have to pay Cousins. If they don't, someone else will. 2 minutes ago, spjunkies said: Kirk is not worth more than $16 million per, let him walk. We let him walk, then what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 QBs get paid. You either pay a good one(which Cousins is)or you end up in 5-11 land forever. Just pay him and figure it out everywhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Ok so we either go to 5-11 years or remain in 8-8 land for the next 5/6 years WOO HOOOO!!! The path forward should be to sign an average quarterback this off-season to a reasonable contract grab a young buck in round 2 of the draft to develop for 2 years, proceed from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 3 hours ago, lavar1156 said: I mean 6-8 in terms of money. Not neccessarily rank. I don't want us to turn into the Ravens or the Colts. Don't be silly, that's Chase Daniel money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 For all the folks in the "let him walk" camp, what's plan B? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 5 minutes ago, spjunkies said: Ok so we either go to 5-11 years or remain in 8-8 land for the next 5/6 years WOO HOOOO!!! The path forward should be to sign an average quarterback this off-season to a reasonable contract grab a young buck in round 2 of the draft to develop for 2 years, proceed from there. I'd like to see what you mean by "average" QB in your path forward. The reason being, I think you'll find that the price for an average QB is pretty steep. So, you pay maybe half of what you'd pay Cousins to get someone not as good. Then, you take a flier on a 2nd round pick and hope that he eventually produces like KC has since 2015. All of that to save $8-10M annually with an annually-increasing cap? Is this path forward strictly financial? What are the odds that you actually come out ahead by year 2 of your plan? You'd have reduced QB costs but also reduced QB output meaning that you now have to spend more money (probably more than $10M you saved at QB) elsewhere just to get back to where we are right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar1156 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 4 minutes ago, Wildbunny said: Don't be silly, that's Chase Daniel money... I think I'm confusing myself. I mean whatever the top 6-8 QB's are making. I really dont think we will give Kirk top 5 money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Just now, lavar1156 said: I think I'm confusing myself. I mean whatever the top 6-8 QB's are making. I really dont think we will give Kirk top 5 money. The average of the top-5 QBs is $22.98M per year. The average of the next 3 guys (6-8) is $21.28M per year. So, we're talking $1.7M annually. If that's how far apart the two sides get, this thing is locked up. In the NFL, that's probably 1 30-second commercial during the 1pm games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Just now, TD_washingtonredskins said: I'd like to see what you mean by "average" QB in your path forward. The reason being, I think you'll find that the price for an average QB is pretty steep. So, you pay maybe half of what you'd pay Cousins to get someone not as good. Then, you take a flier on a 2nd round pick and hope that he eventually produces like KC has since 2015. All of that to save $8-10M annually with an annually-increasing cap? Is this path forward strictly financial? What are the odds that you actually come out ahead by year 2 of your plan? You'd have reduced QB costs but also reduced QB output meaning that you now have to spend more money (probably more than $10M you saved at QB) elsewhere just to get back to where we are right now. I'm sorry but Kirk simply does not produce enough on deep passes or in the red zone to command a large contract from us, the guy sitting on the beach right now would be a slight downgrade from Mr. Cousins. He's simply not worth it in the long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veryoldschool Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 1 minute ago, spjunkies said: Ok so we either go to 5-11 years or remain in 8-8 land for the next 5/6 years WOO HOOOO!!! We got the best QB in at least the last 20 years of the franchise, one that is statistically a top 10 guy, liked and respected team leader, a driven perfectionist that works his tail off to get better and since he still hasn't started a full 2 seasons he may continue to improve and you think the Skins should let him walk? Forget about it, I don't have another 20 years I want Kirk signed and SM to continue building around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 I have no problem saying that right now, Kirk is a top 10-12 QB in the league. Letting him go would be beyond foolish and put this team right back at square 1 with more questions than answers. Kirk, for all his faults, is plenty good enough to lead this team and put them in position to win. If Joe Barry had guts and actually rushed the QB vs. the Lions and Hopkins made his bunny vs. the Bengals, would we be hearing the same moronic "whispers" coming out of Redskins Park? Probably not. I don't know why Kirk is even the focal point of the discussion during this by with the ludicrous notion that there wouldn't be a drop off w/ Colt. Of all the hot takes, this one is beyond idiotic. It just sucks that we have folks in the fanbase who actually give this any credence. I hope dude gets signed to a long-term deal before Nov 13th. Kirk should use those salty tears from those who have their jimmies rustled to season his pasta before it boils. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said: We got the best QB in at least the last 20 years of the franchise, one that is statistically a top 10 guy, liked and respected team leader, a driven perfectionist that works his tail off to get better and since he still hasn't started a full 2 seasons he may continue to improve and you think the Skins should let him walk? Forget about it, I don't have another 20 years I want Kirk signed and SM to continue building around him. And therein lies the problem, our franchise is so used to poor we're going to be willing to accept mediocrity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar1156 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 4 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: The average of the top-5 QBs is $22.98M per year. The average of the next 3 guys (6-8) is $21.28M per year. So, we're talking $1.7M annually. If that's how far apart the two sides get, this thing is locked up. In the NFL, that's probably 1 30-second commercial during the 1pm games. 21+ million is a little higher than I realized. But the cap will increase as well. I just know some teams would offer that in a heart beat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, spjunkies said: I'm sorry but Kirk simply does not produce enough on deep passes or in the red zone to command a large contract from us, the guy sitting on the beach right now would be a slight downgrade from Mr. Cousins. He's simply not worth it in the long term. I don't really mind your opinion about Cousins, I just doubt that your plan gets us anywhere close to his production level. Whatever you want to rank him right now (let's say you think he's a 6/10), "the guy sitting on the beach" would not be anywhere close to that. So, your plan would save a few cap dollars, but weaken the QB position significantly. Who do you propose we play at QB while we groom a 2nd round pick (who could work out or not work out, as we know)? To me, that's the crux of any "replace Kirk" plan. If I knew that McCoy could produce at 90% of what Kirk is producing, I'd be all for it. I don't see what would lead anyone to think that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veryoldschool Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 5 minutes ago, spjunkies said: And therein lies the problem, our franchise is so used to poor we're going to be willing to accept mediocrity. Mediocrity? Do you think Tom Brady's grow on trees? Maybe you would've been one of Brady's critics in the early day who dismissed him as a "system" QB. Whatever, I wish you fellows would stick to the Not Impressed thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 1 minute ago, spjunkies said: And therein lies the problem, our franchise is so used to poor we're going to be willing to accept mediocrity. Well, he's breaking franchise records...not just outplaying Brunell, Campbell, and Frerotte. I am not going to rake anyone over the coals for not liking Cousins, but I just can't accept any plan that doesn't have an adequate replacement. I think your plan is far too optimistic that we could just find another guy to plug in. Tyrod Taylor makes $18M. Alex Smith makes $17M. Ryan Fitzpatrick makes $12M. RGIII makes $7.5M. To me, I'll pay Cousins $20-22M and understand what our baseline is over rolling the dice with someone we don't know who is going to command $10-12M as a starting QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 5 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: I don't really mind your opinion about Cousins, I just doubt that your plan gets us anywhere close to his production level. Whatever you want to rank him right now (let's say you think he's a 6/10), "the guy sitting on the beach" would not be anywhere close to that. So, your plan would save a few cap dollars, but weaken the QB position significantly. Who do you propose we play at QB while we groom a 2nd round pick (who could work out or not work out, as we know)? To me, that's the crux of any "replace Kirk" plan. If I knew that McCoy could produce at 90% of what Kirk is producing, I'd be all for it. I don't see what would lead anyone to think that. And if the front office knew that McCoy could produce 90% of what Kirk does, he'd be starting. Kirk is obviously on a "prove it" type of deal, and he's living up to his end of the bargain. Aside from the Steelers game, we have 2 losses/tie that are completely self inflicted. *Cowboys - points left on the field (Kirk) *Lions - Joe Barry - nuff said *Bengals - Hopkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek1973 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 57 minutes ago, lavar1156 said: But that's just it. McCloughan doesnt want this team to end up like the Colts and Ravens. Sure KC ends up with 4500 yards and 25+ TDs, I love for him to explain why he is not signing him and we role with say Colt. I am sure us fans will support the fact that he is saving money at the most important position in football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said: Mediocrity? Do you think Tom Brady's grow on trees? Maybe you would've been one of Brady's critics in the early day who dismissed him as a "system" QB. Whatever, I wish you fellows who stick in Not Impressed thread. Difference being Brady was a 23/24 year old kid with a ton of growth potential ahead, do you think soon to be 29 year old Cousins will get much better than he is now? I don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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