HTTR24-7: Andrew Luck- Greatness in GIFs

[pjfootballer]

Colts 2013 opponents:

Texans (2), Titans (2), Jags (2)

San Diego, Oakland, Denver, KC

1 AFC East team TBD

1 AFC North team TBD

St Louis, San Fran, Arizona and Seattle.

Redskins 2013:

Dallas (2), Philly (2), NYG (2)

Detroit, Minnesota, GB, Chicago

1 NFC South TBD

1 NFC West TBD

San Diego, Oakland, Denver, KC

---------- Post added December-7th-2012 at 11:19 AM ----------

I think those arguing for Luck over Griffin would be better served pointing to Robert's numbers dropping back w/o play-action, or his third and long percentage. I have doubts whether Griffin would fare nearly as well in the Colts system. Of course separating a player from the scheme they run is problematic in and of itself. And we sure as heck got the right guy for our scheme (or maybe the right scheme for our guy).

Good points. I'd like to see Griffin get better with straight dropbacks without play action. I'd like to see him improve our 3rd down percentage. Griffin isn't perfect either and still has alot to work on. I think he knows it, which is what makes him such a great player.

[J-bomb]

I guess this thread or his tweet got some attention because nfl am has a segment "What are Rg3 weaknesses" really ? This thread should be showed on nfl network but doubt they do it...

[Saqs]

Good points. I'd like to see Griffin get better with straight dropbacks without play action. I'd like to see him improve our 3rd down percentage. Griffin isn't perfect either and still has alot to work on. I think he knows it, which is what makes him such a great player.

I dont understand why operating out of straight drop backs or under center is such a point of emphasis when we can do all of what can be done under center plus some out of the Pistol formation. Hell I watched Peyton Manning pass out of shotgun or play action probably 90%+ of their plays last night. We know he can do it and he has done it. He was under center a lot in the Pittsburgh game. But why is it necessary?

[steve09ru]

The biggest excuse I see for RG3 being successful is that he has a solid running game that helps him out - they fail to mention that he is the reason the running game is successful. Sure the oline has opened up some holes and Morris runs hard but a lot of it is because RG3 freezes everyone and by the time they realize who has the ball Morris is at the line and gone - he directly affects his own numbers - just tired of hearing it's because he has a good run game

[pjfootballer]

I dont understand why operating out of straight drop backs or under center is such a point of emphasis when we can do all of what can be done under center plus some out of the Pistol formation. Hell I watched Peyton Manning pass out of shotgun or play action probably 90%+ of their plays last night. We know he can do it and he has done it. He was under center a lot in the Pittsburgh game. But why is it necessary?

I didn't say I wanted us to do "just" straight dropnbacks. What I'd like to see him do is improve on it and get better. Without the play action, he does struggle a bit with this part of his game. But we all knew that. If he gets better at this, then it's just another thing for the defense to worry about "In Addition" to his ability to run the read option and throw out of the pistol/play action. The more he can do, the better.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

I thought he was good at progressions. It looked like all but two of the INT's he never took his eyes off the primary and was throwing there no mater what. So call me confused

That's been a knock on him. His ability to read defenses post-snap has been pretty bad. But he's a rookie and that's sort of what you expect from rookie QB's. Russell Wilson and RG3 are VERY rare exceptions to this.

[Spaceman Spiff]

IMO, RG3 is a Magic Johnson moreso than a Michael Jordan. He doesn't have to throw for 250+ yards to make his impact felt on a game. Magic Johnson could dominate a game by scoring 12 points but handing out 10+ assists and starting fast breaks off rebounds.

[Laron Burgundy]

Colts 2013 opponents:

Texans (2), Titans (2), Jags (2)

San Diego, Oakland, Denver, KC

1 AFC East team TBD

1 AFC North team TBD

St Louis, San Fran, Arizona and Seattle.

Redskins 2013:

Dallas (2), Philly (2), NYG (2)

Detroit, Minnesota, GB, Chicago

1 NFC South TBD

1 NFC West TBD

San Diego, Oakland, Denver, KC

If we do take our division, which I think we stand a good shot due to the giants having such a brutal december schedule, that means we get Atlanta and San Fran as the TBD teams. Atlanta, GB, San Fran, Denver, NYG and Chicago? Are they serious? That'll be like 7 games against top 10 teams next year. Heck, 5 of those guys have been ranked 1st at some point this season and Denver may climb to 1st soon. Meanwhile it looks like Indy gets the Bills and Steelers as their TBD. They get Texans, Denver, San Fran and a questionable Pitt team (yes, they are better than they are now with a healthy roethlisberger, but a 35 year old Harrison and Kiesel, 36 year old Hampton 32 year old Polamalu, 34 year old Clark and 33 year old Ike Taylor? That defense is going to fall apart hard and soon).

I didn't say I wanted us to do "just" straight dropnbacks. What I'd like to see him do is improve on it and get better. Without the play action, he does struggle a bit with this part of his game. But we all knew that. If he gets better at this, then it's just another thing for the defense to worry about "In Addition" to his ability to run the read option and throw out of the pistol/play action. The more he can do, the better.

RG3's numbers on dropback passes were something like 62% completion with 8 tds and 1 int, problem is he only had 5.3 ypa, which would be league low. Thing is I'd wager MOST qb's take their deep shots from PA AND we never, EVER 7 step drop for deep throws, so I think that skews the numbers a bit as well. Certainly it could use work but it isn't as doom and gloom as some may have you believe.

[iMeast]

Lots and lots of overthrows. They may be winning, but it isn't specifically because of him.

HTTR

[ILikeBilly]

The deep throw down the right sideline is the one I would find scary if I was a Colts fan. The receiver is open and Luck has time, but the ball just floats and forces the receiver to slow down. Of course, it is picked off. Is his arm that weak?

[skinny21]

I didn't say I wanted us to do "just" straight dropnbacks. What I'd like to see him do is improve on it and get better. Without the play action, he does struggle a bit with this part of his game. But we all knew that. If he gets better at this, then it's just another thing for the defense to worry about "In Addition" to his ability to run the read option and throw out of the pistol/play action. The more he can do, the better.

Exactly. Hopefully we can improve the line in the offseason, because right now it really hinders the offense in terms of obvious passing downs. Makes it more difficult to grade Griffin in this area too.

[IrepDC]

I was one of the people that had been watching the Colts this year and said Luck looks like Grossman at times, "**** it, I'm going deep." Now people can see some of that. He's had a LOT of INT's dropped this year, too.

[nuposse87]

RG III fits into our scheme perfectly as Luck is fitting into their scheme perfectly. They're both ahead of the curve (for rookies) and have both respective squads probably playing ahead of the talent on their respective rosters. Bashing either one of them for their shortcomings seems nonsensical to me. I look forward to their first regular season meeting, cause I fully expect the skins to come out on top

[KCClybun]

I was one of the people that had been watching the Colts this year and said Luck looks like Grossman at times, "**** it, I'm going deep." Now people can see some of that. He's had a LOT of INT's dropped this year, too.

Luck had 1 pick versus Green Bay, but I swear, watching that game he should've had six. And I said that without a hint of hyperbole; balls hit defenders right in the hands.

[Dallsux]

Jay Gillespie December 7, 2012 at 3:50 PM

Luck is playing a pro style offense unlike RG3. He is learning the speed of the NFL defenders without any help especially by o-line. Pressure in your face all day will cause you to slip. Colts are not looking for a great year but are getting one anyways. They are giving a Luck a crash course in NFL. He will come out next year like a veteran, RG3 and Wilson will come out and getting clobbered by defenses that have figured him out and they will be way behind Luck

This made me lol. Obviously a Luck Homer.

[rm1369]

I laugh at this one every time.. How do you throw this when you know the CB is sitting there in zone? Dumb decision..

http://httr24-7.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/lUCK1.gif

His rookie receiver ran a slant and didn't cross the face of the defender - he ran behind him. Luck trusted his receiver to run the right route. He didn't. Confirmed by both Arians and Hilton. One of the other interceptions was also a wrong route by the rookie Brazil. Again confirmed by Arians and Brazil. The Colts have 6 rookies that are major contributors on offense. Believe it or not, all the offensive mistakes are not on Luck.

---------- Post added December-7th-2012 at 11:16 PM ----------

It's funny, I started frequenting this forum because it appeared that, unlike most forums, there were some decent non homer conversations and I looked forward to watching and contrasting the development of the two great QBs our teams have been blessed with. After reading the first few pages of this thread I've realized how wrong I've been. It may just be the most homerrific, straight hating threads I've ever seen. I certainly wouldn't expect any Skins fan to want anybody other than RGIII - just as you won't find a Colts or Seahawks fan who would want anyone other than Luck or Wilson. But Rex Grossman? I see there's no point in trying to discuss anything rationally. Have your circle jerk and I'll keep looking for a decent, non blatant homer NFL discussion.

[bradboyd80]

.......Have your circle jerk and I'll keep looking for a decent, non blatant homer NFL discussion.

What did you expect? Every forum has loads of homers; I'm sure the Colts forums are no different. Obviously it just sounds as though you're a bit butt-hurt that Luck is actually being given some criticism for the 16 or so interceptions that he's thrown this year. Yeah, he's a rookie and interceptions are to be expected. But he's being given WAY too much credit for your team's success given your strength of schedule. It's not like he's racking up wins against elite defenses (as it might seem based on the way some folks talk).

Edit: Don't forget, this franchise has endured 20 years of failure. We finally have our QB who is lights out just about every game he plays, and has us close to winning our division and back to relevancy. A little homerism is to be expected right now. There are plenty of good conversations held here, so stick around and perhaps you'll see for yourself this can be a good place to visit for good football discussion.

[KCClybun]

It's funny, I started frequenting this forum because it appeared that, unlike most forums, there were some decent non homer conversations and I looked forward to watching and contrasting the development of the two great QBs our teams have been blessed with. After reading the first few pages of this thread I've realized how wrong I've been. It may just be the most homerrific, straight hating threads I've ever seen. I certainly wouldn't expect any Skins fan to want anybody other than RGIII - just as you won't find a Colts or Seahawks fan who would want anyone other than Luck or Wilson. But Rex Grossman? I see there's no point in trying to discuss anything rationally. Have your circle jerk and I'll keep looking for a decent, non blatant homer NFL discussion.

Before you get indignant, I'd figured I'd explain to you why those two interceptions aren't completely on the rookie wide receivers.

On the ball he was going to throw to T.Y Hilton; okay, T.Y Hilton ran the wrong route. But it was still a bad decision by Luck to throw it in the first place. The corner Drayton Florence was sitting there in zone, basically waiting for a slant route. He was squatting on that route, with his eyes trained on Luck in the backfield.

Even if T.Y does cross his face, Florence either makes a tackle, breaks up the pass, or jumps the slant route anyway, since he was just sitting there, waiting for it. And even with that, Luck's ball location on that pass would've been bad, as the pass was high, and it would been behind Hilton. On a slant route you want to guide your guy away from coverage, not put a ball behind him.

As for the interception on the pass for Brazill, I can't see how that was on Brazill.

This is the look Luck had;

Brazill looks like he's running a deeper route here, and the safety is looking to cover him.

What draws the safety up is the fact that Luck is staring down Brazill after he steps up in the pocket.

Was Brazill supposed to run a very, very deep comeback or something? If Luck holds the safety, or gives him a pump fake, he has Brazill over the top for a touchdown.

Instead, he just flat underthrew it.

Or are you talking about another play to Brazill?

[rm1369]

What did you expect? Every forum has loads of homers; I'm sure the Colts forums are no different. Obviously it just sounds as though you're a bit butt-hurt that Luck is actually being given some criticism for the 16 or so interceptions that he's thrown this year. Yeah, he's a rookie and interceptions are to be expected. But he's being given WAY too much credit for your team's success given your strength of schedule. It's not like he's racking up wins against elite defenses (as it might seem based on the way some folks talk).

Edit: Don't forget, this franchise has endured 20 years of failure. We finally have our QB who is lights out just about every game he plays, and has us close to winning our division and back to relevancy. A little homerism is to be expected right now. There are plenty of good conversations held here, so stick around and perhaps you'll see for yourself this can be a good place to visit for good football discussion.

Your right, most forums have a similar attitude. As I said, initially thought this one a little better. I was wrong. I have no problem discussing stats, situations, and schemes with anyone that's interested in a discussion. It's hard to find. I have no problem with real discussion. I find what the Skins and RGIII are doing as very intriguing. I've admitted my skepticism of the system (not RGIII) for the long term, but admit its a unique situation and and I'm really interested in how it plays out. I have no ill will for the Skins and I like RGIII as a player and person (as much as can be known about him without "knowing" him). I'm not "butt hurt" by valid criticism of Luck and admit there is some - just as there is for RGIII, Wilson, and any other player. But that doesn't matter anyway, because this thread is nothing but pure homerism and hatred - just as you say you find in most places. I'm not butt hurt, just disappointed. I'm sure I'll be around and lurk. Maybe after the all important ROY is settled fans of all three teams can appreciate the greatest QB class of all time and the great talents our teams are fortunate to have. Until then, its not worth sifting through the junk to try to have find a "real" conversation or debate.

[trimee]

Until then, its not worth sifting through the junk to try to have find a "real" conversation or debate.

How would you know what is actually said in this thread if you haven't actually read through it? Sounds to me like you read a couple of posts and then made up your mind that this thread is "pure homerism and hatred". Sounds like a pretty good example of being butt hurt if I ever saw one.

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

Andrew Luck has had six potential interceptions dropped by defenders this season' date=' most in the NFL. All six of those dropped interceptions came in games where Luck led a fourth quarter comeback drive, including two against the Lions in Week 13. On the season, Luck has gone 6-of-7 with 96 yards and a touchdown following a dropped interception.[/quote']

holy christ

Also, this may be homerism but it's informed homerism. All the stats and evidence suggest that Andrew Luck is currently an average QB and RGIII is playing at a borderline MVP level.

[KCClybun]

holy christ

Also, this may be homerism but it's informed homerism. All the stats and evidence suggest that Andrew Luck is currently an average QB and RGIII is playing at a borderline MVP level.

They didn't watch the Green Bay game cuz I counted that many near interceptions in 1 game.

[rm1369]

holy christ

Also, this may be homerism but it's informed homerism. All the stats and evidence suggest that Andrew Luck is currently an average QB and RGIII is playing at a borderline MVP level.

As long as he's not asked to pass when the D knows its a passing situation: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1433559-how-do-nfls-2012-rookie-qbs-stack-up-in-the-clutch

[SteveFromYellowstone]

His rookie receiver ran a slant and didn't cross the face of the defender - he ran behind him. Luck trusted his receiver to run the right route. He didn't. Confirmed by both Arians and Hilton. One of the other interceptions was also a wrong route by the rookie Brazil. Again confirmed by Arians and Brazil. The Colts have 6 rookies that are major contributors on offense. Believe it or not, all the offensive mistakes are not on Luck.

---------- Post added December-7th-2012 at 11:16 PM ----------

It's funny, I started frequenting this forum because it appeared that, unlike most forums, there were some decent non homer conversations and I looked forward to watching and contrasting the development of the two great QBs our teams have been blessed with. After reading the first few pages of this thread I've realized how wrong I've been. It may just be the most homerrific, straight hating threads I've ever seen. I certainly wouldn't expect any Skins fan to want anybody other than RGIII - just as you won't find a Colts or Seahawks fan who would want anyone other than Luck or Wilson. But Rex Grossman? I see there's no point in trying to discuss anything rationally. Have your circle jerk and I'll keep looking for a decent, non blatant homer NFL discussion.

Why do you think this thread is full of homerisms? Luck has made some absolute **** throws and awful reads that you seem to ignore and write off as "oh the receiver ran the wrong route". Yeah I'm sure that's happened 16 times You say you don't like him being compared to Grossman but the stats are very similar and Andrew seems to make a lot of similar boneheaded interceptions that he has no business throwing. What's so ridiculous about it? The QB ratings are within 5 points, Luck has 1 more TD and a couple less picks, Grossman has a higher completion percentage, they took a similar amount of sacks. I don't see the issue. At this point in his career Luck is just not putting up the numbers Wilson and RG3 are and the only reason he is even in the discussion is the cupcake schedule.

Do you admit that Luck has enjoyed one of the easiest, if not the easiest, schedules in the NFL? Do you admit that RG3 leads Luck in nearly every statistical category except passing yards? I don't see how anyone can say that they are playing equally well at this point. RG3 is better right now.

This is a question for everyone. Why do you think that Andrew Luck's ridiculously easy schedule is being ignored?

[Laron Burgundy]

And look, we're not saying Luck is playing poorly for a rookie. Afterall, Peyton led the league in interceptions as a rookie as well, but the talk about him getting MVP is just borderline ridiculous.

Also, as far as that bleacher report article goes, it's great comparing 3rd down percentage and the ilk, but are we really arguing that Matt Ryan and Roethlisberger are elite qb's or that Mark Sanchez was a better rookie than Andy Dalton or RG3, because that is what those numbers show. Finding a nice stat that separates rookie qb's is great, but when that stat doesn't correlate to future ability or even actual rookie season success, I have my doubts to the validity of the stat as an argument. I mean, hell, later in the same article they correlate RG3's numbers to be as low as Drew Brees's. Let that sink in for a bit.

Not to mention RG3 converts at almost twice the rate on 3rd and medium than Luck does and 3rd and short is relatively similar. So maybe, just MAYBE, having reggie wayne helps on 3rd and long compared to us having half a season without our #1 wr (the colts' previous #2) as well as not having Fred Davis since week 7. They always like to talk about Luck's talent-poor offense without mentioning that RG3 has worse, especially when taking into account injuries.

Not saying Luck is bad by any means, but he's got one less td and 15 more turnovers. To say he's carrying that team more than RG3 has is preposterous.

I'm interested if a Colts fan believes the Colts tanked last season, or do you really think your team was a 2-14 team talent-wise.