Pathetic crowds at home opener

[Suffolk_Skins]

Somethibg was different Sunday, been to plenty of games that were far from full but that felt a bit like pre season when looking up top. Shame, I'll still be there this week though. We had loads in Arizona as well. I clearly spend too much money on these chumps as I'm going to 5 of the first 6. 

[Burgundy Yoda]

26 minutes ago, hail2skins said:

Gibbs was 17-15 at FedEx. Hardly much better than the overall .500 mark.

Probably the overall best win% of all of our coaches since FedEx opened though, if not the best, hes close. 

[Rogue Jedi]

When even the die-hard, loyal fans are getting to be apathetic, we are getting into pretty dangerous territory. Never have I imagined that a week after a blowout victory, our home opener would be half-empty.

 

As poster mentioned before, we have basically lost an entire generation of fans. I don't think anyone born after 2001 really cares about the Redskins.

 

I was born in 1988. I was 4 years old when this team won it's last Super Bowl, so I was barely conscious of what was happening.

 

By the time I really started paying attention and understanding the game, I was getting a heavy diet of Gus Frerotte, Jeff Hostetler, Jeff George. The 1999 season was a random gem with Brad Johnson and Stephen Davis putting up solid seasons, but after we botch the Brad Johnson situation, we go to Danny Weurfell, Shane Matthews, and Patrick Ramsey. 

 

Much of the 2000's were a blur, and it's understandable how we couldn't pick up new fans with Spurrier/Zorn circus and constantly whiffing at QB, per usual. Joe Gibbs 2.0 lit a new fire, but ultimately led to a whole lot of nothing, maybe even slightly tainting his legacy. Although Mark Brunell was solid, he was clearly past his prime, and led the door to Jason Campbell and Todd Collins. Not exactly the sexiest faces of the franchise. When we hired Shanahan, I thought we were finally turning a page, and he goes out and gets McNabb, who makes a fool of himself as this teams QB.

 

From then on it's basically goes into recent events, from Grossman to Beck, back to Grossman, then RG3/Cousins to our current situation.

 

If you look at this team in a vacuum from the last 25 years, we should learn to not be surprised by the attendance and lack of enthusiasm.

 

It shouldn't take 25 years to build a winning team. The Jaguars are my favorite example of this. They start as an expansion team, make the AFC title game a year later, go back into irrelevancy, resurge in the mid 2000's with Gerard/Leftwich, then go back to the cellar, and are now a perennial powerhouse and arguably top 3 in the entire league.

 

The Eagles were one of the worst teams in the league 2 years ago and are currently reigning champions. What else needs to be said? Excuses are pathetic for our owner and FO.

 

Shahid Khan is the type of owner I wish we had. Esp, when rumors were floating that he'd move the Jags to LA, he stayed committed to the fans, the city and the team, and turned them into what they are, getting the right staff, and building from the bottom up.

 

If Snyder had any integrity, class, or decency, he'd sell the team to the owner we deserve. But we all know he has none of that.

[megared]

26 minutes ago, kleese said:

 

That’s just not a fair assessment. I’ve been to FedEx and I’ve been to the Superdome. The time and $$ investment difference is ALL about location which can’t be blamed on Snyder. Yes NOLA was great because we could walk from our hotel and there are a billion places to eat, drink, and sights to see in between. It’s a cool and fun atmosphere. But unless Dan builds an entire city to surround FedEx he can’t replicate it. And you think parking is bad at FedEx in terms of price? Dallas is way worse and when I parked at the Meadowlands that was a costly deal as well. 

 

I agree that there is very little attractive about a concrete bowl in the middle of nowhere... there is absolutely nothing cool or interesting around FedEx and it’s a pain to get in and out of...but that is all a flaw from the initial design. I am not a local fan... I’ve been to FedEx a handful of times and many other stadiums across the league. I agree the convenience factor at FedEx is WAY below other places... as is the aesthetics. But the “experience” once you arrive at the lot? I think that is really overblown. I think concessions are a waste and a rip off just about everywhere so I only partake minimally anyway. I don’t find anything particularly offensive about FedEx once you actually get in there. At least not when it comes to stuff that can be controlled. 

 

Look I don't completely blame Snyder... after all he inherited FedEx.  But all of the things he did to isolate the experience, prevent Metro access,  pretty much eliminate other places to park within the vicinity... ban pedestrians.   

 

I think Snyder is too greedy to put a stadium in a place where you can go drink, eat,  have fun within walking distance if he isn't directly profiting from it.   Nothing he's done to date indicates otherwise. 

[Renegade7]

16 minutes ago, Suffolk_Skins said:

Somethibg was different Sunday, been to plenty of games that were far from full but that felt a bit like pre season when looking up top. Shame, I'll still be there this week though. We had loads in Arizona as well. I clearly spend too much money on these chumps as I'm going to 5 of the first 6. 

You are, but only because believe this might not of been the best year to do that many games.  Really low expectations this year, many of those could be losses.  Are you going to the saints game?  that's worth it, new orleans is awesome regardless.

[Mr. Sinister]

9 minutes ago, Rogue Jedi said:

When even the die-hard, loyal fans are getting to be apathetic, we are getting into pretty dangerous territory. Never have I imagined that a week after a blowout victory, our home opener would be half-empty.

 

As poster mentioned before, we have basically lost an entire generation of fans. I don't think anyone born after 2001 really cares about the Redskins.

 

I was born in 1988. I was 4 years old when this team won it's last Super Bowl, so I was barely conscious of what was happening.

 

By the time I really started paying attention and understanding the game, I was getting a heavy diet of Gus Frerotte, Jeff Hostetler, Jeff George. The 1999 season was a random gem with Brad Johnson and Stephen Davis putting up solid seasons, but after we botch the Brad Johnson situation, we go to Danny Weurfell, Shane Matthews, and Patrick Ramsey. 

 

Much of the 2000's were a blur, and it's understandable how we couldn't pick up new fans with Spurrier/Zorn circus and constantly whiffing at QB, per usual. Joe Gibbs 2.0 lit a new fire, but ultimately led to a whole lot of nothing, maybe even slightly tainting his legacy. Although Mark Brunell was solid, he was clearly past his prime, and led the door to Jason Campbell and Todd Collins. Not exactly the sexiest faces of the franchise. When we hired Shanahan, I thought we were finally turning a page, and he goes out and gets McNabb, who makes a fool of himself as this teams QB.

 

From then on it's basically goes into recent events, from Grossman to Beck, back to Grossman, then RG3/Cousins to our current situation.

 

If you look at this team in a vacuum from the last 25 years, we should learn to not be surprised by the attendance and lack of enthusiasm.

 

It shouldn't take 25 years to build a winning team. The Jaguars are my favorite example of this. They start as an expansion team, make the AFC title game a year later, go back into irrelevancy, resurge in the mid 2000's with Gerard/Leftwich, then go back to the cellar, and are now a perennial powerhouse and arguably top 3 in the entire league.

 

The Eagles were one of the worst teams in the league 2 years ago and are currently reigning champions. What else needs to be said? Excuses are pathetic for our owner and FO.

 

Shahid Khan is the type of owner I wish we had. Esp, when rumors were floating that he'd move the Jags to LA, he stayed committed to the fans, the city and the team, and turned them into what they are, getting the right staff, and building from the bottom up.

 

If Snyder had any integrity, class, or decency, he'd sell the team to the owner we deserve. But we all know he has none of that.

 

You and I are the same age. I started paying real close attention around that time as well ('98-'99ish). Been on one hell of a long, dark road

[Rogue Jedi]

15 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

 

You and I are the same age. I started paying real close attention around that time as well ('98-'99ish). Been on one hell of a long, dark road

 

We've been through some brutal years, but yet here we are, still.

 

The new generation is not as forgiving or sympathetic.

 

Edit: I love your profile pic, me and my friend quote him from that movie ALL the time, haha.

 

"I REMEMBER YOU! At the farm and that stupid boy"

 

"Kill me before the war is over, will you? It appears you are not the better man..."

 

All in our ****ty Jason Isaacs impression, with that slight lisp, lol.

[Mr. Sinister]

Just now, Rogue Jedi said:

 

We've been through a lot of brutal years, but here we are, still.

 

The new generation is not as forgiving or sympathetic.

 

Yeah, I don't really know a ton of young Redskins fans. Most are fans of teams like the Steelers, Patriots, or Eagles. 

[Renegade7]

1988 also.

 

i remember osaka, i remember my dad going to a giants game before i understood how angry he was coming home. i remember growing up and getting ridiculed for constantly losing to dallas, being young and looking around to see I was only one in the room watching us get our ass kicked at my mom's friends house trying to figure out why we couldn't cross the yellow line and other team could. This lead to eventually getting **** for the team name being racist. last time i went museum hoping in a redskins jersey i got crap from the security guards up front in every single one for one thing or the other about everything wrong with us, some BS, some indefensible. 

 

I've lost count of the reasons Id be justified to leave, but I don't.  I don't expect to get credit for that, but I'll damned if get crap for that not being enough.

[hail2skins]

11 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

Probably the overall best win% of all of our coaches since FedEx opened though, if not the best, hes close. 

Norv was 18-12-1 at FedEx, and that includes two losses right before he got canned.

 

Of course, I liked FedEx in those years. There were issues to be sure.....traffic tie ups on the Beltway, fans who had been in the UL at RFK pushed higher up by the addition of club and suite level, and I don't even think the club level concourse was fitted out in year one. But it was a new place, we weren't far removed from the glory year, and it was fun to watch kids play in the fun area before the game, the band was more a part of the game, Phil Hochberg doing the PA. Snyder didn't really mess with anything his first season, but starting in 2000 he jacked up parking and ticket prices, got rid of Hochberg, brought the loud music in, and started to degrade the experience, IMO.

 

 

[megared]

30 minutes ago, hail2skins said:

This stadium has not really been sold out in some time. If it has, it has been courtesy of close to 20K seats being ripped out and a bunch of no-shows.

 

Two of the three "rings" were full? What are you talking about? Yes. the LL sidelines were full, but the LL end zones had a lot of vacancies. Club level was 50 pct full, and the upper level had a lot of empties.

 

You're still not getting that the waiting list was a lie.   The team was selling thousands of prime location tickets directly to brokers,  when they supposedly had 200k people waiting on season tickets.  They took the tickets they couldn't sell and dumped them off to brokers,  to sell at a loss,  in exchange for giving brokers great tickets that they could profit from.   The new executive put a stop to this practice, but apparently the geniuses in the front office would rather take an over $6 M bath in order to not appear to be manipulating prices to negatively affect STHs (which everyone knew they were doing).

 

Guess what,  in the past when the Steelers or other strong fanbases were taking over Fedex,  vast majority of them were buying off of StubHub.  It's convenient to blame STHs, but they were getting played... so i can't blame anyone for not wanting to buy a season's worth of tickets,  when the team is going to undercut the price they sold them to you for.  

[Renegade7]

3 minutes ago, Rogue Jedi said:

 

We've been through some brutal years, but yet here we are, still.

 

The new generation is not as forgiving or sympathetic.

 

They also have NFL Sunday ticket, Bleacher Report, etc.  It's so easy to be a fan of an out of town team, its playing with fire being this bad this long.  This was inevitable, being mad at the fans for this is rediculous, its not our fault.

3 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

 

Yeah, I don't really know a ton of young Redskins fans. Most are fans of teams like the Steelers, Patriots, or Eagles. 

I'll tell you this now, Redskins turn it around, you'll see people born in this area, even the young ones second guess that, same with what happened with the Nats.  I met a lot of people from DC proper that are younger then me and still put up with it, but if your from like NOVA or something and not old enough to drink, you are an endangered species.  You ask the average young person why they don't root for the Redskins, its because they not only suck they are embarrasing, the team doesn't care about winning or know how to.  They have to start winning or it will not only stay that way it will get worse. Blaming the fans for that is wrong and won't change anything.

[Rogue Jedi]

10 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

They also have NFL Sunday ticket, Bleacher Report, etc.  It's so easy to be a fan of an out of town team, its playing with fire being this bad this long.  This was inevitable, being mad at the fans for this is rediculous, its not our fault.

 

It's why I think the only way to fix this franchise is basically a code-red.

 

Dangerous to say around these parts and I'm sure it's a very unpopular opinion on these boards, but we need to burn it all to the ground and start over.

 

I'm thinking like an Oilers-to-Titans type identity change. People on here our gonna hate that idea, but it's basically the only way now, whether they like it or not. If any franchise is in dire need of a re-branding, it's this one.

 

Maybe then we will see fans trickling back.

[Mr. Sinister]

13 minutes ago, Rogue Jedi said:

Edit: I love your profile pic, me and my friend quote him from that movie ALL the time, haha.

 

"I REMEMBER YOU! At the farm and that stupid boy"

 

"Kill me before the war is over, will you? It appears you are not the better man..."

 

All in our ****ty Jason Isaacs impression, with that slight lisp, lol.

 

?

 

Colonel Tavington is one of the greatest ****bag villains of all time. Had to have him (I love a good villain, hence the sn)

[Renegade7]

1 minute ago, Rogue Jedi said:

 

It's why I think the only way to fix this franchise is basically a code-red.

 

Dangerous to say around these parts and I'm sure it's a very unpopular opinion on these boards, but we need to burn it all to the ground and start over.

 

I'm thinking like an Oilers-to-Titans type identity change. People on here our gonna hate that idea, but it's basically the only way now, whether they like it or not. If any franchise is in dire need of a re-branding, it's this one.

 

Maybe then will we see fans trickling back.

I've said for a while now when the name thing hit its peak we shoulda gone back to the arrow on our head.  I agree, some companies they make a wholesale image change, but it only works if the company is actually better then the reputation it tried to bury.  It does not matter what we wear or call ourselves if we don't win. 

 

I'm not ready to nuke the entire front office (they added a lot of new people i want to give a chance first), just start with getting rid of Allen and not replacing him with someone that has override permissions on personell decisions.  For the love of God, we need Football people making Football decisions, why is the rocket science to us?

 

[Rogue Jedi]

2 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

I've said for a while now when the name thing hit its peak we shoulda gone back to the arrow on our head.  I agree, some companies they make a wholesale image change, but it only works if the company is actually better then the reputation it tried to bury.  It does not matter what we wear or call ourselves if we don't win. 

 

I'm not ready to nuke the entire front office (they added a lot of new people i want to give a chance first), just start with getting rid of Allen and not replacing him with someone that has override permissions on personell decisions.  For the love of God, we need Football people making Football decisions, why is the rocket science to us?

 

 

Yeah, I agree that we should just slap the spear on the helmet, go with Washington Warriors, and call it a day. "Warr-eeee-errrs.... come out and playyeeyaayy"

 

I'm all for giving the new faces a chance... but we should def nuke Bruce and Dan.

6 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

 

?

 

Colonel Tavington is one of the greatest ****bag villains of all time. Had to have him (I love a good villain, hence the sn)

 

Yeah I'm a big fan of that actor. He plays villians so well. He was born to play Lucius Malfoy (unsure if you're familiar with that Potter franchise).

[Renegade7]

1 minute ago, Rogue Jedi said:

 

Yeah, I agree that we should just slap the spear on the helmet, go with Washington Warriors, and call it a day. "Warr-eeee-errrs.... come out and playyeeyaayy"

 

I'm all for giving the new faces a chance... but we should def nuke Bruce and Dan.

Can't nuke Dan, but can rock that GoGo song on the intro 

[Mr. Sinister]

Bruce would explode into a million cans of Coors light. Dan would probably regenerate. ?

[Renegade7]

Regardless of what people feel about the name, I always felt changing to Washington Warriors was the perfect name to change to, especially if we essentially used the 70th anniversary jerseys.  It's the rebrand of least resistance and one we deserve at this point, right while moving back to the RFK site.

 

 

 

[Rogue Jedi]

Just now, Renegade7 said:

Regardless of what people feel about the name, I always felt changing to Washington Warriors was the perfect name to change to, especially if we essentially used the 70th anniversary jerseys.  It's the rebrand of least resistance and one we deserve at this point, right while moving back to the RFK site.

 

 

 

 

Yeah man, I was always a fan of that uniform, maybe because it reminds of my childhood, and when my idols Darrell Green and Champ Bailey wore that uniform together on the same team. Deion, Champ, and Green on the same team, what a time to be alive, lol.

 

I agree it's the path of least resistance, keep the color scheme, maybe update it a bit and clean up some lines, and we got ourselves a badass uniform

[Renegade7]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

Bruce would explode into a million cans of Coors light. Dan would probably regenerate. ?

Some creatures are immune to radiation.  Others...

 

[hail2skins]

23 minutes ago, megared said:

 

You're still not getting that the waiting list was a lie.   The team was selling thousands of prime location tickets directly to brokers,  when they supposedly had 200k people waiting on season tickets.  They took the tickets they couldn't sell and dumped them off to brokers,  to sell at a loss,  in exchange for giving brokers great tickets that they could profit from.   The new executive put a stop to this practice, but apparently the geniuses in the front office would rather take an over $6 M bath in order to not appear to be manipulating prices to negatively affect STHs (which everyone knew they were doing).

 

Guess what,  in the past when the Steelers or other strong fanbases were taking over Fedex,  vast majority of them were buying off of StubHub.  It's convenient to blame STHs, but they were getting played... so i can't blame anyone for not wanting to buy a season's worth of tickets,  when the team is going to undercut the price they sold them to you for.  

I'm not disagreeing with you. When they started ripping out all those UL seats, everyone knew the waiting list was bogus.  That's why I took issue with Renegade when he mentioned the sellout streak. Of course it was a sham, unless you count the seats sold to brokers. Over the past several seasons, plenty of empty seats in the UL have been seen at all the games, perhaps save Dallas. And with them apparently not selling the UL SRO areas and limiting the number of available cave seats on the 200 visitor side, the capacity is probably closer to 70K now.

 

I'm no fan of Snyder and hope that this is sending a message to him.  But I do find it funny regarding the number of people who seem to give up on the team even before the season begins. And I can understand not wanting to go out to Landover....once you've done it a few times, it kind of loses its charm.  But the folks who say that they aren't even going to watch on TV?  What's up with that?

[Renegade7]

35 minutes ago, hail2skins said:

I'm not disagreeing with you. When they started ripping out all those UL seats, everyone knew the waiting list was bogus.  That's why I took issue with Renegade when he mentioned the sellout streak. Of course it was a sham, unless you count the seats sold to brokers. Over the past several seasons, plenty of empty seats in the UL have been seen at all the games, perhaps save Dallas. And with them apparently not selling the UL SRO areas and limiting the number of available cave seats on the 200 visitor side, the capacity is probably closer to 70K now.

 

Prove that statement in bold, you don't like what I said show the attendance numbers. Personally believe the streak ended after if was obvious Griffin was a bust, but before that we put up with a lot of **** and was in there, way more then you are giving credit for because some people didn't resell their tickets (season ticket holders who, you guess it, are sick of this ****)

 

Quote

I'm no fan of Snyder and hope that this is sending a message to him.  But I do find it funny regarding the number of people who seem to give up on the team even before the season begins. And I can understand not wanting to go out to Landover....once you've done it a few times, it kind of loses its charm.  But the folks who say that they aren't even going to watch on TV?  What's up with that?

 

Don't change the subject, you're calling us out for not going to the game, don't move the goal post because you're getting legitament and justifiable push back.

 

You can't come after people like mine, Sin's, and Jedi's generation and huff and puff about us not being as rah rah as fans were in the 80s.  Our Super Bowl recordings are on VHS, man, fandoms are two-way relationships and you are just completely underestimating what that level of embarrassment for that long has done to the number of people that have the choice to join versus remembering how it used to be and just not wanting to go anywhere else.  Those people will probably just stop watching football if this keeps up (that's what my dad said, and he used to sneak into RFK back in the day), that's what we're risking here, and filling up that stadium to your liking is NOT GOING TO FIX THAT.

 

I started a thread asking if this was even a playoff roster while we're talking about being in win now mode.  Did you vote?  Do you not get why some people saw this coming?  My dad said its, week 2, I agree, they could win the Packers game, lose the Saints game, be .500 with 3 winnable games right in front of us.  I'm telling you right here and now that will be the longest two weeks in a long time if we lose that game because our WRs can't get open and we can't keep up with Rodgers (I see us holding him to around 21, if we can't score more that this isn't a playoff team and everyone should have every right to be pissed)

[Alexa]

I can go to Fed Ex anytime I want through work and t's free. I've been there twice in probably 5 years. Yeah the stadium sucks but it's more about all the ahole fans. Many don't know how to handle their drinking, then when you add on all the traffic and subpar team it isn't worth it. The RFK days are long gone but I'll always have those memories. 

[skins2victory]

@Renegade7 I think you are confusing @hail2skins with me. I started this thread. I was born in 86, and have not seen any of the good years either. I live in an area when most people are Seahawk fans. They were going to super bowls while I would get laughed at. I still represent the Burgundy and Gold regardless of the teams success. That's why I made this thread. I'm embarrassed to see our fan base only sell out half the stadium on our home opener, coming off a win, its pathetic. Regardless of the situation, all of us Skins fans represent Redskins Nation. I would like to think Redskins Nation is better than that. Maybe its now only like that for the out state fans. By the reaction in this thread it sure feels like it. The feeling is no one cares anymore. Extremely sad!