pram11 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Mayock is widely considered the best draft analyst not working in a front office. If you look at his mock drafts, the guy's success rate over the past few seasons is amazing. His rankings often differ from the popular lists of guys like Mel Kiper and Todd McShay, but come draft day his rankings are a lot more consistent in the order which players get drafted. Having said all of that, with him still having Locker at #2 on his QB board, right behind Gabbert and ahead of Newton, it just makes me wonder if Locker, despite his stock supposedly dropping lately, is still in play for Mike Shanahan at #10? Shanahan reportedly has liked him for over a year, and I'm just wondering if Locker mends his stock a bit with a good combine and pro day, might we still hear his name come off the board wtih our 1st round pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floodzone004 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I actually like that he kept it like that because everyone went crazy on Locker because of his Senior Bowl and practice performances. Senior Bowl stuff doesn't really have an effect on stock and rightfully so. Why should someone be graded higher or lower with one game of new teammates as opposed to seasons of college game film? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 No football fan I know locally (WA) who watches the Huskies thinks Locker is worth all that much or want him as their pro starter, or even a future QB project, and none think he's worth a 1st round pick. I sure don't. But of course, I'm not a pro scout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper 21 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 no to locker, somethign smells like erick crouch hahah jk but seriously Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pram11 Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 Here's why I think Locker is still a strong possibility at #10: The first and foremost reason is Mike Shanahan's self-confidence. No NFL head coach in recent memory has opereated in the job with as much confidence in himself, his own abilities and convictions, and with as little disregard for what others think, than Shanahan. Whether it's an in-game situation like going for a 2-point conversion to win a game at home in week 2 of the regular season, or decisions he's made as the head of football operations that defied conventional thinking, such as his dealings with Daryl Gardener, Albert Haynesworth and Donovan McNabb's multiple benchings; even the way he handled the transition from Bubby Brister to Brian Griese in Denver. He makes decisions based solely on what he feels is the way to go, and not anything else. More specific to the point, Shanahan makes personnel decisions based on how he thinks a player will fit into his system; he doesn't really worry about overpaying free agents that others might not value as highly, or reaching for players in the draft that may not be as high on others' boards. He's not always right, but the man beleives what he believes and places his own value -- be it by money in free agency or round value in the draft -- on specific players that he believes fit his system and team. If he overspends or reaches for a player comparative to what others think the player's value is, he's not really too concerned with that because of the confidence he has in his own skills. The best example I can provide to that point is his signing of Jake Plummer in 2003. Prior to signing with Shanahan's Broncos, Plummer was anything but a good QB; in fact, "not very good" would be a good way to sum up his play. He had never completed more than 59.2 % of his passes in any of the 9 college or NFL seasons he had played in; he was a career 55.9 % passer in the NFL; four of his 6 seasons with the Cardinals resulted in more interceptions thrown than touchdowns; only one year in the NFL had he thrown more TDs than Ints; his career TD-Int in the NFL was 90 TD-114 Int; four of his 6 seasons with the Cardinals saw him throw at least 20 picks, including 1999, when he had 9 TDs and 24 Ints; and his career high rating in 6 NFL seasons was 79.6, and three times he finished below the 70 mark. Anyone looks at those numbers and sees a QB worthy of signing and handing a starting job would be questioned in their madness, right? Well, not only did Shanahan do just that, he handed Plummer a 7-year/$40 million contract with $13 million guaranteed. Keep in mind that deal was signed 8-years ago, a whopper at the time, no doubt. But Shanahan giving Plummer that kind of deal and handing him the starting the job with the way he had performed in 6 NFL seasons speaks to the confidence I spoke about Shanahan having, and the disregard for others' thoughts and opinions. He finds players he likes for his system and places his own value on them. Which brings me back to Jake Locker; I definitely think you can draw a line of similarity between the Plummer signing and the potential drafting of Locker at #10. Shanahan has reportedly liked Locker going all the way back to last year. Locker has been described as Jake Plummer with a better arm and work ethic. Shanahan needs a QB to build his offense around. Locker's stock has apparently fallen in the past month or so, but as was the case with Plummer, I'm not really sure that matters to Shanahan all that much -- what everyone else thinks about him, that is. If Shanahan identifies Locker as the QB he likes in this draft, thinks he can be the guy to build his offense around and doesn't think he can wait until the 2nd round to get him, I'd point to his signing of Jake Plummer as 'Example A' that Shanahan could very well draft Locker, no matter what anyone else thinks of the move. As for how Shanahan's opinion of Plummer translated to his offense: In 3 full seasons as a starter for Shanahan, Plummer twice posted QB ratings above 90 (he also had an 84.5 rating in 2004), completed a total of 60.1 % of his passes, had a 60-34 TD-Int ratio, threw for 4,089 yards and 27 TD in 2004, and led the Broncos to 13 wins and the AFC Championship Game and went to the Pro Bowl in 2005. No matter what you think of Plummer as a QB or Shanahan as a coach, when you consider what Plummer had done in 6 NFL seasons prior to signing with Denver, then compare that to the production and play Shanahan got out of him, you kind of see a coach who knows how to identify quarterbacks that fit into his system regardless of what others think about that player. And if Shanahan decides that Locker is worth the 10th pick in the draft, I'll be okay with that, even though it wouldn't be the most popular pick amongst our fan base. All I have to do is go back to the Plummer signing, when people were no doubt questioning why Shanahan would sign a guy to that kind of contract who had posted the numbers that Plummer had in his 6 pro seasons prior to signing with Denver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Mayock knows what he's about. He nails the QB position better than any other draftnik in the business. Other people talk all season long and scurry around in their opinions, but when Mayock finally weighs in on a draft subject, everyone else just kind of shuts up and starts adopting his views. As for Locker's stock dropping once the season is over, Like Floodzone said, you can't actually hurt yourself in the Senior Bowl unless you come into practice and sulk, get injured, or give terrible interviews. I agree with Mayock's ranking Locker as the #2 QB in the class. I think he's a better prospect than Jay Cutler was, who was selected eleventh overall. I think he could hold value at tenth overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABSTRACT Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 In Mike Shanahan's "How to be a Champion" book....he says his #1 need for a QB is accuracy. Locker has no accuracy. I don't see how this works. I firmly believe JJ Watt will be selected at #10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i<3DC4ever Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Locker can sure as heck sling the ball downfield, & the guy has super swift mobility. But I really think Shanny will go with O-Line in the first round, considering he was always a man to creat great O-lines during his tenure with Denver. I personally like Mallett (even though I know he wasn't mentioned in the thread) but if things work on draft day & we get some more picks outside of the first, I really think Mallett can zip that ball from what I've seen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 In Mike Shanahan's "How to be a Champion" book....he says his #1 need for a QB is accuracy. Locker has no accuracy. I don't see how this works. I firmly believe JJ Watt will be selected at #10. Locker is extremely accurate throwing on the move, it's when he is in the pocket he has some issues due to inconsistent footwork. I don't see him as the second best QB in this draft personally and would be shocked if we took him at 10. However if he falls into the second round and a good QB coach can get his footwork sorted out someone will get a steal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pram11 Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 In Mike Shanahan's "How to be a Champion" book....he says his #1 need for a QB is accuracy. Locker has no accuracy. I don't see how this works. I firmly believe JJ Watt will be selected at #10. First of all, the whole idea that Locker is not accurate is being hyped too much. In fact, Mayock has said that Locker is one of the most accurate throwers outside the pocket he's ever scouted. If you know anything about Mike Shanahan's offense, a good deal of it requires the QB to play outside the pocket. I do agree with the notion that Locker needs improved accuracy from inside the pocket, but do not discount the fact that he was throwing to a WR corps that literally may have had more drops than any team in the country; which no doubt is a reason his completion percentage is what it was. That said, you don't look at this kid's game in college and surmise that he's not accurate because his completion percentage wasn't real high, then conclude that because Shanahan values accuracay, he won't like Locker. In fact, accuracy is one of the most coachable tools a QB has and it comes through proper footwork, which Locker is said to need work on; that's a good thing, because we know with some work and effort, he can defitnitely get better in this aspect of his game. Steve Young said that when Shanahan coached him, the biggest thing he learned was proper footwork and that Shanahan taught him accuracy comes from good footwork. He said Shanahan could watch tape of any QB and tell if every throw he made on film was a good one or not by watching nothing but his feet. That's something that can be coached, worked on and even turned into a strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I watched the East and West practices on NFL Network where Mayock was commenting -- he was far from glowing about Locker and was nitpicking him. So am surprised Mayock still thinks so highly of him or wonder if Locker is up there because he's not blown away by Newton, etc. Mayock though is far from perfect, i recall he was in love with Robert Ayers 2 drafts ago, going against the grain about him compared to Kiper and many others -- so far that hasn't panned out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I think Mayock changes his tune after the combine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailGreen28 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 In Mike Shanahan's "How to be a Champion" book....he says his #1 need for a QB is accuracy. Locker has no accuracy. I don't see how this works. I firmly believe JJ Watt will be selected at #10.Does Watt fit the role of OLB or DE for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sideshow24 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I was hoping to draft defense at 10 and grab Locker in round 2. Guess that ain't happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Resign Sexy Rexy so we will suck for another year then grab Luck or somebody a few notches below after we make a solid pick at 10 or lower to address either the D line or O line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper 21 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 the wholle shanny system needs a role out is getting blown up if you ask me. matt shuab is a beast in the pocket. we can all agree vy excluding vick is probably the best running qb to come out of college most people thought the texans should have taken him one. lets just say scouts can be wrong, especially about mobile qbs because in the nfl people are faster and smarter and will lay you the hell out. is mobility neccerary in the nfl yes, is it ahead of accuracy, release, vision, qb iq, no by no means. otherwise i can name 100 guys that are faster than locker and probably 100 guys that are more accurate. he is a combo guy that isnt the best at either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I think Mayock changes his tune after the combine. I don't know... The Combine was made for athletes like Locker. If he can demonstrate that he can make all the throws, with his sub 4.5 time, his stock will come back up. I can see 3 QBs taken in the first 12 picks this year. ---------- Post added February-17th-2011 at 10:08 AM ---------- Does Watt fit the role of OLB or DE for us? He's a prototypical DE in a 34... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheismannQuote Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'm of the opinion that Mayock having locker ranked so high has more to do with the fact that this year's class of QB's is nothing to go crazy over. They all seem to have more negatives than positives. I think 3, 4, maybe 5 years ago Cam Newton coming out of would have been a lock for top 3, top 5 but the recent history of QBs with similar stock is not favoring. One big year, one read, supreme athletic talent for the college game, and some side baggage. I feel like that history has been written before. I'm still against even looking at QB at #10 for the redskins. The 2nd round pick would be an ideal place for this middle-of-the-pack class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Tris Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'd like to challenge the notion that Mayock is flawless when it comes to evaluating the QB position. It took some digging, because like every draft analyst, Mayock dumps his archives so their can be no looking back and questioning his rankings. Here are his past few years final QB rankings: 2010: 1. Bradford 2. Clausen 3. Tebow 4. McCoy 5. Skelton 2009: 1. Sanchez 2. Stafford 3. Freeman 4. White 5. Bomar 2008: 1. Ryan 2. Flacco 3. Henne 4. Brohm 5. Booty 2007: 1. Russell 2. Quinn 3. Stanton 4. Beck 5. Edwards 2006: 1. Cutler 2. Leinart 3. Young 4. Whitehurst 5. Croyle 2005: 1. Smith 2. Rodgers 3. Campbell 4. Orton 5. Frye Outside of the Cutler call, I don't see anything that tells me he is any more adept at ranking QBs than another draft guy. Look, Mayock is probably the best of a very inexact group - MM had Devin Thomas as his #1 WR in 2008 guys - but that doesn't make him the end all be all of draft analysts. Here's something I don't understand about the Jay Cutler/Locker comparisons. Most people will concede that Jay Cutler is/was a better prospect than Blaine Gabbert, however, many of these same people also say that Jake Locker is a better prospect than Jay Cutler, and then that Gabbert is a better prospect than Locker. So which is it? And believe me, Mayock was MUCH higher on Culter than he has ever been on Locker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I fully admit to being utterly confused about Locker. I love him, then I hate him. Then I love him again. He seems like the perfect fit. Perhaps his last two years were growing pains. Maybe he's able to take the lead in 2012. I don't know. I'm no scout, just trying to get the overall take on these players and this one is a toughy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 If Locker is there at #10 and Shanahan drafts him, I'm very cool with that. That would tell me that Shanahan thinks Locker has tools that can be developed to become a franchise QB for his system. If Locker is at #10 and Shanahan passes on him, that would tell me he doesn't think Locker is a franchise QB in the near future or that he may be a good QB, but not worth the #10 overall. Either decision, I would be fine with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I fully admit to being utterly confused about Locker. I love him, then I hate him. Then I love him again. He seems like the perfect fit. Perhaps his last two years were growing pains. Maybe he's able to take the lead in 2012. I don't know. I'm no scout, just trying to get the overall take on these players and this one is a toughy. stay away from Locker with a 10 foot pole, I don't even think' I would take him in the 2nd at this point. Nothing about Locker throwing a football looks very natural, unless he's rolling out of the pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Fried Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Damn straight he does. Locker is still the guy I want. Gabbert would be nice, but I like Locker better in every facet of the game except accuracy where I don't think he's bad, just not as good as Gabbert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouvan59 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Locker is extremely accurate throwing on the move, . He's more accurate than most throwing on the move but to characterize him as "extremely" accurate is a bit much. The fact is that he's not accurate compared to your average QB. He's got many of the same flags that Patrick Ramsey had and that scares me. He's obviously a much better athlete and it's possible he can be "coached up" but I just don't like the idea of using a high pick on someone who has to overcome some major flaws to be an NFL QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Fried Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I just don't like the idea of using a high pick on someone who has to overcome some major flaws to be an NFL QB. I definitely understand your concerns, and I have the same ones, but he also has some major pluses that not many other QBs come out with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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