Per PFT. Morgan Moses signs 5 year extension

[Jumbo]

He earned it. The success is wholly Moses'.

[SkinssRvA]

Good job Moses.  Don't let it get to your head, get to work!  

[Califan007 The Constipated]

22 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

He earned it. The success is wholly Moses'.

 

[Art]

18 hours ago, ncr2h said:

If Moses is worth $10M per year, Cousins is worth $50M per year.  Moses could be replaced by Ty Nsekhe with very little drop off in our offense.  Re-signing him isn't a headscratcher, but making him the second highest paid RT in the game is definitely overpaying.

 

I actually agree Nsekhe seems to be nearly as good (though I'm wildly behind paying Moses), but, while I don't necessarily believe what I'm writing next, I'll throw it up in any case.   Some would argue Colt McCoy would provide a similar level of play to Cousins.   Now, with Nsekhe, we've SEEN him play live and he is damn solid at both tackle spots so we have some comfort.   McCoy has not played, not really.

But, McCoy could fairly be said to have been a better college QB.   He had a higher draft stock.   He has a style of play that is similar in make up to Cousins in that he is believed to have intelligence and thinks quickly.   He was a fairly typical young QB with a terrible Browns team.   He certainly did more in his first few seasons in comparison to Cousins.   Cousins got a chance in his third season, 2014, and was filled in by McCoy in 2014.   In a similar sample size, McCoy played better.   

Now, that's water under the bridge.   Cousins has come in and lifted his play.   Seemingly he's corrected his major flaws with turnovers, and has put together two of the finest seasons we've ever had from a QB in our franchise history.   In spite of that there is a LOT of thought he MAY not be the IT his stats appear to reveal.   Certainly he's not as physically gifted as some of the QBs often considered elite.   But he clearly is doing something right.

 

The question, though, is whether he's worth $50 million if McCoy could do a similar job in a similar position for, say, $10 million.

If McCoy could reasonable project to, say, 4300 yards, 22 TDs, 14 INTs, would you RATHER pay for that at a lower rate?

McCoy started four games for us in 2014.   If you kindly project his stats out over 16, his year would have been:

4228 yards, 16 TDs, 12 INTs with a 71 percent completion percentage and 96 or so QB rating.

These games are useless as he did not perform that way, but had he done that in 2015 he'd have been franchised as Cousins was in 2016.

 

If Cousins is Brees or Brady he probably is worth $50 million.   If Cousins benefits from a system that seems pretty QB friendly and is really only a Top 15 or so QB, then he is not.    

So, let me ask it this way.

If you KNEW, with fixed certainty, McCoy would have a season with the numbers above, would you trade Cousins for two first rounders?

 

[Koolblue13]

13 hours ago, Jumbo said:

He earned it. The success is wholly Moses'.

You're really on a roll. Down hill, but you're rolling alright. 

[goskins10]

Has anyone seen details? They keep saying 2nd highest. but that's just raw numbers - which never tell the full story. Need to know the guaranteed money.

[clskinsfan]

7 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

Has anyone seen details? They keep saying 2nd highest. but that's just raw numbers - which never tell the full story. Need to know the guaranteed money.

 

No details yet on Spotrac. They usually have them pretty quick. I will update the op once the numbers are public.

[CommanderDOOM]

2 hours ago, Art said:

If you KNEW, with fixed certainty, McCoy would have a season with the numbers above, would you trade Cousins for two first rounders?

 

Yes, with vibe I got from Kc chillin up in the booth in Atlanta. Hell yeah. Better than a third if anything at all.

I feel they are damn near equally talented regardless. Kirk's arm is better, Colt's got better wheels but is older and has taken more damage. Still, with the play of Long, Sherff,and Moses Colt could produce..... for half the cost. 

I wonder the offers given or if we even entertained anything at all. 

I understand playing it safe and hoping we can get Kc to sign but I'd take the picks, lean on my scouts, continue to build the castle and try to get Rosen, Baker, or the kid from USC next year.

 

 

Congrats to Morgan tho. Out the V. I remember him interviewing before the draft and he was talking bout his versatility. I remember being like whoa at his arms and overall size. Graded out top 20 of all tackles last year and is just hitting his stride. Like Kirk he's come a long way from his worst showings early on. Convince ya bwoy to become the second highest paid at his position too.

 

[ncr2h]

3 hours ago, Art said:

 

But, McCoy could fairly be said to have been a better college QB.   He had a higher draft stock.   He has a style of play that is similar in make up to Cousins in that he is believed to have intelligence and thinks quickly.   He was a fairly typical young QB with a terrible Browns team.   He certainly did more in his first few seasons in comparison to Cousins.   Cousins got a chance in his third season, 2014, and was filled in by McCoy in 2014.   In a similar sample size, McCoy played better.   

Now, that's water under the bridge.   Cousins has come in and lifted his play.   Seemingly he's corrected his major flaws with turnovers, and has put together two of the finest seasons we've ever had from a QB in our franchise history.   In spite of that there is a LOT of thought he MAY not be the IT his stats appear to reveal.   Certainly he's not as physically gifted as some of the QBs often considered elite.   But he clearly is doing something right.

 

The question, though, is whether he's worth $50 million if McCoy could do a similar job in a similar position for, say, $10 million.

If McCoy could reasonable project to, say, 4300 yards, 22 TDs, 14 INTs, would you RATHER pay for that at a lower rate?

McCoy started four games for us in 2014.   If you kindly project his stats out over 16, his year would have been:

4228 yards, 16 TDs, 12 INTs with a 71 percent completion percentage and 96 or so QB rating.

These games are useless as he did not perform that way, but had he done that in 2015 he'd have been franchised as Cousins was in 2016.

 

 

A few key adjustments to your projections.  McCoy played 3.5 games in 2014, not 4.  He also fumbled 6 times and was sacked 17 times.

 

McCoy in 2014 pro-rated for 16 games: 416/585 (71.1%) for 4,832 yards (8.3 y/a), 18 TDs, 14 INTs, 78 sacks, 27 fumbles, -197 DYAR

Cousins in 2014 pro-rated for 16 games: 367/593 (61.8%) for 4,975 yards (8.4 y/a), 29 TDs, 26 INTs, 23 sacks, 6 fumbles, 649 DYAR

 

Pro-rated over a full season:

 

Cousins:

#1 in the NFL in yards

#3 in the NFL in yards/att

#1 in the NFL in net yards/att

#9 in the NFL in adjusted net yards/att

Most INTs in the NFL, tied for #26 most INTs in a season all-time
#11 of 44 qualifying QBs in DYAR

5th lowest sack rate

24.0 points per game would be #12 in the NFL in 2014

 

McCoy:

#3 in the NFL in yards

#4 in the NFL in yards/att

#20 in net yards/att

#19 in adjusted net yards/att

#40 of 44 qualifying QBs in DYAR

Most sacks taken in a single season in NFL history

Most fumbles in a single season in NFL history

4th most fumbles in a single game in NFL history (Colts game); one of 3 QBs in NFL history to achieve 2 career games with 4 fumbles each

14.3 points per game would be fewest in NFL in 2014 (2nd worst = 15.6; median = 21.8)

 

...probably not a franchise tag level player.

[Art]

ncr, if Cousins could have corrected the flaws that benched him in McCoy's favor through greater fluency in the offense it's likely McCoy could have improved on some of his, especially with improving talent on the offensive line.   The point remains, if you KNEW McCoy could put up a season like Cousins did you'd trade Cousins, right?   This is not actually as easy an answer because there's another factor.   If Cousins is Brady or Brees you don't.  

 

[Burgold]

Cousins has always had a knack at avoiding pressure. It's one of the areas that I think that Kirk is actually elite. He knows when to get rid of the ball and gets hit very rarely. Colt doesn't have that sixth sense. He was a touch better than Griffin in this area, but not a lot. That will separate them as much as accuracy, arm strength, mobility, etc.

[Art]

2 minutes ago, Burgold said:

Cousins has always had a knack at avoiding pressure. It's one of the areas that I think that Kirk is actually elite. He knows when to get rid of the ball and gets hit very rarely. Colt doesn't have that sixth sense. He was a touch better than Griffin in this area, but not a lot. That will separate them as much as accuracy, arm strength, mobility, etc.

 

It's true that Kirk is actually elite with regard to his time to delivery.   He gets rid of the ball super quick.   It is in this area he MAY be Brady or Brees in that he can process quickly enough to avoid pressure.   McCoy CLEARLY does not have that and like RGIII will hold on to the ball longer.   Now, for the first 9 games of 2015, Cousins threw about two passes you and I couldn't have thrown.   He got rid of the ball so quickly nothing could develop and it was less a sixth sense and more a John Beck mockery.   Obviously that changed the final 7 games and most of last year so I yield the point.   BUT, if you watch coaches film you see a LOT is left on the field with Cousins as things that are developing are not waited on as the ball is out so quickly.   This is NOT necessarily a bad thing as it likely is why he's effective.   But I'm not yet sure what he shows is what Brady shows who is the closest to showing the same thing I've seen.   

 

[roanoker]

Glad the deal is done. Congrats Moses.

[Burgold]

Just now, Art said:

 

It's true that Kirk is actually elite with regard to his time to delivery.   He gets rid of the ball super quick.   It is in this area he MAY be Brady or Brees in that he can process quickly enough to avoid pressure.   McCoy CLEARLY does not have that and like RGIII will hold on to the ball longer.   Now, for the first 9 games of 2015, Cousins threw about two passes you and I couldn't have thrown.   He got rid of the ball so quickly nothing could develop and it was less a sixth sense and more a John Beck mockery.   Obviously that changed the final 7 games and most of last year so I yield the point.   BUT, if you watch coaches film you see a LOT is left on the field with Cousins as things that are developing are not waited on as the ball is out so quickly.   This is NOT necessarily a bad thing as it likely is why he's effective.   But I'm not yet sure what he shows is what Brady shows who is the closest to showing the same thing I've seen.   

 

I agree. His ability to avoid pressure can be a double edged sword. Mind you, I remember being at RFK in the glory days and being frustrated when we hit Monk for a ten yard first down when Sanders was completely uncovered and would have walked in for a 60 yard score.

 

You will find misses every game and with QBs of every caliber. 

[Tay]

Ian Rapoport is reporting that the deal was 5 years $40M base, $42.5M max, $20M guaranteed.

 

Sounds like a fair deal.

[clskinsfan]

On 4/28/2017 at 4:53 PM, Art said:

ncr, if Cousins could have corrected the flaws that benched him in McCoy's favor through greater fluency in the offense it's likely McCoy could have improved on some of his, especially with improving talent on the offensive line.   The point remains, if you KNEW McCoy could put up a season like Cousins did you'd trade Cousins, right?   This is not actually as easy an answer because there's another factor.   If Cousins is Brady or Brees you don't.  

 

 

In Fairness Art. Cousins just doesnt take very many sacks. Mccoy does. Even with the same OL the sack number difference is huge.

15 minutes ago, Tay said:

Ian Rapoport is reporting that the deal was 5 years $40M base, $42.5M max, $20M guaranteed.

 

Sounds like a fair deal.

Thanks I will update the OP.

[Art]

10 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

 

In Fairness Art. Cousins just doesnt take very many sacks. Mccoy does. Even with the same OL the sack number difference is huge.

Thanks I will update the OP.

 

This is true.   Cousins GREATEST strength as a player is how quickly he processes and gets rid of the ball.   As Burgold and I spoke, THAT is the thing that makes you wonder if Cousins is an elite QB as so few have that ability.   We don't have a huge sample size because in 2014 he wasn't sacked much, but sucked much.   In 2015 he wasn't sacked much, but, for 9 games, sucked a ton.   John Beck with a hint of upside.   Then for the last 23 games he hasn't gotten sacked much and played really well, generally, with normal tides for any player.   Mentally McCoy is simply not going to be Cousins' equal, BUT, with time in the offense this would improve, if never be the strength that it is for Cousins.

[HTTRDynasty]

I approve.  Smart move by the FO to get it done now.

 

•  

Quote

 

• -In his first two seasons as the starting right tackle, Moses has graded as a top 10 player at the position. His 2016 season grade of 85.1 crowned his finest season as a pro, and ranked him as the eighth highest graded right tackle in the league.
• -Moses received a pass blocking grade of 85.1 (ranking him eighth in the league among right tackles) and a run blocking grade of 82.0 (ranking him fifth).
• -Moses allowed just five sacks and three quarterback hits in 648 pass blocking snaps, earning him a pass blocking efficiency of 96.0, tying him for the 14th best mark among all tackles in the league.
•  

With the new signing of Moses and last year’s extension of Trent Williams (2016 overall grade of 90.6 – the highest graded tackle in football), the Redskins have potentially secured elite-level bookend tackles for the next five seasons.

 

 

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro/

[HTTRDynasty]

We're really going to be depending on him to play well against our AFCW opponents this season.  Those teams all have their best pass rushers play primarily on the left side, like we do with Kerrigan.  

 

Von Miller

Khalil Mack

Justin Houston

Joey Bosa

 

These guys can blow up your offensive game plan in a hurry.  I hope he's up to the task of holding his own against them.