Is There a Tipping Point for China and Human Rights Violations???

[PeterMP]

1 hour ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

I’m not really sure Taiwan is worth dying for? Taiwan has always been a part of China and has never been officially independent where has Ukraine was and has been a separate country.
 

I am slightly more understanding of China wanting Taiwan to be a part of them than I am of Russia wanting Ukrain.

 

Just want to point out that over the last 500 years or so Taiwan has spent more time being independent than China as compared to part of China.  China has rarely been able to exert control over the strait.  Even when it was part of Chine, there was regular fighting against mainland control.

 

Ukraine has spent more time being part of Russia than Taiwan has being part of China recently.

Edited June 13, 2022 by PeterMP

[CousinsCowgirl84]

2 hours ago, PeterMP said:

 

Just want to point out that over the last 500 years or so Taiwan has spent more time being independent than China as compared to part of China.  China has rarely been able to exert control over the strait.  Even when it was part of Chine, there was regular fighting against mainland control.

 

Ukraine has spent more time being part of Russia than Taiwan has being part of China recently.

The difference being that Ukraine is actually an independent countries where as Taiwan is where the losers of the Chinese Civil War fled to and that China has claimed since the 1600s….

 

I think there is an obvious difference between the two scenarios.

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84

[Renegade7]

2 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

The difference being that Ukraine is actually an independent countries where as Taiwan is where the losers of the Chinese Civil War fled to and that China has claimed since the 1600s….

 

I think there is an obvious difference between the two scenarios.

 

 

You are talking about recent history, @PeterMP is talking about history period to help with full context here.

[DCSaints_fan]

The problem that Taiwan has is no one recognizes them as independent.  Granted, they haven't asked for it and their "official position" I believe is still One China and that they are the legitimate government of China.  But even in the the event that China invades them, I doubt that even Europe would want to get involved. Except possibly the UK, it would also depend on who happened to be in 10 Downing. 

 

Ukraine's a little different obviously because they actually are in Europe.   On top of that, a nation who has expressed a desire to join the EU and NATO being invaded for those very reasons (at least NATO), is a underhanded threat to the union/alliance.

 

So it may be the US + Taiwan alone that would have to take on China.   At least militarily.

 

Things actually would have been easier had Taiwan declared independence like 40 years ago.  There wouldn't have been anything China could have done about it, at least not in the short term.  But the KMT was still in power than in what was essentially a military dictatorship.   For the west, a nationalist military dictatorship was only marginally better than a communist dictatorship, at least after the Sino-Soviet split in the early 60s.

Edited June 13, 2022 by DCSaints_fan

[CousinsCowgirl84]

5 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

You are talking about recent history, @PeterMP is talking about history period to help with full context

 

We live in the present… 

Edited June 13, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84

[DCSaints_fan]

11 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

I’m not really sure Taiwan is worth dying for? Taiwan has always been a part of China and has never been officially independent where has Ukraine was and has been a separate country.
 

I am slightly more understanding of China wanting Taiwan to be a part of them than I am of Russia wanting Ukrain.

 

Perhaps, if it was just about Taiwan.  But there is concern among foreign policy circles that Taiwan is basically a staging ground to push the US out of the Pacific entirely.  The South China Sea is the busiest shipping lane in the world and if China could exercise control over it, they would be able to exert tremendous pressure over Japan and South Korea by controlling the imports/exports from/to the Middle East and Europe.  Oil imports being pretty critical here.  Which might force them to change their policy with respect to the US.  That would then mean China, the 2nd largest economy in the world, would also have under its thumb the 3rd, and 10th largest economies.  If that happens, the rest of SE Asia (Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia, probably even Australia) falls in line.  That's a huge power block, at that point Guam becomes isolated and undefendable.  After that, how long before they start poking at Hawaii and/or the Aleutians.  Right now, our soft power (economics/diplomacy) and the threat of hard power would be enough to prevent that scenario, but its not exactly inconceivable. 

[Larry]

I keep reflecting that maybe the thing Trump did, that hurt us more than anything else, was to pull us out of an already-negotiated free trade agreement, that would have accounted for 40% of global GDP, and excluded China. 

[Renegade7]

27 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

 

We live in the present… 

 

So the past doesn't matter??? 🧐

[CousinsCowgirl84]

36 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

So the past doesn't matter??? 🧐

Not in this specific case about whether or not Ukraine and Taiwan are the same geopolitically.

[Renegade7]

2 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

Not in this specific case about whether or not Ukraine and Taiwan are the same geopolitically.

 

That's the thing, no one ever said they were, so you are missing the points being made entirely.

Edited June 13, 2022 by Renegade7

[CousinsCowgirl84]

1 hour ago, Renegade7 said:

 

That's the thing, no one ever said they were, so you are missing the points being made entirely.

I didn’t say anyone said that. I said I don’t think they were. So I said they aren’t the same geopolitically and therefore I can understand why China thinks Taiwan should be a part of it moreso than Russia thinking Ukraine should be a part of it.

 

Saying I’m missing the point without saying what the point is 🧐 

 

lazy. 

 

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84

[mcsluggo]

10 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

The difference being that Ukraine is actually an independent countries where as Taiwan is where the losers of the Chinese Civil War fled to and that China has claimed since the 1600s….

 

I think there is an obvious difference between the two scenarios.

 

 there is a load of differences between any two situations you try to compare....

 

but the distinction you are trying to draw is horse****.   

[Renegade7]

27 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

I didn’t say anyone said that. I said I don’t think they were. So I said they aren’t the same geopolitically and therefore I can understand why China thinks Taiwan should be a part of it moreso than Russia thinking Ukraine should be a part of it.

 

Saying I’m missing the point without saying what the point is 🧐 

 

lazy. 

 

Talking about two different things, the history of Taiwan being separate from China in the past being the one several are trying to clarify to you:

 

14 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

I’m not really sure Taiwan is worth dying for? Taiwan has always been a part of China and has never been officially independent where has Ukraine was and has been a separate country.
 

I am slightly more understanding of China wanting Taiwan to be a part of them than I am of Russia wanting Ukrain.

 

This is fundamentally not true, as was explained by at least one poster.

 

Now whether we should be getting involved militarily regarding China invading Taiwan is different conversation that at least one poster tried to explain the strategic importance to you about why we should.

 

There are several different reasons that we shouldn't tell Taiwan we will protect them from China then when China finally does it change our mind on defending them.

[CousinsCowgirl84]

3 hours ago, mcsluggo said:

 there is a load of differences between any two situations you try to compare....

 

but the distinction you are trying to draw is horse****.   

China has claimed Taiwan for 500 years… and Taiwan has never been recognized as an independent state since then…. Ukrai has been independent several times over the past 500 years and especially pertinent to the difference, independent when It was attacked by Russia.

3 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Talking about two different things, the history of Taiwan being separate from China in the past being the one several are trying to clarify to you:

 

 

This is fundamentally not true, as was explained by at least one poster..

I guess it depends on your time horizon but what Peter said isn’t really true. Seems odd to me to try and claim recent history and is less important than ancient history when talking about geopolitics.

Ukraine has been an independent state since after the Cold War where where as Taiwan never has.

Edited June 13, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84

[China]

On 6/5/2021 at 10:09 PM, China said:

 

 

 

China still trying to collect data on US citizens:

 

 As a follow up to this:

 

 

TikTok just gave itself permission to collect biometric data on US users, including ‘faceprints and voiceprints’

 

A change to TikTok’s U.S. privacy policy on Wednesday introduced a new section that says the social video app “may collect biometric identifiers and biometric information” from its users’ content. This includes things like “faceprints and voiceprints,” the policy explained. Reached for comment, TikTok could not confirm what product developments necessitated the addition of biometric data to its list of disclosures about the information it automatically collects from users, but said it would ask for consent in the case such data collection practices began.

 

The biometric data collection details were introduced in the newly added section, “Image and Audio Information,” found under the heading of “Information we collect automatically” in the policy.

 

This is the part of TikTok’s Privacy Policy that lists the types of data the app gathers from users, which was already fairly extensive.

 

Click on the link for the full article

 

Leaked Audio From 80 Internal TikTok Meetings Shows That US User Data Has Been Repeatedly Accessed From China

 

For years, TikTok has responded to data privacy concerns by promising that information gathered about users in the United States is stored in the United States, rather than China, where ByteDance, the video platform's parent company, is located. But according to leaked audio from more than 80 internal TikTok meetings, China-based employees of ByteDance have repeatedly accessed nonpublic data about US TikTok users — exactly the type of behavior that inspired former president Donald Trump to threaten to ban the app in the United States.

 

The recordings, which were reviewed by BuzzFeed News, contain 14 statements from nine different TikTok employees indicating that engineers in China had access to US data between September 2021 and January 2022, at the very least. Despite a TikTok executive’s sworn testimony in an October 2021 Senate hearing that a “world-renowned, US-based security team” decides who gets access to this data, nine statements by eight different employees describe situations where US employees had to turn to their colleagues in China to determine how US user data was flowing. US staff did not have permission or knowledge of how to access the data on their own, according to the tapes.

 

“Everything is seen in China,” said a member of TikTok’s Trust and Safety department in a September 2021 meeting. In another September meeting, a director referred to one Beijing-based engineer as a “Master Admin” who “has access to everything.” (While many employees introduced themselves by name and title in the recordings, BuzzFeed News is not naming anyone to protect their privacy.)

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

Chinese Officials Are Weaponizing COVID Health Tracker to Block Protests

 

Chinese bank depositors planning a protest about their frozen funds saw their health code mysteriously turn red and were stopped from traveling to the site of a rally, confirming fears that China’s vast COVID-tracking system could be weaponized as a powerful tool to stifle dissent.

 

A red health code designated the would-be protesters as suspected or confirmed COVID-19 patients, limiting their movement and access to public transportation. Their rallies in the central Henan province this week were thwarted as some were forced into quarantine and others detained by police.

 

A 38-year-old software engineer was among hundreds who could not access their savings at four rural banks since mid-April. She had planned to travel from her home in Jiangxi province to Zhengzhou, Henan’s capital city, to join a group petition this week to demand her money back. But her health code turned from green to red shortly after she bought a train ticket on Sunday. She said a nucleic test for COVID she took the night before came back negative and her hometown has not reported any infection recently. 

 

“Henan authorities targeted the health code of bank depositors in order to stop us from defending our rights,” she told VICE World News, speaking on condition of anonymity to avoid government reprisal. She eventually managed to reach Zhengzhou using her green health code on a different app, but was daunted by the sight of police officers out in force.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

China: MI5 and FBI heads warn of ‘immense’ threat

 

The heads of UK and US security services have made an unprecedented joint appearance to warn of the threat from China.

 

FBI director Christopher Wray said China was the "biggest long-term threat to our economic and national security" and had interfered in politics, including recent elections.

 

MI5 head Ken McCallum said his service had more than doubled its work against Chinese activity in the last three years and would be doubling it again.

 

MI5 is now running seven times as many investigations related to activities of the Chinese Communist Party compared to 2018, he added.

 

The FBI's Wray warned that if China was to forcibly take Taiwan it would "represent one of the most horrific business disruptions the world has ever seen".

 

The first ever joint public appearance by the two directors came at MI5 headquarters in Thames House, London.

 

McCallum also said the challenge posed by the Chinese Communist Party was "game-changing", while Wray called it "immense" and "breath-taking".

 

Wray warned the audience - which included chief executives of businesses and senior figures from universities - that the Chinese government was "set on stealing your technology" using a range of tools.

 

He said it posed "an even more serious threat to western businesses than even many sophisticated businesspeople realised". He cited cases in which people linked to Chinese companies out in rural America had been digging up genetically modified seeds which would have cost them billions of dollars and nearly a decade to develop themselves.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

Maybe China needs to encounter some Islamic extremism.

 

Islam In China Must Be Chinese In Orientation: President Xi Jinping

 

President Xi Jinping has asked officials to step up efforts to uphold the principle that Islam in China must be Chinese in orientation and religions in the country should adapt to the socialist society being pursued by the ruling Communist Party of China.

Xi visited the volatile Xinjiang region, where the Chinese security forces for the last several years have made efforts to control protests by Uygur Muslims over settlements from Han Chinese from outside the province.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[Riggo-toni]

On 6/12/2022 at 11:41 PM, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

The difference being that Ukraine is actually an independent countries where as Taiwan is where the losers of the Chinese Civil War fled to and that China has claimed since the 1600s….

 

I think there is an obvious difference between the two scenarios.

 

Taiwan was an independent country Formosa that was invaded by Kuomintang forces who immediately executed all of the local leaders. The indigenous people are not Chinese - ethnically they are closer to Philippinos. The US and its Cold War mentality created the fiction of One China policy and the absurd recognition of Taiwan as its legitimate government to prevent another communist government from having a seat on the security council. 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

6 minutes ago, Riggo-toni said:

Taiwan was an independent country Formosa that was invaded by Kuomintang forces who immediately executed all of the local leaders. The indigenous people are not Chinese - ethnically they are closer to Philippinos. The US and its Cold War mentality created the fiction of One China policy and the absurd recognition of Taiwan as its legitimate government to prevent another communist government from having a seat on the security council. 

The Chinese empire claimed Taiwan for 500 years prior to the 1900s and I did say after the 1960s in my post. So your post and my post are both true.

Edited July 19, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84

[China]

 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

I mean, now she almost has to go.

[China]

CNN Exclusive: FBI investigation determined Chinese-made Huawei equipment could disrupt US nuclear arsenal communications

 

On paper, it looked like a fantastic deal. In 2017, the Chinese government was offering to spend $100 million to build an ornate Chinese garden at the National Arboretum in Washington DC. Complete with temples, pavilions and a 70-foot white pagoda, the project thrilled local officials, who hoped it would attract thousands of tourists every year.      

 

But when US counterintelligence officials began digging into the details, they found numerous red flags. The pagoda, they noted, would have been strategically placed on one of the highest points in Washington DC, just two miles from the US Capitol, a perfect spot for signals intelligence collection, multiple sources familiar with the episode told CNN.  

Also alarming was that Chinese officials wanted to build the pagoda with materials shipped to the US in diplomatic pouches, which US Customs officials are barred from examining, the sources said.    

Federal officials quietly killed the project before construction was underway.      

The canceled garden is part of a frenzy of counterintelligence activity by the FBI and other federal agencies focused on what career US security officials say has been a dramatic escalation of Chinese espionage on US soil over the past decade.        

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

Pelosi to visit Taiwan, local media say, despite China warnings

 

U.S. House of Representatives Speaker Nancy Pelosi was set to visit Taiwan on Tuesday, three people briefed on the matter said, as China warned that its military would never “sit idly by” if she visited the self-ruled island claimed by Beijing.

 

Pelosi, who began an Asia trip earlier on Monday in Singapore, was due to spend Tuesday night in Taiwan, the people said.

 

Taiwan’s foreign ministry said it had no comment on reports of Pelosi’s travel plans.

 

Amid widespread speculation over whether she would make a stop in Taiwan, Pelosi’s office said on Sunday that she was leading a congressional delegation to the region that would include visits to Singapore, Malaysia, South Korea and Japan. It did not mention Taiwan.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

China sends warships to surround Taiwan amid Pelosi visit

 

China’s defense ministry announced Tuesday that its military would conduct “targeted” drills and missile tests around Taiwan in response to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s arrival there on Tuesday, in Beijing’s latest escalation since news emerged of the speaker’s highly anticipated trip.

 

The “targeted military operations” are designed to “safeguard national sovereignty” in response to Pelosi’s visit, the defense ministry said Tuesday, vowing to “resolutely thwart external interference and ‘Taiwan’s independence’ separatist attempts.”

 

Experts raised alarms over the exercise, with some noting that the drills would overlap with Taiwan’s territorial waters. M. Taylor Fravel, director of the MIT Security Studies Program, said the drills appear to be “unprecedented,” noting that they would be “the largest number of exercises to be conducted very close to the island of Taiwan itself, and the first to take place on all sides surrounding Taiwan.

 

The drills could also include Chinese missiles overflying the island, Fravel said.

 

In another provocation, 21 Chinese aircraft entered Taiwan’s air defense zone on Tuesday, Taiwan’s defense ministry announced.

 

U.S. officials, however, have concluded that China’s threats against Pelosi — including a suggestion that her plane could be shot down — are nothing more than an intimidation tactic.

 

The Pentagon earlier Tuesday deployed four U.S. warships, including an aircraft carrier, in waters east of Taiwan on what the U.S. Navy said were routine deployments. The carrier, the USS Ronald Reagan, is positioned far from Taiwan, according to one U.S. official.

 

Click on the link for the full article