CNN: Florida Government repeals safety measures for infant cardiac patients

[ExoDus84]

This is pretty ****ing disgusting.

 

Earlier this year, CNN ran a big story about St. Mary's in Florida, and how the mortality rate for infant cardiac patients was significantly higher than other hospitals, and that they were not meeting hospital standards that had been in place for 38 years.

 

So what did the owners of the hospital do? Donate a few hundred thousand to politicians, and have the Governor get rid of the safety standards statewide.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/13/health/florida-hospital-standards-republican-gifts/index.html

 

 

 

The state of Florida is putting thousands of children with heart defects at risk, a group of cardiac doctors say, because of a change in policy that came after Tenet Healthcare contributed $200,000 to Florida Republicans.

 

In a widely publicized investigation in June, CNN revealed that a program at a Tenet hospital in Florida had failed to live up to state quality standards for children's heart surgery.

 

Less than two months later, the state decided to get rid of those standards.

 

Where are all the pro-lifers after this travesty of a decision?

[zoony]

:popcorn smiley that I miss so much:

[Dan T.]

------------------------------- "You mad Bro?"

[DogofWar1]

Only thing to say to that is "Oh, for ****'s sake, REALLY!?"

 

Alternatively:

"Think of the children!  Won't someone please THINK OF THE CHILDREN!"

 

I feel like that last one plays better to a crowd (while still being totally ineffective in fixing the corporate dictatorship we now live under).

 

I for one welcome our new Comcast overlords.

 

Or at least I would if this e-mail to them would send.  Internet's been spotty.

[Larry]

What often gets to me, about stories like this one, is not that our government is for sale to corporations, but how cheaply it's for sale.
 

$200K?  What's that, 10% of what their liability would be, for the death of one child? 

[TimmySmith]

Read the article twice and am still not sure what happened.  Perhaps CNN should reinstate journalistic standards.

[The Evil Genius]

Read the article twice and am still not sure what happened.  Perhaps CNN should reinstate journalistic standards.

 

 

1) A Tenet hospital in Florida had failed to live up to state quality standards that had been in place since 1977 for children's heart surgery.

 

2) Tenet Healthcare then contributed $200,000 to Florida Republicans.

 

3) Two months later, those state standards were scrapped by the State of Florida.

 

 

[twa]

 

 

 

Where are all the pro-lifers after this travesty of a decision?

 

Wondering what that 1/2 million dollar operation would pay for.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/09/health/childrens-heart-surgery-mortality-rates-qa/index.html

 

 

after all the pro-choice crowd likes cost indexes

[TimmySmith]

1) A Tenet hospital in Florida had failed to live up to state quality standards that had been in place since 1977 for children's heart surgery.

 

2) Tenet Healthcare then contributed $200,000 to Florida Republicans.

 

3) Two months later, those state standards were scrapped by the State of Florida.

A mention of exactly what "standards" were "scrapped" would be a nice addition.  A mention of why a 200K donation had such an effect on a multi billion dollar industry may have been helpful.  One also might want to know why a state would scrap such "standards" to protect a single hospital. 

 

In short, a pittance of a donation, scrapped nameless standards to protect a single hospital.  Maybe CNN is worried that the facts may get in the way of the outrage.

[Larry]

Yeah, I'm sure you're right. The real villain here is the Liberal Media.

[TradeTheBeal!]

If it makes hospitals more profitable, it's just the right thing to do.

#trickledown

#bootstraps

[tshile]

A mention of exactly what "standards" were "scrapped" would be a nice addition. A mention of why a 200K donation had such an effect on a multi billion dollar industry may have been helpful. One also might want to know why a state would scrap such "standards" to protect a single hospital.

In short, a pittance of a donation, scrapped nameless standards to protect a single hospital. Maybe CNN is worried that the facts may get in the way of the outrage.

You're not the only one.

There's nothing here to explain anything.

Some doctors and surgeons are mad. Looks shady. But no actual information.

[Burgold]

This hospital has had a "Significantly" higher number of deaths. The hospital has been cited for not meeting state cardiac standards. Now, those standards are gone. Is that likely to improve patient health and welfare? Surprised people are defending this.

 

Here's the local version of the story and some key bits

 

http://www.mypalmbeachpost.com/news/news/state-regional-govt-politics/challenge-of-florida-childrens-heart-surgery-polic/npmmn/

 

But in his ruling, Administrative Law Judge John Van Laningham said the children — whose case was supported by several pediatric cardiologists — did not have legal “standing” to challenge the department’s action.

“If these petitioners have standing, then there would be no intellectually honest limiting principle by which to deny standing to the person who routinely gets his teeth cleaned and wants to challenge the rules regulating dental hygienists on the grounds that they are insufficiently stringent to ensure quality care; or to the man who needs regular haircuts when he challenges the rules regulating barbers for not doing enough to guarantee his safety,” Van Laningham wrote.

:

He also downplayed the claim by critics that the move could threaten patients’ health.

Van Laningham said predicting the outcome was “an inherently speculative enterprise.” He added that hospitals and caregivers would still have other professional and personal motives to safeguard patient care, not just concerns about government oversight.

 

About the rule that has been abolished. Apparently, it provides for outside inspection and rating of the care, equipment and quality of a center.  http://www.mypalmbeachpost.com/news/news/local/rule-change-worries-many-following-st-marys-pediat/nn2Ds/

 

 

 

Campbell joined pediatric cardiologists and a nurse arguing against the agency’s plan to repeal a 30-year-old rule that supports quality standards and allows doctor-led inspections at Florida hospitals performing heart surgery on the state’s tiniest patients.

 

If the rule is gone, the future of the physician review group, the Cardiac Technical Advisory Panel, also would be clouded.

(snip)

Bob Blanchard, a Pensacola pediatric cardiologist who is medical director for the Florida Association of Children’s Hospitals, said CTAP reviews are important for heart units to undergo, along with meeting quality standards.

[tshile]

No one is defending it... just pointing out the lack of information.

Believe it or not, I'd prefer we not kill infants.

[TimmySmith]

No one is defending it... just pointing out the lack of information.

Believe it or not, I'd prefer we not kill infants.

Assuming these "standards" had anything to do with infants.  The world may never know.  

[Larry]

No one is defending it... just pointing out the lack of information.

Not exactly.

There's a difference between wishing for more information, and announcing that the information you've been given does not exist. (I have not seen any of the former.  Only the latter.) 

[tshile]

Not exactly.

There's a difference between wishing for more information, and announcing that the information you've been given does not exist. (I have not seen any of the former. Only the latter.)

Who said information didn't exist?

Did you read the articles linked?

[Larry]

Who said information didn't exist?

 

 

There's nothing here to explain anything.

Some doctors and surgeons are mad. Looks shady. But no actual information.

---

 

Did you read the articles linked?

Yeah. And some of the articles linked, from those articles.

No, I haven't seen anything that actually quotes the actual regulations. Yes, there actually is some information there.

 

---

 

Edit: 

 

Here's the original CNN story about the hospital in question. 

 

CNN:  Secret deaths: CNN finds high surgical death rate for children at a Florida hospital

 

It's got a lot of information.  (I've only read about half of it, myself.  It's really long.)  Names of the dead children.  Names of doctors.  Interviews with the parents of the dead children.  (Including the lies told to them by said doctors.) 

 

Independent doctors who reviewed the hospital's program. 

 

(Note:  Apparently, one of the standards that the state is getting rid of, is the rule stating that such programs must be reviewed by outside experts.) 

[Kilmer17]

It sounds aweful. But I've read all around it and still can't figure out what "standards" are that were ignored and then scrapped. Or if those standards being ignored is why the child died.

I'm ready to rage. But need some ammo

[Burgold]

Actually, I find Timmy's posts the ones more in line with defending the actions than Tshile's. I think Tshile was looking for more clarification which I hope the two local articles I posted provided..

 

If you read the articles, the doctors and hospitals all say the standards are beneficial. Some administers think that it just shouldn't be codified. In other words, they help. They save lives, but don't put it in writing so that if we don't follow through and something goes wrong we can be held responsible.

It sounds aweful. But I've read all around it and still can't figure out what "standards" are that were ignored and then scrapped. Or if those standards being ignored is why the child died.

I'm ready to rage. But need some ammo

As close as I got with just reading the two local articles, one of the big things they don't live up to was a practice of outiside inspection of equipment, facilities, and personnel. I think (if I'm understanding the articles) St. Mary's failed an inspection, then decided they didn't want to allow any more reviewers in.  Thus, they remained below standards, but continued to perform these procedures which resulted in nine infant deaths.

 

I don't think that's the whole of it, but I think that is a part.

[Larry]

FWIW, some little things I've noticed from these articles.

The hospital that CNN originally slammed, that started this thing, has shut down their unit ther performs these surgeries.

But two more hospitals in Florida have decided they want to get in on it. (No mention of who).

[TimmySmith]

Actually, I find Timmy's posts the ones more in line with defending the actions than Tshile's. I think Tshile was looking for more clarification which I hope the two local articles I posted provided..

 

If you read the articles, the doctors and hospitals all say the standards are beneficial. Some administers think that it just shouldn't be codified. In other words, they help. They save lives, but don't put it in writing so that if we don't follow through and something goes wrong we can be held responsible.

As close as I got with just reading the two local articles, one of the big things they don't live up to was a practice of outiside inspection of equipment, facilities, and personnel. I think (if I'm understanding the articles) St. Mary's failed an inspection, then decided they didn't want to allow any more reviewers in.  Thus, they remained below standards, but continued to perform these procedures which resulted in nine infant deaths.

 

I don't think that's the whole of it, but I think that is a part.

The articles you presented did a bit more to clarify the issue (without linking anything to certain donations or using the word "outrage").   The CNN article is straight political nonsense.

[tshile]

---

No, I haven't seen anything that actually quotes the actual regulations. Yes, there actually is some information there.

Right, nothing about the regulations.

Anything about the other questions asked? Why is an entire state changing regulations for one hospital, for 200k?

 

Because those were the questions asked. What are the regulations, and why did an entire state scrap them for 200k from one hospital?

 

Those would seem pretty important to understanding what is going on here..

 

Here's the original CNN story about the hospital in question. 

 

CNN:  Secret deaths: CNN finds high surgical death rate for children at a Florida hospital

 

It's got a lot of information.  (I've only read about half of it, myself.  It's really long.)  Names of the dead children.  Names of doctors.  Interviews with the parents of the dead children.  (Including the lies told to them by said doctors.) 

 

Independent doctors who reviewed the hospital's program. 

 

(Note:  Apparently, one of the standards that the state is getting rid of, is the rule stating that such programs must be reviewed by outside experts.)

Yeah, lots of information about everything other than the stuff we asked about.

 

Children's names. Wow, that tells me lots.

 

The doctors lied - that's terrible and they should be punished. What does that have to do with 200k donations and stripping of regulations?

 

Names of doctors. Interviews with parents.

 

In short, all emotional information that's designed to tug on heart strings (and does a good job doing so) but has absolutely nothing to do with the important parts of the story - the regulations that were removed and what this hospital has to do with it. We have quotes from doctors that are upset that Florida did this, we have parents telling heartbreaking stories, and that's it.

 

Asking for information actually important to the real story here (the one about Flordia getting rid of regulations) is:

- To you denying information exists (yet all you can produce is the one part about peer review groups not being required, which i seem to recall was speculation? not entirely sure)

- To you it's blaming the liberal media, or some nonsense

- To Burgold it's defending the hospital somehow

 

It's a terrible job by CNN. Absolutely terrible. That's all we've said. It has nothing to do with the hospital's actions or terrible track record with infants, or justifying or defending any of that.

 

If you're going to write an article accusing the GOP of accepting 200k worth of donations to change regulations that will cause babies to die you might want to tell us more about that link, tell us what the regulations are, and explain why they're important. At least attempt to explain how 200k and one hospital was enough to change regulations for an entire state.

 

They did none of that. They gave us awful stories about children dying.

 

It's Florida, it's politicians accepting money for what appears to be something truly awful, it's not like the bar is set real high here. Yet CNN, not surprisingly, managed to trip over it.

[Dan T.]

It's worth noting the background of Florida Governor Rick Scott, who made his fortune cofounding the Columbia Hospital Association, which merged with the Hospital Association of America, to become Columbia/HCA, the largest for-profit health care company in the United States.  Which gives an indication of where his sympathies might lie. 

 

State officials said the decision to scrap the standards came directly from Scott's appointed State surgeon general. 

[Larry]

Right, nothing about the regulations.

Anything about the other questions asked? Why is an entire state changing regulations for one hospital, for 200k?

Pointing out that "why" questions are often difficult to answer with absolute certainty.

Although I will point out that the articles have, in fact, proposed a theory which does actually fit the facts. (You actually mentioned said theory.)

(And so fer, it's the only theory that's been proposed.)