POLL: Snyder or JKC?

[Taylor 36]

Is this a joke? They both have more money than God and are willing to spend it, but only one has three Super Bowls.

You do the math.

Ah, but everyone seems to forget that once Gibbs left and the NFL went to the current system it is now presently in (well, it was until the lockout anyway) that JKC accomplished absolutely nothing. Not one division title. Not one playoff appearance. Nada. Let's not forget that it wasn't Snyder that took an annual contender and ran it in to the ground. That's what the Redskins were when Snyder purchased the team. Has Snyder made mistakes that prevented quicker turnarounds, yes. Is he finally starting to own up to those mistakes and attempting to do things differently to make the team better and be a better owner. By all accounts, yes. No one has any proof to the contrary. Snyder has stayed out of any news when it comes to football operations, player personnel, etc.

People keep wanting to bring up the past and throw out mistakes that were made over a decade ago. I'm sure there is not one poster on this board that doesn't have some past transgressions that they finally learned from that make them cringe when they remember or think about them. By the way some people speak, though, you would think that they live their lives exactly the same as they did 9, 10, 12 years ago and have never made a mistake that they had to fix or change that wasn't difficult to do. No wonder they don't know how to let go and recognize attempts at bettering one's self.

Along those lines, people need to stop talking about Snyder's impatience. That myth was created from events that took place in 2000 and 2001. TEN YEARS AGO. However, firing Marty was really his only big transgression in that department. Anyone who doesn't think it was well past time for Norv to go simply never paid attention to his SEVEN years of ineptitude, nor have they paid attention to his HC career after the Redskins. Snyder did not fire Spurrier nor Gibbs. Snyder would have given Spurrier more time, but Spurrier realized he was in over his head and threw in the towel. No sign of impatience there. He did, however, fire Zorn. But, honestly, is there anyone on this board who would not have gotten rid of that disaster after what he showed his last 1.5 seasons of coaching?

Now people want to dump on Snyder for a lawsuit that he has every right by the laws of our land to file. People try to act like every single decision, accusation, and step that has been taken is all Snyder's doing. Wake up people. It is all the doings of his lawyers who doing what lawyers do. This is how lawsuit of this type works. Snyder's lawsuit doesn't even have one iota of a scrap to do with the Washington Redskins. Unless your neighbor works with you, you filing a suit against them doesn't have anything to do with your job or the company you work for. It doesn't matter what any of us think about the lawsuit itself. There are many Snyder haters on this board that would be doing the same thing if they were in Snyder's shoes, but their blind hatred is preventing them from seeing/admitting that. This has nothing to do with Snyder's character; it has everything to do with the lack of ethics in today's media. And, while I'm there, JCK's personal and professional lives were much more tainted than Snyder's' have ever been proven to be. And, you want to talk about a dick of an owner, JKC didn't even leave them team to his family. He basically set them up to lose the Redskins after he died.

People act like it was a dick move on Snyder's part to "steal" the Redskins from the Cooke's. First, it never would have happened if JKC didn't dick over his own family. Second, once again, there isn't one die-hard Redskins fan on this entire site that would not have done their damndest to buy this team if they were in a position to do so at the time, regardless of who your purchasing competitors were.

So, as Cali has stated numerous times in different threads, stop the irrational hate for 30 minutes and take a look at the entire picture. You might find that the intensity and amount of hate some of you have for a man who you don't even personally know is nowhere close to being warranted.

[RFKFedEx]

You might find that the intensity and amount of hate some of you have for a man who you don't even personally know is nowhere close to being warranted.

Ah, the old 'you don't know him argument'.

Is it warranted for Steeler fans to love Dan Rooney even though very few of them know him personally? By your logic, that love is completely irrational.

OBTW, you misspelled Vinny's name in your sig. Bug eyes is a y guy, not an ie.

[Taylor 36]

Ah, the old 'you don't know him argument'.

Is it warranted for Steeler fans to love Dan Rooney even though very few of them know him personally? By your logic, that love is completely irrational.

Ah, the old 'dodge every point made in a post because I've got nothing' argument. You chose to summarize my entire post by one part of the last sentences out of forty-six previous sentences. I have to conclude you didn't bother to even read the entire post. If you had, you would realize I was pointing out why people are irrational in their hate and how they don't know the man. To answer your question, yes, the Steelers fans love of Rooney just because he is an owner that has put together many winning teams is irrational. It is one thing to think he is a great owner and another, completely different thing to love the man that you don't really know just because he pays the bills for your favorite team that happens to win more than lose. Just as it is irrational for people to love JKC. He was owner of the team when a good string of victories were put together. Good owner? Sure, some could argue that. Of course, as with the irrational hating of Snyder, most with tend to overlook the first ten years of JKC's ownership and the last five as well when arguing how great of an owner he was because of of Gibbs' 12 seasons here. But, to love the guy for that, despite not really knowing him personally, (though there is a lot about the guys personal life that has been revealed both before and after his death) is just irrational.

Overall, many irrational posters on this board HATE Dan Snyder much deeper than as an owner. If they thought he was a bad owner, that is fine and an opinion that everyone is entitled to. However, to hate the man so deeply on a personal level as many do, that is just irrational. They don't know him on a personal level.

[SWFLSkins]

Yoko Ono or John Lennon.

Who was the better musician?

hahahaaaaa, you made a funny. LOL. I like it. btw I took option 3. I mean why ask this question? It is like asking a Lion if he would like to have steak or veggies

Only clean pic of Candy Ass I could find.

[hail2skins]

Overall, many irrational posters on this board HATE Dan Snyder much deeper than as an owner. If they thought he was a bad owner, that is fine and an opinion that everyone is entitled to. However, to hate the man so deeply on a personal level as many do, that is just irrational. They don't know him on a personal level.

Not allowing signs to be brought in to FedEx for that MNF game in 2009 really pissed me off as far as Snyder is concerned.

[SWFLSkins]

This thread could easily turn into a would you rather thread.

A nice soft pillow to sleep on or several thumb tacks in your eye?

A foot message by a hot chick or being tied down and having ants eat honey off your face?

Well I hope someday Snyder redeems himself full and give him credit he certainly appears to have begun that process. However what fan would choose Snyder over Cooke at this point in history? But I guess some fans prefer thumb tacks over pillows. Sadist are for real.

[HailGreen28]

JKC as he is right now, would be a better owner than Snyder.

.....except at making money. That's it.

God bless JKC. Hope he isn't seeing what happened after he departed.

[Commander PK]

I put my money where my mouth is and went back to look at the first 10 years Jack Kent Cooke was majority owner of the Redskins. Starting in 1974, the Redskins records were as following: (Courtesy of Wikipedia). Take out the 1982 and 1983 seasons, and there is not much difference in success between the two of them.

1974 1974 NFL NFC East 2nd 10 4 0 Lost Divisional Playoffs (Los Angeles Rams) 19-10

1975 1975 NFL NFC East 3rd 8 6 0 Mike Thomas (Rookie of the Year)

1976 1976 NFL NFC East 2nd[11] 10 4 0 Lost Divisional Playoffs (Vikings) 35-20

1977 1977 NFL NFC East 2nd[12] 9 5 0

1978[13] 1978 NFL NFC East 3rd 8 8 0 John Riggins (Comeback Player of the Year)

1979 1979 NFL NFC East 3rd[14] 10 6 0 Jack Pardee (Coach of the Year)

1980 1980 NFL NFC East 3rd 6 10 0

1981 1981 NFL NFC East 4th 8 8 0

1982[15] 1982 NFL NFC 1st 8 1 0 Won First Round (Lions) 31-7

Won Second Round (Vikings) 21-7

Won Conference Championship (Cowboys) 31-17

Won Super Bowl XVII (Dolphins) 27-17 (3) Joe Gibbs (Coach of the Year)

Mark Moseley (NFL MVP)

John Riggins (Super Bowl MVP)

Joe Theismann (Bert Bell Award) (Walter Payton Man of the Year)

1983 1983 NFL NFC East 1st 14 2 0 Won Divisional Playoffs (Los Angeles Rams) 51-7

Won Conference Championship (49ers) 24-21

Lost Super Bowl XVIII (Los Angeles Raiders) 38-9 Joe Gibbs (Coach of the Year)

Joe Theismann (Offensive Player of the Year) (NFL MVP)

John Riggins (Bert Bell Award)

Now Snyder

1999 1999 NFL NFC East 1st 10 6 0 Won Wild Card Playoffs (Lions) 27-13

Lost Divisional Playoffs (Buccaneers) 14-13

2000 NFL NFC East 3rd 8 8 0

2001 NFL NFC East 2nd 8 8 0

2002 NFL NFC East 3rd 7 9 0

2003 NFL NFC East 3rd 5 11 0

2004 NFL NFC East 4th 6 10 0

2005 NFL NFC East 2nd 10 6 0 Won Wild Card Playoffs (Buccaneers) 17-10

Lost Divisional Playoffs (Seahawks) 20-10

2006 NFL NFC East 4th 5 11 0

2007 NFL NFC East 3rd 9 7 0 Lost Wild Card Playoffs (Seahawks) 35-14

2008 NFL NFC East 4th 8 8 0

Until the Super Bowl win, which took him 9 full seasons to get to, Jack Kent Cooke was not doing much better than Dan Snyder. Hopefully, Dan has now turned the corner as owner.

[HailGreen28]

I put my money where my mouth is and went back to look at the first 10 years Jack Kent Cooke was majority owner of the Redskins. Starting in 1974, the Redskins records were as following: (Courtesy of Wikipedia). Take out the 1982 and 1983 seasons, and there is not much difference in success between the two of them.

1974 1974 NFL NFC East 2nd 10 4 0 Lost Divisional Playoffs (Los Angeles Rams) 19-10

1975 1975 NFL NFC East 3rd 8 6 0 Mike Thomas (Rookie of the Year)

1976 1976 NFL NFC East 2nd[11] 10 4 0 Lost Divisional Playoffs (Vikings) 35-20

1977 1977 NFL NFC East 2nd[12] 9 5 0

1978[13] 1978 NFL NFC East 3rd 8 8 0 John Riggins (Comeback Player of the Year)

1979 1979 NFL NFC East 3rd[14] 10 6 0 Jack Pardee (Coach of the Year)

1980 1980 NFL NFC East 3rd 6 10 0

1981 1981 NFL NFC East 4th 8 8 0

1982[15] 1982 NFL NFC 1st 8 1 0 Won First Round (Lions) 31-7

Won Second Round (Vikings) 21-7

Won Conference Championship (Cowboys) 31-17

Won Super Bowl XVII (Dolphins) 27-17 (3) Joe Gibbs (Coach of the Year)

Mark Moseley (NFL MVP)

John Riggins (Super Bowl MVP)

Joe Theismann (Bert Bell Award) (Walter Payton Man of the Year)

1983 1983 NFL NFC East 1st 14 2 0 Won Divisional Playoffs (Los Angeles Rams) 51-7

Won Conference Championship (49ers) 24-21

Lost Super Bowl XVIII (Los Angeles Raiders) 38-9 Joe Gibbs (Coach of the Year)

Joe Theismann (Offensive Player of the Year) (NFL MVP)

John Riggins (Bert Bell Award)

Now Snyder

1999 1999 NFL NFC East 1st 10 6 0 Won Wild Card Playoffs (Lions) 27-13

Lost Divisional Playoffs (Buccaneers) 14-13

2000 NFL NFC East 3rd 8 8 0

2001 NFL NFC East 2nd 8 8 0

2002 NFL NFC East 3rd 7 9 0

2003 NFL NFC East 3rd 5 11 0

2004 NFL NFC East 4th 6 10 0

2005 NFL NFC East 2nd 10 6 0 Won Wild Card Playoffs (Buccaneers) 17-10

Lost Divisional Playoffs (Seahawks) 20-10

2006 NFL NFC East 4th 5 11 0

2007 NFL NFC East 3rd 9 7 0 Lost Wild Card Playoffs (Seahawks) 35-14

2008 NFL NFC East 4th 8 8 0

Until the Super Bowl win, which took him 9 full seasons to get to, Jack Kent Cooke was not doing much better than Dan Snyder. Hopefully, Dan has now turned the corner as owner.

LOL. So if Dan Snyder had gone to two Superbowls at this point in his ownership, and had only one losing season so far, he'd be as good as JKC.

I'm still not sure how you see both owners as "not much difference." Looks like a HUGE difference to me.

Hail!

[hail2skins]

I put my money where my mouth is and went back to look at the first 10 years Jack Kent Cooke was majority owner of the Redskins. Starting in 1974, the Redskins records were as following: (Courtesy of Wikipedia). Take out the 1982 and 1983 seasons, and there is not much difference in success between the two of them....Until the Super Bowl win, which took him 9 full seasons to get to, Jack Kent Cooke was not doing much better than Dan Snyder. Hopefully, Dan has now turned the corner as owner.

Playoff-appearance wise, you might have an argument. But even if you take out 1982-83, 1974-81 still saw 5 winning seasons (including three 10 win seasons, two of which were in 14 game seasons), two .500 seasons, and one 6-10 seasons.

Damn, if you take away two of Snyder's best seasons (99 and 05) as owner like you did JKC's, you're left with a serious pile of crap.

[HailGreen28]

That right there, if I had to put my finger on one single thing that manged to **** up this franchise for over a decade, that would be it.

Considering how STL took off under Warner after Green was hurt, and how Saunders made everybody look good at KC with Green, Holmes, Gonzales, etc; do you think losing Green hurt that much?

[hail2skins]

Considering how STL took off under Warner after Green was hurt, and how Saunders made everybody look good at KC with Green, Holmes, Gonzales, etc; do you think losing Green hurt that much?

I would've liked to have seen more of the Trent Green movie play out in DC.

However, you make a good point with mentioning the importance of the supporting cast, and I think that the loss of Michael Westbrook early in 2000 really hurt the offense that year. Even if Trent were still here and we had the same level of success in '99, who's to say that Snyder doesn't bring in JG anyway as an insurance policy and gets frustrated if Trent also struggled without Westbrook in 2000?

[Commander PK]

LOL. So if Dan Snyder had gone to two Superbowls at this point in his ownership, and had only one losing season so far, he'd be as good as JKC.

I'm still not sure how you see both owners as "not much difference." Looks like a HUGE difference to me.

Hail!

Well, I did say JKC was more successful. I tend to look at this situation this way. How much difference is there really between 2nd and 3rd, or 3rd and 4th? 6-10 or 8-8? 7-9? or 9-7? The difference between those records could come down to a couple of plays, or a couple of bad calls. Somebody getting injured. Bad coaching decision, etc. What if the offense had kept generating points in the playoffs, and we made it to the big game and won in 2005? Snyder would also have 1 Super Bowl win. Of course it didn't happen, but it wasn't out of the realm of possibility.

---------- Post added June-4th-2011 at 12:25 PM ----------

To take this comparison one step further.

JKC from 1974 to 1983 had a total of 91 wins as owner

Dan Snyder from 1999 to 2008 had a total of 75 wins. (16) win difference averages out to 1.6 more wins per year for JKC.

Take away 1982 and 1983 for JKC, and 1999 and 2005 for Dan Snyder, and the average differs only .2 percent in Snyder's favor. Plus, you have to take into account JKC's partial ownership of the club for over 10 years before he became majority owner. Dan Snyder had no experience prior to 1999.

Just sayin'

[SonnyandSam]

The only real difference between JKC and the Danny is that JKC lucked out (but after consultation with many in the league) picking Bobby Beathard to be his GM. Beathard hired Joe Gibbs and built the SB winning teams. Snyder chose Vinny C and we have had a decade of awful football. Picking the right GM and Coach is a lot of luck. Guys predicted to be great GMs and coaches have failed and vice versa. It is often a crapshoot like the draft.

Should Snyder have JKC's success in his second decade, everyone will forget about the past ten years. Of course....that still has to happen, doesn't it. JKC is considered to be such a great owner only because the Skins were regular winners and three time SB champs. Snyder will eventually be considered the same if Allen/Shanahan can turn the team around on the field.

[hail2skins]

Take away 1982 and 1983 for JKC, and 1999 and 2005 for Dan Snyder, and the average differs only .2 percent in Snyder's favor.

So take away those years, and the Squier still had 69 wins to Snyder's 56. Plus.....we had 14 game seasons from 1974-1977. If you give JKC even three more wins over that four year stretch, he's averaging two more wins per year than Dan........in a 16-game season, that isn't insignificant.

What has been the ballbuster in this guy's ownership so far are the five seasons where we've been 6-10 or worse. And the five different head coaches he's hired. No attempt at continuity whatsoever.....Spurrier walked away from $5 mill/year rather than put up with Dan/Vinny any more, and it was naive to think Joe was going to stay much longer than his five-year deal.

That said, I do think Snyder perhaps has "gotten it" and think he'll give this current coach and GM a good chance......although I'm still curious as to what happens when Shanny leaves (hopefully that won't be for a good while).

[SWFLSkins]

LOL. So if Dan Snyder had gone to two Superbowls at this point in his ownership, and had only one losing season so far, he'd be as good as JKC.

I'm still not sure how you see both owners as "not much difference." Looks like a HUGE difference to me.

Hail!

It is great though that he took the time to show the flaws in his opinion.

[@DCGoldPants]

JKC from 1974 to 1983 had a total of 91 wins as owner

Dan Snyder from 1999 to 2008 had a total of 75 wins. (16) win difference averages out to 1.6 more wins per year for JKC.

Take away 1982 and 1983 for JKC, and 1999 and 2005 for Dan Snyder, and the average differs only .2 percent in Snyder's favor. Plus, you have to take into account JKC's partial ownership of the club for over 10 years before he became majority owner. Dan Snyder had no experience prior to 1999.

Just sayin'

I think the NFL went to the 16 game season around 1980, right? Maybe a little earlier.

That would mean for at least 4-5 seasons, Cooke's teams outperformed Snyder's with 2 fewer chances a year of winning (or losing)

---------- Post added June-4th-2011 at 12:42 PM ----------

So take away those years, and the Squier still had 69 wins to Snyder's 56. Plus.....we had 14 game seasons from 1974-1977. If you give JKC even three more wins over that four year stretch, he's averaging two more wins per year than Dan........in a 16-game season, that isn't insignificant.

What has been the ballbuster in this guy's ownership so far are the five seasons where we've been 6-10 or worse. And the five different head coaches he's hired. No attempt at continuity whatsoever.....Spurrier walked away from $5 mill/year rather than put up with Dan/Vinny any more, and it was naive to think Joe was going to stay much longer than his five-year deal.

That said, I do think Snyder perhaps has "gotten it" and think he'll give this current coach and GM a good chance......although I'm still curious as to what happens when Shanny leaves (hopefully that won't be for a good while).

boom, you beat me too it.

[chipwhich]

The only real difference between JKC and the Danny is that JKC lucked out (but after consultation with many in the league) picking Bobby Beathard to be his GM.

"Lucked out"???

Sometimes people amaze me.

He didn't pick Beathard out of a fish tank full of fish. Beathard was an accomplished talent evaluator in the league.

Luck would be Jim Zorn being hired and then turning this team around. That you would classify as luck.

Intelligent ownership is hiring good football people. JKC did that in hiring Beathard. Nobody in the league was laughing at that decision. Because it was a football decision...unlike the Zorn hiring.

So there wasn't luck involved.

[addicted]

Part of my own struggles with Snyder was because I remember JKC so well and those 80's teams. We were run so professionally back in those days. Snyder couldn't hold JKC's clipboard and comparing the two is like comparing David and Goliath, just not a fair fight.

[HailGreen28]

Well, I did say JKC was more successful. I tend to look at this situation this way. How much difference is there really between 2nd and 3rd, or 3rd and 4th? 6-10 or 8-8? 7-9? or 9-7? The difference between those records could come down to a couple of plays, or a couple of bad calls. Somebody getting injured. Bad coaching decision, etc. What if the offense had kept generating points in the playoffs, and we made it to the big game and won in 2005? Snyder would also have 1 Super Bowl win. Of course it didn't happen, but it wasn't out of the realm of possibility.

I appreciate your candor, even though we disagree. This site was useful in replying to you. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/was/. BTW - I think snyder won 76 reg. season games not 75. bfd.

You did some good homework, and make a thoughtful argument with some stats you bring up, even though I disagree strongly with your conclusion. But playing selective woulda coulda shoulda proves nothing. Take away Belichick's superbowls in NE, and he's just some loser the Browns fired and Patriots hired that still doesn't get it. Taking away a SB year out of JKC's tenure, or imagining a Snyder SB, invalidates any comparison. Especially since only 3 have been won in Skins history.

A couple plays might have kept a Snyder team 7-9 rather than 9-7, or a JKC team 10-6 rather than 12-4. I think every team has a "couple bad plays" in it's season. Exceptions being the '72 Dolphins and '07 Patriots (pre-SB). So I don't think the "couple plays" holds water, especially over 10 seasons where I think things really even out over time between two teams.

---------- Post added June-4th-2011 at 12:25 PM ----------

To take this comparison one step further.

JKC from 1974 to 1983 had a total of 91 wins as owner

Dan Snyder from 1999 to 2008 had a total of 75 wins. (16) win difference averages out to 1.6 more wins per year for JKC.

Take away 1982 and 1983 for JKC, and 1999 and 2005 for Dan Snyder, and the average differs only .2 percent in Snyder's favor. Plus, you have to take into account JKC's partial ownership of the club for over 10 years before he became majority owner. Dan Snyder had no experience prior to 1999.

Just sayin'

JKC his first 10 years went to two super bowls and had only one losing season. The nightmare that has been Snyder's first 10 years has been very different, wouldn't you agree?

As far as total wins go, bear in mind the NFL played only 14 games a season till 1978, and one season after that under JKC was cut by half by strike, a season we went freaking 8-1, so we're handicapping the JKC side a bit already. And in making this a 10 season span instead of 11 seasons, we're leaving out a 11-5 JKC season in '84 and a 4-12 Snyder season in '09, so there's a little more handicap against JKC. Also, it's more accurate to say that JKC gave us 97 WINS, vs Snyder giving us 78 WINS, but it seems you're counting only regular season which is a fair attempt for comparison but 6 playoff wins vs 2, over 10 years each, is another point in favor of JKC.

So if my math is right, big if, JKC gave us 97 total wins vs Snyder 78 wins. That's a 24% difference in JKC's favor over the same length timespan. Counting only reg season wins, JKC gave us 91 wins vs Snyder 76. That's "only" a 19.7% difference in JKC's favor, again over the same length timespan.

And I repeat, this is with some JKC teams playing shorter seasons than Snyder teams.

"No experience" is yet another reason that clown Snyder should have never been allowed to buy the Skins. Of course, the rest of the league, that voted their approval, must be happy now. :nutkick:

There's a HUGE difference between JKC's ownership and Snyder's ownership. So bad, it almost makes me laugh as much as cry.

[Commander PK]

It is great though that he took the time to show the flaws in his opinion.

I also took the time to post my perspective. I try to see things from the "glass is half full" perspective more often than not. Replace Vinny Cerrato with a competent GM (Allen), replace the head coach failures, (Zorn and Spurrier) with Shanahan, and hopefully Snyder has found his recipe for success.

---------- Post added June-4th-2011 at 01:46 PM ----------

Fair Enough on the numbers. They are what they are, and any way you slice it JKC numbers are without question superior. I will concede that much.

I guess the bottom line for me, is when you take Snyderatto in combination will all the head coaches that have come and gone, as well as free agent signings that epic failed, the difference is not so huge as you would expect. Given the way the team was run before Snyder's epiphany, it's amazing we had the limited success they have. Bodes well for the future if we have continued stability and direction from football minds like Shanahan and Allen.

[addicted]

There's a HUGE difference between JKC's ownership and Snyder's ownership. So bad, it almost makes me laugh as much as cry.

This is so true its just sad. It's not about championships. The demands that JKC put on all the team and players made them want to improve and compete every single year. Imagine in today's media if a multiple time Superbowl winning coach had his owner demanding more like he did Gibbs. Instead of just being a douche who signs huge checks and expects nothing like we have now with players that don't try for the owner our late great owner demanded more and got it. The league feared JKC, can anyone say that about Snyder?

[Burgold]

Y'know even if you like Snyder and have been impressed by the caliber of coach and players he's been able to seduce into joining the Redskins despite the on the field results and even if you think that Snyder's open pocket book is all you really can ask of an owner... In other words, if you take as rose tinted a perspective as possible...

You still go for JKC.

JKC has got the nostalgia (means all the bad is buried in the past)

JKC has the rings (with the Redskins and with the Lakers)

JKC had an equally liberal spending policy.

It's just a ridiculous poll. More, if what people really want is an owner who doesn't meddle with day to day affairs and just signs checks, then having a 98 year old owner is another plus.

I mean it's one thing to stack the deck. It's another to rig it.

[SWFLSkins]

Part of my own struggles with Snyder was because I remember JKC so well and those 80's teams. We were run so professionally back in those days. Snyder couldn't hold JKC's clipboard and comparing the two is like comparing David and Goliath, just not a fair fight.

Didn't David beat Goliath, bad example I think.

---------- Post added June-4th-2011 at 03:48 PM ----------

I also took the time to post my perspective. I try to see things from the "glass is half full" perspective more often than not. Replace Vinny Cerrato with a competent GM (Allen), replace the head coach failures, (Zorn and Spurrier) with Shanahan, and hopefully Snyder has found his recipe for success.

---------- Post added June-4th-2011 at 01:46 PM ----------

----I am glad you took that with a a grain of salt. I still think Snyder is on the right track finally and that is the optimist in me as well. Getting rid of bugs was the beginnning, letting Allen and Shanny run it is a great start, adding some wins will verify the revival. JKC had a knack for putting the right people in place, maybe Snyder has learned that now, he certainly showed a flawed approach by bringing and keeping a puppet in place for so long.

_____________________________________________________________

Fair Enough on the numbers. They are what they are, and any way you slice it JKC numbers are without question superior. I will concede that much.

I guess the bottom line for me, is when you take Snyderatto in combination will all the head coaches that have come and gone, as well as free agent signings that epic failed, the difference is not so huge as you would expect. Given the way the team was run before Snyder's epiphany, it's amazing we had the limited success they have. Bodes well for the future if we have continued stability and direction from football minds like Shanahan and Allen.

[SlinginSammy HOF '63]

I have to think about this. Do I want a 10 ounce filet mignon or a hot dog? Hmmmmmm

---------- Post added June-4th-2011 at 02:59 PM ----------

[/color]To take this comparison one step further.

JKC from 1974 to 1983 had a total of 91 wins as owner

Dan Snyder from 1999 to 2008 had a total of 75 wins. (16) win difference averages out to 1.6 more wins per year for JKC.

and they only played 14 game seasons in 4 of those ten seasons under JKC. The difference between the two is night and day no matter how you try to equate the two.