***2021-2022 NBA Season Thread***

[Going Commando]

1 minute ago, DM72 said:

 

And how is that the Warriors problem? It's not like they got a team filled with a bunch of free agents. If you want to get mad at a team or the system, get mad at the Cavs. They're the ones that tried to build a super team. When they built that team, they thought they had a free reign to the chip for the foreseeable future. But the Warriors happened. 

 

It's not their fault.  They exploited a broken system.  It's the NBA's fault for being a broken system.

[DM72]

Just now, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

It's not their fault.  They exploited a broken system.  It's the NBA's fault for being a broken system.

 

Did the Cavs exploit a broken system? They're the team that's built through free agency.

[Sticksboi05]

Yeah anyone blaming the Warriors, please. Same thing NHL GMs did with all these 14 year back-loaded deals to get superstars back in the mid-2000s before that loophole was closed.

[Going Commando]

10 minutes ago, Sticksboi05 said:

Curry - top 10 ever? Don't see that happening even with the MVPs.

 

He's going to go down as the best true PG ever.  His two MVP seasons were some of the best ever.  The only better season from a perimeter player than Curry's '15-'16 is Jordan's '87-'88.  And he's probably going to retire with at least five or six rings.  There is no question in my mind he'll be top ten all time.

Just now, DM72 said:

 

Did the Cavs exploit a broken system? They're the team that's built through free agency.

 

Yes they absolutely did.  How does trying to make Cleveland into the bad guys argue against the fact that the NBA is broken?

[Dont Taze Me Bro]

Why are there a few that keep saying not to blame GS and to blame the Cavs, when nobody is blaming GS?  Put in a hard salary cap and get rid of max contracts, then nobody (Cavs building super teams) and no team is going to strike oil and be able to have built a super team through the draft and add a MVP to the roster in FA to mold it into an invulnerable force.

 

Wanting parity and wanting a hard cap and no max contracts to provide parity is not "blaming" the Warriors or Cavs.  It's simply wanting to see a more competitive league instead of allowing for this to happen year after year.  It's not punishing any teams now, the current CBA doesn't expire until 23-24 unless both sides agree to opt out in 22-23, which most likely won't happen. 

 

And no, not all fans are delusional, and no it's not just Wiz fans that want more parity.  I'm not a Wiz fan, I like watching super teams, but I'd also like to see more competition and multiple teams have a legit shot at making the finals in each conference.  I love basketball, I'll continue to watch it, that's not going to change.  But it doesn't mean that I wouldn't like to see a better overall product on the court, especially during the playoffs.

Edited June 6, 2017 by Dont Taze Me Bro

[Bozo the kKklown]

1 hour ago, Renegade7 said:

I don't know about lying to ourselves, more like we want to believe we have a chance until we actually are beaten.  It's how I do the Redskins, what's the point in assuming there's no chance at all?

No one felt this way in the 90s

 

The early aughts or most of the 80s.

 

What's changed?

 

We want to see great players be great. But my issue is stop blaming players or the NBA for bad front offices. That is what this comes down too.

 

A few years ago we were told big market teams were gonna run things. This year the Heat, Lakers, Sixers, and Knicks were lottery teams and Chicago barely got into the playoffs while a team from Oakland and a team from Cleveland are embarking on a 3rd straight NBA finals.

 

Things change fast in this sport and only a few teams have ever won NBA titles. This sport has never been about "competitive balance" or parity. It can't be.

 

But more than anything, hold your front offices accountable. The smart teams always win while the teams that go "shut up and take my money" tend to fail. A lot of NBA front offices are like that.

Edited June 6, 2017 by BenningRoadSkin

[Bozo the kKklown]

 

Oh yeah, the NBA finals first two games just got its highest tv ratings since 1998. 

[Llevron]

20 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

 

Oh yeah, the NBA finals first two games just got its highest tv ratings since 1998. 

 

They aint gonna stop 

[Kosher Ham]

53 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

There has never been another team with two MVPs in their prime before.  But let's be even more clear: this is an era where there are three guys who are going to go down in the Top Ten All Time and the Warriors have two of them.  Nothing in NBA history even comes close to this.  The Warriors are going to cruise to a three or fourpeat.

 

I would argue that Moses and Dr. J. were in their prime at the time when they played on the Sixers together. 

[DM72]

15 minutes ago, Kosher Ham said:

 

I would argue that Moses and Dr. J. were in their prime at the time when they played on the Sixers together. 

 

I know what he's saying, but don't you have to add Kareem and Magic and Kobe and Shaq? 

[Bozo the kKklown]

Kobe and Shaq were the closest we have now. They steamrolled the league.

 

There was no cries about competitive balance then (except the Kings series).

[Renegade7]

45 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

No one felt this way in the 90s

 

My dad did.

 

As for the current state of parity in the league, I agree with Steve that its not the player or team's fault, its the NBA as an organization.  He listed 18 teams that have won a championship.  If KD does re-sign with GS, there's little reason to believe anyone will be able to stop them save a major injury.  Are we really ready for another era of domination like the Bill Russel Celtics? 

 

I would've been fine if the NBA blocked the KD signing, sort of how they blocked the Chris Paul to Lakers trade (different reasons, but Stern still did it).

[Bozo the kKklown]

Just now, Renegade7 said:

My dad did.

 

As for the current state of parity in the league, I agree with Steve that its not the player or team's fault, its the NBA as an organization.  He listed 18 teams that have won a championship.  If KD does re-sign with GS, there's little reason to believe anyone will be able to stop them save a major injury.  Are we really ready for another era of domination like the Bill Russel Celtics? 

 

I would've been fine if the NBA blocked the KD signing, sort of how they blocked the Chris Paul to Lakers trade (different reasons, but Stern still did it).

Sorry he felt that way.

 

Unfortunately TV ratings and others metrics showed he was in a solid minority.

 

18 teams in a 70 year history is not parity. I know no one listened or cared for the Adam Silver interview I posted last week, but he pointed out that nearly half the NBA titles won were by two teams. That is not parity. And if you dad was old enough to watch Celtics in the 60s and be okay with that, only to complain in the 90s then that is interesting.

 

The other thing is we have no idea what the future will hold. The Warriors may win 5 straight titles, or Durant may shatter his knee and they only get one.  This fear of the future makes no sense.

 

Like I said before, I really believe NBA fans just lie to themselves about some mythical period where everyone had a chance. It never happened.

 

And more than that, its not the NBA organization's fault for bad front offices. Durant going to the Warriors did not mean the Nets gave up there future.

 

The irony here is that the Heat built a super team, and two franchises some how beat them in the Spurs and Mavericks. That was not supposed to happen, but it did.

Cleveland were supposed to go on a run when Lebron returned, but Golden State stepped up.

 

 

Also, smh and lol at wanting the league to prevent a free agent deciding where he wants to go. Thats so wrong on so many levels. May as well bring back the reserve clause and end free agency, for goodness sake.

[DM72]

9 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

My dad did.

 

As for the current state of parity in the league, I agree with Steve that its not the player or team's fault, its the NBA as an organization.  He listed 18 teams that have won a championship.  If KD does re-sign with GS, there's little reason to believe anyone will be able to stop them save a major injury.  Are we really ready for another era of domination like the Bill Russel Celtics? 

 

I would've been fine if the NBA blocked the KD signing, sort of how they blocked the Chris Paul to Lakers trade (different reasons, but Stern still did it).

 

It seems as if you and Steve are using GS as the example where the Cavs are the team that's built through free agency. Yeah, they added a great player through free agency, but their other 3 main guys are all homegrown. Now go look at the Cavs big 3 and their main role players.

Edited June 6, 2017 by DM72

[CrypticVillain]

 

 

Even though this is the same dude responsible for that Steph Curry Elite defender video... He's actually illustrating what I was saying last week about this being Durant's team.

 

The man just has a bigger impact on the overall team than Steph does. And believe me, I'm not knocking Steph at all, that's my dude. But Durant is just as efficient as Steph on offense, but has so much impact on defense. He's been a menace on defense this series. He's put clamps on Lebron and Kyrie multiple times in both games.

5 minutes ago, DM72 said:

 

It seems as if you and Steve are using GS as the example where the Cavs are the team that's built through free agency. Yeah, they added a great player through free agency, but their other 3 main guys are all homegrown. Now go look at the Cavs big 3 and their main role players.

Facts... That's what I've been saying all year.

 

The Cavs have two number one picks FIVE top 5 picks!

 

I don't even have to look at Golden State's roster to tell you that they only have 1 top five pick on the team.

[Warhead36]

You can't blame the Warriors. They did what they were supposed to. They drafted and developed their star talent in Curry, Thompson, and Green. They made smart trades/FAs to acquire vets like Igoudala and Stevenson among others. They put themselves in a position to win a title, get back to the Finals, and still have cap room to land a stud in Durant. They played by the same rules as everyone else, they're just smarter(and perhaps, a little bit luckier, but that franchise is due some luck, they were basically the Bullets/Wizards of the West for many years).

 

Basketball in general is the simplest and most predictable of any major sport. Its not conducive to upsets the way the other sports are. When you get a loaded team like the Warriors, you will win titles. It isn't like baseball where a 100+ win Mariners team in 2001 loses in the first round or hockey where a team like the Caps can dominate the regular season but then lose in the postseason. And of course football is completely different because of the one and done nature.

[Dont Taze Me Bro]

Just now, BenningRoadSkin said:

Sorry he felt that way.

 

Unfortunately TV ratings and others metrics showed he was in a solid minority.

 

  1.  18 teams in a 70 year history is not parity. I know no one listened or cared for the Adam Silver interview I posted last week, but he pointed out that nearly half the NBA titles won were by two teams. That is not parity. And if you dad was old enough to watch Celtics in the 60s and be okay with that, only to complain in the 90s then that is interesting.

 

  2.  The other thing is we have no idea what the future will hold. The Warriors may win 5 straight titles, or Durant may shatter his knee and they only get one.  This fear of the future makes no sense.

 

  3.  Like I said before, I really believe NBA fans just lie to themselves about some mythical period where everyone had a chance. It never happened.

 

  4.  And more than that, its not the NBA organization's fault for bad front offices. Durant going to the Warriors did not mean the Nets gave up there future.

 

  5.  The irony here is that the Heat built a super team, and two franchises some how beat them in the Spurs and Mavericks. That was not supposed to happen, but it did.

Cleveland were supposed to go on a run when Lebron returned, but Golden State stepped up.

 

 

  6.  Also, smh and lol at wanting the league to prevent a free agent deciding where he wants to go. Thats so wrong on so many levels. May as well bring back the reserve clause and end free agency, for goodness sake.

 

1.  There is nothing wrong with fans wanting to see a change and see more parity across the league.  Over time, is it so hard to believe that a fan might start getting bored or tired of lack of parity and basically the same teams cycling through championship runs over time (Lakers, Celtics, Spurs, Bulls, etc.)?  Just because one may have witnessed the dominance that was the Celtics back then, doesn't mean that they can't eventually grow tired of the same narrative over the years.

 

2.  That may happen, but is really irrelevant to the point some of us are trying to make, which is that we would like to see more parity in a league that has always lacked parity.  

 

3.  You keep regurgitating this nonsense as if some of us are saying, "We would like see more parity in the league, more competition, like it was in the good ole days."  When that is clearly not what any of us have said.  The only thing that was mentioned (that I remember - find an exact quote if you have one) was to the effect that there were a handful of teams prior to this era of super teams that had at least a shot to maybe pull an upset and make a finals.  Nothing about the league being loaded with multiple teams in each conference having a shot.

 

4.  You keep regurgitating that point as well, which makes no sense, as nobody is arguing this point with you.  I'm pretty sure everyone acknowledges this and agrees with you, yet you keep feeling the need to keep stating it.

 

5.  Yes, they built a super team.  One that made it to four straight finals, winning two, it's not like that isn't impressive, regardless of dropping two.  

 

6.  Nobody has said they want the league to prevent a free agent deciding where he wants to go.  Where did you come up with that nonsense?  His options would be limited with a hard cap and no max contracts, but he would still have options.  Teams that wanted him would free up cap space and pursue him just like they would now.  You can act like he thought about going to all 30 teams when he hit the market, when we all know that he had a handful of teams he was even considering (Clippers, Lakers, Heat, Celtics, Warriors).  

 

 

[Destino]

18 minutes ago, CrypticVillain said:

Even though this is the same dude responsible for that Steph Curry Elite defender video... He's actually illustrating what I was saying last week about this being Durant's team.

 

The man just has a bigger impact on the overall team than Steph does. And believe me, I'm not knocking Steph at all, that's my dude. But Durant is just as efficient as Steph on offense, but has so much impact on defense. He's been a menace on defense this series. He's put clamps on Lebron and Kyrie multiple times in both games.

 

KD also benefits from the system he's playing in.  He's not being given the ball above the three line while the rest of the team just clears out like he was doing in OKC.  He's getting much easier scoring opportunities in Golden State and is able to dominate within the flow of the offense.  His FG% and 3p% have never been higher in the post season than they are this year.

 

Golden State is getting the most out of their talent by playing excellent basketball.  A different staff could take this collection of stars and run a star friendly (read: simple) offense where Steph and KD just take turns dominating the ball.  Great systems with great players produce the greatest results.   

[Renegade7]

31 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

Sorry he felt that way.

 

 

 

Also, smh and lol at wanting the league to prevent a free agent deciding where he wants to go. Thats so wrong on so many levels. May as well bring back the reserve clause and end free agency, for goodness sake.

2

We don't need your sympathy, and if you read my post, I was talking about the Redskins.  I don't know how he felt about the NBA prior to between Wes Unseld and Gilbert Arenas.  Ya'll keep coming back to GS drafting three of their stars and no one complaining about the Cavs.  What the Warriors did is different, we're talking about having 3 all-stars then adding a former MVP player in his prime.  That's not what the Cavs did, that's not what the Heat did.

[CrypticVillain]

4 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

We don't need your sympathy, and if you read my post, I was talking about the Redskins.  I don't know how he felt about the NBA prior to between Wes Unseld and Gilbert Arenas.  Ya'll keep coming back to GS drafting three of their stars and no one complaining about the Cavs.  What the Warriors did is different, we're talking about having 3 all-stars then adding a former MVP player in his prime.  That's not what the Cavs did, that's not what the Heat did.

The Heat and Cavs might not have done the same exact thing, but they're definitely in the same neighborhood.

[RonArtest15]

50 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

You can't blame the Warriors. They did what they were supposed to. They drafted and developed their star talent in Curry, Thompson, and Green. They made smart trades/FAs to acquire vets like Igoudala and Stevenson among others. They put themselves in a position to win a title, get back to the Finals, and still have cap room to land a stud in Durant. They played by the same rules as everyone else, they're just smarter(and perhaps, a little bit luckier, but that franchise is due some luck, they were basically the Bullets/Wizards of the West for many years).

 

Basketball in general is the simplest and most predictable of any major sport. Its not conducive to upsets the way the other sports are. When you get a loaded team like the Warriors, you will win titles. It isn't like baseball where a 100+ win Mariners team in 2001 loses in the first round or hockey where a team like the Caps can dominate the regular season but then lose in the postseason. And of course football is completely different because of the one and done nature.

 

GREAT points. 

 

I maintain that even with Durant (and health on their side) the Warriors would still be in the Finals. 

 

Warriors drafted/developed 3/4 star players.  But we're getting mad at the lack of parity? 

 

I guarantee that if Durant had signed with the Wizards, folks here on this board wouldn't be saying anything about the landscape of the NBA.  It's sour grapes to me. 

[Bozo the kKklown]

1 hour ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said:

 

1.  There is nothing wrong with fans wanting to see a change and see more parity across the league.  Over time, is it so hard to believe that a fan might start getting bored or tired of lack of parity and basically the same teams cycling through championship runs over time (Lakers, Celtics, Spurs, Bulls, etc.)?  Just because one may have witnessed the dominance that was the Celtics back then, doesn't mean that they can't eventually grow tired of the same narrative over the years.

 

2.  That may happen, but is really irrelevant to the point some of us are trying to make, which is that we would like to see more parity in a league that has always lacked parity.  

 

3.  You keep regurgitating this nonsense as if some of us are saying, "We would like see more parity in the league, more competition, like it was in the good ole days."  When that is clearly not what any of us have said.  The only thing that was mentioned (that I remember - find an exact quote if you have one) was to the effect that there were a handful of teams prior to this era of super teams that had at least a shot to maybe pull an upset and make a finals.  Nothing about the league being loaded with multiple teams in each conference having a shot.

 

4.  You keep regurgitating that point as well, which makes no sense, as nobody is arguing this point with you.  I'm pretty sure everyone acknowledges this and agrees with you, yet you keep feeling the need to keep stating it.

 

5.  Yes, they built a super team.  One that made it to four straight finals, winning two, it's not like that isn't impressive, regardless of dropping two.  

 

6.  Nobody has said they want the league to prevent a free agent deciding where he wants to go.  Where did you come up with that nonsense?  His options would be limited with a hard cap and no max contracts, but he would still have options.  Teams that wanted him would free up cap space and pursue him just like they would now.  You can act like he thought about going to all 30 teams when he hit the market, when we all know that he had a handful of teams he was even considering (Clippers, Lakers, Heat, Celtics, Warriors).  

 

 

1. I did not say there is anything wrong with it. My thing is with this "its bad for the league" talk. Its not. Its proven not to be. Fans seem even more invested in the NBA than in the past. Its not founded in anything.

 

2. It fits the point exactly because you are fearing what you do not know. People really thought the Heat would win 5 NBA titles in a row when Lebron joined. They didn't.

 

3. The only years where this was close was the 94 and 95 seasons. Years where ratings dropped. I do not believe a lot of people are actually that interested in it.

 

4. Huh? It makes total sense. Bad front offices keep teams bad and non competitive. You all keep pretending this isnt about the Warriors, but you are only complaining because the Warriors did it. So it is about the Warriors. The Warriors are a great organization and did a great job of cultivating their talent which then made Durant attracted to them.  Bad front offices, like my Wizards, did not do that. It makes total sense, but you guys want safety nets to help teams that do not deserve the help.

 

5. I never said the Heat's run was not impressive. My point is they didnt go on to win the next 6 NBA titles and even lost a couple of finals. Stop fearing the future.

 

6. @Renegade7 literally said they wanted the NBA to step in to prevent KD from signing with Golden State like they stopped the Chris Paul trade. 

Edited June 6, 2017 by BenningRoadSkin

[Renegade7]

27 minutes ago, RonArtest15 said:

I guarantee that if Durant had signed with the Wizards, folks here on this board wouldn't be saying anything about the landscape of the NBA.  It's sour grapes to me. 

 

 

Wizards fan here, how can you compare adding an MVP player in his prime to a team with three all-star to the Wizards who only have one?

1 minute ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

6. @Renegade7 literally said they wanted the NBA to step in to prevent KD from signing with Golden State like they stopped the Chris Paul trade. 

 

 

Not popular, but I stand by it.

[DM72]

What's everybody's opinion on Charles Barkley's little stunt last night? I know he's been critical of today's NBA and GS in particular, but crashing an NHL/Wayne Gretzky press conference to bash the NBA? I think Charles has finally went to far. He has to lose a ton of respect in the NBA community after that one.

[Dont Taze Me Bro]

13 minutes ago, RonArtest15 said:

 

GREAT points. 

 

I maintain that even with Durant (and health on their side) the Warriors would still be in the Finals. 

 

Warriors drafted/developed 3/4 star players.  But we're getting mad at the lack of parity? 

 

I guarantee that if Durant had signed with the Wizards, folks here on this board wouldn't be saying anything about the landscape of the NBA.  It's sour grapes to me. 

 

You are completely missing the point.  Nobody is mad at the Warriors, nobody is mad at LeBron for creating super teams in Cleveland and Miami.  Nobody is mad at Kevin Durant (with exception to some Wiz fans) for picking the Warriors in free agency.  It's all within the current rules of the CBA, getting mad about those points would be silly. 

 

I can't speak for everyone of the others in favor of more parity, but I can speak for myself, when I say I'm not mad at the lack of parity.  I'm not going to not watch NBA basketball because of it.  I'm actually going to get the NBA league pass next year so I can watch my team and any team/match-up if I choose to.  And I'll watch the playoffs and finals like I do every year, regardless if my team is in it or not.  

 

But...........that does not mean that I would not like to see less super teams (speaking to creation and not drafting) and more parity across the league.  Golden State would still be a super team without Durant because they drafted extremely well, developed their players and happen to hit the jackpot.  I love seeing that happen, it's the way it should be and it should be what every team is trying to do.  

 

But it would be nice if the talent was spread out more across the league, IMO.   And the only way to do that would be to implement a hard salary cap and get rid of max contracts.  Then, the LeBron way of self-creation of super teams and the team that built one the right way (through the draft and FA) wouldn't be able to hit the jackpot and bring in an MVP FA to make them an indestructible force.  

 

Speaking for myself, some need to quit substituting the words "mad", "upset", "hate" for "would like to see" when talking about parity.  And it doesn't matter that the league has always lacked parity, we know that.  Some of us would just like to see more parity.  I'm honestly baffled at why some on here cannot accept that as anything other than that.