What Can The Redskins Do Specifically To "Protect" RG3?

[DCsportsfan53]

I think we have unanimous approval that RG3 should take better care of himself. I go further and say we need to dump the read-option to lower his exposure to injury. The fact that he wasn't hurt on a read-option play isn't relevant in my opinion, but those who disagree want to keep it in our scheme.

Where do you stand on this point?

The reason I have no problem with the read option is the types of hits it leads to....ie straight ahead, falling forward tackles. Those are rather innocuous overall and realistically, even if he's running an option 10 times a game it should only lead to him getting tackled 3 or 4 times. It just doesn't concern me that much. A vast majority of those times he's getting tackled from the side, falling forward with the taller after having gotten north and south. what concerns me is when he gets hit while throwing on the run because he waited too long, cutting it back inside with people closing from all angles off a scramble and hits in the pocket when he's stationary. The read option just doesn't concern me, rg's decision making with his body when plays break down is where I worry.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

The read-option isn't "our offense." It just happens to be the part that RG3 runs well. But, it's also the part that involves the highest risk for RG3.

You're right. I guess I meant that I wouldn't completely eliminate that aspect of our offense entirely. I'm OK with only running it a couple times per game or figuring out other ways to get Griffin to hurt teams with his legs every now and then. If we can devise something better, that's great.

I do want to say that I'm excited to see Griffin eventually run the traditional Shanahan offense. But some designed QB runs would be good with his skill set. Whether that's read option or something else, I don't really care.

[Probos]

The only thing they can do is either stop the read option or teach him to slide at the correct time.

How about both?

I strongly believe they need to abandon the read option bs -- he needs to evolve into a more prototypical pocket passer ala Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, etc. He will always be "mobile", but I don't think that the offense should be completely predicated on the strong possibility that he could run at anytime like it was this year. The organization invested a lot in him, and he has all the tools and smarts to become a great pocket passer w/mobility. He needs to be protected at all costs moving forward.

[Oldfan]

The reason I have no problem with the read option is the types of hits it leads to....ie straight ahead, falling forward tackles. Those are rather innocuous overall and realistically, even if he's running an option 10 times a game it should only lead to him getting tackled 3 or 4 times. It just doesn't concern me that much. A vast majority of those times he's getting tackled from the side, falling forward with the taller after having gotten north and south. what concerns me is when he gets hit while throwing on the run because he waited too long, cutting it back inside with people closing from all angles off a scramble and hits in the pocket when he's stationary. The read option just doesn't concern me, rg's decision making with his body when plays break down is where I worry.

You sound like Mike Shanahan trying to justify running his QB inside. Mike claimed that hits in the pocket were more dangerous.

Your conclusion, like his, is not a reasonable deduction based on what I've seen on the field for many years; but if that's your conclusion based on your view of the evidence, there's nothing I can say that will change your mind.

---------- Post added January-9th-2013 at 01:52 PM ----------

...I do want to say that I'm excited to see Griffin eventually run the traditional Shanahan offense. But some designed QB runs would be good with his skill set. Whether that's read option or something else, I don't really care.

I watched Mike's 2008 offense with Cutler every time I got the chance. Imagine an offense with an O-line no better than the one we have now leading the NFL with only 11 sacks of Jay Cutler. In that year, Mike had to break Cutler of taking off and running too often.

[deejaydana]

here are my personal suggestions, perhaps someone with "insider status" can get this in front of the "right people" :

1) max protect on each and every play, including running plays. Use both TE's so as to ensure RG3 can't so much as be breathed upon by the opposing team's D

2) bubble-wrap. Lotsa bubble wrap.

3) complimentary box of prophylactics before each game

[Skinsinparadise]

If you don't run the option as designed, it will be ineffective.

The defense can counter your plan by allowing Robert to keep for the inside option and then smacking the crap out of him whenever the opportunity presents itself. Even if RG3 makes a couple of nice gains running inside, Kyle isn't going to risk putting his own reputation in the toilet by risking another knee injury on a running play.

Teams do that, protect the edges, etc but if so it also leaves them vulnerable to being gashed up the middle by Alfred Morris, and we've seen it happen that way

[Hooper]

The read option had nothing to do with RG3's injury.

Not to mention RG3 wasn't even running that much the second half of the season.

If he's back in 2013, some form of the read option will be back.

[Oldfan]

The read option had nothing to do with RG3's injury.

Why do you think this fact matters in the context of this discussion?

[DiscoBob]

#1 and #2, will do the most to prevent further injury

1) Have him practice throw away's in training camp and practice....we need to beat into his head that scrambling is OK, but there is a point where killing yourself for 3 yards isn't worth it

2) Implement a "Doctor's Exam" process whenever he shows the slightest hint of injury - if this means burning timeouts in an important game - DO IT. Rely on the doctors recommendation ONLY. Corollary - RGIII never plays again with knees at less than 100%....EVER

Next ones go to scheme, where I would not fully eliminate the read option. I would preserve the run "options", but take advantage of it much less than they did this year. It was too beneficial to our team, and when used properly, any QB keepers can be virtually untouched runs.

3) Only use the QB keeper in WIDE open scenario's, training RGIII to slide immediately if he keeps and then realizes there aren't easy yards there...

4) Continue to build a repertoire of plays that use the read option look, just significantly bound the situations where RGIII runs. I believe that you can still get the effectiveness of the read option with many fewer QB runs. This is compounded if you have 4-5 different read option looks. Examples below

- Two read option - RB or QB keep

...... - From Pistol with the RB dive look

...... - From Shotgun with a RB counter look

- Two read option - RB1 or RB2 (no QB keep option)

- Three read option - FB, RB, or QB keep

- Fake two read option pass

- Fake three read option pass

I believe you could still create the general "freeze the defense" effect that we saw this year by implementing more option looks while cutting the number of QB keeps by 50% - 75%.

5) In spite of #4, phase in more traditional drop back passes, to keep RGIII learning how to better read defenses. I would do this in 2013 even if it costs us a couple of wins.

[Oldfan]

Teams do that, protect the edges, etc but if so it also leaves them vulnerable to being gashed up the middle by Alfred Morris, and we've seen it happen that way

They can take away Morris; take away the pitch; and force RG3 to keep it and run inside. He will gain yards, but at high risk.

[Hooper]

Why do you think this fact matters in the context of this discussion?

Because stop are saying we have to stop running it to protect him. I disagree. I think it's more about RG3 knowing when to slide or quit on a play.

And LUCK.

[Sekhmet187]

Nearly every major QB injury I've seen since the 90s and beyond, has involved a player getting hit on a sack or getting hit while escaping pressure. RGIII's injury from Ngata could have been avoided with a slide.

Either way, the best way to protect a QB is get him better lineman to protect him from getting hit. Tyler Polombus is not the answer at RT. RGIII got hit many times in the pocket, and thats not good for any QB. The Read Option opens him up to a little more danger, but not anything thats worse than if he drops back to pass 50 times a game in shotgun where speedy LBs are diving at his legs to sack him.

[Oldfan]

Because stop are saying we have to stop running it to protect him. I disagree. I think it's more about RG3 knowing when to slide or quit on a play.

And LUCK.

But, the fact that his injury did not occur while running the ball on a read-option play is not evidence that the risk of injury isn't higher on those plays. One event is not evidence of anything.

[skinzwiz]

It is my firm belief that RGIII's athleticism is needed to compensate for the lack of explosiveness in this offense. Outside of Garçon, there is no other explosive threat. Robinson became a ghost as well as Hankserson at the end of the year.

I think if this team had more weapons and explosiveness, RGIII wouldn't need to run so much. His running ability should be the gravy that puts this offense over the top, not the lifeblood of the offense.

[Sekhmet187]

But, the fact that his injury did not occur while running the ball on a read-option play is not evidence that the risk of injury isn't higher on those plays. One event is not evidence of anything.

Well when has a QB ever been injured on a read option play in the NFL at all?

I could easily say, since it hasn't really happened (Both RGIII injuries were just scrambles), that saying the read option is more dangerous is mere speculation. Richard Crawford isn't bigger than RGIII and he has to return punts, doesn't necessarily mean he'll be hit with a severe injury more often. Its all about how smart you play when running with the ball. When QB's drop back to pass, then you have to hope the blindside guy doesn't come at a bad angle.

[Chump Bailey]

His running ability should be the gravy that puts this offense over the top, not the lifeblood of the offense.

Interesting take SW - makes sense.

[rumplestilskin]

Because stop are saying we have to stop running it to protect him. I disagree. I think it's more about RG3 knowing when to slide or quit on a play.

And LUCK.

Exactly right. His first injury was a freak hit but it was on Robert for sure and so was his Atlanta concusion. He had full opertunity to get out and he chose not to. These are learning experiences and he is not a dumb guy. Eventually when he reflects on this season he will see that being couragous is one thing but jeopardizing his health and the teams success is another. He is still young and fearless but this season was a sobering reminder to him that the NFL truly does stand for "not for long" if you dont respect it.

[Oldfan]

Nearly every major QB injury I've seen since the 90s and beyond, has involved a player getting hit on a sack or getting hit while escaping pressure...

That's only true because, until this season, NFL teams have had very few running QBs in its history.

---------- Post added January-9th-2013 at 02:43 PM ----------

Well when has a QB ever been injured on a read option play in the NFL at all?

Since the read option has rarely been used to any extent before this year, and only a few teams are running it, you are asking a meaningless question.

Based on our knowledge of the NFL, we know that running QBs face more risks than non-running QBs. We can conclude that: Therefore, the read-option contains more risk for running QBs.

[Morneblade]

They can take away Morris; take away the pitch; and force RG3 to keep it and run inside. He will gain yards, but at high risk.

OF, what do you mean by running inside?

[andy614]

I dunno...put a skirt on him? :slap:

[Oldfan]

OF, what do you mean by running inside?

On the option, the QB can take it laterally before he pitches it or keeps it.. I don't mean that one. By inside, I mean the cut in the area vacated when the DE slides inside to take the RB.

[Probos]

I don't see the read-option as the cause of Griffin's injuries.

Atlanta game: scramble

Baltimore game: scramble

Seahawks game: scramble

The bottom line for me is that Griffin needs to improve his awareness and being smarter about protecting himself when he runs.

This is true -- however, continuing the read option increases his chances of injury. They need to minimize the risk as much as possible moving forward.

[Oldfan]

Assuming Robert comes back close to 100%, I can't imagine that Mike Shanahan will be running the same risks with his super-QB that he did this past season. My bet is that we have seen the last of the read-option, but the Pistol is here to stay.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Assuming Robert comes back close to 100%, I can't imagine that Mike Shanahan will be running the same risks with his super-QB that he did this past season. My bet is that we have seen the last of the read-option, but the Pistol is here to stay.

Could be true. If that's the case, I'm OK with it. My "long-term" vision of Griffin is John Elway so I want him to master the traditional Shanahan offense at some point anyway. I just assumed he'd run for longer into his career. Running the offense from the pistol is a cool wrinkle too.

Question for you...are you against any and all designed QB runs? Even the frequency with which they were used in 2011 with Beck/Grossman? That seems like it would be somewhat of an overcompensation since even non-mobile QBs keep the ball a few times per season (by design).

[Probos]

I dunno...put a skirt on him? :slap:

Yeah -- Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees and Ben Roethlisberger should all wear skirts too I guess.