Romney/Ryan Lose 2012 Election Thread

[Tulane Skins Fan]

He's proud of the fact that he paid a lot of taxes? Does this guy not understand that the words that come out of his mouth are being recorded by people?

I can literally think of a million ways that sound byte is going to hurt him.

[@DCGoldPants]

He's proud of the fact that he paid a lot of taxes? Does this guy not understand that the words that come out of his mouth are being recorded by people?

I can literally think of a million ways that sound byte is going to hurt him.

Truth is....he can't win this from any angle now. He didn't release them, said he paid 15%. Then got hammered....released them...it was 13% I think. Doesn't matter...still looks bad. Then Norquist goes on TV this morning and talks about how its fine because all the money was already taxed before, so the Gov't just wanted another bite of the apple. Doesn't matter.....because people start asking about offshore accounts and why he needs them. So, he flips his message to Obama Doesn't Work or whatever that banner said behind him today. STILL doesn't matter because unemployment seems to be dropping still and if that's the case he's done anyways. He just doesn't relate to anybody and it shows. Stinks of John Kerry X100.

[Larry]

I think the only way he recovers from this is to change the subject from "how much tax DID Romney pay" to "how much taxes SHOULD Romney pay?".

You know. Talk about policy. .

I think next time it comes up in the debate, the line should be "I'm the only person on this stage who thinks I should pay ANY".

I bet that clip gets re-shown a lot.

[Kilmer17]

I think there is a way he could flip it and benefit. Along the lines of "In addition to the XXXX million I paid in taxes, the companies I ran created XXXX jobs".

Im also fairly certain that he doesnt have anyone smart enough around him to figure out how to do that effectively.

[88Comrade2000]

All the Dems or liberals here should be salivating. Unless things go into the tank their guy Obama wins easily.

Obama and his class warfare will play well against Romney and Newt's mouth and baggage won't be able to beat Obama.

The weakest and flawed Republican field ever!

[SnyderShrugged]

All the Dems or liberals here should be salivating. Unless things go into the tank their guy Obama wins easily.

Obama and his class warfare will play well against Romney and Newt's mouth and baggage won't be able to beat Obama.

The weakest and flawed Republican field ever!

The only chance that the GOP has is to find a nominee that is as different from Obama in policies as possible so as to differentiate themselves from him. Of course you know where I fall, but I think that it could also have been a few others that didnt run.

The GOP at this point, loses unless they do this. (and still may lose even if they do)

[mistertim]

I think there is a way he could flip it and benefit. Along the lines of "In addition to the XXXX million I paid in taxes, the companies I ran created XXXX jobs".

Im also fairly certain that he doesnt have anyone smart enough around him to figure out how to do that effectively.

I think he has already tried that one to a certain extent. The problem he has and will run into if he tries to push that more and more (especially if he ends up in the general election with Obama) is his claim that "I created x number of jobs at Bain" is going to get some major scrutiny when it comes to how many jobs were possibly created IN SPITE of Bain's involvement as opposed to directly because of it, how many people were laid off when Bain came in and took over, and how many jobs were shipped overseas, etc. We all know how easy it is to fudge the numbers so that it looks like much more positive stuff happened than actually did. I can see how he is trying to spin his Bain years but it could potentially end up as a liability for him...again, especially in a general election as opposed to just the Republican primary.

[Larry]

All the Dems or liberals here should be salivating. Unless things go into the tank their guy Obama wins easily.

Obama and his class warfare will play well against Romney and Newt's mouth and baggage won't be able to beat Obama.

The weakest and flawed Republican field ever!

Minor flaw in your sound bites, there.

[mjah]

Minor flaw in your sound bites, there.

Recent converts to the "Obama is somehow the one waging class warfare, not us" angle don't see it as a flaw.

Safe to say, the angle doesn't play to anybody but the solid right. The middle, wherever their A/D rating for the President may ramble, doesn't seem to see Obama as a class-warrior type. And with good reason.

Still, the "accuse others of doing exactly what you're doing" wing (see: activist judges, government overreach, deficit spending, entitlement expansion, etc., etc.) continues to like the angle. You just aren't their target audience.

...Not that you didn't know all of this already...

[mistertim]

Since the prevailing conservative logic is that capital gains should be taxed at lower and lower rates because the people who benefit from that are "job creators", I assume it would follow that Romney has created a ton of jobs through all of the money he has made via his capital gains and the low taxes he pays on it. Well, besides illegal gardeners.

[visionary]

The only chance that the GOP has is to find a nominee that is as different from Obama in policies as possible so as to differentiate themselves from him. Of course you know where I fall, but I think that it could also have been a few others that didnt run.

The GOP at this point, loses unless they do this. (and still may lose even if they do)

I don't really understand this thinking. It could certainly help win the primaries, but overall people aren't as upset at Obama as the right is.

It's a foolish strategy in my opinion. The American people don't want someone who has the opposite policies of Obama.

They want someone who knows what he's doing and is able to improve on the good Obama has done while fixing the bad he has done (or by a lack of doing).

They don't want someone who will go 100% in the other direction.

The main problem with Obama is that people see him as weak, not that he's always wrong.

[Hooper]

A GOP candidate starting a national conversation about USA having regressive tax rates for millionaires by forcing another GOP candidate to release his tax records. Priceless.

Yes. It is bizarre. I have never seen the GOP eat their own like this. And attacking their own policies.

[GibbsFactor]

Yes. It is bizarre. I have never seen the GOP eat their own like this. And attacking their own policies.

The GOP has no leadership. They are currently following radio personalities. There's no "establishment" any more. That's why you are seeing Newt and Mitt and Rick slug it out the way they have been. No high level strategy for the party. The radio personalities are good at beating the drum but they can't achieve true political gamesmanship with the politicians who undoubtedly do not respect the radio personalities.

[Jumbo]

The GOP has no leadership. They are currently following radio personalities.

I would just add "and Fox-fed talking heads etc" and note if that ship goes down like the dysfunctional wreck it is, there may never be a more just example of "live by the sword, die by the sword."

[Tulane Skins Fan]

I would just add "and Fox-fed talking heads etc" and note if that ship goes down like the dysfunctional wreck it is, there may never be a more just example of "live by the sword, die by the sword."

If the ship didn't go down in 2008, its not going down. These two parties, both of them, are firmly entrenched as the only two parties allowed in American oligarchic politics.

I do wonder if the more moderate republicans (those few that exist) would join with the democrats to bring back the Republican-Democrats. And then just have the tea party left to ***** and moan to each other on the far right.

[Predicto]

The GOP has no leadership. They are currently following radio personalities. There's no "establishment" any more. That's why you are seeing Newt and Mitt and Rick slug it out the way they have been. No high level strategy for the party. The radio personalities are good at beating the drum but they can't achieve true political gamesmanship with the politicians who undoubtedly do not respect the radio personalities.

In other words, they have turned into Democrats.

"I'm not a member of any organized political party. I'm a Democrat." Will Rogers

[Larry]

Now, Romney does represent a threat to the GOP. But his threat is that he gives a reality that doesn't match the GOP rhetoric.

The GOP loves to talk about cutting taxes on "job creators" and corporate incomes taxes and "the death tax" and capital gains.

But, when they say those things, they want everybody to think that they're talking about the guy who owns the Subway franchise down on the corner.

They don't want people to figure out that who they're actually catering to is, well, Mitt Romney.

[GibbsFactor]

Now, Romney does represent a threat to the GOP. But his threat is that he gives a reality that doesn't match the GOP rhetoric.

The GOP loves to talk about cutting taxes on "job creators" and corporate incomes taxes and "the death tax" and capital gains.

But, when they say those things, they want everybody to think that they're talking about the guy who owns the Subway franchise down on the corner.

They don't want people to figure out that who they're actually catering to is, well, the 1%..

Quick edit there for you.

[Jumbo]

If the ship didn't go down in 2008, its not going down. These two parties, both of them, are firmly entrenched as the only two parties allowed in American oligarchic politics.

I didn't mean go down permanently. Of course that's not going to happen. I meant "lose an election that should have arguably been a cake walk to win."

[Larry]

I didn't mean go down permanently. Of course that's not going to happen. I meant "lose an election that should have arguably been a cake walk to win."

I don't know about "should have been a cake walk".

IMO, part of the GOP's problem, this election, is that they haven't created a "brand identity".

They have a brand identity. But they want to claim that that isn't them any more.

But, they haven't created a new identity. The only new identity they've created is "obstruct everything, and complain loudly".

In short, their actions for the last four years were an OK strategy, if the economy sucks for four years straight.

They just don't work so well, if things get better.

[Predicto]

If the ship didn't go down in 2008, its not going down. These two parties, both of them, are firmly entrenched as the only two parties allowed in American oligarchic politics.

There will always be two parties - the whole electoral structure of the US ensures that - but what those two parties stand for can change drastically over time. Heck, pretty much the exact same people that used to be the Southern Dixie Democrats in the 1950s and 60s are now the tea party base of the GOP, just like Lyndon Johnson predicted.

In other words, being a third party pretty much is a waste of time. Taking over one of the two existing parties - that can work, and work well. Ron Paul understands that, which is why he stays in the GOP.

The genuine divide between the two parties is currently mostly over social issues today. However, if Ron Paul and the Libertarians manage to take over the GOP, the borders between the two parties will shift again.

[Tulane Skins Fan]

There will always be two parties - the whole electoral structure of the US ensures that - but what those two parties stand for can change drastically over time. Heck, pretty much the exact same people that used to be the Southern Dixie Democrats in the 1950s and 60s are now the tea party base of the GOP, just like Lyndon Johnson predicted.

In other words, being a third party pretty much is a waste of time. Taking over one of the two existing parties - that can work, and work well. Ron Paul understands that, which is why he stays in the GOP.

The genuine divide between the two parties is currently mostly over social issues today. However, if Ron Paul and the Libertarians manage to take over the GOP, the borders between the two parties will shift again.

Probably true as recently as five years ago. There is a genuine divide on fiscal issues now. I think the Tea Party is a little bit altruistic in its assessment of what will happen if they get what they seek, but I think they genuinely believe that if we eliminate medicare, medicaid, social security and other such programs things will be better.

I assumed you meant social issues things that "social conservatives" fight for, not "social security." Maybe that was a bad assumption.

[88Comrade2000]

:evilg::evilg::evilg: Can't wait until you and Eye of Newt and Whacky Paul and Douchebag Ricky are gone from Florida; well until one of you wins the nomination.

[Tulane Skins Fan]

Mitt Romney could face new questions about his overseas investments after a campaign official acknowledged to NBC News that his campaign is revising his federal ethics forms to report more than a half dozen offshore holdings, including income from a multi-million dollar Swiss bank account that was not disclosed last year.

The tax returns released by the Romney campaign this week showed that the Ann Romney Blind Trust had reported $1,783 in interest income from a bank account held at UBS in Switzerland in 2010. But interest from the Swiss bank account -- as well as holdings in other offshore investments in the Cayman Islands, Bermudas and Ireland that appear in the trust fund's tax returns -- were not disclosed in Romney’s financial disclosure form filed with the Office of Government Ethics last August

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/01/26/10244809-romney-revising-disclosures-for-overseas-accounts

Umm... I can't believe this, but I think Romney just got caught cheating on his taxes. At least from this article, it looks bad. I can't believe how bad this guy is blowing it.

Granted its not that much money, but here's what comes out of this: Romney hid money in a Swiss bank account where all billionaires hold money to cheat the tax man.

He had "no explanation" for why the money wasn't disclosed. I know why: he didn't want to look like he was hiding money in Swiss bank accounts when he ran for president. So what did he do? He ACTUALLY hid it. Man.

[88Comrade2000]

Romney is the perfect candidate for Obama to face because he plays perfectly into the argument OBama will be making. Should the race be Obama vs. Romney and the Dems gain full control. All the tax change that the Dems make will be directly traced to Mitt Romney. Mitt Romney will have made Obama's case for him.

Right now I have Obama winning comfortably.

Obama gets 331 EVs

Romney gets 207 EVs

http://www.270towin.com/2012_electio....php?mapid=fFr

If it is Newt, its a slightly bigger margin.

Obama gets 347 EVs

Newt gets 191 EVs

http://www.270towin.com/2012_electio....php?mapid=fFp

The only way Repubs wins is things getting worse and even then it will be a narrow victory. The Repubs win the election in the fall; then some of the midwestern states will go for the Republican candidate and Obama loses Florida and maybe VA and/or NC.

Mitt Romney could face new questions about his overseas investments after a campaign official acknowledged to NBC News that his campaign is revising his federal ethics forms to report more than a half dozen offshore holdings, including income from a multi-million dollar Swiss bank account that was not disclosed last year.

The tax returns released by the Romney campaign this week showed that the Ann Romney Blind Trust had reported $1,783 in interest income from a bank account held at UBS in Switzerland in 2010. But interest from the Swiss bank account -- as well as holdings in other offshore investments in the Cayman Islands, Bermudas and Ireland that appear in the trust fund's tax returns -- were not disclosed in Romney’s financial disclosure form filed with the Office of Government Ethics last August

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/01/26/10244809-romney-revising-disclosures-for-overseas-accounts

Umm... I can't believe this, but I think Romney just got caught cheating on his taxes. At least from this article, it looks bad. I can't believe how bad this guy is blowing it.

Granted its not that much money, but here's what comes out of this: Romney hid money in a Swiss bank account where all billionaires hold money to cheat the tax man.

He had "no explanation" for why the money wasn't disclosed. I know why: he didn't want to look like he was hiding money in Swiss bank accounts when he ran for president. So what did he do? He ACTUALLY hid it. Man.