The Bad Timing Thread: Scoty Mac Giving the Redskins an Identity (sorry, none of our current QBs are in the plans)

[Wyvern]

If the running game works well in the regular season --- Cousins may not have to resort to passing so much, and having to throw deeper in to the defense to move the chains.

Scherff is an upgrade (run blocking) over Chester at RG, Moses is probably better than Polumbus. Morris has had a year to fit in with the power blocking scheme -- he seemed to find the fit around mid season -- too late for Cousins, but he made Griffin and McCoy look a little better.

IMHO, this team (especially the offense) is still transitioning from Shanhan's version to Gruden's version. So I'm not expecting playoffs -- but competitiveness. ...Especially if the defense can keep the offense in the game, and occasionally allow it to use ball-control WCO to bring in the points needed to eke out a win.

[88Comrade2000]

Welcome back.

 

 

I do agree with you that 2015 is an evaluation year and everyone on the team from the coaches to the players to maybe even the custodians and ticket people are being evauluated.

 

I do agree our QB of the future isn't on this team and neither is our coach of the future.

 

When the decision is made to change the coach; will Scot get to make that decision.  I know I sound like a broken record; but I don't trust Snyder to allow Scot to make the decision.  I am not even sure Scot gets a year 2 also; if there's some coach that wants full control and Dan takes a liking to. We know how he is.

 

If Scot does get to come back and make the choices; then I think it will take him 2-3 more years to fully stock the team to where he feels it should be.  I could see Kirk or Colt coming back on a short term contract and playing until the rookie QB is ready to play.

[Mooka]

If the running game works well in the regular season --- Cousins may not have to resort to passing so much, and having to throw deeper in to the defense to move the chains.

....

IMHO, this team (especially the offense) is still transitioning from Shanhan's version to Gruden's version. So I'm not expecting playoffs -- but competitiveness. ...Especially if the defense can keep the offense in the game, and occasionally allow it to use ball-control WCO to bring in the points needed to eke out a win.

 

Define "works well." And not poking at you here, I'm trying to picture what that would look like on this team. 

 

Last season you could argue our running game worked relatively well. We finished middle of the pack in most rushing stats but had some success there with every RB on our roster averaging over 4.0YPC. We were 19th in rushing, 14th in YPC and 9th in RTDs. Mediocre stats, but our team was below mediocre last season. 

 

Watching the games we all know that we were playing from behind many games making it hard to stick to the run and that turnovers, penalties and poor special teams play also hindered the running game. Almo also wasn't winning all the 1 on 1 match ups in the open field either. 

 

Our running game might have to be very good to give Cousins some breathing room. I'm not sure if I can picture it. I'm picturing Kirk dealing with a ton of pressure and adversity this season. 

 

 

If Scot does get to come back and make the choices; then I think it will take him 2-3 more years to fully stock the team to where he feels it should be.  I could see Kirk or Colt coming back on a short term contract and playing until the rookie QB is ready to play.

 

Sounds like a solid plan there. I also don't see a future here with Jay Gruden regardless of his ability to coach. We just may not have a winner for the next few seasons. 

 

Let's hope we don't have to bear through a Steve Spurrier or Mike Shanahan version 2.

[RedskinsLegacy]

I won't judge any QB the 1st year and here is why, some of the best QB's to ever play in this league were int machines in their 1st year and only had 1 win all season, but after a few seasons leading their teams, all won Super Bowls. While we have a QB who looked like a superstar in his 1st year, and now doesn't look like he could beat out a 3rd string QB.  Lets see Cousins stats after this season, then we can make a better judgement on man, whether he can over come int's and make those big time plays that good NFL QB's have to. I personally think the guy will be twice as good as last year, but only time will tell. Let's just please stay healthy and get back to winning football in Washington, Something all Redskins fans can agree on.

[newday]

We are building the lines this year. Use a high pick on QB next year.

[Koala]

Holy crop how has this devolved into another QB thread?? It's in the thread title people, the OP is arguing anything but QBS -- so we immediately set in on another Griffin vs Cousins discussion. Jeebus.

To the OP, I agree with most of what you say but I but the Scherrf pick was a mistake now matter how you cut it. Top 5 picks are once a decade phenomenon, you HAVE to get more value than we did. Last time we had a #5 pick it was Sean Taylor, for comparison.

IT took Redskins coaches like 2 practices to figure out he wasnt good enough to play tackle, how didn't SM figure this out before we drafted him?? And picking a guard at 5 is simply unacceptable, so double the shame on SM if he suspected Scherrf wasn't a true tackle. /rant

He has done a better job of getting quality depth than he has about improving the sad state of our starters. But that's exactly the genius of it.

For years we always focused on the starters, on the big name, on filling the immediate hole -- and we see how that worked out. SM takes the opposite approach, build quality depth that can push the starters, and eventually the cream will rise to the top.

THAT'S how you build a squad. I can't believe it took us this long to figure it out, but I am VERY comfortable with the direction and strategy.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

I don't subscribe to the "It will take five years to rebuild" idea that some of our more esteemed posters (Hi, SHF!!) subscribe to.

Any NFL team can be turned around from top to bottom in two years. Since I'm not sure we are currently an NFL team, I'll go with three in this instance.

Yeah LKB is pretty much the best poster on the board.

100% spot on.

[Peregrine]

Who we signed as the QBs coach is not the monumental signpost of our franchises future like you seem to think it is.  Thats an awful lot of conjecture over a simple QB coach.

[Mooka]

Who we signed as the QBs coach is not the monumental signpost of our franchises future like you seem to think it is.  Thats an awful lot of conjecture over a simple QB coach.

 

Its not, but bringing in a Scot McCloughlan was. And McCloughlan immediately started rebuilding our 2 lines, brought in many tough, physical defensive backs that can tackle and play press-man. Drafted the best run blocker, a physical RB, etc. 

 

He did not bring in any O-Line to improve the pass protection though there may have been no moves available nor any value in the draft there. Did not change up the receiving core (though we have receivers) and we are currently very short at TE. He also brought in a QBs coach that has little experience and no success with young QBs. 

 

So I assume our FO is preparing for the worst, but clearly we are no longer building around RG3 or Kirk Cousins. Cousins will have to prove he can run the kind of offense that will make us successful and that means he will have to have patience. In the type of offense we eventually want to run asking the QB to win games for you generally is the finishing touch. Its what transitioned Seattle from a tough, defensive team, to a SB team. (also what lost them the SB last year lol) I've watched Kirk understandably try and do waaaaay too much out there as he's trying to come into games off the bench to rally us back or fit the ball into super tight windows. He may have to shift gears and honestly, Washington might not be the best place for him in the future either. He may do better in an offense that will allow him to throw the ball more.

We'll have to see what kind of offense Gruden truly thinks our team is capable of.  

[88Comrade2000]

Actually, we have had an identity.  Just not one we prefer.

 

A clueless organization looking for the quick fix and giving undue amount of attention to star or star potential type players.

 

If Scot gets to do his job; hopefully we will have a new identity. 

[pjfootballer]

Holy crop how has this devolved into another QB thread?? It's in the thread title people, the OP is arguing anything but QBS -- so we immediately set in on another Griffin vs Cousins discussion. Jeebus.

To the OP, I agree with most of what you say but I but the Scherrf pick was a mistake now matter how you cut it. Top 5 picks are once a decade phenomenon, you HAVE to get more value than we did. Last time we had a #5 pick it was Sean Taylor, for comparison.

IT took Redskins coaches like 2 practices to figure out he wasnt good enough to play tackle, how didn't SM figure this out before we drafted him?? And picking a guard at 5 is simply unacceptable, so double the shame on SM if he suspected Scherrf wasn't a true tackle. /rant

He has done a better job of getting quality depth than he has about improving the sad state of our starters. But that's exactly the genius of it.

For years we always focused on the starters, on the big name, on filling the immediate hole -- and we see how that worked out. SM takes the opposite approach, build quality depth that can push the starters, and eventually the cream will rise to the top.

THAT'S how you build a squad. I can't believe it took us this long to figure it out, but I am VERY comfortable with the direction and strategy.

 

The drum has been beaten many times about fans opinions on the #5 pick. It was said that we were so deficient in most areas that Scot basically went "BPA" no matter the position.  I remember someone pulling up a quote after Scherff was drafted where Scot basically said that Scherff would play T or G or where ever we needed him and that he wanted to put the best "5" guys on the line no matter their draft status.

 

I know, I know, the "draft experts" say that taking a guard isn't "good value."  But with the slotted rookie salary system, it's the same "value" no matter what position was picked. If Scherff becomes an All-Pro for 10-15 years and solidifies a position that has been an albatross for us over the years, then we received "good value."  At this point, we need "good" players, not matter what. 

 

We have had a lack of talent and depth over the years.  I really wish fans would give Scot some time before declaring any of these picks as horrible.  We haven't even played one damn "meaningful" game yet.  You yourself said he is doing it right, yet you chastise him for picking Scherff at 5.  We need to stop being so hyper-critical of everything and let it play out.

[Thinking Skins]

I'm going to go back to my philosophy of not needing a superstar QB, and i'll somewhat counter the initial post and say that I don't think that the hiring of the QB coach doesn't really mean that Kirk and RG3 aren't the answer, but just that he knows how to coach QBs better than Gruden who really doesn't have the resume that Cavanaugh has.

 

But I think the more important part of this puzzle is the fact that Scot was brought in. And (putting on my positivity cap), I think that Scot's entire language from the get-go has been about building a team around the QB so that it doesn't rest solely on one player and require a superstar at the position. That makes me think that we'd rather draft a Joe Flacco or Andy Dalton, or a QB with potential who drops, and see if they can get us a ring rather than just going by the philosophy of "get me a franchise QB and I'll get you a SB".

[RedBeast]

If Scot gets to do his job; hopefully we will have a new identity.

The Washington "Head"skins?

I jest...but seriously. Support McDaddy 100%