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Moose & Squirrel v Boris & Natasha: what's the deal with the rooskies and trumpland?

Jumbo

By Jumbo
in The Tailgate

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Sacks 'n' Stuff

Sacks 'n' Stuff

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, RedskinsMayne said:

@Sacks 'n' Stuff... Brodensky. Man. Dude. Brah. I said that there was plenty of bufoonery to go around. Not sure how that is holding obama to a different standard. Ive been pretty consistent...  derp?

Well if you don't think the president does anything, why would one of them be a buffoon for not doing anything?

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Sacks 'n' Stuff

Sacks 'n' Stuff

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, RedskinsMayne said:

If it was partly cloudy how could it be partly sunny? Derp derp derpity do.

If you believe Presidents should be judged by their actions but at the same time you don't believe presidents actually do anything but at the same time you believe Obama is a buffoon for not doing anything could it be that you are just talking out of your ass?

 

Yes.

Edited by Sacks 'n' Stuff
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RedskinsMayne

RedskinsMayne

Posted
Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

If you believe Presidents should be judged by their actions but at the same time you don't believe presidents actually do anything but at the same time you believe Obama is a buffoon for not doing anything could it be that you are just talking out of your ass?

 

Yes.

 

 

I believe that presidents are bafoons who don't do anything. Obama was another bafoon who didn't do anything. There's no mutual exclusivity, Eugene. I didn't say should be judged, i said ARE judged. And for the last 20 years they haven't done anything and nothings gotten done.

 

Talk tough on Iran, no progress. Some ****ty deal where we pay them millions in ransom. Great.

Talk tough on North Korea, no progress.

Talk about Red line in syria, hah!

Talk about Russian aggression in Crimea psht...

talk about fixing entitlement? Still waiting

talk about revitalizing america with infrastructure investment? Lols, popular line but never happens.

 

 

I mean really, do i have to go on?

 

 

On the the other hand the courts have

 

legalized gay marriage

killed obamacare

reduced capital punishment

improved woman's access to healthcare

let transgender people use the bathroom they want

 

and that's just what i can think off off the top of my head.

 

 

And, the main point was that president Trump saying Obama spied on him is not that big of a deal... but that sort of got lost in your inane attempt to blow his comments up like it was the worst thing a president has ever said or did.

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Burgold

Burgold

Posted
Posted (edited)

It seems to me that your argument while aimed at Presidents is really about Congress. Congress hasn't held up its end of the bargain. Decades (is that fair to say) of obstructionism, extreme partisanship, and being bereft of ideas other than "NO!" is what is hurting this country. What we need to do is go back to the days of Tip O'Neil when the two parties railed at each other in public and then went to the bar together or a dark room and got stuff done. I do believe the GOP is far more guilty of this than the Dems and statistics back it up. Look at the rate of filibustering alone since Obama took office. Congress more than doubled the use of the tactic as compared to the George W Bush and may be as high as five times its historical rate. Simple things like appointing bench judges couldn't get done. At one point, there were nearly 150 empty seats in this country because Congress refused to vote on anyone nominated by Obama.

 

You are right that there is a limited amount a President can get done without Congress. George W. Bush, Barrack Obama, and now Donald Trump have all begun using Executive Orders to try to circumvent the blockade that is Congress. What is odd to me is that Trump seems to need/want to use it despite having clear majorities in both chambers of Congress. That's how bad the GOP led Congress is!

 

Trump is a problem. He's an embarrassment. His constant lying is damaging to the reputation and credibility of this country. Congress may be worse.

Edited by Burgold
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RedskinsMayne

RedskinsMayne

Posted
Posted (edited)

we were discussing how important what the president says is. Congress didn't say "No Nukes For North Korea" in a state of the union speech, they didn't say "There is a red line that syria can't cross". Nope.

 

 

Presidents did. Nothing happened. Their words don't mean a whole lot. All presidents lie. President Bush made up intelligence to support a war. Clinton lied under oath to support his ****. Trump saying Obama wiretapped him is an equal nothing. QED.

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Burgold

Burgold

Posted
Posted
40 minutes ago, RedskinsMayne said:

we were discussing how important what the president says is. Congress didn't say "No Nukes For North Korea" in a state of the union speech, they didn't say "There is a red line that syria can't cross". Nope.

 

 

Presidents did. Nothing happened. Their words don't mean a whole lot. All presidents lie. President Bush made up intelligence to support a war. Clinton lied under oath to support his ****. Trump saying Obama wiretapped him is an equal nothing. QED.

Really? You don't remember what Congress said? How they kept saying over and over how it was illegal for Obama to act without their approval. How Congress said it was their mission to make President Obama a one term President and defeat any proposal that might help any American?

 

To the larger point, you are entirely wrong. I'll give you a very simple minor example. President Trump early on when made mention of a company. There was a profound effect on that company's stock price. No actions just Trumpian tweets or talk. I'll give you another similar example. Trump's talk about minorities and adoption of Right Nationalist language can already be correlated to a significant jump in hate crimes.

 

You can argue this point. You can believe it. You are wrong. You can pick gaffes. You can pick times where the rhetoric was not fulfilled, but in sum, "Is only one problem with your theory. Is stupidest thing I've ever heard."

 

(A cookie for the person who can place that quote)

 

 

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RedskinsMayne

RedskinsMayne

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Burgold said:

Really? You don't remember what Congress said? How they kept saying over and over how it was illegal for Obama to act without their approval. How Congress said it was their mission to make President Obama a one term President and defeat any proposal that might help any American?

 

To the larger point, you are entirely wrong. I'll give you a very simple minor example. President Trump early on when made mention of a company. There was a profound effect on that company's stock price. No actions just Trumpian tweets or talk. I'll give you another similar example. Trump's talk about minorities and adoption of Right Nationalist language can already be correlated to a significant jump in hate crimes.

 

You can argue this point. You can believe it. You are wrong. You can pick gaffes. You can pick times where the rhetoric was not fulfilled, but in sum, "Is only one problem with your theory. Is stupidest thing I've ever heard."

 

(A cookie for the person who can place that quote)

 

 

 

You are arguing that congress ineffective. I mean, that's nice and all, but it's a different 

 

 

A stock jump on one day has approximately zero long term effects. But, if you want that one I'll give it to you. Presidents are ineffective baffoons. Words don't matter that much. Trumps lies no worse than any other presidents.  Clinton lied about his ****, bush lied about Iraq, Obama lied about Syria... 

 

How many people were killed because of Obama and Bush's lies. A lot more than we're killed because trump accused Obama of lying or saying he doesn't know what the KKK is. 

 

You could argue that the increase in hate crimes has more to do with eight years of Obama.... not his fault but people get upset when they aren't doing good, eight years of a black man in office is a good place to start if you want a scapegoat.

 

 

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Burgold

Burgold

Posted
Posted

I'll give you another example and then I'll probably bow out of this argument.

 

George W. Bush got us into Iraq. Iraq didn't attack us, didn't plan to attack us, UN reports and US Intel argued there were no concerns with his WMD programs. The President's words galvanized a whole nation into war. A war which cost a 100,000 Iraqi lives and thousands of American ones.


The Courts did not get us into Iraq. George W. Bush did and his administration did. They made the case. They won the argument. It was their rhetoric, cherry picking of Intel, and lies that as of 2013 cost us 1.7 trillion dollars to date (according to Reuters)

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-iraq-war-anniversary-idUSBRE92D0PG20130314

 

Seems like a President's words and arguments can be pretty damn important... unless you think the lives of our soldiers, marines, sailors, etc. are worth nothing or that trillions of dollars don't count.

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RedskinsMayne

RedskinsMayne

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Burgold said:

I'll give you another example and then I'll probably bow out of this argument.

 

George W. Bush got us into Iraq. Iraq didn't attack us, didn't plan to attack us, UN reports and US Intel argued there were no concerns with his WMD programs. The President's words galvanized a whole nation into war. A war which cost a 100,000 Iraqi lives and thousands of American ones.


The Courts did not get us into Iraq. George W. Bush did and his administration did. They made the case. They won the argument. It was their rhetoric, cherry picking of Intel, and lies that as of 2013 cost us 1.7 trillion dollars to date (according to Reuters)

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-iraq-war-anniversary-idUSBRE92D0PG20130314

 

Seems like a President's words and arguments can be pretty damn important... unless you think the lives of our soldiers, marines, sailors, etc. are worth nothing or that trillions of dollars don't count.

 

 

So, are we saying trumps lie about obama is worse than this lie, or not?

 

 

Edited by RedskinsMayne
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Burgold

Burgold

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, RedskinsMayne said:

 

 

So, are we saying trumps lie about obama is worse than this lie, or not?

 

 

I'll take this as an admission that a President's words matter and have an impact. Something can't be worse if it's irrelevant, right?

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Jumbo

Jumbo

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@RedskinsMayne

 

Hi sweetie.

 

If you like joining the scrum, you'll need to dial back the gratuitous snark/asswipe tone in order to remain. I offer no further tutorial or guidance other than read the rules (esp. 5 & 12) carefully, understand and follow them, and follow moderator directives.  Also, stay on the thread topic. 

 

added: I see you were warned a week ago on another matter by another mod. If you like being here, I suggest adjustment.

 

Per routine, do not reply to this post in the thread, and do not PM me with questions that suggest to me you have not read and understood the rules or this post.

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Burgold

Burgold

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, RedskinsMayne said:

 

 

Whole conversation got started because you lot act like Trump lying about obama was a huge deal. One of the worst things anyone has ever done as president... when in fact, it's not even close.

That is not the argument you were making. Not at all. 

 

Trump's lies are impactful and they do matter. They are changing the way we look at the President because he lies about nearly everything even when there is no need. Some of his whoppers are terrible. 

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LD0506

LD0506

Posted
Posted

Funny, now we hear the new improved latest version of why the * in the WH isn't a disaster of cosmic proportions, or why it doesn't matter, or why it isn't their fault, or yadda yadda ****ing yadda........... now it's "All Presidents lie or are ineffective or don't really do anything meaningful, so what difference does it make?" Is that it?

 

 

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TK

TK

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Jumbo said:

@RedskinsMayne

 

Hi sweetie.

 

If you like joining the scrum, you'll need to dial back the gratuitous snark/asswipe tone in order to remain. I offer no further tutorial or guidance other than read the rules (esp. 5 & 12) carefully, understand and follow them, and follow moderator directives.  Also, stay on the thread topic. 

 

added: I see you were warned a week ago on another matter by another mod. If you like being here, I suggest adjustment.

 

Per routine, do not reply to this post in the thread, and do not PM me with questions that suggest to me you have not read and understood the rules or this post.

It'd also help if he NOT hit the Like button on the post he reports. 

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