Reaganaut Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 There's so much wrong in this post that it's reaching out of my screen and slapping me in the face.I stopped thinking like guys think in Disney movies and started thinking like Reagan about two years ago, and my success with girls went up about 10,000% even though I was getting less physically attractive (I used to be athletic as all hell, now I'm about 15-20 pounds overweight and really need to get my ass in shape). Reagan knows what he's talking about. If you don't want to listen because your blind squirrel tactics find a nut every once in a while, you're just penalizing yourself. Preach, Reagan, preach. Glad to hear you figured this out Hubbs. I got married three years ago to a goddess that I picked, not the other way around. When you are a man women sense it instinctively. It doesn't matter what you look like either. They would rather be with a real man who is sexually aware and a few lbs overweight than a guy with abs who dotes on their every word, smiles at them looking for approval, and generally does what mommy taught them. Men act differently, talk differently, and aren't impressed by beautiful women. In fact, it's counterintuitive, but it's best to bust on hot women. Ask them if their shoes come in women's sizes etc. Trust me, you're right. Here's the bottom line: if the OP's friend has to ask this question then the game is already lost. Why? Because he puts this girl on a pedestal. She may actually even really want this guy to kiss her, but he's too busy biting his nails to watch her signs. His inner game is all wrong and it won't matter anyway how many dates it takes to kiss her because it's already blown. He's just a friend now and no matter how hard he tries he put himself there by his own choices. I bet this girl is telling her friends that she can't figure this guy out, she's giving him the signs but he is too dense to pick up on them. She will move on quickly like a chimp to the next tree. Guys are too stupid to realize that the girl will NEVER PUT THE MOVES on them. It's not "ladylike" and only "sluts" do that. Girls give signs. Guys just wonder if two dates is the right time to kiss her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubbs Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I was just kidding with ya, man. I was actually one of the few that didn't think you were totally nuts in that thread....One of the things I remember, was you said you liked to get your sleep and that was a reason why you did it. I completely understood that part. Because sleep is also very important to me. Interestingly, there was a story at nascar.com a few weeks ago about Jeff Gordon and his sleep. He and his wife had a kid a few years ago. And last year they used to arrive at the track with him each week. They would all sleep in his coach (or whatever they call them). He said with them being there with him he never got much sleep because his little girl always kept him up. Anyway, he said that this year they don't arrive at the track until the day of his races. I think there's something to be said for that. Because this year he's a much better driver and is competing for wins each and every week. Last year, not so much. Ha, I know. I'm fine with taking a good ribbing - doesn't necessarily mean that I think I'm wrong, but if you can come up with a good zing based on something I've said, I'll laugh along with you. That's a good story, and I totally believe that it's made a difference for Gordon. Sleep is incredibly important to the human body, and is the single most underrated part of America's daily schedule. If you don't believe me, just ask the Portland Trail Blazers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubbs Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 In fact, it's counterintuitive, but it's best to bust on hot women. It's like isolated truth. Guys are too stupid to realize that the girl will NEVER PUT THE MOVES on them. ...although I disagree with that. I've had it happen more than once. It's rare, but it definitely does happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus87 Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Glad to hear you figured this out Hubbs. I got married three years ago to a goddess that I picked, not the other way around. When you are a man women sense it instinctively. It doesn't matter what you look like either. They would rather be with a real man who is sexually aware and a few lbs overweight than a guy with abs who dotes on their every word, smiles at them looking for approval, and generally does what mommy taught them. Men act differently, talk differently, and aren't impressed by beautiful women. In fact, it's counterintuitive, but it's best to bust on hot women. Ask them if their shoes come in women's sizes etc. Trust me, you're right. Here's the bottom line: if the OP's friend has to ask this question then the game is already lost. Why? Because he puts this girl on a pedestal. She may actually even really want this guy to kiss her, but he's too busy biting his nails to watch her signs. His inner game is all wrong and it won't matter anyway how many dates it takes to kiss her because it's already blown. He's just a friend now and no matter how hard he tries he put himself there by his own choices. I bet this girl is telling her friends that she can't figure this guy out, she's giving him the signs but he is too dense to pick up on them. She will move on quickly like a chimp to the next tree. Guys are too stupid to realize that the girl will NEVER PUT THE MOVES on them. It's not "ladylike" and only "sluts" do that. Girls give signs. Guys just wonder if two dates is the right time to kiss her. Well, I'll say this much. The way you describe your view on it might come off as a little blunt in some ways, but I agree with you in the general idea.I think it's easy for some guys to psyche themselves out of the game before it's even really started, and when it comes time to make moves that she's expecting a guy to make, they're too busy thinking they need to "just let it happen" or not offend her in some way. I've almost always found, from my own experience and my friends' experiences, that sitting back and playing the "easy going, casual, patient" role was for chumps. Girls don't necessarily want jerks or guys that move too fast, but they also don't mind if a guy can tease them for making a clumsy mistake, joke on them for a song or movie they like, etc. Especially if the joking involves any light physical contact, like if I'm out with a girl and some silly pop song comes up on that she likes, I'll tease her for it while nudging her with my elbow or something. I'm not advocating going out, finding a cute girl somewhere, and then immediately proceeding to make fun of her clothes and haircut and then following that by asking her out to dinner sometime. But most girls don't mind a little joking on them to lighten the mood, especially if they can give it the same in return. It can instantly relieve some of the pressure of being on a date with a new person and break the lines on some personal boundaries that maybe both people didn't feel comfortable exploring yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffSchmeff Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I'd say first or second date. I've gone out with girls that seemed really nervous and there just wasn't an opportunity on the first date. If there's no kiss by the second date, there is usually a problem. If this guy doesn't get a kiss by the third date, SHF is right, he's in the friend zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reic Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I say first date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buenosdiaz Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 i usually send a kissy smiley after about a week of talking we're talking about chat room girlfriends right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Call me crazy, but I'd say when it feels right... To put a number on it is strange, to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HogNose Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 First date. i usually send a kissy smiley after about a week of talkingwe're talking about chat room girlfriends right? :hysterical: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinz4Life12 Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 the OP is putting the ***** on a pedestal. quit building the ***** up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaganaut Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Well, I'll say this much. The way you describe your view on it might come off as a little blunt in some ways, but I agree with you in the general idea.I think it's easy for some guys to psyche themselves out of the game before it's even really started, and when it comes time to make moves that she's expecting a guy to make, they're too busy thinking they need to "just let it happen" or not offend her in some way. I've almost always found, from my own experience and my friends' experiences, that sitting back and playing the "easy going, casual, patient" role was for chumps. Girls don't necessarily want jerks or guys that move too fast, but they also don't mind if a guy can tease them for making a clumsy mistake, joke on them for a song or movie they like, etc. Especially if the joking involves any light physical contact, like if I'm out with a girl and some silly pop song comes up on that she likes, I'll tease her for it while nudging her with my elbow or something. I'm not advocating going out, finding a cute girl somewhere, and then immediately proceeding to make fun of her clothes and haircut and then following that by asking her out to dinner sometime. But most girls don't mind a little joking on them to lighten the mood, especially if they can give it the same in return. It can instantly relieve some of the pressure of being on a date with a new person and break the lines on some personal boundaries that maybe both people didn't feel comfortable exploring yet. This is closer to what I believe and you will definitely do better than a wuss bag guy. You have to keep control of the situation. Girls want that. You should be a gentleman and order for them, open doors, put your hand on their back to guide them through a door etc. This lets them know they are protected. At the same time, busting on them has to be funny. If it's just being rude then forget it. Being playful is great. For fun, I accused a very attractive woman of stalking me in a bar on St. Pats day. Every time she passed me I'd say "would you please stop stalking me, this is getting embarassing..." Late night she walked up behind me and grabbed my hand. She said "You're doing all the right things, it's just that I'm married." I laughed with her for a couple minutes about it. She thought it was charming, funny and she apologized to me for not being able to do anything about it. There's a difference between a jerk guy or someone who moves to fast and they are not interested, believe me. You can be a jerk if you are funny, or move fast if they want you to move fast. Attraction is not a choice. You can, however create attraction in her for you and she cannot control it. By the same token, if you turn her off by being a "friend" then there's no way she will feel attraction for you however many times you send flowers or call her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenaa Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I'd guess the OP's "friend" is looking for more than to just "hit it". You can be a "real man" and not kiss a woman on the first date. I took my wife on several dates before we kissed. She was definately wanting a kiss and teased me afterwords for taking so long. But I can tell you this, it was a first kiss we remember fondly to this day, 17 years later. I can recall every detail down to what she was wearing. I want to know a woman a little before starting down the road to physical intimacy. If she's not someone I want to hang with, I'm not interested in the physical. It takes more than one date for me to figure that out. Call me a wussy or whatever you want, my wife would disagree and that's all that matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaganaut Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 It's like isolated truth....although I disagree with that. I've had it happen more than once. It's rare, but it definitely does happen. Hubbs, I believe you because I've had girls do that too BUT be honest. Was it a girl you had raging hormones for and were in a major flirt routine with, or was it a girl who had it for you from the beginning? I'm sure Brad Pitt could walk into a club and have his jeans ripped off of him in under a minute. There's a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenaa Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 This is closer to what I believe and you will definitely do better than a wuss bag guy. You have to keep control of the situation. Girls want that. You should be a gentleman and order for them, open doors, put your hand on their back to guide them through a door etc. This lets them know they are protected. At the same time, busting on them has to be funny. If it's just being rude then forget it. Being playful is great. For fun, I accused a very attractive woman of stalking me in a bar on St. Pats day. Every time she passed me I'd say "would you please stop stalking me, this is getting embarassing..." Late night she walked up behind me and grabbed my hand. She said "You're doing all the right things, it's just that I'm married." I laughed with her for a couple minutes about it. She thought it was charming, funny and she apologized to me for not being able to do anything about it. There's a difference between a jerk guy or someone who moves to fast and they are not interested, believe me. You can be a jerk if you are funny, or move fast if they want you to move fast. Attraction is not a choice. You can, however create attraction in her for you and she cannot control it. By the same token, if you turn her off by being a "friend" then there's no way she will feel attraction for you however many times you send flowers or call her. What does any of this have to do with whether or not you kiss a woman on a fisrt date? If your charm is working, waiting a few dates only heightens the anticipation. If a woman is put off by not getting kissed on the first few days, I have one word. Next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaganaut Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I'd guess the OP's "friend" is looking for more than to just "hit it". You can be a "real man" and not kiss a woman on the first date. I took my wife on several dates before we kissed. She was definately wanting a kiss and teased me afterwords for taking so long. But I can tell you this, it was a first kiss we remember fondly to this day, 17 years later. I can recall every detail down to what she was wearing. I want to know a woman a little before starting down the road to physical intimacy. If she's not someone I want to hang with, I'm not interested in the physical. It takes more than one date for me to figure that out. Call me a wussy or whatever you want, my wife would disagree and that's all that matters. You are lucky your wife really liked you because you probably did wait too long and could have lost her. What if you never got the courage up to kiss her in the first place? Do you think she would have initiated it with you? No. I am in agreement that physical is not where it's at, but it's very important. Anyone who says different is dishonest. You have to have physical attraction and chemistry or it's a sham. I'm not going to sugar coat it, you probably were a wussy those years ago, but as long as you have control of yourself and your marriage then you are fine. As long as you are happy then no worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaganaut Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 What does any of this have to do with whether or not you kiss a woman on a fisrt date? If your charm is working, waiting a few dates only heightens the anticipation. If a woman is put off by not getting kissed on the first few days, I have one word. Next. Let me make this clearer. If a woman likes a guy and is giving him all the signals and he just sits there biting his nails then she will move on before the guy can even say "next." I do think you are wise though to bring up the word NEXT into the equation. You need to find a gem. Only one in ten beautiful women are cool and even worth your attention to begin with. If you approach this from a mentality of scarcity then you will end up with the leftovers. If you are confident and are willing to say "next" then you will be much more successful. Kissing really isn't a big deal, but it's the first step. It's uncomfortable for some people and it used to be for me too until I was about eighteen. Being a "man" is way more important. No way to fake it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I think everyone is way overthinking this. Do your thing. If it is introducing yourself with a kiss...then introduce yourself with a kiss and you will find a woman that is your type. If you want to get to know someone first...then get to know them first. The only people you will ever miss out on are the ones that aren't your style in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinthePRF Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Depends on what girl you're taking out. 1. Innocent girl Likely occupation: Student What she expects: 3rd date passionate romantic kiss on the lips What you expect: To be her first everything Summary: Go easy, she's going to remember you forever, good or bad. 2. Sassy girl Likely occupation: Retail associate What she expects: 2nd date hot french kiss What you expect: 1rst date kiss, prepare to be disappointed Summary: She underrates you, you might end up working hard for little reward, so cool your jets a bit. 3. Flirty girl Likely occupation: Waitress What she expects: 1rst date make out session, something to make her forget her boyfriend who she is madly in love with still What you expect: 1rst date kiss, you're going to get that and a bit more. Summary: Buyer beware, you're going to get more than you bargained for. 4. Modeling girl Likely occupation: Spending daddy's credit cards What she expects: 4th, maybe 5th date kiss, as soon as you've earned your keep. What you expect: To marry her, immediately. Summary: If you are sold only on perfect 10 looks, start banging your head against the wall and enjoy the pain to reap later great reward, or failure. 5. One night stand girl Likely occupation: day shift stripper What she expects: Someone to finally stop treating her like an object, this time. What you expect: Hit it and forget it. Summary: There is a darker side of one night stands those that have had the "luck" to have one don't share, have fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgun88 Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 hahaha kevin....nice work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SolidSnake84 Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I met the woman who would eventually be my wife when she was only 16. We were high school sweethearts/ I knew her through a friend, and ended up talking and hanging out with her for a LONG Time, before we kissed for the first time almost 7 months later. She told me that night that she had been waiting for a long time for that. So i think it depends on the type of girl. My wife was very shy, and very quiet. She wasnt like so many of these girls I see that give everything up on the first date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubbs Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I met the woman who would eventually be my wife when she was only 16. We were high school sweethearts/ I knew her through a friend, and ended up talking and hanging out with her for a LONG Time, before we kissed for the first time almost 7 months later. She told me that night that she had been waiting for a long time for that.So i think it depends on the type of girl. My wife was very shy, and very quiet. She wasnt like so many of these girls I see that give everything up on the first date. Using your junior (sophomore?) year of high school as a general guide for adult dating is kind of like using the Model T as a general guide for fixing a 2009 hybrid. Hubbs, I believe you because I've had girls do that too BUT be honest. Was it a girl you had raging hormones for and were in a major flirt routine with, or was it a girl who had it for you from the beginning? I'm sure Brad Pitt could walk into a club and have his jeans ripped off of him in under a minute. There's a difference. Usually flirting. The one that's popping into my head right now, I had spent a couple of hours going back-and-forth with her when she suddenly pulled me into a closet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SolidSnake84 Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 That's a good point about the model T reference. I should have elaborated more on my story. I was just trying to illustrate the point that i think there is no set rule. I think it varies with each person... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PresidentClinton07 Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Depends on what girl you're taking out.1. Innocent girl 2. Sassy girl 3. Flirty girl 4. Modeling girl 5. One night stand girl This post is so true, it can't even be described in words. :applause::applause::applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike619 Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 my girl gave me a small kiss on the lips at the end of our second date. i didnt get a really good kiss until in to our 4th date. and we arent stuck in the friend zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffSchmeff Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 See? Second date though. I still say if you go 3 dates with nothing you're in trouble. It doesn't have to be makeout central - just any kind of kiss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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