S.T.real,lights,out Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Also i find it sooo hard to believe that Snyder hasn't even considered the Pats GM!!! You know he wants to win more than anyone else! I know he loves his money but it seems he Genuinely wants to win!!! Do the right thing and get the Pats GM and lets start this thing over the right way! I would be willing to wait a few years for something good to come out of this team than to go through another season like we just did! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BALLz Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 It boggles my mind continuously that Snyder doesn't just go out and buy the best scouting department he possibly can.I mean seriously. He wants to spend the cash. Why not spend on the guys making the real decisions, so he doesn't waste any money on bum free agents or draft picks? Saves him a lot more that way. In defense of Snyder on this subject, he did go out and get Morocco Brown last off-season. I believe a lot of people are pretty high on him. He was brought in after FA had started though, but when he got here he made good decisions. Mike Green was a pretty good find and he did well when Horton was out. So was Fincher. And our practiced squad had like 5 people signed off it. I'd say thats a pretty good testiment to his talent evaluation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie5 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Also i find it sooo hard to believe that Snyder hasn't even considered the Pats GM!!! You know he wants to win more than anyone else! I know he loves his money but it seems he Genuinely wants to win!!! Do the right thing and get the Pats GM and lets start this thing over the right way! I would be willing to wait a few years for something good to come out of this team than to go through another season like we just did! This is all well and good, but remember one thing: Phil Savage of the Ravens was, more or less, Scott Pioli just a few years ago. That didn't work out so well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 For some reason I think Cowher is going to be a major flop at his next stop, but I still want a new coach here, just not him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goaldeje Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 This is all well and good, but remember one thing: Phil Savage of the Ravens was, more or less, Scott Pioli just a few years ago. That didn't work out so well. This is an excellent point, one that few people think through. Bellichick runs the show up there. Yes, Pioli appears to do a fine job, but we really don't know for sure until he gets on his own, do we? There are no guarantees here. Ernie5's reference to Savage should be sobering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/jan/01/its-up-to-snyder-to-make-the-call/All over the NFL, every owner whose team is not in the playoffs should be making a New Year's resolution - call Bill Cowher. That includes Washington Redskins owner Dan Snyder. Bill Cowher went 161-99-1 in 15 seasons as coach of the Steelers. For Snyder to make that call would be admitting that his nepotism toward Cerrato was a failed exercise, as Cowher, or any other HC worth his salt, would want him gone. (Witness last years bungled coaching search.). And also for him to step back, relinquish control of the football side, and turn over full football duties to a proven, professional GM that Cowher could work with and build this franchise the way it should be built. Herein lies the problem. His ego won't allow it. :mad: Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikie Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 regarding cowher, I'd bet the next team he ends up at is going to be the team with a or the closest thing to a franchise QB... he went to 5 AFC championshps and won 1 of them, with Big Ben in his second year... before that he had kordell and o'donnell who were horrible in his losses, and I think taught him how hard it is to win with anything less than a franchise-esque QB... and I just don't think we qualify as that team... I know it's a stretch, but I think cowher is going to give serious consideration to denver... with cutler there and an owner with the patience and character of bowlen, and the open GM spot as well, I think it's the perfect fit for Bill... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armada58 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 It's really amazing how hypocritical people can be. (I'm not calling out any individual) People are seriously ripping Snyder for NOT doing the things that they used to rip him FOR doing. .................Years ago he got crucified because he needed a GM. So he promotes Cerrato to GM. One year into Cerrato's tenure of having final say on personnel, people want to get rid of the GM. Amazing. .................He used to get killed for ignoring the draft and signing too many free agents. So we ignore free agency and go heavy on the draft. Now people want to rip the draft class after only their rookie seasons. It's like all those years of free agency made people forget about how long it takes for rookies and for a whole draft class in general to develop. Be careful what you wish for!!! ..................Snyder got crucified for never having continuity. He decides to stick with the game plan started a year ago and not make wholesale changes. Now he gets ripped for not tearing it all down and starting over. ..................Snyder used to get slaughtered for going after the "flashy" hires and the "big splash". So he hires a decidedly non-splashy HC in Zorn. Now he's getting ripped for not going after Bill Cowher. The list goes on and on. It's crazy. We've officially reached the point where Snyder will NEVER be able to do the right thing. I, for one, like the fact that we're sticking with Zorn and ignoring the temptation for splashy moves and wholesale changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destructis Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I didnt even say anything about getting cowher. If i were Dan Snyder my number one priority would be to can Vinny and Get Pioli. I think Dan should then let Pioli run the show but agree at least to give zorn one year for pioloi to evaluate. I agree with you on this. As much as I like Zorn, I think Pioli should be able to make his own choice if that's what he wants to do. If he is going to live and die by his decisions, then he should have the power to go with what he believes full bore. I would hope that Pioli thinks enough of Zorn to keep him, but if he doesn't..... I also think that Pioli should take the hit at the beginning and clean out anyone he doesn't feel fits in with what he wants to do. I don't see Dan Snyder giving up control again though. To bad because Pioli would be great here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie5 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Armada: Welcome. Sometimes it seems people prefer hating to winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuryYourDuke Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Yeah, you're right. Two playoff appearances in three years really cracked people up. I'm fine with people saying that the team has underperformed during Snyder's ownership -- because they have -- but this laughingstock nonsense just removes any credibility from the speaker. If we're laughingstocks (which I seriously doubt), it's because of paranoid quotes like those above.When my brother was in college in Chicago in the late 80s, we used to laugh at the Bear fans who would praise the team as being the greatest ever if they went 4-1 and then threaten to lynch the McCaskey family if they went 1-4. All along, it simply highlighted the fact that these fans didn't understand the game. Now, we're like that. That depresses me more than losing football games. Man, we are a laughingstock. He wasn't saying we haven't at times performed well. But it is obvious that from a management standpoint, we are the joke/cautionary tale of the NFL. Think about it. Every guy that wants to be traded, who does their agent link them to? The Washington Redskins. Why? So he can up their salary with other teams b/c everyone knows we overpay. Every time a big name, over the hill FA comes up, the media talks about the Skins being interested. Everyone laughs about our front office's big spending ways. Snyder is synonymous with poor management around the NFL. He's king of the big splash. Other front offices, other teams fans, and the media look at us as a joke. Trust me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuryYourDuke Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I agree with you on this. As much as I like Zorn, I think Pioli should be able to make his own choice if that's what he wants to do. If he is going to live and die by his decisions, then he should have the power to go with what he believes full bore. I would hope that Pioli thinks enough of Zorn to keep him, but if he doesn't.....I also think that Pioli should take the hit at the beginning and clean out anyone he doesn't feel fits in with what he wants to do. I don't see Dan Snyder giving up control again though. To bad because Pioli would be great here. If you look over the Snyder tenure, it seems people having their hands tied, whether in management or coaching, is a common theme. Thereby reducing otherwise talented peoples' ability to function at their best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sideshow24 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 you mean like he did with marty and gibbs? He fired Marty to get control BACK. Cowher can't even compare to the success of Gibbs I and the overwhelming fan support of bringing the legend back, so I think he was the ONLY person he'd ever give that much control to for a long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrumanB Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Every offseason there's going be "that" coach that everyone just has to get. The past 2 seasons, it's been Cowher. This offseason, Shanahan is in the mix. Next offseason, Holmgren will be the talk of the NFL. How about we stop chasing names (coaches AND players) and try to succeed with the direction Snyder has chosen for this organization. I have MANY issues with how Snyder has run this organization in the past, but he seems to have learned something from Gibbs and let's see how it plays out. Both Zorn AND Cerrato deserve at least another season to show that they can be successful. So far, I think the results have been mixed. But, we have to give these guys an opportunity. You can't pull the plug after one season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armada58 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Armada: Welcome. Sometimes it seems people prefer hating to winning. Hating is just easier, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darc Requiem Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 @Armada58 Excellent post. "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" describes Snyder's situation. Snyder has made some boneheaded decisions in the past, but at this point he gets lambasted no matter what he does. He gave Gibbs total control and still got reamed whenever something went wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 It looks as thought you are all setting yourself up for disappointment. If Cowher comes back this year with another team then the Skins lose out. Shannahan as well. Mangini? Pass. What has that guy done? My thought is Cowher is waiting another year. That's a good thing for skins fans because Vinny Zorn may and most likely will fail next season. I think at that point in time you will see Dan finally decide to cut ties with Vinny Next year... We're stuck with what we have. Enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I don't see Cowher ever coming here. Mostly because at this point in his career, Cowher will demand (and most likely receive) a GM/Coach role. He'll want authority on a lot more than just coaching. I don't see Dan ever giving that up. I also think he would want to coach a team where he can really put his own stamp on the entire franchise and its history. That would be extremely tough to do in markets like Wash or Dallas or SanFran, etc. I don't know this of course, just my guess. And last but not least, I've heard him say so many times how much he enjoys his time in North Carolina. IIRC he's building or recently built a home outside of Raleigh. Personally? I think he's waiting for the Panthers job to open up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie5 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Every guy that wants to be traded, who does their agent link them to? The Washington Redskins. Why? So he can up their salary with other teams b/c everyone knows we overpay. Every time a big name, over the hill FA comes up, the media talks about the Skins being interested. Everyone laughs about our front office's big spending ways. 2000 wants its news back. Aside from that year, when have we gone after over the hill free agents? If we are known for that, it's because people are lazy and prefer to hate over paying attention. If we're laughingstocks because of that, who cares? Most of what passes for knowledge about the Redskins FO is speculation or, worse, bias. What facts do you have that Snyder does A, B, or C? Frankly, even the media has sort laid off recently about the Redskins being big spenders. Why can't people on this board (they should know better)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie5 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 @Armada58Excellent post. "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" describes Snyder's situation. Snyder has made some boneheaded decisions in the past, but at this point he gets lambasted no matter what he does. He gave Gibbs total control and still got reamed whenever something went wrong. Precisely. Life is lived in the grey areas. You can be critical of some of Snyder's decisions and still stand up for the fact that he gets ridiculously unfair treatment from Redskin fans. I guess with sources of "information" like JLC, it's easy to see why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie5 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Next year... We're stuck with what we have. Enjoy. I will. Gladly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Marty for sure,I actually think Snyder let Gibbs kinda do his own thing,for many reasons:some including Snyders affection for Gibbs and Gibbs being a HOF coach,but as we seen Gibbs couldn't renew his magic as HC in bringing the Skins back. I'm of the opinion that Snyder influenced Gibbs more than Gibbs influenced Snyder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Tomb Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 It's really amazing how hypocritical people can be. (I'm not calling out any individual) People are seriously ripping Snyder for NOT doing the things that they used to rip him FOR doing. .................Years ago he got crucified because he needed a GM. So he promotes Cerrato to GM. One year into Cerrato's tenure of having final say on personnel, people want to get rid of the GM. Amazing. .................He used to get killed for ignoring the draft and signing too many free agents. So we ignore free agency and go heavy on the draft. Now people want to rip the draft class after only their rookie seasons. It's like all those years of free agency made people forget about how long it takes for rookies and for a whole draft class in general to develop. Be careful what you wish for!!! ..................Snyder got crucified for never having continuity. He decides to stick with the game plan started a year ago and not make wholesale changes. Now he gets ripped for not tearing it all down and starting over. ..................Snyder used to get slaughtered for going after the "flashy" hires and the "big splash". So he hires a decidedly non-splashy HC in Zorn. Now he's getting ripped for not going after Bill Cowher. The list goes on and on. It's crazy. We've officially reached the point where Snyder will NEVER be able to do the right thing. I, for one, like the fact that we're sticking with Zorn and ignoring the temptation for splashy moves and wholesale changes. QFT... Unfortunately, I think you're right. People will never give Dan Snyder the credit he deserves. He has changed. That being said, would I be happy with bringing in an accomplished GM like Pioli...yes. But do I think we need to strip the team of everything yet again and start rebuilding...not on your life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headexplode Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 For the most part I was pretty pleased with the past two offseasons (of course, I wouldn't have drafted two receivers and a tight end in the second round, but I can at least rationalize those moves). For me, the trade for Jason Taylor bothered me at the time, and really bothers me now, and is emblematic of a flawed philosophy. Management has an earned reputation for mortgaging the future for short-term gains that never seem to materialize, anyway, and no matter how many times it has blown up in their faces, they, like the masochistic battered wife that goes back to her husband time and again, can't seem to resist, or create justifications for it (Daniels went down, and/or, we're only a player or two away from being a postseason contender). I don't lay the team's woes all at Snyder's and Cerrato's feet, as many fans are wont to do, but with any organization, the buck stops at the top, and Snyder/Cerrato have simply not gotten it done. They have made the playoffs a couple times, but can one claim that we have a legitimate team built for long-term, consistent success? With that said, I hope Snyder sticks with Cerrato/Zorn for a few years, if only for some stability in a franchise that has had very little in the past decade. It is nice knowing who the coaches and players are going to be from year to year. There is some young talent on this team that can be built around. If Cerrato/Zorn fall on their faces, then we'll know, but if they get their stuff together, it may be better than we think. I think hoping for the franchise savior (i.e. Cowher) is foolish and counterproductive at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 i worded it wrong more so meant suggest. Vinny hasnt done a solid job bro, morrocco brown is puttin in alot of leg work and yes Vinny had a hand in bringing him back but he could end up being Cerratos replacement. interesting comment...BTW, what do you think of Morocco Brown as possible GM? Do you think he has what it takes, or does he need more experience? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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