AsiaticSkinsFan Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I also agree with a lot of what you said...especially the part of "being a great passer doesn't make one a great point guard."I never once said Lebron would be a better PG, because that's irrelevant. I would be like saying Magic would be a better SF than Lebron. All I said was I feel as though Lebron is a better passer than Magic. Magic can do things Lebron can't and Lebron can do things that Magic can't. no doubt, I was clear in saying that no one on here is saying that. Its just something that annoys me with fans and media pundits who say that Lebron could be a great point guard even though we have seen him not play well at point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Please carry on w/ your thread but I urge you not to expose yourself to criticism by making outlandish hyperbole . If i've offended you, then good that was my point. and no need to reply because this will be my first and last post in this thread, cuz its clear there is nothing to see here. If you want to discuss the topic, then fine, but please don't make the mistake of thinking that anyone here truly cares enough about what you posted, to get offended, or care whether or not you post in here anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper 21 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Lets go nets just got my internship with this organization. NETS baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiaticSkinsFan Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Magic was not just passing to Kareem for all those assists. he took very mediocre players like AC Green, Scott, Vlade etc. and made them shine. He could pass w/ either hand from all angles and drop a dime w/ a bounce, bullet or lob. He could dominate a game by getting everyone involved. Last i checked Lebron's MO was he played and everyone stands around to watch him play. how does that make him a better passer? Lebron drawing the double/ triple team then dishing to the open man by using his height and athleticism to pass over defenders does not make him a better passer or see the court better then Magic. Magic made passing cool. His fastbreaks weren't just lobs to streaking players, it was art. he didnt' just pass to the open guys, he passed them open. He could create a passing lane by faking another pass thats how crucial he was. this is my point right here, you confused being a great guard with being a great passer. Lebron is not a point guard and is not good in that role because he is cannot facilitate and run an offense like Magic can. But that doesnt mean Lebron isnt a rival passer to Magic. He has great court vision and routinely hits the passes you give Magic credit for. On top of that Lebron won 60 games with REAL mediocre players around him in Cleveland. The players you named as former Magic teammates were not mediocre in the least bit. In saying that, what Magic did in taking a truly mediocre team in the '91 Lakers to the finals trumps a lot of what Lebron did and is what I am getting at when it comes to Magic being a great point guard versus Lebron not being able to play it as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCranon21 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 this is my point right here, you confused being a great guard with being a great passer. Lebron is not a point guard and is not good in that role because he is cannot facilitate and run an offense like Magic can. But that doesnt mean Lebron isnt a rival passer to Magic. He has great court vision and routinely hits the passes you give Magic credit for. On top of that Lebron won 60 games with REAL mediocre players around him in Cleveland. The players you named as former Magic teammates were not mediocre in the least bit.In saying that, what Magic did in taking a truly mediocre team in the '91 Lakers to the finals trumps a lot of what Lebron did and is what I am getting at when it comes to Magic being a great point guard versus Lebron not being able to play it as well. That team had to be the oldest in the Finals with Magic, Worthy, AC, Byron Scott and Sam Perkins starting if I recall. That team showed Vlade in his 2nd year, an older Sedale Threat(sp?). That was the tail end of Showtime, and Dunleavy was the coach. I remember that team doing wonders in the WC, and actually beating a better Portland squad in the WCF. Magic did do a lot with that team and they was old ass hell. Well we all know what happened on Nov 7th, 1991, and how it affected the Lakers going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Lets go nets just got my internship with this organization. NETS baby! That was you, wasn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper 21 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 No no lol not quite never been to a nets game yet. Can't wait I've been a wiz/spurs fan my whole life. Got a new team now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Trying to separate facilitating and passing doesn't make sense. That's a part of passing... You have to be able to see and know where the ball should go in addition to being able to throw it there. ---------- Post added October-1st-2012 at 05:54 PM ---------- No no lol not quite never been to a nets game yet. Can't wait I've been a wiz/spurs fan my whole life. Got a new team now Congratulations. I hope you have a great experience there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper 21 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Thanks hopefully it turns into something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Thanks hopefully it turns into something Before long I'm sure you'll be running the place. Seriously though, that sounds like an amazing opportunity. You're living the dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBash Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 With RG3 lighting it up and the Nats playoff bound, I've never been less excited for the start of NBA season. And that's with the NHL lockout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I hope 2k13 does something like Madden where you can upload a photo and render your actual face into the game in the My Player mode. I want to be totally immersed as I live out my dream of being a 7'2" shot blocking, three point shooting, 15 rebounds a game, dunk machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiaticSkinsFan Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 That team had to be the oldest in the Finals with Magic, Worthy, AC, Byron Scott and Sam Perkins starting if I recall. That team showed Vlade in his 2nd year, an older Sedale Threat(sp?). That was the tail end of Showtime, and Dunleavy was the coach. I remember that team doing wonders in the WC, and actually beating a better Portland squad in the WCF. Magic did do a lot with that team and they was old ass hell. Well we all know what happened on Nov 7th, 1991, and how it affected the Lakers going forward. that team was old and injured and were not anywhere near Showtime at that point. It was just Magic and them. Larry Drew, Terry Teagle,Elden Campbell, Sedele Threat, a lot of bums. Worthy and Scott were injured in those playoffs too. The Blazers were thought to be the best team in the NBA that year, and the Lakers beat them. I actually wonder if they could have beaten the Bulls that year if Worthy and Scott were healthy. ---------- Post added October-1st-2012 at 08:09 PM ---------- I think a lot of people are sleeping on the Knicks. I`m surprised by it... but I do prefer it than being hyped up. people are sleeping on the Knicks because games are past most of their players bedtime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 That`s what they said about Boston`s big 3 too. They won a championship.. and have been strong contenders for the last 4 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiaticSkinsFan Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 That`s what they said about Boston`s big 3 too. They won a championship.. and have been strong contenders for the last 4 years. You comparing Boston's Big 3 in 2007/8 when they were close to their primes to the Knicks' almost 40 club of Camby, Kidd, and Kurt Thomas? And they have Sheed in training camp too the Knicks are a first or 2nd round and out team this year. They are nowhere close to a title team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 The only way the Knicks will make noise is if Kidd and Amare develop some chemistry and Carmelo can stay hot. Even with that, they probably still can't beat the likes of Miami, Philly, and Boston. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted October 2, 2012 Author Share Posted October 2, 2012 Nah, I knew what you meant. And you're absolutely right, watching one 8 minute clip is a horrible way to compare/contrast/ make an argument for any player in any sport being better than another...---------- Post added October-1st-2012 at 02:57 PM ---------- RA, hit the icon next to the "Reply With Quote" tab to multi-quote Thanks, man! Testing it out right now this is my point right here, you confused being a great guard with being a great passer. Lebron is not a point guard and is not good in that role because he is cannot facilitate and run an offense like Magic can. But that doesnt mean Lebron isnt a rival passer to Magic. He has great court vision and routinely hits the passes you give Magic credit for. On top of that Lebron won 60 games with REAL mediocre players around him in Cleveland. The players you named as former Magic teammates were not mediocre in the least bit.In saying that, what Magic did in taking a truly mediocre team in the '91 Lakers to the finals trumps a lot of what Lebron did and is what I am getting at when it comes to Magic being a great point guard versus Lebron not being able to play it as well. You hit the nail on the head. A lot of people in here are thinking that I said that Lebron could step in at the 1 and be just as dominant or more dominant than Magic. I don't think Lebron comes close to facilitating an offense like Magic did (because like you said, there is MUCH more that goes into being a PG than just being a good passer and having excellent court vision...word to Omar Cook never really sniffing the L). I stand by my argument that I believe that Lebron is a better passer. *Edit...the Knicks...LOLOLOLOL. We'll FOREVER be waiting for the Amare/Melo pairing to work. We'll be 5 years into this disaster, and folks will still be saying "just give them more time to gel." C'mon now. Both players have close to 20 years NBA experience between them. You can't change a Zebra's stripes at all. This is an OLD team that is going to be at best a 5 seed in the East. They will make ZERO noise in the playoffs. Only two players worth a damn on that squad are Chandler and Shump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 You comparing Boston's Big 3 in 2007/8 when they were close to their primes to the Knicks' almost 40 club of Camby, Kidd, and Kurt Thomas? And they have Sheed in training camp too I`m 1/100th a basketball fan as I am a football (Redskins) fan.... Garnett, Allen and Pierce were not in the primes 4 years ago. They were all in their early 30`s. They were all superstars that had a little something left. But `prime`, yeah NO. And then you compare the Celtics big 3.. and their age(s)... to the Knicks bench players. That`s a red herring. If that`s what you bring to the table... I`d rather talk to my kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiaticSkinsFan Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 I`m 1/100th a basketball fan as I am a football (Redskins) fan.... Garnett, Allen and Pierce were not in the primes 4 years ago. They were all in their early 30`s. They were all superstars that had a little something left. But `prime`, yeah NO. re-read my post, I never said they were in their primes. I said "close too," so yeah NO. And then you compare the Celtics big 3.. and their age(s)... to the Knicks bench players. That`s a red herring.If that`s whaI compare them to themt you bring to the table... I`d rather talk to my kids. hang on, YOU compared them. Not me, YOU compared them. YOU brought up Boston's Big 3, not me. YOU! YOU! YOU! Dont flip it and bounce it and try to make it like I did, YOU did it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 You hit the nail on the head. A lot of people in here are thinking that I said that Lebron could step in at the 1 and be just as dominant or more dominant than Magic. I don't think Lebron comes close to facilitating an offense like Magic did (because like you said, there is MUCH more that goes into being a PG than just being a good passer and having excellent court vision...word to Omar Cook never really sniffing the L). I stand by my argument that I believe that Lebron is a better passer. You and Asiatic seem to be trying to separate facilitating teammates from passing as if they are two separate skills. It doesn't make sense. Being a good passer means knowing where the ball should go, knowing the best way to get it there, and then being able to do it. Facilitating your teammates is what you do when you make good passes. You can't say one guy is a superior passer while acknowledging he's an inferior facilitator. That's incoherent. If all you wanted to say was that LeBron is better at tossing the ball around in fancy ways, then I'd respond, "so?" It'd be such a meaningless claim. (And I would still think Magic is the flashier, more spectacular passer and ball handler). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 Jason Kidd died 18 months ago. Last year was some kind of elaborate Weekend at Bernie's thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted October 2, 2012 Author Share Posted October 2, 2012 You and Asiatic seem to be trying to separate facilitating teammates from passing as if they are two separate skills. It doesn't make sense.Being a good passer means knowing where the ball should go, knowing the best way to get it there, and then being able to do it. Facilitating your teammates is what you do when you make good passes. You can't say one guy is a superior passer while acknowledging he's an inferior facilitator. That's incoherent. If all you wanted to say was that LeBron is better at tossing the ball around in fancy ways, then I'd respond, "so?" It'd be such a meaningless claim. (And I would still think Magic is the flashier, more spectacular passer and ball handler). Facilitating the offense and passing ARE two separate things. Part of what makes a good PG is how they RUN a team. Getting your guys in the best position to succeed even when the ball is not in your hands. If you can facilitate the offense effectively AND be a good passer, you've got the recipe for success as a PG in the NBA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiaticSkinsFan Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 Facilitating the offense and passing ARE two separate things. Part of what makes a good PG is how they RUN a team. Getting your guys in the best position to succeed even when the ball is not in your hands. If you can facilitate the offense effectively AND be a good passer, you've got the recipe for success as a PG in the NBA. yup, for instance Mike Conley is one of the best point guards in the NBA, imo, at running an offense and setting his teammates into the right spots. But Lebron is a better passer than Conley, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 I always thought being a good passer meant, passing the ball to the right person at the right time, in the smallest window as possible. That is why I always liked Mark Jackson when he was playing (Mainly his second stints with Indy and New York). Back then my coach was like, people can be flashy all they want, if the pass leads to two points then it was the best pass. Mark Jackson always seemed to make the best pass to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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