Inside Biz.com-Sources: Sacramento Kings may move to Virginia Beach, arena deal in the works

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Exactly what is wrong with sports. How can anyone believe that the owners of the Kings, who also own a casino, can't scrape together enough cash to build a building on their own?

My understanding is that the Maloofs are legitimately broke. They need to be forced to sell the team.

The Maloof's are like most sports team owners, smart businessmen

There is room for debate there.

---------- Post added August-24th-2012 at 02:48 PM ----------

The article is incorrect on one point... the Hampton Coliseum could serve as a temporary home while a new facility is built.

Everyone realizes that there is 0 chance of this happening, right?

[TD_washingtonredskins]

That is a very recent phenomenom and it is partly tied to the fact that Pitt demolised Pitt Stadium and built a beautiful basketball arena in its place. Pitt has been very good and had a great place to watch games.

At the same time' date=' Pitt football attendance has cratered.

I don't think Pittsburgh is big enough to support four teams. Short of going into some kind of 15-year funk, the Steelers will always sell out. But the Pirates and Penguins typically need to be good to draw fans and even then it's a struggle. Another team dilutes that market.[/quote']

Agreed...Pittsburgh has loud fans (I mean that they run their mouths, I'm not talking about cool crowd noise) and they have a consistent color scheme going (which I admit is actually pretty cool). But they don't have loyal fans. The Pirates never filled arguably the best stadium in the big leagues until that team showed life. The Pens have to be pretty good to get a great following. I would argue that if the Steelers hit a cold streak after their relatively recent resurgence, they'd return to having luke-warm interest (like they did in the 1980s). Adding another team that might not be a powerhouse probably wouldn't work out.

[The Evil Genius]

The Maloofs only own 2% of the Palms now.

They're severely cash strapped (or appear to be) as owners - thus their refusal to pony up any funds for a new arena (which they need in order to spend more money on the team).

Hell, the Maloofs even walked away (reneged) from a recent sweetheart deal in Sacramento that would have funded a large portion of a new arena.

[mcsluggo]

....The Maloof's are like most sports team owners, smart businessmen.....

they are absolute walking idiots that have spent the last 20 years turning an inherited fortune into a black hole. they are dumber than a bag of burning poop.

[tds]

Being a transient town hasn't hurt DC that much.

I don't necessarily like the idea of the team coming into the area, but I could see how it could be pretty successful. The NBA has been able to make a franchise work in Orlando for the past 20 years...

DC transients have money. Hampton Roads transients are navy families who for the most part are barely getting by. I don't think most people in this are make enough money to afford nba tickets and there aren't enough large companies buy corporate sponsorships.

[Going Commando]

How has that logic worked in Charlotte twice now?

Charlotte isn't really a BBall area. You're thinking of Raleigh Durham Chapel Hill, which is a hike from Charlotte and very different in its sort of regional makeup. There's no good college sports around Charlotte. I'm not sure what sports Charlotte is all about.

Kansas and Missouri has good Sports fans. I think HS football and the Panthers is about all Charlotte and the surrounding region care about.

At any rate, the problem with the Bobcats is Michael Jordan. You don't really have to look beyond that.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Charlotte isn't really a BBall area. You're thinking of Raleigh Durham Chapel Hill, which is a hike from Charlotte and very different in its sort of regional makeup. There's no good college sports around Charlotte. I'm not sure what sports Charlotte is all about.

Kansas and Missouri has good Sports fans. I think HS football and the Panthers is about all Charlotte and the surrounding region care about.

At any rate, the problem with the Bobcats is Michael Jordan. You don't really have to look beyond that.

The idea behind putting a team in Charlotte was that NC was BBall crazy and that Charlotte was one of the fastest growing cities in the country with a huge corporate presence. It has failed twice now.

I think Kansas City could work. But I just don't think that you can say "Well, they worship the Jayhawks, so they will spend money to see Tyreke Evans."

[artmonkforHOF]

they are absolute walking idiots that have spent the last 20 years turning an inherited fortune into a black hole. they are dumber than a bag of burning poop.

They might be idiots, but I meant smart in the sense that even they can see there is no way to turn a profit on a new state of the art facility if you build it with your own money. they have also gotten everyone to believe they don't have enough money for a new stadium when what really is happening is they are not getting the stadium deal they want, which includes much more than just a stadium. They want the best sweetheart deal they can find and will do anything to get the deal where they pay as little as possible, but control as many different revenue streams as possible. This usual ends up with the team owning an large entertainment area, or getting a shady "management fee" for some made up reason. The kings will go wherever they get an arena built with control of parking, retail & office space and some other kicker, maybe a casino, theatre or condo development.

They might be stupid enough to overplay their hand with Sacramento (sounds like it might have happened already), but they are smart enough to have at least one other city interested in paying the construction costs for them, which also gives them leverage with Sacramento. Again, they might be too dumb to use that leverage or pull any of this off, but you have to have something going for you if 2 cities have offered to flush $500million down the toilet just so you can move (or keep) your team there.

[Going Commando]

The idea behind putting a team in Charlotte was that NC was BBall crazy and that Charlotte was one of the fastest growing cities in the country with a huge corporate presence. It has failed twice now.

I think Kansas City could work. But I just don't think that you can say "Well' date=' they worship the Jayhawks, so they will spend money to see Tyreke Evans."[/quote']

Not just the Jayhawks though. BBall is big throughout the entire region, including Missouri. Lawrence and Manhattan are both close. St Louis is still in reach. Great sports fans up into Iowa and Nebraska too that you could tap into. Omaha and Des Moines are only three hours away.

A couple of other things, Kansas City has demonstrated they're a loyal sports town with great fans. They love the Chiefs and have been surprisingly steadfast with the Royals and it's got an awesome college style atmosphere at events. Give them a Pro team in their favorite sport and I think they'll come.

And they do have a really nice new arena in the Sprint Center that the Kings could start moving into tomorrow if they wanted.

Also, the Kings have Thomas Robinson. You have to believe a guy like TRob would make the transition really smooth for the fan base.

It makes far too much sense to me. Assuming the Kings MUST move of course.

I still think it's unfortunate Sacramento will probably lose the Kings. They've been great to that team over the years despite having to suffer through some absolutely horrible times.

---------- Post added August-24th-2012 at 07:44 PM ----------

Also meant to say that I don't think putting a basketball team in Charlotte failed because the region is lacking. I think the first Hornets run there would have worked out if the product on the court had been better. Charlotte jerseys and merch was some of the hottest stuff around in the early 90's when it looked like they had something special brewing with young Larry Johnson, Alonzo Mourning, Kendall Gill, & Dell Curry. It flamed out and they never got good again and it probably killed fan interest in the area.

Carolina is great to the Hurricanes, you wouldn't think Hockey would thrive there but it does. And the Panthers are already firmly entrenched after just fifteen years or so. Pro sports work in the region if the organization is good. NBA basketball could work in Carolina if the organization wasn't historically awful.

Could a franchise survive anywhere with that level of incompetence in the FO?

[RichmondRedskin88]

You do realize that VCU has about a million students from the 757 right? Half of that school's student body is from Nova, the other half from Hampton Roads.

Minor league rivalries are petty and definitely wouldn't keep Virginians from getting behind a VA pro team. It's a whole different story. I couldn't tell you one single player's name that plays for any HR or Richmond minor league team and I bet that's true for 98% of the people living in both metro areas. The NBA is a national game with international celebrities. Richmonders wouldn't avoid following an entertaining HR NBA team because they're still pissed about what happened in some minor league hockey game years ago.

Also, you know VCU is leaving the CAA for the A-10 right?

Of course I know they are leaving. I'm a season ticket holder and alum. Note those ones from Norfolk wanted to get out of there. Same goes for the Nova ones. You got your numbers wrong sir. 60% is from Nova. The other 40% is made up of Richmond and Norfolk people (I'd say more Richmond folk though). This is far beyond a past hockey game. Richmond will not support a Norfolk team. Besides the fact that this area supports mainly DC teams Richmond has no interest in any Norfolk teams. Richmonders don't care they can't name all the players because they just care about the team. Will every Squirrels fan be able to name each player. No, but the fact is they will still show up constantly at games. Why? Loyalty. Richmonders have grown to appreciate minor league teams especially after the Braves ditched us and then trashed the Richmond folk in the press conference. Richmond fans are not like NBA folk at all. Richmond fans are family oriented in general. The kids get to meet players and form a role model link with them at the minor level. They wouldn't get that with the NBA and celebrities. NBA crowds are generally wealthy people who are there with a acquaintance or something. It's not a family oriented league.

[bushwack]

Unfortunately I don't see our area ever getting a Major League professional team in any sport. Basketball would be the sport that makes the most sense; however, there's one major setback for this area which no one has mentioned yet. The drawback is revenue sharing within the cities. The city of Va Beach would want help from the surrounding cities, Norfolk, Chesapeake, Portsmouth, Suffolk, Hampton, & Newport News to help finance to build a new stadium; however, Va Beach isn't going to be willing to share the revenue that will be generated by the Kings or any other professional team. The same goes for any of the other six cities, they will want help to build a new stadium/arena, but won't want to share the profits.

Another large obstacle to overcome which I did see mentioned earlier is traffic. With the HRBT, M&M, JRB, Midtown Tunnel, & Downtown Tunnel traffic is already horrendous on most weekdays and even bad on some weekends. I hate to think how bad the traffic would be on a game day if the Heat, Thunder, Lakers, Celtics, etc...were coming to town. The HRBT would be even more at a standstill, and then the overflow traffic would slow down the M&M and Downtown Tunnel.

While it would be nice to see this area get a major league team, I just don't see it working from a financial or logistic point of view.

[pjfootballer]

Let Charlotte get the Hornets name back and I suspect attendance will go up. I know it sounds stupid, but alot of people hate the name Bobcats around here since their 1st owner was named Bob. And Jordan is as horrible as an owner as he was a GM.

[lovetoaster]

Also meant to say that I don't think putting a basketball team in Charlotte failed because the region is lacking. I think the first Hornets run there would have worked out if the product on the court had been better.

...

It flamed out and they never got good again and it probably killed fan interest in the area.

...

NBA basketball could work in Carolina if the organization wasn't historically awful.

Huh? The product on the court was not the problem. The Hornets made the playoffs in six of the last eight seasons that they were in Charlotte, reaching the second round of the playoffs in the last two years. There were obviosly some lean years at the beginning of the franchise, but they made the playoffs in seven of their last ten seasons in Charlotte.

The problem was the owner, George Shinn, that would not pay the players what they were worth, was involved in a nasty rape accusation and was constantly demanding more money for the taxpayers. All of this turned what was a fiercely loyal fanbase against him and people stopped coming and got turned off to the NBA in general. A lot of people here still hold that against the Charlotte franchise, even though Shinn and the original franchise have been gone for a decade. It really was a nasty situation.

A little insight from Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlotte_Hornets_(NBA)

While the Hornets continued to put a competitive team on the court, the team's attendance fell dramatically, in large part because Shinn had become a pariah in the city. In 1997, a Charlotte woman claimed that Shinn had raped her, and the resulting trial severely tarnished his reputation in the city. The consensus was that while Charlotte was as basketball-crazy as ever, fans took out their anger at Shinn on the team. Shinn had also become discontented with the Coliseum. Although it had been considered state-of-the-art when it opened, it was now considered obsolete due to a limited number of luxury boxes. On March 26, 2001, both the Hornets and the Vancouver Grizzlies applied for relocation to Memphis, Tennessee. The Grizzlies would eventually get the move. Eventually, Shinn issued an ultimatum: unless the city built a new arena at no cost to him, the Hornets would leave town."

The league heavily considered making Shinn sell the team, but fearing that would set a bad precedent, they allowed them to move to New Orleans.

Now, Bob Johnson certainly did not help the situation when Charlotte was awarded another franchise. There was excitement in the city, but the franchise was run so poorly and cheaply and the product was so bad that it killed any momentum. So there was nothing wrong with the on-court product the first time around, it was abysmal ownership. The second time around, it has been both.

[Skin'emAlive]

Fascinating story. I had no idea that was what killed basketball in Charlotte!

[pjfootballer]

With Benson announcing he wants a new name for New Orleans basketball team, there has been significant "BUZZ" here in Charlotte about getting the Hornets name back. People around here still wear Hornets gear. It's like some of us with the Bullets. I have 2 Bullets authentics and refuse to get Wizards gear. If I went back to DC for a game, I'd wear my Bullets gear.

[lovetoaster]

Fascinating story. I had no idea that was what killed basketball in Charlotte!

Yeah, it really is an interesting story. I am fairly certain that if George Shinn was not the owner of the original Hornets, they would still be in Charlotte and doing well. So many things happened the first time around that alienated so many people in the area.

[TheLongshot]

Unfortunately I don't see our area ever getting a Major League professional team in any sport. Basketball would be the sport that makes the most sense; however, there's one major setback for this area which no one has mentioned yet. The drawback is revenue sharing within the cities. The city of Va Beach would want help from the surrounding cities, Norfolk, Chesapeake, Portsmouth, Suffolk, Hampton, & Newport News to help finance to build a new stadium; however, Va Beach isn't going to be willing to share the revenue that will be generated by the Kings or any other professional team. The same goes for any of the other six cities, they will want help to build a new stadium/arena, but won't want to share the profits.

Yeah, that is a big problem with that area, with each of those cities (which are like counties in most states) having their own revenue stream. If the area was like Fairfax County (Where only the city of Fairfax is their own zone) it would be easier. When I lived there in the early 80s, it was very strange to have all these small regions rather than one big county containing them all.

[mcsluggo]

Yeah, it really is an interesting story. I am fairly certain that if the Maloof family was not the owner of the Sacramento Knigs, they would still be in Sacromento and doing well. They suck donkey testicles.

i fixed that post for you...

[lovetoaster]

i fixed that post for you...

Agreed, I thought about making that parallel earlier. Really passionate fan bases that have had their interest systematically destroyed by abysmal ownership. I will give Sacramento this, a lot of the people in Sacramento are still passionate about the Kings. It seemed like most of the people in Charlotte did not care that much after being being kicked in the junk by Shinn time and time again.

[Going Commando]

Sacramento doesn't deserve to lose their team. It'd be nice if there was some way to force the ownership to sell if they were demonstrably incompetent and shady. It'd be a shame if the Kings moved.

And I'm not sure I'd want to support a team with ownership like that even if they came to my doorstep.

[mcsluggo]

Sacramento doesn't deserve to lose their team. It'd be nice if there was some way to force the ownership to sell if they were demonstrably incompetent and shady. It'd be a shame if the Kings moved.

And I'm not sure I'd want to support a team with ownership like that even if they came to my doorstep.

the self-protecting blindness we afford ourselves in order to survive...

((such as makin THIS statement on a website owned by the Snyder Group Ltd....))

[The Evil Genius]

Sorry, but comparing Snyder to the Maloofs is insane.

No one ever will say that Snyder won't spend to make the Skins better. Or FedEx field better (again, spending - not actual results).

[mcsluggo]

Snyder is no dummy, and he isn't broke (or pretending to be, whichever the case may be with the Maloofs)... but he also isn't particularly easy to roor for!

[The Evil Genius]

Snyder is no dummy, and he isn't broke (or pretending to be, whichever the case may be with the Maloofs)... but he also isn't particularly easy to roor for!

Maybe he should buy a casino, start a playboy theme nightclub, & surround himself with d-list actresses.

[mcsluggo]

hey... i already conceded that the Maloofs were quite probably the worst owners in all of sports.

Snyder just also isn't a prince charming.

fortunately i get to enjoy BOTH (the Kings and the skins are "my" two teams... sigh )