The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[DWinzit]

8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Listened to the Junkies who said they listened to Logan Paulsen who said the Giants baffled the offense by changing their game plan from the first game. Baiting them to prepare for the previous plan and reversing it.

 

By the way Logan said the exact same thing last year which is the coaches prepared for the Giants game plan from game 1 but the Giants switched it up in game 2 and threw them off. 

 

So in game 1 this year the Giants blitzed like mad. So this time they faked blitzed and dropped their guys into coverage and the team wasn’t ready for that. And Logan apparently said their front 4 did enough to pressure this offense without having to blitz much.

 

Wink > EB/Ron

[Skinsinparadise]

Just now, DWinzit said:

Wink > EB/Ron

No doubt 

[DJHJR86]

He's been in the bottom third of QBR for most of the year, bottom third in passer rating, and leads the league in turnovers and sacks.  This nonsense about taking him over Josh Allen needs to stop.  The "he's the guy" talk needs to stop.  

 

 

 

He's earned next year.  That's it.  And if the new regime wants to draft or sign their guy, go for it.  

[method man]

2 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

The current options re OL in 2024 free agency aren’t great are they. Think we need to invest with at least 2 high value picks via the draft.

 

Oh and why didn’t we trade Brissett for that 6th rounder we were offered. Self preservation at its worst.

Agreed. Need a tackle and a guard. I would still keep Leno around but move him to RT where he can handle the second best edge rushers on the other team

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

7 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

And Logan apparently said their front 4 did enough to pressure this offense without having to blitz much.

I had an idea, perhaps we should convert some of our line to corner the way they are constantly backpedaling.

1 minute ago, DJHJR86 said:

He's been in the bottom third of QBR for most of the year, bottom third in passer rating, and leads the league in turnovers and sacks.  This nonsense about taking him over Josh Allen needs to stop.  The "he's the guy" talk needs to stop.  

You could have just sent this in a DM to @zCommander.

 

 

2 minutes ago, method man said:

Agreed. Need a tackle and a guard. I would still keep Leno around but move him to RT where he can handle the second best edge rushers on the other team

I think we desperately need a center.

[Skinsinparadise]

13 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

 

 

I think we desperately need a center.

 

Stromberg had a good camp.  I know Ron didn't want to start a rookie center and oddly drafted him to stash for the future in a win now season.  But I think there is a good chance he's the guy.  LG though to me has no one.  

 

 

on a different note, Mike Jones has been down on Howell from the jump.  So him gloating about an off game is on point for him

Edited November 20, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Stromberg had a good camp.  I know Ron didn't want to start a rookie center and oddly drafted him to stash for the future in a win now season.  But I think there is a good chance he's the guy.  LG though to me has no one.  

Larsen has looked better than Gates but he’s still skating backwards too quickly for my tastes.  Just another indictment on Ron’s ability to properly build a team.

[DJHJR86]

12 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

on a different note, Mike Jones has been down on Howell from the jump.  So him gloating about an off game is on point for him

 

https://x.com/ByMikeJones/status/1726412934308347949?s=20

 

Seems pretty fair to me.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

11 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

https://x.com/ByMikeJones/status/1726412934308347949?s=20

 

Seems pretty fair to me.

I’ll stick to watching QB School and the like for analysis on Howell.  
 

Mike Jones has been milquetoast since he was an embryo and has zero knowledge of the game.  The only reason he’s not reporting from Topeka, Kansas is he had the privilege of reporting on Dan Snyder’s epic failures.

 

Fans are not “going along” with anything Ron is saying.  Fans generally like Howell because of how he looks amongst the landscape of other young QBs and how they performed in their first season of starting.  Add to that, there is no elite QB tree to pick one just because we want one.  

Edited November 20, 2023 by BatteredFanSyndrome

[KDawg]

10 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

https://x.com/ByMikeJones/status/1726412934308347949?s=20

 

Seems pretty fair to me.

I don't think so. He seems to focus on the negative of Howell and put a lot of it at his feet. But, QBs cannot win alone. Rodgers struggled in Green Bay last year, does that mean he wasn't any good coming off of two MVP seasons? Or did his supporting cast weaken him?

 

I agree that you can't crown him as a long term guy. But he is certainly a potential franchise caliber QB. Whether he becomes that still remains to be seen. 

[Warhead36]

49 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Listened to the Junkies who said they listened to Logan Paulsen who said the Giants baffled the offense by changing their game plan from the first game. Baiting them to prepare for the previous plan and reversing it.

 

By the way Logan said the exact same thing last year which is the coaches prepared for the Giants game plan from game 1 but the Giants switched it up in game 2 and threw them off. 

 

So in game 1 this year the Giants blitzed like mad. So this time they faked blitzed and dropped their guys into coverage and the team wasn’t ready for that. And Logan apparently said their front 4 did enough to pressure this offense without having to blitz much.

 

Not surprised. Our coaching is atrociously bad. We don't have dynamic or creative thinkers at all. 

 

Daboll and Martindale were playing 4D chess. Our coaches play tic tac toe and struggle.

[DJHJR86]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

I agree that you can't crown him as a long term guy. But he is certainly a potential franchise caliber QB. Whether he becomes that still remains to be seen. 

 

His ceiling is probably Baker Mayfield.  Numbers are very similar through the first 12 games.

[Warhead36]

I don't know if Howell is the guy. There is a good chance he isn't. But there is also at least a chance he is. A better chance than we've had in recent years.

 

With that said, if the new regime wants to shoot for someone else, for whatever reason, then I'm fine with that too. 

[Professor_Nutter_Butter]

I think Howell has at least earned the opportunity to be QB1 next season.

 

And I swear to God, I will riot if this team drafts Caleb Williams. 

[Warhead36]

Just now, Professor_Nutter_Butter said:

I think Howell has at least earned the opportunity to be QB1 next season.

 

And I swear to God, I will riot if this team drafts Caleb Williams. 

Williams has the talent but something about him irks me. He just has this diva aura about him and I feel like he'll just crash and burn in the pros. 

 

Maye is the truth though, this past bad game not withstanding. 

 

Not sure I'd want any other QB.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I personally like Sam’s makeup.  Coach’s son, says all the right things anytime he’s asked, works hard, spends all his time studying tape, tough as nails, and can make all the throws on the field.

 

He checks A LOT of boxes.

 

Sometimes checking all those boxes isn’t enough.  It’s possible they won’t be for Sam.

 

Not once this season, have I seen a tape where EB has schemed him a bunch of open guys and he’s failing to see them and holding the ball too long.  There have been moments where he could have pulled the trigger and didn’t but name me one other QB with a handful of starts who doesn’t have those moments?

[DJHJR86]

1 minute ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Not once this season, have I seen a tape where EB has schemed him a bunch of open guys and he’s failing to see them and holding the ball too long.  There have been moments where he could have pulled the trigger and didn’t but name me one other QB with a handful of starts who doesn’t have those moments?

 

The receivers not being open pretty much all year while they almost always seemed to get open last year is 100% on the offensive scheme and coaching.  It has to be.

 

 

The "he leads the league in passing yards!" stat was always a bizarre one to crow about.  He also leads the league in attempts...which would make sense that he would also have the most yards.  

 

[Warhead36]

3 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

The receivers not being open pretty much all year while they almost always seemed to get open last year is 100% on the offensive scheme and coaching.  It has to be.

 

 

Yeah Turner had his issues but our receivers actually got open against man coverage last year. Teams this year are just playing us straight up man to man because our WRs can't beat it. Its been talked about all year by guys like Cooley and Paulsen and is probably the most frustrating thing about this team(when you consider how highly our WRs were supposed to be rated going into the year).

[Riggo#44]

4 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

The receivers not being open pretty much all year while they almost always seemed to get open last year is 100% on the offensive scheme and coaching.  It has to be.

 

 

The "he leads the league in passing yards!" stat was always a bizarre one to crow about.  He also leads the league in attempts...which would make sense that he would also have the most yards.  

 

 

This is why I am on the EB-can-go-too bus. He is not running a good offense. Our receivers are too easily covered, we run obvious running plays that predictably get stuffed. Many of these issues are caused by issues on the O-line, but the scheme doesn't get people open either.

[Warhead36]

Just now, Riggo#44 said:

 

This is why I am on the EB-can-go-too bus. He is not running a good offense. Our receivers are too easily covered, we run obvious running plays that predictably get stuffed. Many of these issues are caused by issues on the O-line, but the scheme doesn't get people open either.

Good point about the run plays. Yesterday there was that one 3rd and 2 early. Looks like Howell audibles out of the original play, and you'll notice the Giant DL shift to their right(offense's left). What happens? We run right to the left and get stuffed.

 

We're just way too predictable on offense. Now part of that is the bad OL limiting things, but still, you look across the league and teams DESTROY man coverage all the time. Our guys never even get open. So either the WRs suck, which I don't think is the case(I do think they're overrated but they aren't this bad)or the scheme is trash.

[DWinzit]

Who can it be that Turner is being made to sound better than our current OC...OMG, I never thought I'd read, say or think that, oh how we continue to fall

[Riggo#44]

4 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

We're just way too predictable on offense. Now part of that is the bad OL limiting things, but still, you look across the league and teams DESTROY man coverage all the time. Our guys never even get open. So either the WRs suck, which I don't think is the case(I do think they're overrated but they aren't this bad)or the scheme is trash.

 

It seems to me he is running Reid's offense where they feed the TE a lot. Which is great, when you have the best TE in the league. Unfortunately, we have Logan Thomas, who is fine, but not Kelce. Our best weapons are not getting utilized. We are only marginally better from last year, statistically, with a far better QB.

[Warhead36]

Just now, Riggo#44 said:

 

It seems to me he is running Reid's offense where they feed the TE a lot. Which is great, when you have the best TE in the league. Unfortunately, we have Logan Thomas, who is fine, but not Kelce. Our best weapons are not getting utilized. We are only marginally better from last year, statistically, with a far better QB.

The over emphasis on the TEs just kills me. Yeah sure when you have Travis effing Kelce you can employ that strategy but we don't have that. The offense should be run through McLaurin, Dotson, and even Robinson now(who has played some good football to be fair).

[Professor_Nutter_Butter]

50 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Williams has the talent but something about him irks me. He just has this diva aura about him and I feel like he'll just crash and burn in the pros. 

 

Maye is the truth though, this past bad game not withstanding. 

 

Not sure I'd want any other QB.

Williams has bust written all over him because of his apparent maturity issues. Maye could possibly be decent, but really I'd just ride with Howell if it came down to the two. 

Edited November 20, 2023 by Professor_Nutter_Butter

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I’ve tried to remain patient with EB because I can acknowledge he’s a first year OC, tasked with an offense with what is basically a rookie QB with a really bad OL, and a defense that is crime against football. 

This game was a referendum on him for me.  He basically got Sam killed last game against the Giants, and failed to dial up any counters to what Wink was dialing up.  While he did run it more and can’t secure the ball for his guys, situationally he pooped the bed on multiple occasions.  The drive where we had to kick the FG after &goal from the 5 was one of the worst sequences of RZ playcalling I’ve ever seen.  Following failed first down shots with 2nd and 10 delayed runs is practically his signature move.  The whole world knows it’s coming and leads to 3rd and 10 or worse nearly every time.  It’s hard to even comprehend why he keeps going back to that well again when it’s been bone dry all season long.  

Edited November 20, 2023 by BatteredFanSyndrome