Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Sure that's possible to happen, but if everyone in the country realized that abortion laws changed then the outcome would be determined by the two people involved. I wouldn't think that as men you and I could always react the same way to every situation. And your suggesting its a good idea for a married woman to go have an abortion without talking to her husband first? Really why would that be good at all? Only case I can see is she was steppin out on him and posted up on the wrong guy which is an issue all by itself altogether or that the marriage is toast and shes keeping stuff from him. Again not a good situation imo Maybe the woman was having an affair. Maybe the woman is thinking about leaving. Maybe the woman wasn't planning this and just doesn't want to start a family yet. None of these are good things. It is very difficult for me to think of a situation where an abortion is ever a "good" thing. It would obviously be better if the woman and her husband communicated about this, but I certainly don't think the state should be compelling couples to have terrible conversations that they did not wish to have. And I certainly don't think the state should be involved in making exceptions to doctor-patient confidentiality. Do you think doctors should be forced to contact husbands if they are treating that husband's wife for an STD? ---------- Post added June-8th-2011 at 12:28 PM ---------- He asks her. If she lies and its later discovered that she lied then she gets punished for lying. What is your recommended punishment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Do you think doctors should be forced to contact husbands if they are treating that husband's wife for an STD? What is your recommended punishment? Yes a husband should be notified if it is communicable As for aborting a child the husband wants...a fine is in order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Yes a husband should be notified if it is communicableAs for aborting a child the husband wants...a fine is in order I assume the reverse is true as well then. How much of a fine? And how does this work in a community property state, like Texas. I easily see a situation where a housewife is drawing from a marital savings account to pay a fine in which the husband who earned the money to pay the fine is the only victim. I mean, would you insist that your wife be fined which then reduces the value of the marital estate that you will then be splitting after the presumed divorce? What am I saying is: How does addicted's reporting system benefit anyone? You are eroding doctor/patient confidentiality, eroding a right to privacy, almost certainly causing a divorce, possibly creating a situation where domestic violence is likely, and ultimately punishing the "victim" via the enforcement mechanism. The only solution I see is somehow subtracting the wife's share of the marital estate, but that would create a policy whereby the state is almost forcing a couple to divorce. (By the way, this law could only be a federal law. And that means that the federal government would be getting directly involved in regulating marriages - which even the most liberal of liberals sees as an area reserved to the states). PS I also give credit to addicted for at least attempting to think about the real-world ramifications of the suggestions here. I just wonder if he wants to create a policy that actually says to a woman, "Get married and lose control of your body." Again, that seems to be a strange public policy as it would almost certainly discourage marriage and encourage co-habitation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Edit...I want to apologize to anyone offended by my thoughts on this for anything I could have said to make it sound as if I was anti woman, anti abortion, or anything. I am not any of these things. I've thought a lot about this issue, and think the compromise here is to separate married and single women's rights on this issue. I respect any woman's decision to have or not have an abortion but I don't think that my feelings extend to married women the same as a single woman. If a married woman wants to have an abortion I think the husband should have say in that, if the woman is single then I see the crowd that says its her body to do what she wants with it. Maybe something like this would end the debate but guess not. Sorry if anyone got upset or the wrong idea about me You don't need to apologize. I don't agree with what you are saying, but you are being thoughtful about the issue and wrestling with it sincerely, something that we all should aspire to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I assume the reverse is true as well then.How much of a fine? And how does this work in a community property state' date=' like Texas. I easily see a situation where a housewife is drawing from a marital savings account to pay a fine in which the husband who earned the money to pay the fine is the only victim. I mean, would you insist that your wife be fined which then reduces the value of the marital estate that you will then be splitting after the presumed divorce? What am I saying is: How does addicted's reporting system benefit anyone?[/quote'] In the case of divorce it should be taken from her split to recompense the loss In cases w/o divorce ....court mandated blowjobs to work off the debt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 In cases w/o divorce ....court mandated blowjobs to work off the debt That fits into the overall tone of this thread, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 That fits into the overall tone of this thread' date=' I guess.[/quote']Demanding a blow job from an angry spouse and you'll probably get what you deserve, if not what you're hoping for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Demanding a blow job from an angry spouse and you'll probably get what you deserve, if not what you're hoping for. I enjoyed World According to Garp too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renaissance Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I have a sneaky suspicion that a lot of people are confusing the concepts of "child support" and "alimony." I have a sneaky suspicion most people commenting have only ever seen/heard one side of the story. How about all those moms who have to support a kid completely on their own bc the "father" doesn't do anything but show up at the kid's graduation to give them 100 bucks? Or all those fathers who fight tooth and nail and actually get full custody of their kids? I have seen both in my own family and to act like the mom who gets some dead-end, low-paying job so she can live off of child support payments is the norm is a complete joke. And did someone in here seriously suggest fining a woman who gets an abortion against the father's will??? If you don't want your girl to get an abortion, don't knock her up. It's as simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Maybe the woman was having an affair. Maybe the woman is thinking about leaving. Maybe the woman wasn't planning this and just doesn't want to start a family yet.None of these are good things. It is very difficult for me to think of a situation where an abortion is ever a "good" thing. It would obviously be better if the woman and her husband communicated about this' date=' but I certainly don't think the state should be compelling couples to have terrible conversations that they did not wish to have.[/quote'] To me the states tell us about sexual education when we are kids but you don't think that the state should push married adults to talk about an abortion? I don't think the reverse of "turn a blinds eye" is the answer to either of these issues. I'm not suggesting anything more then a phone call. Kinda the same way a therapist is forced to call someone if they think they are in danger because of something they were told. Nothing more or less, just legally obligated to make a phone call. And I certainly don't think the state should be involved in making exceptions to doctor-patient confidentiality.Do you think doctors should be forced to contact husbands if they are treating that husband's wife for an STD? No because this isn't the same thing. I don't advocate the Dr playing Dr Phil type games with people like this. What is your recommended punishment? Same thing that someone could get if they lied in court and were caught. Its legally falsifying information and should be handled as such. ---------- Post added June-8th-2011 at 01:59 PM ---------- I also give credit to addicted for at least attempting to think about the real-world ramifications of the suggestions here. I just wonder if he wants to create a policy that actually says to a woman' date=' "Get married and lose control of your body." Again, that seems to be a strange public policy as it would almost certainly discourage marriage and encourage co-habitation.[/quote']Part of the idea is to discourage marriage. We have too many divorces in our county as it is. I think your right that the marriage rate would decrease slightly with this and I don't personally see anything wrong with that. And it's not just "Get married and lose control of your body", when two people get married they are making vows and promises to one another to share everything so why wouldn't that include choices to have an abortion or not? Its really "Get married and its now our decision" but I've never said that a married woman couldn't get an abortion. I just am against a married woman getting an abortion without the man having the right to accept full responsibly and custody of the baby if he so felt inclined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I have a sneaky suspicion most people commenting have only ever seen/heard one side of the story. Ya think? No one knows more about the world and how everything works than a 22 year old male on the Internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 You don't need to apologize. I don't agree with what you are saying, but you are being thoughtful about the issue and wrestling with it sincerely, something that we all should aspire to. Thanks for the kind words. The system isn't broken as it is now but it needs tweaking I believe to help come to a more amicable and agreeable solution for everyone involved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 No because this isn't the same thing. I don't advocate the Dr playing Dr Phil type games with people like this. So you think a husband has the right to know that his wife is pregnant but does not have the right to know that she has herpes or is HIV positive. Personally, I would much much much rather know the latter, though I don't think I have a right to either piece of information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 And did someone in here seriously suggest fining a woman who gets an abortion against the father's will??? If you don't want your girl to get an abortion, don't knock her up. It's as simple as that. Why yes I did....Does a husband not suffer a loss if a child he wants is aborted(and has no say in it) The mother has the choice of whether or not the husband will be obligated by her choice....as you so elegantly put it,he did knock her up and the fetus carries his genes. A fine would take some finessing,but it could be worked out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 If you don't want your girl to get an abortion, don't knock her up. It's as simple as that. I think that's right. If you're opposed to abortion. Abstain from sex that way your potential child can't be aborted. When you feel lusty just think of Nancy Reagan and "Just Say No!" :pfft: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Why yes I did....Does a husband not suffer a loss if a child he wants is aborted(and has no say in it) You know, I take Mom out to eat three times a day. And when we're in the restaurant, we both find it very entertaining to watch other people's kids. They're amusing. I guess that means that I have an interest in every potential child that might be born. Obviously I should have the authority to order every potential parent in the world to follow my orders, right? Since your standard is "any person who has an interest should be in charge, and the fact that somebody else has a greater interest must be ignored", right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I guess that means that I have an interest in every potential child that might be born. Your logic is fantastic Would ya'lls opinion changed if the husband paid for in-vitro with the wife's consent and then she aborted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Your logic is fantastic It's your logic. I'm simply pointing out how absurd it is. Would ya'lls opinion changed if the husband paid for in-vitro with the wife's consent and then she aborted? But wait! What if it happened underwater? Oh, and maybe if there was an eclipse involved? I'm certain that if I invent enough maybe's, then maybe I can come up with some kind of imaginary place where one person has the right to demand that another person donate their body to serve his interest. There's just got to be one, somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renaissance Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Would ya'lls opinion changed if the husband paid for in-vitro with the wife's consent and then she aborted? You're right. This is the situation we should be worried about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 You're right. This is the situation we should be worried about. Hey, we had one a few pages back, pushing the scenario where a woman fraudulently gets a guy to get her pregnant, by promising that she would get pregnant, and then, after she's pregnant, gets an abortion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 You're right. This is the situation we should be worried about. I'm just curious if it is the money or emotional investment or what that factors in your thinking. If it is consensual sex between a husband and wife(which any normal person knows can result in pregnancy) why are males interests irrelevant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Why won't anybody explain the things that I keep making up for them to say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 I'm just curious if it is the money or emotional investment or what that factors in your thinking.If it is consensual sex between a husband and wife(which any normal person knows can result in pregnancy) why are males interests irrelevant? They are not irrelevant. But, ultimately, they can't override the woman's right to control her own body. That is the most fundamental right any of us have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 OK ,I guess men are irrelevant in the equation then Sperm donors that are on the hook for child support.....Kool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 OK ,I guess I'll just make up some more things for other people to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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