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      The Bill Callahan era began here at the Hard Rock Stadium in Miami. For the first quarter it was really,really bad football being played by both teams. 
      The Redskins were determined to establish the Run game. The First Quarter all they established was that they still couldn’t run. Or pass. Or do much of anything. 
       
      It wasn’t until the 2nd Quarter that Peterson was able to start ripping the worst Run D in the League for chunks of 18 & 24 yards. The Skins managed to score a TD with a 25 yard pass to Scary Terry McLaurin. 
       
      The Dolphins would open the Second Half only managing five plays before the Redskins would get the ball punted back to them. They would run a balanced run/pass attack of six plays for 70 yards in 1:25 ending in McLaurin’s second touchdown of the day. The Defense would then get a turnover allowing the Offense to get to Field Goal range and add another 3 points to make the score 17-3. 
       
      To open the Fourth Quarter, Hopkins would miss a 55 yard Field Goal, leaving the score at 17-3.  After being sacked five times, the Dolphins would pull their own switcharoo at QB and go to Ryan “Neckbeard” Fitzpatrick which resulted in a touchdown drive for them, making it 17-10. They went for & recovered the Onside Kick. They also managed to not score any points after that. The Dolphins would find theirselves with ball at the 2:00 Warning. Fitzpatrick would take them on a 9 play 75 yard touchdown drive with six seconds remaining on the clock. Miami went for the win with the 2 Point Conversion and failed. The Redskins would recover the onside kick by Miami and Keenum took a knee to get the Redskins their first win of the season. 
Fergasun

Where is the Outrage over Boeing 737-MAX?

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4 minutes ago, HOF44 said:

Seems like the next question is if MCAS can override the pilot taking control.   Just gotta wait and let the investigation play out.  

 

I’m fine with it... but even if it is a mistake Boeing made, I’m not “outraged”... sometimes you have to pay a price for progress... automated systems sent perfect, nor should the be expected to be. I’m sure Boeing doesn’t have an interest in selling planes that fall from the sky.

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

 

I’m fine with it... but even if it is a mistake Boeing made, I’m not “outraged”... sometimes you have to pay a price for progress... automated systems sent perfect, nor should the be expected to be. I’m sure Boeing doesn’t have an interest in selling planes that fall from the sky.

This wasn't progress. Progress would have been making a new lighter airframe designed for these fuel efficient engines.  Boeing took a shortcut to save time and money and tried to put engine on an airframe that was never designed for them and 100's of people payed with their lives.  All brought on because they were losing orders to Airbus in this size category.  

Edited by HOF44
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24 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

You can definatley disable autopilot and mcas on the max8. A crew flying the lion air crash did it and was able to continue for a safe flight.

You did not even read that headline from Reuters I just posted.

You may want to pay close attention to one specific word...."REPEATEDLY"

15 minutes ago, HOF44 said:

Seems like the next question is if MCAS can override the pilot taking control.   Just gotta wait and let the investigation play out.  

Certainly sounds like it, since the pilots turned it off repeatedly.

11 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

 

I’m fine with it... but even if it is a mistake Boeing made, I’m not “outraged”... sometimes you have to pay a price for progress... automated systems sent perfect, nor should the be expected to be. I’m sure Boeing doesn’t have an interest in selling planes that fall from the sky.

Boeing hasn't paid the price...the hundreds of passengers and the pilots did.

Now that I know you see people as expendable for corporate profit I can more properly understand your dysfunction.

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1 hour ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

 

Boeing hasn't paid the price...the hundreds of passengers and the pilots did.

Now that I know you see people as expendable for corporate profit I can more properly understand your dysfunction.

 

Well have to see, I highly doubt all the airlines who had aircraft taken out of service due to this are going to accept sole responsibility for thier financial losses...

1 hour ago, HOF44 said:

This wasn't progress. Progress would have been making a new lighter airframe designed for these fuel efficient engines.  Boeing took a shortcut to save time and money and tried to put engine on an airframe that was never designed for them and 100's of people payed with their lives.  All brought on because they were losing orders to Airbus in this size category.  

 

 

Your reasoning behind why they kept the 737 body is pure speculation. You are a acting like designing a completely new airframe doesn’t have similar risks.

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2 hours ago, HOF44 said:

Seems like the next question is if MCAS can override the pilot taking control.   Just gotta wait and let the investigation play out.  

 

It can certainly re-engage if you do not completely disable it.

When it does you will see the trim wheels rotate....if you look.

 

From my reading the Lionair flight did not fully disable it and tried to work within the mcas system to correct the problem.

 

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2019/march/14/faa-grounds-boeing-737-max-fleet

https://leehamnews.com/2018/11/28/indonesian-authorities-release-preliminary-lion-air-crash-report/

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Ahhhh still blaming the pilots for Boeing's flaw. It's fine, I get it, he probably hazs a big chunk of his 401k in Boeing stock.

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5 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

 

Well have to see, I highly doubt all the airlines who had aircraft taken out of service due to this are going to accept sole responsibility for thier financial losses...

 

 

Your reasoning behind why they kept the 737 body is pure speculation. You are a acting like designing a completely new airframe doesn’t have similar risks.

If it was speculation MCAS would have never existed on a 737.  The engines affected the stability of the airframe. If not MCAS would have never been created to mask the instability. 

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7 minutes ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

Ahhhh still blaming the pilots for Boeing's flaw. It's fine, I get it, he probably hazs a big chunk of his 401k in Boeing stock.

 

The pilots actions in response are a different matter than the flaw.

 

pretty sure my opinion here is not gonna move the stock price. :ols:

 

 

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1 minute ago, twa said:

 

The pilots actions in response are a different matter than the flaw.

 

pretty sure my opinion here is not gonna move the stock price. :ols:

 

 

Ohhh so you're committed to your opinion for some other bizarre reason that simply defies logic and reason.

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1 minute ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

Ohhh so you're committed to your opinion for some other bizarre reason that simply defies logic and reason.

 

defies yours

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4 minutes ago, twa said:

 

defies yours

Which is based on facts, reason, and the opinion of experts.

Your's is based solely on truthiness.

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Here is a video which demonstrates what a crew flying a max would need to do to manually adjust the trim setting (after recognizing the issue, and disabling MCAS)

 

 

 

of note, this is an example of a case when the trim is full down

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Interesting.  https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/africa/ethiopia-says-pilots-performed-boeings-recommendations-to-stop-doomed-aircraft-from-diving-urges-review-of-737-max-flight-control-system/2019/04/04/3a125942-4fec-11e9-bdb7-44f948cc0605_story.html?utm_term=.ae6606692dc2

 

Experts say that the airplane was traveling too fast for the manual trim wheel to be operated.

At higher speed, manual trim may not be available due [to] air load on the stabilizer,” said John Cox, a former pilot and an airline-safety consultant who has been privately briefed on the evidence by people familiar with the investigation. “Not enough force can be generated manually to move the trim.”

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1 hour ago, HOF44 said:

Interesting.  https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/africa/ethiopia-says-pilots-performed-boeings-recommendations-to-stop-doomed-aircraft-from-diving-urges-review-of-737-max-flight-control-system/2019/04/04/3a125942-4fec-11e9-bdb7-44f948cc0605_story.html?utm_term=.ae6606692dc2

 

Experts say that the airplane was traveling too fast for the manual trim wheel to be operated.

At higher speed, manual trim may not be available due [to] air load on the stabilizer,” said John Cox, a former pilot and an airline-safety consultant who has been privately briefed on the evidence by people familiar with the investigation. “Not enough force can be generated manually to move the trim.”

 

I.e., 500 MPH wind is strong!

 

Shout out to all the aerospace and human factors engineers in this thread. :)

 

From what I’ve read, the MCAS kept kicking in because the computer “thought” the aircraft was stalling, so it automatically pointed the aircraft at the ground get air flowing over the wings... which is not something you want when the ground isn’t that far away. Seems like it’s a good feature to have, but they really should not let it kick in below a certain altitude.

 

I have a feeling this has more to do with tight deadlines, overworked software developers, and skimpy QA/QC than it does airframes and engine weight.

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41 minutes ago, RansomthePasserby said:

I have a feeling this has more to do with tight deadlines, overworked software developers, and skimpy QA/QC than it does airframes and engine weight.

 

Decades ago, working computer programming, I recall the expression:

 

If builders built buildings the way programmers write programs, the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization. 

 

Also reflecting on the things I keep hearing about designing computer-driven tractor trailers. 

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1 hour ago, Larry said:

 

Decades ago, working computer programming, I recall the expression:

 

If builders built buildings the way programmers write programs, the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization. 

 

Also reflecting on the things I keep hearing about designing computer-driven tractor trailers. 

Sounds about right.

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Posted (edited)

yeah, was reading about the same thing. If completely true, it jives with a lot of what I've read prior about crashes involving modern jets: it's never just one thing. 

 

Modern jets are designed with a lot of redundancy. So here you had an alleged bird strike, pilot error, software error and mechanical error

Edited by Elessar78
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5 hours ago, Elessar78 said:

Modern jets are designed with a lot of redundancy. So here you had an alleged bird strike, pilot error, software error and mechanical error

 

Yes and both pilots were in their 20s, so add inexperience to the list.

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1 minute ago, RansomthePasserby said:

 

Yes and both pilots were in their 20s, so add inexperience to the list.

 

The pilot while being young was fairly experienced, the co-pilot was not.

fwiu they use like a apprenticeship program w/co-pilots which allows much less experienced ones in the ****pit than the US does.

 

the most disturbing thing to me in the last article was they supposedly didn't address the trim wheel till 3 minutes after experiencing control issues.

Combine that with not reducing power and easing pressure on the trim surfaces then conditions rapidly degrade.

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4 minutes ago, RansomthePasserby said:

 

Yes and both pilots were in their 20s, so add inexperience to the list.

But some people just want to flat out blame Boeing or FAA. And I won't say they're blameless. Ethiopian Air needs some blame for not purchasing the optional sensors or having flight simulators for their pilots. Boeing for less than perfect software. FAA for less than perfect oversight. Boeing has had decades of minimal accidents of this magnitude. 

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Posted (edited)

Boeing fixes their problem when they learn about it and.....wait for it......

......

.......

.......

........

........

keep waiting.....

.......

........

those planes don't crash!

those people live

this thread doesn't exist.

Edited by AsburySkinsFan

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Do you expect problems never to occur in flight?......or just easy ones?

 

Doing things is never hard till things go wrong, then you find out who knows how to do things.

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