Mooka Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 people are assuming that if they agree with a statement that it is ok to be made, however not taking into account that many others may disagree. This arguement that as long as you agree with it, it's ok, is ridiculous IMO. The argument is that if you win an Oscar you get to stand up there and say whatever you wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarrellsMyHero28 Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 You're 20 so I'll let that slide...consider that a second chance :rotflmao: What exactly are you going to do to me? You're a baby, a child--you're immature, ignorant and a total sheep for the Republican party. Yeah, I'm 20 years old and I know exponentially more than you about just about every subject you've ever posted on and I can actually debate them intelligibly. Quit ****ing about movies being liberal, if you don't like them don't go watch them. If the Academy Awards offend you then don't turn on your TV that night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heisenberg Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 81 you should basically stop watching movies. The fact that you don't see Sean Penn movies because of his political leanings mean that 99% of movies that come out you just shouldn't bother seeing. I can't believe you made such a ridiculous statement - although you did have that ridiculous WALL-E thread a while back so I guess I shouldn't be too surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Your racial (spelling FTW) speech is not a good comparison. Of course someone would be legally permitted to say it. It would, however, be wrong. Just like someone could get up and make a homophobic speech, but it would be wrong too. So as long as you agree with the speech, or in your mind think it's RIGHT, it's perfectly fine to make it.:doh: You say that you aren't hateful, but don't "accept" their "lifestyle." Being gay is no more a choice than being straight is. Since when was not accecpting something fall under the definition of hate?? And the last part is of course all OPINION. Couching the argument in terms like "lifestyle" is propaganda too. The same tired arguments were made supporting laws against mixed-race marriages in the 50's and 60's. I think your viewpoint has as much ethical and moral validity as those racist views do. Of course you have a right to have those views, and I would absolutely defend your right to express them. It doesn't make them correct. Nor are yours. Last night Sean Penn was articulating the same thing (I think). It is time for the people who would deny equal rights to all to think about and reflect on their views. I think (and hope) that a generation from now we will all look back at the homophobia of the prop 8 vote the same way we look back at Jim Crow now. I guess what I find so amazing, is that as long as you agree with the statement, he was right on! However, if some other statement was made that you didn't agree with it wouldn't have been ok. Ok, what if a conservative republican actor won an award and made a speech in which he proclaimed support for those who upheld marriage and voted yes on prop 8 and that Homosexuals should be ashamed of their lifestyle? Would that have been ok to say at the oscars?? Basically that would be the opposite of what penn said...right?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 The argument is that if you win an Oscar you get to stand up there and say whatever you wish. Well that just isn't the case, since I posed an example of saying whatever one might wish and it has been met with, that's wrong and racist. So that arguement also doesn't hold true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 81 you should basically stop watching movies.The fact that you don't see Sean Penn movies because of his political leanings mean that 99% of movies that come out you just shouldn't bother seeing. I can't believe you made such a ridiculous statement - although you did have that ridiculous WALL-E thread a while back so I guess I shouldn't be too surprised. Which ridiculous statement are you talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Bottom line, Penns speech was intolerant of other peoples views. Which is pretty hypocritical since tolerance is the mantra of gay supporters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dictator Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 It would be freaking heaven if 81 learned the art of the multi-quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcl05 Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Ok, what if a conservative republican actor won an award and made a speech in which he proclaimed support for those who upheld marriage and voted yes on prop 8 and that Homosexuals should be ashamed of their lifestyle? Would that have been ok to say at the oscars?? Basically that would be the opposite of what penn said...right?? Of course it would have been OK. They are allowed to say basically whatever they want. They would have been wrong, but they would be allowed to say it. Freedom of speech means freedom to demonstrate your ignorance and bigotry. I agree with Penn. I didn't agree with a lot of the stuff Reagan or Charlton Heston spoke out about. They absolutely had the right to do it, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpillian Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 So beautiful... Latika (whatever the actress' really name) was gorgeous in Slumdog Millionaire -- you are right on TJ. Had an odd experience last night: I watched Slumdog Millionaire and then a half hour later watched Rahman win his Oscars for the sountrack and Jai Ho, and then a half hour later watched them win Best Picture. And boy did it deserve it. I wasn't expecting much from the movie, and was wildly surprised by it. A truly original story, in (for me at least) an extremely exotic locale. Totally blew me away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcl05 Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Bottom line, Penns speech was intolerant of other peoples views. Which is pretty hypocritical since tolerance is the mantra of gay supporters. Wrong. Equality is the mantra. Equal rights for all. There's no reason to "tolerate" homophobia, just like we shouldn't tolerate racism or sexism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachie Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Bottom line, Penns speech was intolerant of other peoples views. Which is pretty hypocritical since tolerance is the mantra of gay supporters. He was speaking intolerantly of intolerance, man. Intolerance = bad. Not tolerating intolerance = good. Tricky. I can see where you missed that nuance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooka Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Well that just isn't the case, since I posed an example of saying whatever one might wish and it has been met with, that's wrong and racist. So that arguement also doesn't hold true. The argument holds true, in reality. Maybe not in your fantasy world where you equate calling the president a ****** with what Penn said. When you ask trivial questions: Who is he and why does he get a stage when most of america doesn't?? You get trivial answers. Don't get all argumentative trying to argue that 1+1 does not equal 2 because of some fantasy math you created in your head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heisenberg Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Which ridiculous statement are you talking about? The fact that you won't watch a Sean Penn movie because you disagree with his politics is absurd. I'm sorry but it is. If that's really the case then you should probably stop watching the Redskins - along with most professional sports and give up a ton of other movies as well. I don't understand the correlation between the political views of Sean Penn the actor and the character he plays in the movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AAARedskin Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 I really think Mickey Rourke was cheated. Sean Penn COMPLETELY benefitted unfairly thanks to the high percentage of gays in the Academy, the high percentage of EXTREME liberals in the Academy who are hardened supporters of the plight of gays, and the subject matter of the film "Milk." Sometimes if you make the right film about the right LIBERAL TOPIC/CAUSE, you can have an Oscar HANDED to you, rather than you having to EARN IT. Oh, and before anybody even thinks of attacking me, I'm NOT a hater......I'm just being very honest and being very, very real. Sean Penn is a miserable dwarf, and he's half the actor MICKEY ROURKE is. Penn all but admitted in his acceptance speech that MICKEY deserved the Oscar!.......yes it is sometimes tuff to hide one's guilt, isn't it Mr. Penn? Penn also hugely benefitted from being an EXTREME liberal activist.....something that the liberal Academy surely appreciates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Of course it would have been OK. They are allowed to say basically whatever they want. They would have been wrong, but they would be allowed to say it. Freedom of speech means freedom to demonstrate your ignorance and bigotry. Thank, you. At least you've been man enough to admit such a statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 He was speaking intolerantly of intolerance, man. Intolerance = bad. Not tolerating intolerance = good. Tricky. I can see where you missed that nuance. Wait, I thought tolerance was the ability to indulge the beliefs of others or actions that differ from someone elses. See everyone including you miss that part. Tolerance is not acceptance. However, again most people including you and others who think like you, believe that those two words have the same meaning, when in reality they completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 The argument holds true, in reality. Maybe not in your fantasy world where you equate calling the president a ****** with what Penn said. When you ask trivial questions: You get trivial answers. Don't get all argumentative trying to argue that 1+1 does not equal 2 because of some fantasy math you created in your head. Do not people in this world hold the belief regarding what I used as an example?? It doesn't matter whether it's right or wrong, but that it is a belief held by people in our society. It doesn't matter if it is hateful or not. Racist or not. It's the point. Many people hold the opposite view of what Penn said, thus they found it offensive and condecending. If he is allowed to make that speech, which was deemed offensive by I'm sure alot of people, than isn't it equally offensive to make the speech example I used. So far, no one agrees. The problem is, there are many on this board who paint me a blinded by me "propaganda" or "agenda" yet, many of you are just as blinded by yours. I'll use it again, if republican award winner got up and made a speech that said he was proud of the people who stood up and voted yes on prop 8 and was ashamed of the gay community and their lifestyle, would he be ok in saying that?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 The fact that you won't watch a Sean Penn movie because you disagree with his politics is absurd. I'm sorry but it is. If that's really the case then you should probably stop watching the Redskins - along with most professional sports and give up a ton of other movies as well.I don't understand the correlation between the political views of Sean Penn the actor and the character he plays in the movies. I don't want to play a role in paying him. Not to mention that he is a total hypocrit. He rails against those who don't support equal rights for gays, yet he pal's around and shmoozes with dictators who countries don't even allow gay rights. As for the Redskins, or other movies, I don't know the political leanings of any redskin. Why, becuase they don't get up on some soapbox in public and point a finger at anyone. Which is how it should be. Do your thing and keep your mouth shut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagleskins Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 People that automatically shut out actors because of their political beliefs are absolute idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 People that automatically shut out actors because of their political beliefs are absolute idiots. :doh: brilliant, just classy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachie Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Wait, I thought tolerance was the ability to indulge the beliefs of others or actions that differ from someone elses. See everyone including you miss that part. Tolerance is not acceptance. However, again most people including you and others who think like you, believe that those two words have the same meaning, when in reality they completely different. Pwning yourself again. Gay people tolerate and accept everything about straight people. Your section of the straight demo won't tolerate or accept gay marriage. You don't want them to be as free as you are. You don't want them to have equal rights. That's bigotry. Bigotry is wrong and so you are wrong. It's such a simple concept, 81. That's the part you're missing. The other part is freedom of speech. You have it, Sean Penn has it. Going by your first post in this thread and all your fist pounding and wailing throughout (which is your right), you just can't stand to see him exercise his. Sorry, bud. You're getting punked here and no matter how many times you try to rephrase your argument, it's still going to be the ravings of a bigot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Pwning yourself again. Gay people tolerate and accept everything about straight people. Your section of the straight demo won't tolerate or accept gay marriage. You don't want them to be as free as you are. You don't want them to have equal rights. That's bigotry. Bigotry is wrong and so you are wrong. It's such a simple concept, 81. That's the part you're missing. The other part is freedom of speech. You have it, Sean Penn has it. Going by your first post in this thread and all your fist pounding and wailing throughout (which is your right), you just can't stand to see him exercise his. Sorry, bud. You're getting punked here and no matter how many times you try to rephrase your argument, it's still going to be the ravings of a bigot. First of all I'm done with you on this, since all you do is label and pound your fists against your chest as if your right. Self confidence is an honorable trait, however arrogance is truely ugly Ya know I could stand here too and do what you have, which is tell you you're wrong without any debate. But I foolishy choice to actually debate the topic. Finally, I have to point out again a final time, that you my friend do not understand the difference between tolerance and acceptance. Once you understand the difference between those two words, you will get it, until than you will only be left in the dark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toe Jam Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 :doh: brilliant, just classy! And you are surely the epitome of class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinz4Life12 Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 First of all I'm done with you on this, since all you do is label and pound your fists against your chest as if your right. Self confidence is an honorable trait, however arrogance is truely ugly Ya know I could stand here too and do what you have, which is tell you you're wrong without any debate. But I foolishy choice to actually debate the topic. Finally, I have to point out again a final time, that you my friend do not understand the difference between tolerance and acceptance. Once you understand the difference between those two words, you will get it, until than you will only be left in the dark. this is a statement of defeat as i see it. and i still wish rourke would have won... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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