In The Barrel Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 If they only look good while playing with him, does that make him the best QB coach, or does that make him really good at scheming? As a Packers fan you should know better than anyone - Farvvvvrrrre always said Fat Andy was a great help to him getting over the SB hump, which I am sure made you very happy. If only he could master time outs and challenges and run ratio and the Eagles could have a chance maybe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 As a Packers fan you should know better than anyone - Farvvvvrrrre always said Fat Andy was a great help to him getting over the SB hump, which I am sure made you very happy. If only he could master time outs and challenges and run ratio and the Eagles could have a chance maybe Actually, I was just starting my GB fandom in their super bowl era. I think it was in the super bowl they lost to the Broncos that I became a Packers fan (I was young and impressionable and wanted to see them make a comeback). So yes, Andy Reid did work with Favre, but since I've didn't start truly understanding the game until after then, so I can't make any judgments on the effect he had. Anyways, I'm not saying that he's not a good QB coach, I'm just throwing out an alternate possibility. I do have to agree with you on the run ratio, I think if he could figure out that he needs to run the ball more often it would go a long ways. McCarthy kept running the ball last year despite an ineffective run game because his philosophy was that its not what you do on the ground that matters, but rather the run/pass ratio because that's what keeps the defense honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger187126 Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 Keep in mind that McNabb did all this with his team pouding the ball at 6.1 yards per attempt with perfect San Diego weather, You can't get better passing conditions than that. two words: cardiovascular endurance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 ^^^^ How the hell is he going to puke all over the field wearing that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexx1240 Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 That is precisely what every single sports fan does after every game they watch.---------- Post added September-12th-2011 at 01:17 PM ---------- Thank you :applause:...as Skins fans we endured about 9 months of ridicule and criticism aimed at our team and our coach by both the media and McNabb and his agent. I think 24 hours of "returning the favor" isn't much to ask lol ... Exactly. But I will be returning the favor for a whole week (or possibly more) til McNabb can show that he's an elite QB in this league as some perceive him to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 I see things differently. 1- if Shanahan had been honest and just told the press "we aren't happy with his performance at QB and we're going with Rex" much of the side show would have been averted. The whole conditioning, phantom injury, and knowledge of the offense evolving story line was a soap opera the media loved to talk about. If your QB is playing poorly bench his ass for that and man up about it. sure, things could have been handled differently in retrospect, but i hardly slam shanahan for not saying 'our QB is a stubborn idiot who's too dim to learn the playbook'. in fact, he got a draft pick back that nobody seemed convinced we would get that may not have been possible had he been 'honest'. i dont get the whole 'head coach needs to tell us whats going on all the time thing' anyway. team comes first, not the media (or fans) nosy interest. 2- if it wasn't for Kurt Warner I'd be more convinced he's entirely overrated. He looked bad in New York and then magically returned to his amazing self in Arizona. Mcnabb got a lot done with garbage wide outs. I don't know if he's entirely overrated or only works in one system but whatever it is he looks finished in the NFL. 39 yards is unacceptable for a 3rd string QB. i defended mcnabb against those that said he was overrated. i dont know if he was or not, but it is apparent that he didnt want to hear what the shanahans were teaching. he should do better in minnesota if the 'system' is similar to what he ran in philly, and the coach doesnt try to teach him new things. 3- His PR stunts were half of an entirely mishandled situation. Bottom line is he should never have been a redskin. We could have Grossman and Colt McCoy (a younger better John Beck) and still have a 3rd rounder if we didn't trade for Donovan. He had his agent fight his OC in the media and frankly both should know better. we shouldnt have traded for him, no doubt. i dont know what kyle did as far as dissing mcnabb in the media- what are you referring to? i still look at his behavior- all the stuff thats already been covered- and how he did dick for this team by his actions (or lack thereof when it came to learning, listening and playing well) and i see people basically letting him off the hook while somehow blaming shanahan for his bad play, and i just dont get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paloosa Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Did you see the latest on NFL network from Lombardi giving McNabb a pass saying that it was a team effort and not entirely McNabb's fault. Why is it now they are giving McNabb a free pass when he is a Viking but they couldn't do that when he was here? I seems that when you leave Washington that all the past failures are forgiven and they get a free pass for the mistakes that they do now. It seems that the preception is that all the problems are with the organization and not the players like Haynesworth and McNabb. Haynesworth doesn't practice and plays in a game but it is ok and McNabb throws for 39 yards in a game and it is a team failure. I see the logic in that, Don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mursilis Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 If they only look good while playing with him, does that make him the best QB coach, or does that make him really good at scheming? Isn't that the same thing? A coach's job is to maximize the talent available to him. The story on Joe Gibbs is, when he first came here from San Diego, he wanted to install the high-flying passing attack the Chargers had, but after starting 0-5, he went to the run-oriented smashmouth style that got the 'skins to the Super Bowl the next season. A good coach looks at the players he has, and adapts his schemes to get the most out of what those players do best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss_Hogg Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 The classiest 39 yards, 1 INT I've ever seen. :applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouvan59 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Isn't that the same thing? A coach's job is to maximize the talent available to him. The story on Joe Gibbs is, when he first came here from San Diego, he wanted to install the high-flying passing attack the Chargers had, but after starting 0-5, he went to the run-oriented smashmouth style that got the 'skins to the Super Bowl the next season. A good coach looks at the players he has, and adapts his schemes to get the most out of what those players do best. A good coach also plays the players that give his team the best chance to win. This is the Washington Redskins, not the McNabb Redskins. McNabb's failures had nothing to do with the fact that he couldn't physically run the offense. McNabb's failings were because he wouldn't mentally commit to it. He couldn't even get the team in the right formations. This whole line of thinking that the offense didn't "fit" McNabb is a load of rubbish. The offense should have been perfect for him. Except for the whole worm-burner thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Isn't that the same thing? A coach's job is to maximize the talent available to him. The story on Joe Gibbs is, when he first came here from San Diego, he wanted to install the high-flying passing attack the Chargers had, but after starting 0-5, he went to the run-oriented smashmouth style that got the 'skins to the Super Bowl the next season. A good coach looks at the players he has, and adapts his schemes to get the most out of what those players do best. not the same thing. A good coach adapts a system to his personnel, but he also develops them; teaches them how to become better players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bird_1972 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Over a full season that translates to: 640 att, 364 comp, 4,580 yds, 36 TD, 16 Int. McNabb extrapolated out to 16 games: 581 att, 338 comp, 4,156 yds, 17 TD, 18 Int For comparison's sake: Brady (2010): 16 games, 492 att, 324 comp, 3900 yds, 36 TD, 4 Int P.Manning (2010): 16 games, 679 att, 450 comp, 4700 yds, 33 TD, 17 Int A. Rodgers (2010): 15 games, 475 att, 312 comp, 3922 yds, 28 TD, 11 Int Our full season extrapolated numbers without Donovan (ie, with Grossman) look pretty damn good when compared with the elite QBs in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I seem to remember Joey T saying that the Redskins actually led the NFL in offense those first five games that season; they just couldn't win any games, and he threw a crap ton of picks. We went to the more run heavy style to basically save Joe from himself while he learned the offense, and to manage the game and keep our defense off the field. When Joe won the MVP a couple seasons later, he didn't do it buy playing ball control and running the ball. He was slinging it EVERYWHERE, just like Mark Rypien would during the Super Bowl run. So we were just as pass happy as Joe wanted to be later, we just ran the ball a bit more. And for all the talk of Gibbs 1 adapting, when Gibbs came back for his second run, he didn't really adapt his system for the modern day NFL. I seem to remember that Kyle did his best, trying to adapt his system for McNabb. He tried to change the progression of McNabb's reads from high to low, to low to high like McNabb did in Philly. He added the screens and the checkdowns and all that McNabb wanted, but McNabb couldn't run the offense at a fundamental level. And he didn't want to. I think the majority of his time here, he was still butthurt that Philly had released him. He didn't want to put the time or the effort in to get the system down. As Mike said, McNabb needed to work on the little things. His footwork was God awful. His overall mechanics sucked. His accuracy is dubious. But for all the talk of him being a class act and a hard worker and all that stuff, he never committed and bought in. And Kyle could only do so much with a guy who didn't want to run his system or work hard to perfect it. You can only adapt your system to the player if the player is willing to change the way he does things too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 two words:cardiovascular endurance That is a classic!! Did you see the latest on NFL network from Lombardi giving McNabb a pass saying that it was a team effort and not entirely McNabb's fault. Why is it now they are giving McNabb a free pass when he is a Viking but they couldn't do that when he was here? I seems that when you leave Washington that all the past failures are forgiven and they get a free pass for the mistakes that they do now. It seems that the preception is that all the problems are with the organization and not the players like Haynesworth and McNabb. Haynesworth doesn't practice and plays in a game but it is ok and McNabb throws for 39 yards in a game and it is a team failure. I see the logic in that, Don't you? Didn't you know? The media doesn't hate us. It's a conspiracy according to some. Isn't that the same thing? A coach's job is to maximize the talent available to him. The story on Joe Gibbs is, when he first came here from San Diego, he wanted to install the high-flying passing attack the Chargers had, but after starting 0-5, he went to the run-oriented smashmouth style that got the 'skins to the Super Bowl the next season. A good coach looks at the players he has, and adapts his schemes to get the most out of what those players do best. We led the NFL in offense thos first 5 games, but we were 0-5. Gibbs figured he needed to give the defense a breath. Like the Chargers/Fouts, we were scoring too fast and the defense was not able to keep up. Most Coryell teams had terrible defenses and that's why they never won the SB. In 1983 we scored a record 541 points with a high flying offense. The Posse (Monk, Clark and Sanders) would have season of 1000 apiece. In 1991 we again led the league in points scored and went on to win a SB. Gibbs was not as "ground chuck" as the history would perceive him to be. Usually we would come out flying, put up a bunch of points, get a big lead, then the "Riggo Drill" would start around the end of the 3rd quarter. Then we would wear down their defense and salt the game away. Alot of time, Riggins would gain most of his yards in the 4th quarted after we battered them with him for 3 quarters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Indecisive Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 and I made the mistake of picking up McNabb as my backup QB in my Fantasy league..... traded for Fitzpatrick the moment McNabb started throwing the ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xero21 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Shanahan also traded a 2nd round pick for him. Hopefully we won't be going through any more trades like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouvan59 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 We led the NFL in offense thos first 5 games, but we were 0-5. Gibbs figured he needed to give the defense a breath. Like the Chargers/Fouts, we were scoring too fast and the defense was not able to keep up. Most Coryell teams had terrible defenses and that's why they never won the SB. In 1983 we scored a record 541 points with a high flying offense. The Posse (Monk, Clark and Sanders) would have season of 1000 apiece. In 1991 we again led the league in points scored and went on to win a SB. Gibbs was not as "ground chuck" as the history would perceive him to be. Usually we would come out flying, put up a bunch of points, get a big lead, then the "Riggo Drill" would start around the end of the 3rd quarter. Then we would wear down their defense and salt the game away. Alot of time, Riggins would gain most of his yards in the 4th quarted after we battered them with him for 3 quarters. It was actually more that we were turning the ball over like nobody's business the first five games. Extrapolated the first five games over a full season we would have had the #4 offense and the #1 defense by yards. Scoring defense-wise however we were the second worst. Ironically once we changed offenses our scoring defense got much better and our YPG allowed went way up. So our yardage on offense went down but the scoring went up and our yardage on defense went up and our scoring against went down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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