Coach Janky Spanky Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 The Cundiff signing was a real head-scratcher from the moment in happened. It's already been a factor in two games -- Gano wouldv'e at least had a chance to hit that kick in the Rams game whereas with Cundiff there was absolutely no way. Gano's not perfect but he's better -- time for us to realize we made a mistake and move back to Gano. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphil006 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Neil Rackers? Where's he now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roanoker Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 This is the most level-headed post in here. Gives his explanation in detail and I agree for the most part. I would however bring kickers in this week starting with Gano to let Cunmiss know his seat is smoldering and getting real hot . I second your motion! This team has enough drama than having to worry about the kicker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins4SB Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Anyone have a list of FA kickers? Look at the Bucs kicker, Connor Barth. He bounced around team to team after not making the final roster and now he's kicked 24(?) straight FG, including several from 50+. I wish we could find someone like that out there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRagone Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Bang, here is Dave Taub's ST DVOA ranking. He has been the Bears ST Coach since 2004.2011 - 1 2010 - 1 2009 - 4 2008 - 5 2007 - 1 2006 - 1 2005 - 27 2004 - 12 What explanation would you offer for his unit's marked improvement since 2006? a) Taub became brilliant in 2006; It took Taub three years to build his unit; c) Devin Hester arrived and Taub taught him how to run; d) Devin Hester arrived and already knew how to run. I'll take "e" for $500 E being "Answers B and D" Why do I say that? Because Hester hasn't been the only person returning kicks for them over that timeline, nor the only person successful at doing it (Though absolutely was the most successful). I would also imagine that there's another aspect to that answer...the fact you have such a dynamic kick returner like Hester puts more focus of importance onto your special teams, likely invigorating a coach and also providing a heightened focus on it by the team in general. I would say Hester has a HUGE part to play in that improvement...but he's not the only part. Additionally, your statement doesn't disprove Bang's notion that coaches affect their players as his argument wasn't that "Coaches are the ONLY things that affects how players perform" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 ZRagone. Lurk less and post more. I like your style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.T.real,lights,out Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Will say this...if we did decide to move on to another kicker the last one i would want is Gano. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsCrushCowboys Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Neil Rackers? Where's he now? Neil William Rackers[2] (born August 16, 1976) is an American football placekicker of the National Football League (NFL), who is currently a free agent. ****maybe he still has his uniform***** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins4SB Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Matt Prater, Justin Tucker, Rob Bironas, Steven Hauschka, Matt Bryant, David Akers, Robbie Gould, Dan Bailey. All of these guys were UDFAs and most of them have been cut from other teams at one point in their careers. Not to mention several other kickers not named here that were 6th or 7th round picks and have been reliable and consistent. I'm tired of seeing other teams have success grabbing kickers off the scrap heap and have success for several years. We have been plagued with kicking issues for the longest time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I will give you this.And only because Hester is a special player.. he really is. Even you I'm sure can agree with me when i say that i believe that probably close to 90% of all long returns are a result of good blocks and a nice hole or seam for the returner. most of the time on a big return they're never touched. rarely is a big return the result of spectacular individual performance. But with Hester it is different. he gets blocks, but he also does unbelievable things on his returns to make men miss or run through tacklers. He makes a lot of those long returns on his own skill. he's special, and if they ever do come down off the high horse and put returners in the HOF, he's clearly one in the mix. I get whatr you're saying about drafting the right players. But lets face it. Draft, trade, free agent,, doesn't matter. On our special teams players consistently make mistakes. Kickers do miss extraordinary amounts of field goals. For 8 years now. Coordinators don't just sit and wait to see who is dropped in their laps. They have say on who is acquired for them and who they keep and cut. (And if they DON'T,,, what exactly is it that makes danny smith so revered? this is one more thing 'behind the scenes' thing that is shot down, and his greatness behind the scenes is what they try to sell us when they tell us how awesome he is.) I'm not saying we should have spectacular special teams. I'll settle for games played cleanly, relatively mistake free.. like last week vs the Bengals. they played well yesterday on coverages, but another element of the STs has a breakdown and we're in a dogfight at the end, when we should have had a lead to sit on. (I can forgive the long miss.. I can't understand why they send him out.. who doesn;'t know his limits? Smith, or Shanahan? Who is supposed to know how far he can hit reliably? it happens too much, my friend. ~Bang I understand your frustration. I think you understand that I have no idea whether Danny Smith should stay or go. I'm not in a position to judge a special teams coach. I really don't think there's that much to it. I see a lot of dumb penalties in ST in the NFL. I think ordinary intelligence is an underrated factor when acquiring talent. Dumb players make dumb mistakes.I coached 11-12 year-old boys in three sports. Give me a bunch of smart kids and I can coach a smart game of football, baseball or basketball. Give me a bunch of slow-witted kids, I'm helpless. ~ Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I understand your frustration. I think you understand that I have no idea whether Danny Smith should stay or go. I'm not in a position to judge a special teams coach. I really don't think there's that much to it. I see a lot of dumb penalties in ST in the NFL. I think ordinary intelligence is an underrated factor when acquiring talent. Dumb players make dumb mistakes.I coached 11-12 year-old boys in three sports. Give me a bunch of smart kids and I can coach a smart game of football, baseball or basketball. Give me a bunch of slow-witted kids, I'm helpless. ~ Joe i get what you say when you say we as outsiders really don't have an objective way of viewing what a coach actually does. All we have is the result. Personally, I liked Gano, and I will even give credit for Danny actually developing him. Other than blocks last year (which have been shown to not be his fault) he was a damn fine kicker, and considering we brought him as a rook... we'd seen progressive improvement in the kid's game. His leg strength is superior, at least it looks that way from my sofa. the move to Cundiff was a total head-scratcher to me. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I'll take "e" for $500E being "Answers B and D" Why do I say that? Because Hester hasn't been the only person returning kicks for them over that timeline, nor the only person successful at doing it (Though absolutely was the most successful). I would also imagine that there's another aspect to that answer...the fact you have such a dynamic kick returner like Hester puts more focus of importance onto your special teams, likely invigorating a coach and also providing a heightened focus on it by the team in general. I would say Hester has a HUGE part to play in that improvement...but he's not the only part. Additionally, your statement doesn't disprove Bang's notion that coaches affect their players as his argument wasn't that "Coaches are the ONLY things that affects how players perform" You came in in the middle of an on-going debate.In a previous thread, Bang supported another poster's offer of Danny Smith's DVOA rankings as evidence that Danny was not a good Special Teams coach. I used Dave Taub's rankings to illustrate how one outstanding kick returner probably impacted Taub's rankings. Therefore, Bang's reasoning based on the evidence of Smith's rankings is flawed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 My disgust with Danny is more than any ranking. That was just one more reason on a long list, as far as I'm concerned. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinklein Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I haven't followed this thread since the bump, but let me simply add this: The case for Graham Gano was made when his competition was Neil Rackers, and he won that job. Billy Cundiff made an even stronger case for Graham Gano last night. Dark horse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphil006 Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Neil William Rackers[2] (born August 16, 1976) is an American football placekicker of the National Football League (NFL), who is currently a free agent. ****maybe he still has his uniform***** Can we bring him in for competition??? How can Tampa find the kicker they did and we're still looking for our Chip Lohmiller? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowhunter Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 OK Shanny, it's time to make the call. How many has cund-whiff (I like that nickname) missed inside the 35?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeefJerky Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I'm sure they have Gano on speed dial. PLEASE make the call shanny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDTERPS27 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I'm done. Cundiff never missed in Baltimore until the Championship game, but he has sucked for us. He offers nothing that Gano can't provide. At least Gano gives us a chance from 50+, or god forbid if we ever needed one from 55+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskins55 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 whose talent? Griffin's talent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThisOneGoesTo11 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Edit: Posted in more relevant thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#BgMase76# Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I don't think anyone here needs to make the case for Gano or any other kicker. Cundiff is his own best argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowhunter Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I don't think anyone here needs to make the case for Gano or any other kicker. Cundiff is his own best argument. Agreed here. I wonder if a new guy is brought in, when would it occur? Is Tomorrow too soon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aolforbroadband Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Cundiff will be cut by Wednesday, mark my words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Cundiff will be cut by Wednesday, mark my words. I would honestly be surprised if it takes that long. After last week, they have to at least talked to a few other kickers. I am thinking tomorrow he is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsandRockBandFan Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Get a competition between Gano and Rackers again and see who comes out better like during August. Cundiff needs to go NOW! I couldn't believe that he missed two kicks within the 35 and had me worried when he was kicking from practically extra point range. He has not earned his spot should be cut asap. I'm so tired of missing points because of inept kickers, while other teams kickers are looking great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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