ES Soccer Thread

[DC9]

Soccer isn't something that you'd be able to watch on TV in the states with any reliability until recently.

 

This Premier League TV deal... and yes, even the Bundesliga one (to a much lesser extent) is popularizing the game.

 

That's all that the US needs.  A seed.  The world cup won some hearts over, but the MLS was never going to do that because the quality of the league is a joke.

 

At the end of the day we'll look back at these TV deals as the biggest effects in my opinion.

 

Much like how we have all of these talented young golfers now because of Tiger's popularity.

 

It's going to happen and it'll be within the next 20 years.

[DC9]

Rumor has it Odell Beckham was a better soccer player than football player. Could you imagine what that would look like....

 

Same with Ndamekong Suh and Sebastian Janekowski.  I remember hearing Janekowski scored like 60 goals his senior year for his high school team in Florida.

[jpage520]

I think it's a little column A and a little column B. The US has a very strong sports culture in general. Which is a HUGE factor in why we do churn out so many of the greatest athletes in the world. But structure plays a huge part. The more soccer grows here in its popularity, the more money will go into proper training, and the more money will go into growing the MLS into a more respectable league. We just don't quite have near the developmental environment here that they have overseas. Kids here can start into football as tikes and have the resources to grow up in it and be groomed to become superstars. Same with baseball through little league into school and basketball through AAU. Not saying it doesn't exist here for soccer, but it's nowhere near what it is overseas.

 

DC you're right in that the quality of play isn't there yet. But I think more of that goes into the fact that there's a prevalent notion here that you don't get rich playing soccer in the US. It's clear as day when the formula for a lot of the clubs in the league involve 1-2 guys pulling in Bentley money and the rest of the team driving KIAs.

 

One thing that I think absolutely burns the MLS is the fact that so many of their games never see regular TV airwaves. Especially during this time of year. It's mind boggling to me how they'll have a full weekend slate of good games, yet a max of four end up being broadcast to a general audience. And typically, one of those isn't even in English! Folks aren't going to pay a subscription fee to watch a league they have no familiarity with. Hell, even local TV is an issue. Before NC8 signed on to broadcast a lot of DCU games, you still had to stream them. That's insane. Instead of trying so hard to sell a subscription service to folks who don't know your product, how about trying to get a better TV deal?? That infuriates me.

[Elessar78]

We wouldn't instantly be world powers, but to say that having our best athletes playing soccer wouldn't make us better I think is a little short sighted. It would definitely have an impact. Better training methods and kids not playing in the college system will of course help a ton, but so will better athletes playing and loving soccer.

It's probably a more mental game than a physical game. Ronaldo isn't good because he's fast and has a good vertical. He's got phenomenal control and a good brain for the game. Same with Messi, his physical limitations are offset mostly by his understanding of the game and control of the ball. There's no guarantee that the Allen Iverson's and Odell Beckhams will achieve the grasp of the game or attain the ball control necessary. There's a lot of 6 foot somethings that are strong and fast in both MLS and NFL. In World Cups, our guys are fitter and comparable speed as any team. A team of Jozy Altidores, essentially. Control and smarts are where they are ahead of us. 

 

A QB gets 3 seconds to make a decision. In soccer, once a player is on the ball he, in effect, becomes the QB and he's got one second (for every ten yards of space) or less to make decisions. 

 

But all this is only relevant if we want to play like Argentina, Germany or Spain. 

 

Park the bus and launch it up to 6'8" soccer Lebron and we just run and brutalize teams and all this won't matter. 

[MisterPinstripe]

It's probably a more mental game than a physical game. Ronaldo isn't good because he's fast and has a good vertical. He's got phenomenal control and a good brain for the game. Same with Messi, his physical limitations are offset mostly by his understanding of the game and control of the ball. There's no guarantee that the Allen Iverson's and Odell Beckhams will achieve the grasp of the game or attain the ball control necessary. There's a lot of 6 foot somethings that are strong and fast in both MLS and NFL. In World Cups, our guys are fitter and comparable speed as any team. A team of Jozy Altidores, essentially. Control and smarts are where they are ahead of us. 

 

A QB gets 3 seconds to make a decision. In soccer, once a player is on the ball he, in effect, becomes the QB and he's got one second (for every ten yards of space) or less to make decisions. 

 

But all this is only relevant if we want to play like Argentina, Germany or Spain. 

 

Park the bus and launch it up to 6'8" soccer Lebron and we just run and brutalize teams and all this won't matter. 

You don't think that Ronaldo's psychical prowess doesn't have much of an impact with how good he has been in his career? Messi is a great athlete, just not how we typically think of an athlete. You sound like you think that our best athletes in other sports could have learned them game if they grew up playing it. If Lebron played soccer how do you know he wouldnt have the mental capacity for it? You don't, just like we don't know that he did.

 

Lets say all of our top athletes played soccer growing up instead of whatever they did. Obviously they all wouldnt be amazing soccer players. But I think its a bit silly to say that we would have gotten some great soccer players out of a huge bunch of the top players from the NBA, NFL, MLB, etc.

Edited April 12, 2016 by MisterPinstripe

[SkinssRvA]

Well, looks like city will do it. One group of mercenaries beats another. At least it's the BPL mercenaries that win!

[Elessar78]

Do you believe that we have a lot of college players and MLS players that are physically on par with whatever they have in Europe or South America? I do.

 

If we are, at the very least, on par physically. Why aren't we closer? 

[Bozo the kKklown]

Christian Pulisic looks like a great player, physically.

Edited April 12, 2016 by BenningRoadSkin

[FrFan]

Blanc as himself, clueless, with a stupid 3-5-2.

[MisterPinstripe]

Do you believe that we have a lot of college players and MLS players that are physically on par with whatever they have in Europe or South America? I do.

 

If we are, at the very least, on par physically. Why aren't we closer? 

I don't know that we are, we have guys with straight line speed, but we don't have many quick agile players. I think the biggest issue we have is the insistence that kids have to go to college. For one, I don't think college is a fit for everyone or worthwhile for everyone. Secondly, it definitely inhibits the growth of skills soccer wise.

 

If you think we are on par physically with Europe and South America, how do you think things would change if some of our top athletes played soccer well instead of their sport? For example, if you had a CB with the size and leaping ability of a power forward in basketball, who grew up playing and loving soccer, you don't think that would help us? Obviously not everyone is going to be good at soccer. But you seem to be saying that our top athletes wouldn't be good at soccer because reasons. Sure there are players that wouldn't be, but there would also be some players that would be.

 

And you didn't answer my last question. Do you think that Ronald's physical prowess hasn't had a big impact on his greatness? And do you think that Messi is a great athlete or not? If you don't think that Messi is a great athlete I will end this discussion here and leave it alone as we will never see eye to eye.

Edited April 12, 2016 by MisterPinstripe

[DC9]

Blanc as himself, clueless, with a stupid 3-5-2.

 

How do you NOT win with that side?  :lol: :lol:

 

I'm totally blown away by that.

 

City are clearly a different side with De Bruyne in the 11.  Kids a tidy player.

[FanboyOf91]

Do you believe that we have a lot of college players and MLS players that are physically on par with whatever they have in Europe or South America? I do.

 

If we are, at the very least, on par physically. Why aren't we closer? 

 

Lack of technical ability, low soccer IQ, no tactical education, poor American coaches who are obsessed with raw athleticism.

[Elessar78]

That's my point. If the ONLY thing holding our players back was strength, speed, and ups I'd concede the point. But we don't have players who exhibit enough control or "soccer IQ" (or at least enough of them) if you made them faster /stronger you'd just have Jozy.

Messi: is a great athlete, but those aren't the types we are discussing here

Ronaldo: his physical prowess modifies his skills and understanding of the game. Again, I believe we have guys in MLS that can match him for pace.

Edited April 12, 2016 by Elessar78

[MisterPinstripe]

That's my point. If the ONLY thing holding our players back was strength, speed, and ups I'd concede the point. But we don't have players who exhibit enough control or "soccer IQ" (or at least enough of them) if you made them faster /stronger you'd just have Jozy.

Messi: is a great athlete, but those aren't the types we are discussing here

Ronaldo: his physical prowess modifies his skills and understanding of the game. Again, I believe we have guys in MLS that can match him for pace.

I dont think anyone has said that the only thing holding back players was strength, speed, and ups. I certainly have never said that and can't think of anyone else who has. It's not an either or conversation. We can say that having our best athletes more often playing soccer would help AS WELL as coaching, training time. Both would be beneficial.

I just said our best athletes. That doesn't mean just people like Lebron. That could mean small quick guys like scat backs. So yes, when I say athlete Messi is included in that type. He's a small agile athlete.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Lest EVERYONE forgets through another exciting European week the REAL important day this week. Friday. 

 

God rest. The end is in sight.  

 

 

Hail. 
 

Edited April 13, 2016 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Such contrast to the last round. Thank you in advance to our friends from Dortmund:

Liverpool to hold minute's silence before Dortmund game in memory of Hillsborough victims - Liverpool Echo

 

Hail. 

Edited April 13, 2016 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

The latest new addition. This time to his staff:

 

Liverpool set to add Bayern Munich fitness coach to Klopp's backroom staff - Liverpool Echo

First Matip turning down Bayern. Then Gotze rumoured to be all but sealed. And now this. 

 

Memo to Bayern: NEVER piss off a Dortmund man!  .

 

Hail. 

Edited April 13, 2016 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[FrFan]

Zidane the ripper https://vine.co/v/iT0KQrzbeO6

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Zidane the ripper https://vine.co/v/iT0KQrzbeO6

 

 

You crazy French.  .

 

Hail. 

[DC9]

Saw that Dortmund away are planning to do a 96 mosaic in the away end.

 

All class.

 

All class.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Saw that Dortmund away are planning to do a 96 mosaic in the away end.

All class.

All class.

Honestly, last week was one big love in. NEVER had such hospitable welcome everywhere on a European trip. Top, top people.

There's plans to great the coach as well ala the 13/14 run in when it was 10 deep with all the flags, flares and smoke bombs.

So UEFA will probably do us for being over excited and supporting our team.

Hail.

Edited April 13, 2016 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[DC9]

I think this is the difference between a mature man and one of these younger kids, like a Raheem Sterling.

 

I think it's obvious that Ben wants out to both the club and to himself.  I think he's probably disappointed that Origi has taken his spot at LFC and with Belgium.  But I also think that he's saying the right things, and that hasn't gone unnoticed with me.

 

James Pearce ‏@JamesPearceEcho 3m3 minutes ago City of London, London

Benteke wants to stay & fight for his #LFC future but Reds open to offers for £32.5m striker http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-fc-striker-christian-benteke-11179209 …

Honestly, last week was one big love in. NEVER had such hospitable welcome everywhere on a European trip. Top, top people.

There's plans to great the coach as well ala the 13/14 run in when it was 10 deep with all the flags, flares and smoke bombs.

So UEFA will probably do us for being over excited and supporting our team.

Hail.

 

Saw that it was coordinated for a pub at the top of Anfield road between both support groups and the police.  I'm not sure you could do any better than that.

I can't ****ing wait until tomorrow.  Between the 2nd leg and the Caps starting their playoff march to the Stanley Cup, I'm about to die.

Zidane the ripper https://vine.co/v/iT0KQrzbeO6

 

Oh my!

 

That's probably a thousand dollar suit, too!

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

You and me too bro'.

Think I'm gonna' have a few bevvies in town with our Dortmund brothers and then head up and get in the ground early. Want to savour EVERYTHING!

1 more sleep!

Hail.

[DC9]

One thing that I think absolutely burns the MLS is the fact that so many of their games never see regular TV airwaves. Especially during this time of year. It's mind boggling to me how they'll have a full weekend slate of good games, yet a max of four end up being broadcast to a general audience. And typically, one of those isn't even in English! Folks aren't going to pay a subscription fee to watch a league they have no familiarity with. Hell, even local TV is an issue. Before NC8 signed on to broadcast a lot of DCU games, you still had to stream them. That's insane. Instead of trying so hard to sell a subscription service to folks who don't know your product, how about trying to get a better TV deal?? That infuriates me.

 

From a business perspective, this is horrible for MLS.  Being that I live out of state, I already shell out a few hundred a year for the Sunday ticket (NFL) and for Center Ice (NHL) and I'm still a Redskins STH and haven't been to a game in two years.  No way I can justify buying a package to watch a ****ty DCU team bumble it's way through this season.  My wife would leave me

 

But if you're trying to grow your league, and you see that Fox and NBC have deals with the Premier League and Bundesliga and are absolutely slaying the ratings... then go you're failing by making it so you have to buy a package to watch low quality football.  If I'm an MLS exec,  I see that little nugget there and I think to myself "that leaves CBS and ABC as open markets".  ABC doesn't even show sports at all anymore.  Go after them and see what kind of deal you can work out.  You get ABC, you get Disney as well, and they have money to burn.  CBS, they have the AFC games for the NFL and they also have the NCAA Basketball tournament, but they don't have a soccer league that they're tied to.  Why not go after them?

 

Just more poor business decisions... right down to limiting the number of foreign players each team can have.

[MisterPinstripe]

I remember last year or the year before MLS announced this big TV deal and that they would be on broadcast TV now, I was looking forward to being able to watch some games.

There are barely any MLS games on TV, whatever deal they did is crap and didn't really do anything for MLS exposure.