Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 I think it's just as embarrassing to describe Skins fans' praise of Cooley as "deification" instead of "appreciation". You aren't embarrassed that we hold Chris Cooley in the same light that other franchises hold Hall of Fame players? I think it's just as embarrassing to describe Skins fans' praise of Cooley as "deification" instead of "appreciation". You aren't embarrassed that we hold Chris Cooley in the same light that other franchises hold Hall of Fame players? I think it's just as embarrassing to describe Skins fans' praise of Cooley as "deification" instead of "appreciation". You aren't embarrassed that we hold Chris Cooley in the same light that other franchises hold Hall of Fame players? No. Aside from the fact he's the most productive receiving TE this franchise has ever had outside of the great Jerry Smith, no other player in recent memory has been as approachable or means as much to the fans of this ball club as Chris Cooley. (The awesome one that is 10 notwithstanding.). Why wouldn't we bestow that acclaim on a guy who has done so much for this team and community? 'Embarrassed' at the esteem Chris Cooley is held by many Redskins fans is the very LAST emotion that comes to mind personally speaking. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 No. Aside from the fact he's the most productive receiving TE this franchise has ever had outside of the great Jerry Smith, no other player in recent memory has been as approachable or means as much to the fans of this ball club as Chris Cooley. (The awesome one that is 10 notwithstanding.). Why wouldn't we bestow that acclaim on a guy who has done so much for this team and community? 'Embarrassed' at the esteem Chris Cooley is held by many Redskins fans is the very LAST emotion that comes to mind personally speaking. Hail. None of that makes him a Hall of Fame football player, though. He is a great dude and he was a very good player. I haven't said that he wasn't. But we talk about him in the same breath as other guys that he has no business being mentioned with and it's disrespectful to those other players. "Tony Gonzales" - says the Falcons and Chiefs fan "Kellen Winslow" - says the Chargers fan "Chris Cooley" - says the Redskins fan All three fan bases look at us like we're stupid... and we say "But he makes cool pottery and he was really good when we sucked." All three fan bases are like, "Yep... not only are they all racist... but they are stupid, too." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 I'd never claim Chris was a HoF player. That's homerism and then some. Hell, he's not even our all time best TE. But he was up there with the very best in the league at his position through the main duration of his career and there's not much more you can ask of a guy than that. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 I'd never claim Chris was a HoF player. That's homerism and then some. Hell, he's not even our all time best TE. But he was up there with the very best in the league at his position through the main duration of his career and there's not much more you can ask of a guy than that. Hail. I agree with you 100% on all. He was even one of my farvorites during that time (as if we had many other choices, lol). That's why myself and so many others who are alike in thought process on Cooley hate talking about him like this... I don't want to paint him as a bad player or even a bad dude, he's just the opposite on both. But he is given rare air by a lot of this fan base. That's all I'm saying. Can we talk about so non-polarizing linebacker now? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted June 20, 2013 Author Share Posted June 20, 2013 The level that Cooley is held to is the reason he is overrated. Yes, he is one of the most productive TEs in franchise history, and that doesn't mean by any stretch of the imagination that we can't be grateful and appreciative, but it grew to an unhealthy level, to the point of a "Cooley or bust" mentality that fans had despite Fred Davis being the better option later in his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted June 20, 2013 Author Share Posted June 20, 2013 I agree with you 100% on all. He was even one of my farvorites during that time (as if we had many other choices, lol). That's why myself and so many others who are alike in thought process on Cooley hate talking about him like this... I don't want to paint him as a bad player or even a bad dude, he's just the opposite on both. But he is given rare air by a lot of this fan base. That's all I'm saying. Can we talk about so non-polarizing linebacker now? lol LaVar sucks, Marcus Washington was the man. Come to think of it, that 2007 defense should have by all accounts been one of the best defenses in the league: DE: Phillip Daniels DT: Anthony Montgomery DT: Cornelius Griffin DE: Andre Carter SLB: Marcus Washington MLB: London Fletcher WLB: Rocky McIntosh CB: Shawn Springs FS: Sean Taylor SS: LaRon Landry CB: Carlos Rogers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Cooley was one of the faces of our offense during a troubled and emotional few years for the Redskins and a league leader for a lot of that time. I'd hardly call him overrated. There were a ton of things going on that had us all with our heads in our hands and he would lift them up and bring a smile. That means something to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 LaVar sucks, Marcus Washington was the man. Come to think of it, that 2007 defense should have by all accounts been one of the best defenses in the league: DE: Phillip Daniels DT: Anthony Montgomery DT: Cornelius Griffin DE: Andre Carter SLB: Marcus Washington MLB: London Fletcher WLB: Rocky McIntosh CB: Shawn Springs FS: Sean Taylor SS: LaRon Landry CB: Carlos Rogers You know I was pretty surprised when we cut Anthony Montgomery upon Shanny's arrival. I wouldn't say he was underrated, but if you want a NT prospect who is already on your roster, you'll find few bigger men in the league, lol. EDIT: And gosh I wish Shawn Springs could've stayed healthy. I loved him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Curious question ..... Would any of you mock Dallas fans who hold up Witten as an all time Dallas great? I mean he's had similar, if slightly better production to Chris over the duration. All whilst working with a much better talent giving him the rock. And Dallas have ultimately been as unsuccessful as ourselves through his career. Both real nice, good guys who've meant a heck of a lot for their respective franchises and community whilst also being amongst the league's best on the field. Would Dallas fans be 'overrating' Witten to hold him in the same esteem as most Redskin fans do Cooley? Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Curious question ..... Would any of you mock Dallas fans who hold up Witten as an all time Dallas great? I mean he's had similar, if slightly better production to Chris over the duration. All whilst working with a much better talent giving him the rock. And Dallas have ultimately been as unsuccessful as ourselves through his career. Both real nice, good guys who've meant a heck of a lot for their respective franchises and community whilst also being amongst the league's best on the field. Would Dallas fans be 'overrating' Witten to hold him in the same esteem as most Redskin fans do Cooley? Hail. I'll say it, Witten is much more clutch than Cooley ever was. Not even an argument. Cooley was productive and had good stats, but I don't ever remember him being clutch or "go-to" at any point. EDIT: And a lot of that is Jason Campbell's fault. Who never led a game winning drive at the end of the game. Sure you can argue about that Saints game where he hit Tana deep, but that was more of a 4th corner comeback. You can say that about any number of players though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Curious question ..... Would any of you mock Dallas fans who hold up Witten as an all time Dallas great? I mean he's had similar, if slightly better production to Chris over the duration. All whilst working with a much better talent giving him the rock. And Dallas have ultimately been as unsuccessful as ourselves through his career. Both real nice, good guys who've meant a heck of a lot for their respective franchises and community whilst also being amongst the league's best on the field. Would Dallas fans be 'overrating' Witten to hold him in the same esteem as most Redskin fans do Cooley? Hail. I'll say it, Witten is much more clutch than Cooley ever was. Not even an argument. Cooley was productive and had good stats, but I don't ever remember him being clutch or "go-to" at any point. No question Witten is the better of the two. But the point being there's not that much overall difference in production, and ultimately both franchises achieved little with either man. Yet it's somehow fine to talk about Witten as one of the leagues best over the duration but to do that with Chris is 'overhyping' him? I'm basically on the same page as were you guys are coming from. But I don't get how you think Redskins fans are overhyping a recent Redskin great when it comes to this fanbase and this team. Hail. *Edit* And I don't know how much more 'clutch' Cooley could of been for Campbell or Scott '05 through '07/ '08. At times, he was our ONLY 'go to' guy that they could rely on. (With no disrespect to 'Tana who was often WIDE open but missed by Captain Checkdowns singular vision.). I think the surrounding dross is clouding your memory man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Curious question ..... Would any of you mock Dallas fans who hold up Witten as an all time Dallas great? I mean he's had similar, if slightly better production to Chris over the duration. All whilst working with a much better talent giving him the rock. And Dallas have ultimately been as unsuccessful as ourselves through his career. Both real nice, good guys who've meant a heck of a lot for their respective franchises and community whilst also being amongst the league's best on the field. Would Dallas fans be 'overrating' Witten to hold him in the same esteem as most Redskin fans do Cooley? Hail. I'll say it, Witten is much more clutch than Cooley ever was. Not even an argument. Cooley was productive and had good stats, but I don't ever remember him being clutch or "go-to" at any point. EDIT: And a lot of that is Jason Campbell's fault. Who never led a game winning drive at the end of the game. Sure you can argue about that Saints game where he hit Tana deep, but that was more of a 4th corner comeback. You can say that about any number of players though. That role has been held by Moss for a long time here. Witten is a fantastic TE and has been better than Cooley. There, I said it. Washington >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>LaVar. Not even close. Springs was great too. I really wish he had stayed healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Curious question ..... Would any of you mock Dallas fans who hold up Witten as an all time Dallas great? I mean he's had similar, if slightly better production to Chris over the duration. All whilst working with a much better talent giving him the rock. And Dallas have ultimately been as unsuccessful as ourselves through his career. Both real nice, good guys who've meant a heck of a lot for their respective franchises and community whilst also being amongst the league's best on the field. Would Dallas fans be 'overrating' Witten to hold him in the same esteem as most Redskin fans do Cooley? Hail. I'll say it, Witten is much more clutch than Cooley ever was. Not even an argument. Cooley was productive and had good stats, but I don't ever remember him being clutch or "go-to" at any point. No question Witten is the better of the two. But the point being there's not that much overall difference in production, and ultimately both franchises achieved little with either man. Yet it's somehow fine to talk about Witten as one of the leagues best over the duration but to do that with Chris is 'overhyping' him? I'm basically on the same page as were you guys are coming from. But I don't get how you think Redskins fans are overhyping a recent Redskin great when it comes to this fanbase and this team. Hail. *Edit* And I don't know how much more 'clutch' Cooley could of been for Campbell or Scott '05 through '07/ '08. At times, he was our ONLY 'go to' guy that they could rely on. I think the surrounding dross is clouding your memory man. I think it's less of Witten not being great and more of "It's all Romo sits to pee's fault" with Dallas though. Witten is a baller. He catches everything and he's hard to take down... but if he's running the other way 20 times a year... oye. So if anything with Witten it's a sympathy thing from the media like: "Sorry you have Romo sits to pee as a qb, dude." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted June 20, 2013 Author Share Posted June 20, 2013 Curious question ..... Would any of you mock Dallas fans who hold up Witten as an all time Dallas great? I mean he's had similar, if slightly better production to Chris over the duration. All whilst working with a much better talent giving him the rock. And Dallas have ultimately been as unsuccessful as ourselves through his career. Both real nice, good guys who've meant a heck of a lot for their respective franchises and community whilst also being amongst the league's best on the field. Would Dallas fans be 'overrating' Witten to hold him in the same esteem as most Redskin fans do Cooley? Hail. Not at all, because Witten has been productive for his whole career. Cooley was wildly productive for his first five, then essentially fell off a cliff for three of his last four. Witten has arguably gotten better as his career progressed. He put up his highest ypc of his career two years ago, and the second most yards in his career last year. He has surpassed 1000 yards four times. Cooley never broke 900, Witten did it seven times. Cooley only outproduced Witten one time in his career (two if you count touchdowns). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 And before anyone gets in my knickers about "Well you said JCam was partially to blame for Cooley" and then you said "Romo sits to pee gets the blame for Witten" and how is that not the same thing? Well, you're right. But I'll tell you. Romo sits to pee is/was/and will always be much better then Jason Campbell ever is/was/or will be. We are lying to ourselves if you say otherwise. Romo sits to pee makes dumb plays and he also makes great plays. Campbell played safe... very safe. Cooley benefitted from Campbell constantly checking down. But he was hurt by Campbell because JCam rarely went deep and rarely completed a deep pass. Witten isn't or wasn't made by Romo sits to pee, but he makes Romo sits to pee better. I'm not saying Cooley didn't make JCam better, and there is only so much you can do there, but I'd argue if JCam had Witten he'd make that QB better instead of just being a reliable guy like Cooley was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Curious question ..... Would any of you mock Dallas fans who hold up Witten as an all time Dallas great? I mean he's had similar, if slightly better production to Chris over the duration. All whilst working with a much better talent giving him the rock. And Dallas have ultimately been as unsuccessful as ourselves through his career. Both real nice, good guys who've meant a heck of a lot for their respective franchises and community whilst also being amongst the league's best on the field. Would Dallas fans be 'overrating' Witten to hold him in the same esteem as most Redskin fans do Cooley? Hail. Not at all, because Witten has been productive for his whole career. Cooley was wildly productive for his first five, then essentially fell off a cliff for three of his last four. Witten has arguably gotten better as his career progressed. He put up his highest ypc of his career two years ago, and the second most yards in his career last year. He has surpassed 1000 yards four times. Cooley never broke 900, Witten did it seven times. Cooley only outproduced Witten one time in his career (two if you count touchdowns). Oh come on man, Cooley was heavily injured two of the last four years. And the last year he was brought back as a fill-in to make up the numbers as he knew the scheme after FreddyD went down. Talking of whom, when has Witten had anyone of that caliber competing against him and taking away plays? Or for that matter when has Witten had to deal with a run first Gibbs O and still produce to a high standard? Uncannily, Jason Witten is a Cowboy I really like. Great player. And an even better man. He's up there with Coach Landry, Staubach and Aikman among the VERY few Dallas guys I totally admire and respect. But you've got to look at the bigger picture and ALL facets when looking at Jason and Chris over the duration. And factor them all in, there's really not that much difference between the two however you try cut it for me. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted June 20, 2013 Author Share Posted June 20, 2013 But you've got to look at the bigger picture and ALL facets when looking at Jason and Chris over the duration. And factor them all in, there's really not that much difference between the two however you try cut it for me. Hail. That right there is over-rating him. Witten has averaged 5 catches per game over his career, Cooley 3.6 Witten has 56.3 yards per game, Cooley 40.3 Witten has .27 TDs per game, Cooley .28 By any measure, Witten has been the better player over the course of his career. And it's not really close. If Cooley were really as good as Witten, or they were essentially the same player, there would have been no need to draft his successor, and Shanny wouldn't have released him this past year. If you list the Pantheon of modern Tight Ends (from 2000 to present), Cooley is far down that list. Gonzo Gates Witten V. Davis Gronk Graham Then Cooley gets thrown in with the likes of Dallas Clark, Ben Watson, Kellen Winslow Jr, Todd Heap, etc. Putting him up with the likes of Witten over the course of his career is how he gets overrated. He had 5 very good years. Over his career though he was average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 But you've got to look at the bigger picture and ALL facets when looking at Jason and Chris over the duration. And factor them all in, there's really not that much difference between the two however you try cut it for me. Hail. That right there is over-rating him. Witten has averaged 5 catches per game over his career, Cooley 3.6 Witten has 56.3 yards per game, Cooley 40.3 Witten has .27 TDs per game, Cooley .28 By any measure, Witten has been the better player over the course of his career. And it's not really close. If Cooley were really as good as Witten, or they were essentially the same player, there would have been no need to draft his successor, and Shanny wouldn't have released him this past year. So VINNY CERRATO'S drafting decisions are being used to support the claim that Cooley is "the most overrated Redskin of all time"? lol....Holy crap. I'd be curious to see, back when Davis was drafted, if you responded to it by saying "I'm not surprised...we need to find Cooley's successor," or if you were like 99% of the rest of the board and said "WTF? We have Cooley!! We don't need another TE!" lol ... And as was pointed out earlier, it wasn't as if Cooley's production "fell off a cliff" simply because he wasn't good enough ("then essentially fell off a cliff for three of his last four."). He was on IR two of those last four seasons, and was released from the team in another one of them. That was a completely disingenuous way to describe Cooley's last 4 years here. Longevity is a hallmark of the great ones, and unfortunately for Cooley he didn't possess that during his career due to injuries so he can't be put up there with the Wittens and Winslows of the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 But you've got to look at the bigger picture and ALL facets when looking at Jason and Chris over the duration. And factor them all in, there's really not that much difference between the two however you try cut it for me. Hail. That right there is over-rating him. ..... And conversely you're not taking every aspect into consideration when comparing. I hate to say you're doing this for once in your posting career bro', but you're just using stats to suit and not taking everything else into consideration. Put Witten here, with the run first systems and poor talent running those systems, allied to the injuries; and Cooley in Dallas with all Wittens had his career and tell me the respective numbers would be much of any different for either guy. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 And before anyone gets in my knickers about "Well you said JCam was partially to blame for Cooley" and then you said "Romo sits to pee gets the blame for Witten" and how is that not the same thing? Well, you're right. But I'll tell you. Romo sits to pee is/was/and will always be much better then Jason Campbell ever is/was/or will be. We are lying to ourselves if you say otherwise. Romo sits to pee makes dumb plays and he also makes great plays. Campbell played safe... very safe. Cooley benefitted from Campbell constantly checking down. But he was hurt by Campbell because JCam rarely went deep and rarely completed a deep pass. Witten isn't or wasn't made by Romo sits to pee, but he makes Romo sits to pee better. I'm not saying Cooley didn't make JCam better, and there is only so much you can do there, but I'd argue if JCam had Witten he'd make that QB better instead of just being a reliable guy like Cooley was. But then the opposite side of that coin says that if Cooley had a pass-happy OC like Garrett and a QB on the level of Romo sits to pee throwing to him all of his stats would noticeably improve (actually that mod from CZ said the same thing). Cooley would have had a QB who actually hit him in stride. And if you think Cooley was JC's safety valve, you should hear how Cowboys fans talk about Romo sits to pee relying heavily on Witten lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 But you've got to look at the bigger picture and ALL facets when looking at Jason and Chris over the duration. And factor them all in, there's really not that much difference between the two however you try cut it for me. Hail. That right there is over-rating him. ..... And conversely you're not taking every aspect into consideration when comparing. I hate to say you're doing this for once in your posting career bro', but you're just using stats to suit and not taking everything else into consideration. Put Witten here, with the run first systems and poor talent running those systems, allied to the injuries; and Cooley in Dallas with all Wittens had his career and tell me the respective numbers would be much of any different for either guy. Hail. I eluded to this earlier in the thread. Witten would've been better than Cooley here. He's a coverage nightmare and with us running the ball it would've been one-hand-washing-the-other all day with CP26 in his prime. As I said earlier, I don't think Romo sits to pee makes Witten better (just the opposite in fact). I also don't think Cooley made JCam better or that Cooley would've made Romo sits to pee better, but I truly believe Witten would've made JCam better. And before anyone gets in my knickers about "Well you said JCam was partially to blame for Cooley" and then you said "Romo sits to pee gets the blame for Witten" and how is that not the same thing? Well, you're right. But I'll tell you. Romo sits to pee is/was/and will always be much better then Jason Campbell ever is/was/or will be. We are lying to ourselves if you say otherwise. Romo sits to pee makes dumb plays and he also makes great plays. Campbell played safe... very safe. Cooley benefitted from Campbell constantly checking down. But he was hurt by Campbell because JCam rarely went deep and rarely completed a deep pass. Witten isn't or wasn't made by Romo sits to pee, but he makes Romo sits to pee better. I'm not saying Cooley didn't make JCam better, and there is only so much you can do there, but I'd argue if JCam had Witten he'd make that QB better instead of just being a reliable guy like Cooley was. But then the opposite side of that coin says that if Cooley had a pass-happy OC like Garrett and a QB on the level of Romo sits to pee throwing to him all of his stats would noticeably improve (actually that mod from CZ said the same thing). Cooley would have had a QB who actually hit him in stride. And if you think Cooley was JC's safety valve, you should hear how Cowboys fans talk about Romo sits to pee relying heavily on Witten lol... Well, that's their problem for having a complex offense that is hard to learn for their crack-head WRs. Campbell didn't help Cooley at all, but Witten ran better routes, had better hands, was bigger, stronger, faster, smarter, and did better than Cooley at what Cooley did best in his prime... YAC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedlamVR Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 But you've got to look at the bigger picture and ALL facets when looking at Jason and Chris over the duration. And factor them all in, there's really not that much difference between the two however you try cut it for me. Hail. That right there is over-rating him. Witten has averaged 5 catches per game over his career, Cooley 3.6 Witten has 56.3 yards per game, Cooley 40.3 Witten has .27 TDs per game, Cooley .28 By any measure, Witten has been the better player over the course of his career. And it's not really close. If Cooley were really as good as Witten, or they were essentially the same player, there would have been no need to draft his successor, and Shanny wouldn't have released him this past year. If you list the Pantheon of modern Tight Ends (from 2000 to present), Cooley is far down that list. Gonzo Gates Witten V. Davis Gronk Graham Then Cooley gets thrown in with the likes of Dallas Clark, Ben Watson, Kellen Winslow Jr, Todd Heap, etc. Putting him up with the likes of Witten over the course of his career is how he gets overrated. He had 5 very good years. Over his career though he was average. You are going put Rob Gronkowski in the Pantheon of greatest TE in history (or since 2000) despite the fact essentially he is catching balls from one of the best QBs ever to live and given the huuuuuge number of surgeries and procedures Gronk has been through over the past 2years may not be playing in the league in 12 months and at the end of it he might have that one eye popping season in 2011 and that be it .. And then you have those other TEs you have thrown in the Trash - just go up the I95 and you will get the answer to the question who was the best TE in the early 2000s and I am betting mr Heaps name will come up more than once ... and Dallas Clark in Indy i am sure you will get a bunch of people comparing Clark to the top TEs of the age .. The point is - some one is over rated is someone who generates a lot of talk but achieves very very little - I cannot see how you can call the best receiving TE the Redskins have had in their franchise history who consistently put up numbers early in his career to be one of the top 5 TEs in the the league, who is amongst the top 5 productive pass catchers in the franchise history - over rated .. The final 4 years took the sheen off - but lets look at those last 4 years . 2012 brought back when Davis went down with a ACL, in 2011 was that year too far but in 2010 he had a career year in terms of yards but was no where near the player he was and that was coming off a serious injury ... and I always ask this - in 2010 Davis coming off the a great showing in 2009 slips back into the shadow of Cooley - what happened then - i mean CC is supposed to be this terrible person with a horrible work ethic and yet somehow he spoils Freds coming out party ? It still doesn't add up .. But yes the tail end of Cooleys career has been average but that does not take anything away from what he did in the early part of his career - Does Gibbs 2 take away from anything he did in the 80's? Was Larry Allen one of the best offensive linemen in to play the game in the early 90s ...does the fact his career went on and on take away from his early achievements ? Would you consider Urlacher a HoF level of player despite the fact he has not been a force for more than half a decade ? Does the fact Art Monk end his career as an Eagle take away a decade of achievements with the Skins ? And speaking of Monk .. this all Cooley did was catch check down passes from Campbell and made a career out of it... does it not sound like certain national writer and the "All he did was catch 8 yard button hooks" comments on Monk - and that was the justification why he was snubbed for HoF honors ( i am not saying Cooley is HOF by any means) But that was just factually dubious as is the Jason Campbell coment .. given JC didn't start untill the back end of 2006 and then was injured for half of 2007 and in 2009 Campbell started but Cooley was injured - then I count that as maybe 2 seasons of starts where Cooley and Campbell played together - was he catching check down passes from Campbell from the bench ? And then you talk about he has not had the impact say a Witten did - but Witten i believe has played his entire career with Tony Romo sits to pee, they are BFFs hell he even went down to mexico with him to chilax between the season and divisional round of the payoffs ... The chemistry they have developed is not easy to replicate especially with the QBs we had between 2004 and 2011 - Cooley was not blessed with exceptional athletic ability or measurables or a great supporting cast or stable coaching and team direction but what he was good at was making plays and making them on a consistant basis .. To call someone over rated just because you perceive other people think he is on some elevated level is just stupid ... i mean really really hound dog in a bag stupid - point me to the Chris Cooley HoF thread ... Yes there was an appreciation thread for the guy - what does that prove - we had one for James Thrash and Jon Jansen other people thought he played well - well above what ever could have been expected for him .. Cooley was so well liked by some of the fan base because he was not the inaccessible asshat, or immature idiot - he remained as he would always be had he been, has he been a starting NFL TE or joe shmoe at the gas station ... when it came to extension time his contract was very modest by comparison and he made it clear when his career was winding down he would rather not play than not be a Redskin, and unusually he stood by what he said ... thats why people liked him ... and when he was good he was very good and he maybe played off reputation in some peoples minds but what NFL player doesn't ? I really liked Chris Cooley but i would never say he could be HoF player - but that does not make him average or below average ... just like it don't make Garry Clark average ... or Chris Samuels average, or Mark May average... i think i am just about done with this honestly ... i need to move on Stephen Davis -- over rated ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted June 20, 2013 Author Share Posted June 20, 2013 And conversely you're not taking every aspect into consideration when comparing. I hate to say you're doing this for once in your posting career bro', but you're just using stats to suit and not taking everything else into consideration. Put Witten here, with the run first systems and poor talent running those systems, allied to the injuries; and Cooley in Dallas with all Wittens had his career and tell me the respective numbers would be much of any different for either guy. Hail. That's just it though, if the two traded places I think that Witten still would have done better than Cooley. Like DC said, he's a matchup nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Let me just quickly point out that with Vinnie Testeverde throwing him the ball on the 6-10 Cowboys, Jason Witten caught 87 passes for 980 yards and 6 TDs and went to the pro-bowl. The next year, with 33 year-old Brunell-esque Drew Bledsoe under center, Jason Witten had 66 receptions for 757 yards and 6 TDs and went to the pro-bowl. The next year, with that same Drew Bledsoe throwing the ball for the first six games of the season before first-time starter Tony Romo sits to pee took over, Witten caught 64 passes for 754 yards ... and went to the pro-bowl. Witten is a nine-time pro-bowler and two-time all-pro, and it's not because he's had this awesome team around him. He's actually a really good player, and suggesting Cooley is as good is ... well ... overrating him. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Let me just quickly point out that with Vinnie Testeverde throwing him the ball on the 6-10 Cowboys, Jason Witten caught 87 passes for 980 yards and 6 TDs and went to the pro-bowl. The next year, with 33 year-old Brunell-esque Drew Bledsoe under center, Jason Witten had 66 receptions for 757 yards and 6 TDs and went to the pro-bowl. The next year, with that same Drew Bledsoe throwing the ball for the first six games of the season before first-time starter Tony Romo sits to pee took over, Witten caught 64 passes for 754 yards ... and went to the pro-bowl. Witten is a nine-time pro-bowler and two-time all-pro, and it's not because he's had this awesome team around him. He's actually a really good player, and suggesting Cooley is as good is ... well ... overrating him. Sorry. But seriously... it's conversations like this that divide the fan base on the issue. If you over rate Cooley your mind isn't going to be changed... and if you say Cooley was just a really good player, you're a hater... but you're also correct No need for anymore Burgundy on Burgundy crime, fellas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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