HTTRDynasty Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 Lying season is officially underway 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 6 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: Lying season is officially underway Yep. All these want to be fake beat reporters making up their own stuff and here is one example and Jeremiah talks about it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 Cool chart. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Always A Commander Never A Captain Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 6 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: Cool chart. Quickest thing to note: Everyone below say...0.5 on the Gunslinging Index is a bust. Players around 2 or above on the Gunslinging index have high variance but some big hits, but all the hits were those with elite physical traits. Those without elite physical traits were average at best. The most hyped QB prospects in this draft are all in good spots, which backs up that this QB class is better than usual. The rate of hits for QB's near both of the 1-2 Gunslinger and 1-2 Game Manager are quite high. Average to great in the NFL for most unless they just lack good NFL traits. e.g. Will Grier's arm strength was poor. Bryce Young (jury still out) is too tiny We obviously are taking a shot at a QB in this draft, but if any team needs a QB, this is the draft to take a shot. Stash and develop if need be. Another observation that I'm adding some color to this chart to show. Light Green Circle seems to be the sweet spot, except for every QB in this red channel for some reason. None within the red channel have had long term success or been as good as expected. Mahomes is close to the channel, so it's probably just a big fat coincidence, but I find it interesting nonetheless. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatNFLChick Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 I don't know that I buy this tbh. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 On 2/2/2024 at 9:28 PM, CapsSkins said: I'm honestly kinda surprised he answered vs. leaving it at "we believe in Sam" lol Allen broke down this year and started sayin more what's on his mind...he looked ready to smoke a cigarette after one game when the fire alarm went off during his interview... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 6 hours ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said: Quickest thing to note: Everyone below say...0.5 on the Gunslinging Index is a bust. Players around 2 or above on the Gunslinging index have high variance but some big hits, but all the hits were those with elite physical traits. Those without elite physical traits were average at best. The most hyped QB prospects in this draft are all in good spots, which backs up that this QB class is better than usual. The rate of hits for QB's near both of the 1-2 Gunslinger and 1-2 Game Manager are quite high. Average to great in the NFL for most unless they just lack good NFL traits. e.g. Will Grier's arm strength was poor. Bryce Young (jury still out) is too tiny We obviously are taking a shot at a QB in this draft, but if any team needs a QB, this is the draft to take a shot. Stash and develop if need be. Another observation that I'm adding some color to this chart to show. Light Green Circle seems to be the sweet spot, except for every QB in this red channel for some reason. None within the red channel have had long term success or been as good as expected. Mahomes is close to the channel, so it's probably just a big fat coincidence, but I find it interesting nonetheless. Nice work. To your latter point, I think that’s just coincidence. One thing this chart doesn’t account for is situation once these guys get to the league. For example, I bet if Mayfield had been drafted by the Eagles instead of the Browns we would all view him in a completely different light today - he’d probably be a SB champion by now. And if Hurts had been drafted by the Browns he’d be viewed as a bust today. Injuries also had a hand in stalling Baker’s career. It’s fascinating when you consider what Mahomes might have become without Reid and the nearly perfect environment he was drafted into. It was just one of those situations where lightning struck and both Reid and Mahomes truly brought out the best in each other. It’s also pretty interesting how low of a floor Lamar and Josh Allen had according to this chart (which does match how they were viewed as prospects IIRC). They landed in great environments as well, allowing them to maximize their upside. The other guys in that quadrant… not so much. Also, Kingsbury has worked with some TALENTED QBs man: Mahomes, Williams, Baker, Murray, etc. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frontline205 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 8 hours ago, mistertim said: I've talked quite a bit on here about what I like and dislike about Daniels and what I like and dislike about Maye when it comes to actual football. Do I really need to rehash the entire thing for you? And can you tell me who exactly "anointed" Maye vs him having to work for it? And I honestly don't care about switching your opinion. Yours is clearly already made up. But at the very least you can be intellectually honest about why you're deciding one over the other. . I watched half of UNC’s games and saw a QB who constantly threw off his back foot on scrambles, and throws that usually don’t fly at the NFL leve. PFF has him being responsible for 29.2 percent of the pressure that he faces as a whole. Meaning 30% of his pressure is due to his own mistakes 2nd highest of all QBs PFF graded. Referring of my hold onto the ball too long comment“intellectually dishonest” how so? And yes anointed yea there are two anointed QB’s this year. I can sit here and throw stats at you and you the same, but college stats don’t matter when September comes. You really going to be “intellectually dishonest” yourself and act like my assement of hold onto the ball too long and makes too many throw with bad footwork aren’t a thing. Should that not be a criticism? Are those not major issues at the NFL level that has killed careers? I never said he was going to bust. I just don’t like all the hype on a college football show for the 2nd team all ACC guy. Doesn’t mean Jayden Daniel’s and definitely Caleb Williams are perfect no one is in the draft. I think you think I criticized your video and for some reason you’re taking that personal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 I dont think you can go wrong with any of the big 3 tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 10 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said: Cool chart. I’d love to know how they graded QBs into which quadrants. I have arguments about a lot of the placings!! It looks like someone pulled names out of a hat. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 15 minutes ago, MartinC said: I’d love to know how they graded QBs into which quadrants. I have arguments about a lot of the placings!! It looks like someone pulled names out of a hat. There’s a link in the tweet. Also here: https://opensourcefootball.com/posts/2021-02-05-gunslingers-and-game-managers/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 2 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: There’s a link in the tweet. Also here: https://opensourcefootball.com/posts/2021-02-05-gunslingers-and-game-managers/ Thanks appreciate that. So they at least have a methodology - buts it’s pretty subjective and gets into correlation versus causation difficulties IMO. The results of their methodology suggest it needs some tweaking!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 1 minute ago, MartinC said: Thanks appreciate that. So they at least have a methodology - buts it’s pretty subjective and gets into correlation versus causation difficulties IMO. The results of their methodology suggest it needs some tweaking!! Yeah, similar to PFF, it’s tough to be completely objective when ranking or grouping players. I personally think the chart is fairly accurate when looking at these players in a vacuum (i.e. looking beyond the situations they landed in). But I’m not surprised others would disagree. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWinzit Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 The chart shows Howell grading out pretty well. And look at Jake Fromm showing up. Damn I hated that Haskins pick and I see Darnold grading out quite well...Well, it's not perfect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 15 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: Yeah, similar to PFF, it’s tough to be completely objective when ranking or grouping players. I personally think the chart is fairly accurate when looking at these players in a vacuum (i.e. looking beyond the situations they landed in). But I’m not surprised others would disagree. I’m having a hard time seeing Mason Rudolph as high ceiling for a start! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 There really is no set formula for QBs. You just gotta take a guy with elite traits and high character and hope being in the big leagues doesn't completely destroy him mentally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Consigliere Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 12 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said: Lying season is officially underway I've been a consistent, it's Maye or Williams guy, but I have to own the historical reality that final seasons going a bit sideways or down often lead to drops, especially if the combine, pro day, workouts, interviews and due diligence background stuff doesn't entirely exculpate the player's down performance. Could happen, could be b.s. It is worth noting, there are a wide variety of views, always on scouts, recall the famous SI article (at least to me) from Octoberish 2017 breaking down each of the big 5ish QB's from the '18 class where the scouts didn't agree very much, and had them totally wrong for the most part lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Command The 414 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 I saw this on FB, as Commanders fan would you be good w/this deal or a similar deal which would involve trading up to get Williams? Personally I’m not for trading up, I’m sure throughout the league rumor mill and GM talk that the pulse of the Bears is widely known what their plans are, to trade Fields or stick with him 2 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatNFLChick Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 5 minutes ago, Command The 414 said: I saw this on FB, as Commanders fan would you be good w/this deal or a similar deal which would involve trading up to get Williams? Personally I’m not for trading up, I’m sure throughout the league rumor mill and GM talk that the pulse of the Bears is widely known what their plans are, to trade Fields or stick with him Nope, way too much. It all comes done to Williams - if he wants nothing to do with the Bears, we’re in good shape. All subjective, clearly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seantaylor=god Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 1 minute ago, Est.1974 said: Nope, way too much. It all comes done to Williams - if he wants nothing to do with the Bears, we’re in good shape. All subjective, clearly. Agree. I don’t really understand the logic of us (or any team) giving up so much in the event he doesn’t want to play for them. He can hold out, not sign a contract, etc. We would simply let them work out their mess. If they wanted a QB and Caleb told them he wouldn’t play for them they would either select a different QB at 1, or if they liked Maye and Daniels equally, I could see them offering the pick to us or the Patriots but I don’t think either would pay more than a second. Maybe the Patriots would trade more if they felt stronger about a drop off and didn’t want QB3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcbothwel Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 7 minutes ago, Command The 414 said: I saw this on FB, as Commanders fan would you be good w/this deal or a similar deal which would involve trading up to get Williams? Personally I’m not for trading up, I’m sure throughout the league rumor mill and GM talk that the pulse of the Bears is widely known what their plans are, to trade Fields or stick with him This is getting ridiculous. After what just happened last year with the Panthers, no team in their right mind in the top 5 can trade their pick this year, plus a 1st, plus more. #2, #36, 2025 conditional 3rd. If the Bears want Daniels/Maye, we are their only chance...If they want to go with Fields, then we should bow out because another team in the 4-10 range can give them a haul. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 12 minutes ago, seantaylor=god said: Agree. I don’t really understand the logic of us (or any team) giving up so much in the event he doesn’t want to play for them. He can hold out, not sign a contract, etc. We would simply let them work out their mess. If they wanted a QB and Caleb told them he wouldn’t play for them they would either select a different QB at 1, or if they liked Maye and Daniels equally, I could see them offering the pick to us or the Patriots but I don’t think either would pay more than a second. Maybe the Patriots would trade more if they felt stronger about a drop off and didn’t want QB3. Offer them their second rounder back and a fourth next year. Job done 😂 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 I gotta trade a future 1st, a stud DT, AND a high 2nd rounder to move up ONE spot? Yeah...no. I make the Bears take Williams and am perfectly happy with Maye/Daniels. 3 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 I want more picks, not less. I'd rather sign Wilson to a 2 year deal, slide back twice and grab JJ and some more ammo. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.thumb.jpeg.3d05d94a5044fa9ada2aa8cc7156fc2a.jpeg)
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now