President Barack Obama/Vice-President Joe Biden Re-elected to 2nd Term Thread

[twa]

Strange that Rep governors are seeing jobs created,and if it was not for them the employment numbers would truly be abysmal

Choices MATTER

http://dailycaller.com/2012/06/14/republican-governors-statehouses-linked-to-job-creation-more-than-democrats/

Republican governors and GOP-controlled state legislatures presided over 16 percent more job creation than their Democratic counterparts from January 2010 to April 2012, according to a Daily Caller analysis of Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) employment data.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/06/14/republican-governors-statehouses-linked-to-job-creation-more-than-democrats/#ixzz20kvA9ZbO

[GSF]

So CNN said it so it's the truth

What percentage of Americans do you think have any clue how much the Bush tax cuts save them in their wallets. I don't want to be smug....honestly.

Americans aren't segregating their "tax cuts" into piles of envelopes for expenses, they are trying to get by. That concept is ludicrous.

Americans are trying to pay their bills with what they get in their paycheck and tax returns. They aren't saying, wait this is tax cut money, lets use it to pay down a credit card.

Actually when the tax cuts first came into existence, Americans were very aware of how much extra money they had. I know I knew exactly how much extra money I had. The Republicans were banking on this, and that people would pump that money back into the economy. It didn't happen. Of course now that 10 years have gone by, what you say is true, it doesn't feel like extra money anymore, but it sure did back then.

The CNN piece I'm talking about was with Fareed Zakaria. I think he's actually prettu fair. At least CNN will try to give both sides a chance to make their case, something that can't be said about Fox or MSNBC.

BTW, I'm not arguing that ending all of the Bush tax cuts now would fix the economy. My point was that the tax cuts are a big part of the reason why we're in so much debt.

[chipwhich]

BTW, I'm not arguing that ending all of the Bush tax cuts now would fix the economy. My point was that the tax cuts are a big part of the reason why we're in so much debt.

We are in debt for a lot of reasons, the tax policy isn't in the top 5.

[Hersh]

I get so tired of the excuse' it is someone elses fault'....It is called leadership,and if you can't do it you are toast.....and deservedly so

in a perfect world has never existed,nor a perfect people

This is an absolutely absurd statement. The Democrats passed a Republican idea of health care reform against the will of Republicans. Now, unless Obama does exactly what an uncompromising House wants to do, they won't pass anything the President wants. To suggest this is a Presidential leadership problem is a giant lie. One party and only one party has been uncompromising and has not wanted to work with this President on anything.

---------- Post added July-16th-2012 at 04:27 AM ----------

We are in debt for a lot of reasons, the tax policy isn't in the top 5.

According to whom?

[GSF]

We are in debt for a lot of reasons, the tax policy isn't in the top 5.

Actually it's in the top 2, along with the wars of the 2000s.

[twa]

Hersh...leadership is getting people to do what needs done,not issuing orders

to suggest otherwise is what is absurd

[chipwhich]

According to whom?

Well if you have a recommendation of why we are in debt, please list your top 5 reasons

You blaming it on taxation?

---------- Post added July-16th-2012 at 12:33 AM ----------

Actually it's in the top 2, along with the wars of the 2000s.

Well there you admitted it, you think our economy sucks because of our tax policy. Why did you deny it earlier?

[Hersh]

Hersh...leadership is getting people to do what needs done,not issuing orders

to suggest otherwise is what is absurd

So you are saying that President Obama should be able to get the House of Republicans to pass jobs bills and that nothing has been done because the President can't get Republicans on board? If so, you really have no understanding your party.

[GSF]

Hey Chipwhich, how about stop talking in circles and offer up some substance. I've said many times, I don't believe the tax cuts caused the economy to "suck" as you put it. I said the tax cuts are 1 of the big reasons why we are currently in debt. I'm not sure why you can't differentiate the 2.

You said the tax cuts were not in the top 5 reasons we are in debt. What are your top 5?

[twa]

If you can't get them on board you need to change the offering obviously

[Hersh]

Well if you have a recommendation of why we are in debt, please list your top 5 reasons

You blaming it on taxation?

---------- Post added July-16th-2012 at 12:33 AM ----------

Well there you admitted it, you think our economy sucks because of our tax policy. Why did you deny it earlier?

No particular order.

1. Can't have guns and butter at the same time. Gotta pay for the guns and we didn't.

2. Not having a pay as you go system in congress. Example: didn't pay for Medicare Part D

3. The inability to address the costs of health care services.

4. The American Public

5. Sorta with number 1, defense spending

---------- Post added July-16th-2012 at 04:46 AM ----------

If you can't get them on board you need to change the offering obviously

So he should offer only exactly what they want? Maybe he can offer something along the lines he did in health care like an individual mandate. As I said earlier, that completely REPUBLICAN idea.

[GSF]

If you can't get them on board you need to change the offering obviously

I do believe you make a good point, however the republicans in congress made a vow from day 1 to do whatever it took to get Obama out of office. Many of Obama's offerings have often been to the right of what true liberals want. It doesn't matter what Obama offers up b/c The Reps aren't going to work with him on anything.

[chipwhich]

Hey Chipwhich, how about stop talking in circles and offer up some substance. I've said many times, I don't believe the tax cuts caused the economy to "suck" as you put it. I said the tax cuts are 1 of the big reasons why we are currently in debt. I'm not sure why you can't differentiate the 2.

You said the tax cuts were not in the top 5 reasons we are in debt. What are your top 5?

The wars

9/11

The housing crisis

The banking crisis

Unemployment

That's my top 5. Taxation isn't in them.

[GSF]

No particular order.

1. Can't have guns and butter at the same time. Gotta pay for the guns and we didn't.

Bingo! We have a winner. Goodnight guys. I will have to continue this debate another day.

---------- Post added July-16th-2012 at 04:52 AM ----------

The wars

9/11

The housing crisis

The banking crisis

Unemployment

That's my top 5. Taxation isn't in them.

That list better describes causes for recession, not our debt situation.

[chipwhich]

That list better describes causes for recession, not our debt situation.

same thing

[mistertim]

So he should offer only exactly what they want? Maybe he can offer something along the lines he did in health care like an individual mandate. As I said earlier, that completely REPUBLICAN idea.

As far as I can tell that is essentially what the Republicans see as "compromise": "You do exactly what we want and we'll call it good". Apparently if Obama were a "real leader" he would simply go along with whatever they say.

[Hersh]

The wars

9/11

The housing crisis

The banking crisis

Unemployment

That's my top 5. Taxation isn't in them.

While some of these certainly exacerbated the situation the problem with some of those is that they occurred after the debt was already around 9 trillion. Agreed on the wars and not paying for the wars is one really bothers me as much as anything.

[twa]

Many of Obama's offerings have often been to the right of what true liberals want. It doesn't matter what Obama offers up b/c The Reps aren't going to work with him on anything.

Those two sentences are in conflict,and the assertion Reps would deny themselves to harm him foolish except on the margins

It does illustrate my point though

mistertim....most people on the Hill would settle in a heartbeat....and have throughout our history

Mr I Won is simply incapable of the game at that level

I can damn well guarantee Hillary could have lead despite opposition

add

http://hotair.com/archives/2012/07/15/is-it-any-wonder-that-washington-feels-as-broken-as-it-did-four-years-ago/

In a taped interview that aired on CBS Sunday Morning, he told Charlie Rose:

Washington feels as broken as it did four years ago. And you know, if you ask me what is the one thing that has frustrated me most over the last four years, it is not the hard work. It is not, you know, the enormity [sic] of the decisions. It is not the pace. It is that I haven’t been able to change the atmosphere here in Washington to reflect the decency … and common sense of ordinary people—Democrats, Republicans and independents who I think just want to see their leadership solve problems. And, you know, there is enough blame to go around for that.

When Rose asked Obama if he was on the list of those deserving some of the shared blame, he responded: “I think there is no doubt that I underestimated the degree to which in this town politics trumps problem solving.” Short answer: No.

[deejaydana]

Obama's lastest gem:

"If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen."

I understand the sentiment but this is another quote Romney should use to bury Obama. Surely Obama is telling the masses that nothing happens w/o the gov't helping along the way (at least that's what I take from this) BUT this quote comes off to me as being from a President who has no understanding or concern of small businesses.

[Predicto]

Obama's lastest gem:

"If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen."

.

Yeah, once again context matters.

Obama said-

We’ve already made a trillion dollars’ worth of cuts. We can make some more cuts in programs that don’t work, and make government work more efficiently…We can make another trillion or trillion-two, and what we then do is ask for the wealthy to pay a little bit more…

There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me, because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there.

If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business. you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.

The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together. There are some things, just like fighting fires, we don’t do on our own. I mean, imagine if everybody had their own fire service. That would be a hard way to organize fighting fires.

So we say to ourselves, ever since the founding of this country, you know what, there are some things we do better together. That’s how we funded the GI Bill. That’s how we created the middle class. That’s how we built the Golden Gate Bridge or the Hoover Dam. That’s how we invented the Internet. That’s how we sent a man to the moon. We rise or fall together as one nation and as one people, and that’s the reason I’m running for President — because I still believe in that idea. You’re not on your own, we’re in this together.”

Not remotely an insult toward small business owners, of course. What he said - his exact words - were: "Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business. you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen."

It requires lying to yourself to say that Obama just said: "small business owners didn't build their businesses." He said "business owners didn't build the roads and bridges."

I understand the sentiment but this is another quote Romney should use to bury Obama. Surely Obama is telling the masses that nothing happens w/o the gov't helping along the way (at least that's what I take from this)

You wouldn't have to make a guess at what Obama meant if you actually read what Obama said before reading a blog taking one sentence out of context and then rushing to the Tailgate to post what you thought was a major gaffe.

BUT this quote comes off to me as being from a President who has no understanding or concern of small businesses

That's because that is what you want it to mean. Even though he didn't say what you think he must have said.

[sacase]

Obama's lastest gem:

"If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen."

I understand the sentiment but this is another quote Romney should use to bury Obama. Surely Obama is telling the masses that nothing happens w/o the gov't helping along the way (at least that's what I take from this) BUT this quote comes off to me as being from a President who has no understanding or concern of small businesses.

That quote is so bad it could come out of Atlas Shrugged. When you read more of what he said he was basically saying these millionaires could not get where they are without the little guy. You are just as important as they are with their factory.

[deejaydana]

Yeah, once again context matters.

Not remotely an insult toward small business owners, of course. What he said was "Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business. you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen."

It requires lying to yourself to say that Obama just said: "small business owners didn't build their businesses." He said "business owners didn't build the roads and bridges."

But I suspect you are correct, some people will be screaming about this as though the first sentence wasnt there.

Well I've seen plenty of small business owners already complaining about the quote. I understand he's trying to sell us on more and more gov't. It's his stance. Government workers will celebrate that stance. It's just who he is, he can't understand or comprehend the toils of owning a business because he's never been there. And of course context is important but it's not like all the preceeding words are doing anything to celebrate the actual risk takers in our society. Just my take. I figured the Obama thread was being neglected today ;-D

[mistertim]

That quote is so bad it could come out of Atlas Shrugged. When you read more of what he said he was basically saying these millionaires could not get where they are without the little guy. You are just as important as they are with their factory.

And you disagree? You think the person who owns the factory would be where they are without workers, without having an education growing up, without roads to transport their products, without police to ensure that nobody comes and steals their products or property, without any of a huge number of things that they didn't, and couldn't, provide for themselves?

[Predicto]

Well I've seen plenty of small business owners already complaining about the quote. I understand he's trying to sell us on more and more gov't. It's his stance. Government workers will celebrate that stance. It's just who he is, he can't understand or comprehend the toils of owning a business because he's never been there.

Of course they are complaining. They don't know what Obama actually said any more than you did. They just read the Fox or Breitbart misquote, same as you, and they are running with it - same as you did.

That's 4 times in one day you have been fooled now. Isn't it starting to bug you?

[Teller]

And you disagree? You think the person who owns the factory would be where they are without workers, without having an education growing up, without roads to transport their products, without police to ensure that nobody comes and steals their products or property, without any of a huge number of things that they didn't, and couldn't, provide for themselves?

Where does the money for education, roads, police, etc, etc come from? It's not like these business are getting a handout.