Wise - After a Shove, a Fall From Grace (Lavar Shouting Match w/Coach after Sat game)

[TheGuru10]

Yes he does have an ego. But so do all NFL players. Hell even Lindsey has an ego. My thing is you guys make comments as if you were his lockermate. I just have one question for all of you Lavar bashers. Does he or does he not make plays when he's on the field? You say you can't wait for him to be gone. And with a straight face, knowing full damn well that when he's gone you'll be missing him at some point or another. At least the guy wants to be here.

Oh and P.S. He would make more than 9 plays if he was a part of the 3rd down package.

:applause: :applause: :applause:

[TD Riggo]

I say we cut Lindsey! Seems that he's been the instigator in a lot of this mess because he prefers Warrick Holdman. And since he prefers Holdman, I say he isn't very good at evaluating talent!

[TheGuru10]

BY the way, before we get too carried away in praising Lindsey, who is a good linebackers coach, let's not forget how bad the Chargers defense was under him.

Not that this has anything to do with this current situaiton, but I think that it should also be part of the big picture, when we talk about how successful he has been.

Great point. I'd also add that when a coach reaches a certain level, has proven to know his craft, as Lindsey has shown, there are other reasons why you don't get back to that level. A lot of that has to do with knowing how to motivate your players and deal with your players in a professional manner. That's what seperates a defensive coordinator from a head coach and a defensive coordinator from a LB's coach.

[Guest GibbSkins11]

While I respect your passion, I can't agree with your analysis. LaVar played 2 games last year(really 1.5). The coaches were able to discern all of what you say based off that many games. A little over critical don't you think. And before someone says they saw it on past game tapes, that's not fair, b/c you don't know from watching a film what the call was at that time unless you made the call.

Oh, and Warrick Holdman got cut from Cleveland this offseason. Why was that, b/c he was making all kinds of plays and reading his assignments well, but they just couldn't afford that league minimum salary of his?

i agree with u my redskins brother but the staff was trying to teach him about following his assignments , b/c they know how he plays and lavar arrington is a great lb , i still think he can be a all-time great linebacker but u make 3 or 4 bg plays then give up a chunk of yardage b/c of a overpursuit,he needs to follow the defense the way gregg williams draws it(thats why they didnt let him come back to start until he got it in practice) and the skins used holdman b/c he is solid ,not great ,not a game changing type of guy ,but b/c he makes the defense better , people forget he was the third cog of a great bears lb corps when they went 13-3 ( urlacher,colvin,and holdman) but i agree lavar has been getting better with his mental game and hasnt looked that bad at all , he actually has played great football when he has been on the field the 2nd half of the season,maybe his best as a redskin and dont get me wrong lavar is a better player than holdman,but he cant talk back to the coaches , i dont care who it is even lavar:applause: :helmet: :applause:

[Jumbo]

I think there might need to be some sort of ban on Lavar threads from satuday evening until after the game on sunday...LOL....

Too bad we can't get the media to shut up about him for a bit.

I am sick of hearing about him.

I'm with ya brother, but I broke my own resolution and got involved :laugh:

[tenken627]

Lavar does seem to need some growing up, but I'm just sick of it all already with these stories.

It's like the Washington D.C. area media feels the urge or NEED to create a T.O. type of disturbance. All of this would most likely have come up soon as the offseason started, but the media is blowing it up now. The other players say that this issue is small and doesn't affect them against Philly whatsoever, but they all sound sympathetic to Lavar. Can the media just please stuff it for another month, then come out? It's all over the national media now, not just the locals.

Just because the TO saga has died down for another year, don't try to make this something its not.

[visionary]

There should be no talk of cutting anyone right now...it would only add fuel to the fires.

Darn it, we and the Redskins are supposed to be growling and clawing for the Eagles right now, not tearing apart the team or the players.

I think this team needs some sort of player/coach media black out, like they had with Marty, for the next few weeks.

[Guest GibbSkins11]

And with all that tremendous success as a defensive coordinator w/ his trusty LB coach Tonto, oops, Dale Lindsey at his side, he is now only a Defensive Line coach. Doesn't really add up does it?

actually he is the def cord too (williams is the asst head coach def),lol , blache has turned that defensive line into a great one , remember the days of 96,97,98 and so on when the skins would allow teams to give up plenty of rushing yards up the middle , now i see griffin and salavea these last 2 years makin plays in the middle , give blache a little credit it isnt 100% the players and he was the one who had the skins bring in phillip daniels who since he has been healthy has been a damn good DE and everyone knows the vet renaldo wynn , i think the reason they let go of blache was b/c of the losing records in chicago since the 13-3 year the defense actually was pretty good , he could of got a better title somewhere else , but like gregg williams , joe gibbs has built a great coaching staff , id rather have a former def cord as our d-line coach then a guy who has never been one , blache has proven he can help build a defense , check the stats he did it in chicago , and he is doing it with our defensive line , i think we are pretty damn lucky to have a great coaching staff that joe gibbs has made:applause: :helmet: :applause:

[Guest GibbSkins11]

LaVar has been here for 5 years and the Redskins have not had a winning season. This year with Gibbs back in Year 2 the team is primed for a real chance for the postseason and its first winning record since 1999.

thus it isn't Arrington but the team concept plus added talent that is willing to work within that system that is allowing this club to rise again to respectability.

Marcus Washington is a talented linebacker with good pass rush skills who could put up better sack totals if he freelanced more and played outside of the defense as called but he doesn't do that because he is a consummate pro.

And that is what this staff is looking for.............talented football players that are mature, smart and willing to be coached.

Arrington has gone through a MESS of defensive coordinators from Ray Rhodes to Marvin Lewis to Gregg Williams and they ALL came away with the impression that Arrington did not seem ready to put his ego in check to play within the given system, and that in the long run cost the team games.

These three coaches all have Super Bowl credentials while Arrington has never played in a postseason game.

Who are you going to side with in this?

One guy doesn't like a player you write it off as a bad fit.

When it is EVERY DC the club brings in over 3 staffs you know it is the player folks

great post bulldog:notworthy HTTR and ur great post:notworthy

[TD Riggo]

I agree with the Lavar thread ban, maybe until Monday morning would be nice! But like you guys, the motto "if you build it they will " held true. I got sucked in and had to add my 2/100ths of a Samolian. I still think the ban would be appropriate.

One more thought .. I think shoving a player should be grounds for immediate dismissal, regardless of whom the player was! I also think that the NFLPA will be investigating the incident.

[spanishomelette]

Has it occured to anyone in this thread that Lavar's reaction to Lindsey was probably exactly what Lindsey was looking for. Lindsey is a self-described a-hole...It's his way or the highway from what I've read, and he does not appear to be one to shrink from confrontation. When you see Lavar on Sunday, you'll see 2 things...His ass will be missing, and he will be on the field playing defense.

There is no way I'll ever believe Wise of all people has the pulse of this situation.

[Guest GibbSkins11]

Someone will get cancer from reading that.

its the truth , i hope lavar plays great at philly , but i was a huge LA fan since we drafted him and im tired of the press stuff , hes focusing the skins attention away from philly and where he will go in the offeseason , if the skins bench him i wouldnt care , we played great vs dallas without him :applause: :helmet: :applause:

[MustangSteve]

He looked like the same Lavar to me when he was on the field, dominating and making plays.

And like the article said, hes pulled out of the game on 3rd and forth down when we need him the most, where he can prove himself and earn his money!!! Its been obvious all year that there was a problem but plain and simple if anyone thinks LaVars back ups are better then him then there IDIOTS.

We are about to hit the Playoffs where its all big boyz from there on out, no more half ass running backs or teams, and NO 2nd chance. I DO NOT agree with what LA did in the Times this week, im totaly against it.

But Im also against any coach who jumps in there players face and cant respect him as a man. I hated Ditka for it, Buddy Ryan and any coach like that!!! Yes LA needs to stay away from all interviews and yes since the Redskins pay him, then plain and simple put him to work and not on the dayum bench.

The way it looks he will be gone and if anyone thinks that Philly, NY or Dallas wont get him then wake the **** up! And I guarantee you they wont bench him on 3rd down when there playing against us.

Everyone of you fans think about this, how good would Santana Moss be if we sat him on the bench on 3rd and forth down? He definately wouldnt be the threat he is today!!!!

[Aghar]

It is my hope that after the dust settles and the skins bring home (at the very least ) a playoff victory or two that many of the fans will be burning their weekly issues of "the post" more often than a #56 jersey!

I do know one thing for sure, right now the people at the paper are loving the speculation they are creating around this team at a very critical moment. Let us sit back and see who wins out in this one. My money is on the Skins! :applause:

Bring on the Eagle and %$#@! the Post! :kungfu:

:eaglesuck :point2sky

[MustangSteve]

There should be no talk of cutting anyone right now...it would only add fuel to the fires.

Darn it, we and the Redskins are supposed to be growling and clawing for the Eagles right now, not tearing apart the team or the players.

I think this team needs some sort of player/coach media black out, like they had with Marty, for the next few weeks.

That would be perfect!!!! And these are all grown men from coaches to players, all they have to do is sit down and talk. Get all that dayum gurly drama out of the way, get all hard feelings solved, and go out and kick the sh*t out of every team in our way!!!!

[Guest GibbSkins11]

I say we cut Lindsey! Seems that he's been the instigator in a lot of this mess because he prefers Warrick Holdman. And since he prefers Holdman, I say he isn't very good at evaluating talent!

i think he prefers the player who dont run his mouth 24/7/365 and cause problems :applause: :helmet: :applause:

[Guest GibbSkins11]

this will be my final post to this LA bs...........

im tired of redskin fans backing lavar arrington , im tired of seeing skins fans treat a guy like a legend who wants to talk to the media about his future instead of the biggest redskin game in 7 years , i use to be a huge LA fan when he talked about the redskins like he use to , now he talks about the skins after he is done with his offseason plans speech ,omg, when joe gibbs said he had core redskins i dont thing LA is one of them and this is why LA is not my favorite redskin anymore, but i hope he proves me wrong i know he still inside has a passion of the redskins , do me a favor LA , SHOW IT , play like i always thought u could play like a dang beast a legend that would make LT jealous , go out and play and beat philly thats the only thing any redskin fan should be thinkin about!!! :applause: :helmet: :applause:

[[[ghost]]]

was lavar really that bad that game?

[Tulane Skins Fan]

this will be my final post to this LA bs...........

im tired of redskin fans backing lavar arrington , im tired of seeing skins fans treat a guy like a legend who wants to talk to the media about his future instead of the biggest redskin game in 7 years , i use to be a huge LA fan when he talked about the redskins like he use to , now he talks about the skins after he is done with his offseason plans speech ,omg, when joe gibbs said he had core redskins i dont thing LA is one of them and this is why LA is not my favorite redskin anymore, but i hope he proves me wrong i know he still inside has a passion of the redskins , do me a favor LA , SHOW IT , play like i always thought u could play like a dang beast a legend that would make LT jealous , go out and play and beat philly thats the only thing any redskin fan should be thinkin about!!! :applause: :helmet: :applause:

and as the player who was quoted says, the coach went overboard. i feel bad for lavar on many levels. i think he takes things too personally for one. but i also think that he has been treated like crap over the last two years. he's one of my favorite redskins ever, and he always will be.

lets not be one of these fans that believes that the player is a selfish millionaire no matter what he says, but overlook the selfish billionaire who owns the team. please.

[ImmortalDragon]

]']was lavar really that bad that game?

No.

[SkinsHokieFan]

I am a huge huge Lavar fan. My cousin is his "usual" server at a restaruant in Fair Oaks that he frequents Wednesdays during the season, and she has always said nothing but good things about him personally, and what a great guy he is

The guy has riddiculous physical talent, and if he wanted to could be the greatest of all time

But seriously, this is now a god damn joke.

Where do my loyalties land? With a player who has never led his team to the playoffs, to a national championship, or a conference championship, or a division championship

Or with an organization and coaching staff which has a legacy of greatness

It really is that simple. Lavar has never won a major sports title since high school

Did Penn State ever win the Big 10 during Lavar's time there? Did they compete in a BCS/Alliance bowl or National Championship?

No

Did Lavar ever lead this team to a playoff berth, a divisional championship, conference championship or Superbowl?

Is Lavar even .500 since becoming a Washington Redskin?

The adage is if you can lose WITH a player you can certainly lose without them

We could lose with Champ Bailey. We could lose with Lavar Arrington. We can certainly lose without them

However something is different. As Art said, would you rather have the Redskins be 9-6 and Lavar, who is being paid MILLIONS treated like crap, or a happy Lavar with the Redskins 5-11?

Honestly here

Lavar, your pouting is just riddiculous. If you consider football just a "game" give me the millions you make. Give me the 20,000 square foot mansion you live in

You make too much money to be crying to the media every time your feelings get hurt. You make too much money not to fall in line with the program Joe Gibbs wants here

You are paid to care about football, about winning and about the Washington Redskins

That is why you got a 15 million dollar signing bonus. Not because you are the face of the organization or any nonsense like that, but because you are here to win, period

Players come and go, hell I was a big fan of Reggie Brooks and Skip Hicks, and even Chris Hakel (if anyone knows who that is you get a prize)

But its the Washington Redskins I care most about. Lavar, I really really really wish we could do this with you. I wish you were going to be a part of this future, getting 15 sacks and 100 tackles a year, being who you can be and helping this team win championships

Its clear you are not that player. And it really is too bad, because you get PAID MILLIONS to be that player

UnWise Mike seems to forget that. If I got paid millions to play football, who in the hell cares how I am treated. I am out there to win, and get the job done, because I cost a lot of people (fans who pay 15 percent of their salaries to season tix) a lot of money

[Tulane Skins Fan]

the one thing i disagree with you skinshokiefan, is that this is the same organization that created a distinguished legacy. i know gibbs is back, and he's the biggest winner we've ever had. but this disupte goes back to before gibbs got here. this is a disupte between snyder and arrington. and snyder has not been a winner himself.

i dont know. like i said. i feel bad for lavar. i feel bad that he takes things so personally that he shouldnt, but i also feel bad for the way the redskins have treated him. the redskins of snyder, that hasnt been productive with anyone except maybe marty who they fired. i hope this ends well for both parties, but that seems impossible.

lavar is one of my favorite skins ever, and he always will be. but, at the end of it, i will never say that snyder is one of my favorite redskins. or even that he is actually a redskin. players are redskins, not owners.

[Guest GibbSkins11]

and as the player who was quoted says, the coach went overboard. i feel bad for lavar on many levels. i think he takes things too personally for one. but i also think that he has been treated like crap over the last two years. he's one of my favorite redskins ever, and he always will be.

lets not be one of these fans that believes that the player is a selfish millionaire no matter what he says, but overlook the selfish billionaire who owns the team. please.

the coach had to have a reason after a win to go overboard and i dont care if the guy has millions or billions to talk about the offseason when we have a game against philly , a game that is the biggest game since lavars been hear ( hes never had a chance at the playoffs in washington ,drafted 2000, last playoff team 99-00 one) u think he would realize the importance of this game and not talkin about stuff in the offseason , either la is really stupid or just is all about himself, he is the only person in dc thinking of the offseason and not the philly game , that dont get u a little mad?

[Tulane Skins Fan]

the only thing that gets me mad is that our best players don't play on third down

[End2round2sanders]

Im still a Lavar fan, I want him to retire a skin, but more importantly do well as a skin.