GibbsFactor Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Just out of curiosity how can you see the work ethic of any prospect?Why is it that Newton lacks the work ethic and say a prospect like Gabbert doesn't? And Cam has great work ethic. He was the first one on the field and the last one off. He stayed late to study and even got his recievers together out of practice to work on timing. He's a winner. As proven by the last three teams he was on. Questioning his work ethic is futile. Now, he may be a little entitled... Or he could be a kid that is trying as hard as he can. He's been busted for buying a stolen laptop and having up to 12 speeding tickets. Maybe he was late to class a lot? He couldn't afford a laptop and got one on the cheap to keep up with his education. Everyone will balk at those excuses but at the end of the day, we just don't know. The only thing we do know is that he's a freak of an athlete and is very personable and intelligent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I'll take that risk any day of the week. If my franchise has a 1/3 chance to get arguably the greatest QB of all time? That's a no brainer. Sure 2/3 will set you back 2- 5 years, but that one, that one can set your franchise up for the next decade. I don't think his game suggests he's going to be the greatest of all time, You could be right but I don't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I don't think his game suggests he's going to be the greatest of all time, You could be right but I don't see it. The poster you quoted mentioned Joe Montana. A QB who played for one season at Notre Dame and won the national championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I don't think his game suggests he's going to be the greatest of all time, You could be right but I don't see it. I do. Great arm. Athletic. Wins every time he leads a team. Big. Strong. Fast. I don't think we've ever seen a kid coming out like this guy. Name one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 The poster you quoted mentioned Joe Montana. A QB who played for one season at Notre Dame and won the national championship. Oh my mistake. But about Joe Montana In the 1979 NFL Draft, the San Francisco 49ers selected Montana in the third round with the 82nd overall pick. that's a hell of a drop and difference from being #1 over all, or #10 by us. I don't understand the comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Tris Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 He's a winner. As proven by the last three teams he was on. Nit picking, but what exactly did Newton have to do with Florida winning the National Championship? ---------- Post added February-22nd-2011 at 03:40 PM ---------- I do. Great arm. Athletic. Wins every time he leads a team. Big. Strong. Fast. I don't think we've ever seen a kid coming out like this guy. Name one. Tebow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Oh my mistake. But about Joe Montana In the 1979 NFL Draft, the San Francisco 49ers selected Montana in the third round with the 82nd overall pick. that's a hell of a drop and difference from being #1 over all, or #10 by us. I don't understand the comparison. Your logic was you shouldn't draft someone, who only played for one year, even if they won the national championship that year and so on. Joe Montana is such a QB, and he turned out to be arguably the greatest QB of all time. Therefore straying from a prospect simply because they only played for a year is a poor logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Nit picking, but what exactly did Newton have to do with Florida winning the National Championship?---------- Post added February-22nd-2011 at 03:40 PM ---------- Tebow. He kept that Tebow kid in check. Making sure that Tebow kid knew what was up if he didn't play well. And nope. Tebow ain't Cam. Cam is bigger, faster and is much more of a prototypical QB. Vince Young? Nope. Cam is bigger with a much better arm and accuracy. Russell? Leaf? Nothing in common other than their rocket launchers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I do. Great arm. Athletic. Wins every time he leads a team. Big. Strong. Fast. I don't think we've ever seen a kid coming out like this guy. Name one. That reminds me of Jason Campbell....always a winner, big arm, fast...strong QB.... Look you could be right. He might be the next Payton Manning. But I don't think so. What I see is a new hype train that's going crazy for this kid right now who 2 months ago wasn't ever considered the top player coming off the board but because he won the national title game (that's a joke to me), can give an interview, can practice well, suddenly he's jumped to the top of the board. Like my original post said. We see this all the time and rarely works out. I don't buy the hype behind the guy. He's got a long way to go to produce in this league Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
number twenty-eight Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 So was Jarmarcus Russel, so was Ryan Leaf...so what? I'm just saying it isn't unheard of. Without the benefit of foresight, I'm ready to roll with Cam if he gets to us, given all his shortcomings. I'll take his one year of excellence and expect more because he's shown in one season all the pro skills necessary to be great. For full disclosure: Montana started parts of two seasons. As a junior he was third string and won the NC. He was the unchallenged starter as a senior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrecker Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Yeah...I'd say that quote is the first off-season slip-up in Cam's never-ending quest to hype himself before the draft. Sounds like a bit of a God complex to me. He must think both him and the Beatles are more popular than Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Tris Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Cam is bigger, faster and is much more of a prototypical QB. Vince Young? Nope. Cam is bigger with a much better arm and accuracy. Russell? Leaf? Nothing in common other than their rocket launchers. Nothing about Newton is prototypical. He got a near 1-1 run pass ratio, more even that Vick, Tebow, Young, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Look you could be right. He might be the next Payton Manning. But I don't think so. What I see is a new hype train that's going crazy for this kid right now who 2 months ago wasn't ever considered the top player coming off the board but because he won the national title game (that's a joke to me), can give an interview, can practice well, suddenly he's jumped to the top of the board. Like my original post said. We see this all the time and rarely works out. I don't buy the hype behind the guy. He's got a long way to go to produce in this league And everyone's got their right to an opinion. Out of curiosity, who's your QB you target in this draft? Or do you skip QB this draft and acquire one next season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 And Cam has great work ethic. He was the first one on the field and the last one off. He stayed late to study and even got his recievers together out of practice to work on timing. He's a winner. As proven by the last three teams he was on.Questioning his work ethic is futile. Now, he may be a little entitled... Or he could be a kid that is trying as hard as he can. He's been busted for buying a stolen laptop and having up to 12 speeding tickets. Maybe he was late to class a lot? He couldn't afford a laptop and got one on the cheap to keep up with his education. Everyone will balk at those excuses but at the end of the day, we just don't know. The only thing we do know is that he's a freak of an athlete and is very personable and intelligent. He couldn't afford a laptop? Seriously that's what you take from his buying a stolen laptop? I don't think his buying a stolen laptop is the crime of the century and I would not be overly worried about it in terms of drafting him if that was the only thing on his resume. Call it a bad decision, hope he learned a lesson and move on. But it's not the only incident. 12 speeding tickets? Cash for playing? Cheating by handing in someone elses work to get his grades? There is a worrying pattern of either bad judgement or a sense he sees himself as above the rules. Now he is not the only young man who has done stupid things at College (clearly I was perfect) and maybe its just part of his maturing. Here is what worries me though - you say he worked really hard at College at practice and I believe you. My question is given all the flags about his character how hard is going to work when he becomes a multi millionaire? I worry that he and his family see football as means not an end - the feeling that his goal is getting drafted high and getting paid not getting drafted high, getting paid and then becoming the best pro QB he can be. So I do think the question 'how hard will he work as a Pro' is a legitimate question. It's a question you need to ask about all the prospects but I think there are more flags around Newton in this area than Gabbert for example. I think there are even bigger questions in this area around Mallet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Nothing about Newton is prototypical. He got a near 1-1 run pass ratio, more even that Vick, Tebow, Young, etc. His throwing motion is much more prototypical of a QB than either Tebow or Young, and obviously he has prototypical size for a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Your logic was you shouldn't draft someone, who only played for one year, even if they won the national championship that year and so on. Joe Montana is such a QB, and he turned out to be arguably the greatest QB of all time. Therefore straying from a prospect simply because they only played for a year is a poor logic. No that's not at all my logic, your reading comprehension sucks if thats all you got out of the posts I've made in this thread but whatever. Why are you ignoring the fact that Montana who fits the one year QB arguement you want to mention didn't go in the first round or in the top 10 like Newton will go. Do you not think that you can take more risks on third rounders then you can on top 10 first rounders? If you can't figure that out I suggest putting down the torches and pompoms for a while and think about this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Your logic was you shouldn't draft someone, who only played for one year, even if they won the national championship that year and so on. Joe Montana is such a QB, and he turned out to be arguably the greatest QB of all time. Therefore straying from a prospect simply because they only played for a year is a poor logic. Montana started two years - he had 189 attempts in 77 and 260 attempts in 78 his senior year. He also has some spot duty in 76. In 77 he started as backup but ended up starting nine games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Nothing about Newton is prototypical. He got a near 1-1 run pass ratio, more even that Vick, Tebow, Young, etc. He's got much better footwork and throwing mechanics. His 1-1 ratio is based off of system that he was in. In actual passing plays, his bail % was the same as Aaron Rodgers this year at around 8%. Another little known fact, Newton was a pocket passer in High School. He had to consciously decide to start running more as he always preferred to make the pass first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Montana started two years - he had 189 attempts in 77 and 260 attempts in 78 his senior year. He also has some spot duty in 76.In 77 he started as backup but ended up starting nine games. I see that now, a poster before stated he started for one year and I took them at their word. My mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Tris Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 His throwing motion is much more prototypical of a QB than either Tebow or Young, and obviously he has prototypical size for a QB. But his playing style is not. That is far more important to me. Phillip Rivers doesn't have a prototypical throwing motion. Drew Brees doesn't have prototypical size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 And everyone's got their right to an opinion. Out of curiosity, who's your QB you target in this draft? Or do you skip QB this draft and acquire one next season? I don't like the price tags on Gabbart or Newton. Both would cost us our first round pick if they are there and we want them. I'm hoping we can find someone with the second, depends on who slips etc. Locker in the second would be a good pick imo, Devlin in the third if we can get back in that round would be a good pick. I firmly believe that you can't spend a top 15 pick on a QB who has questions. It really depends on how the board shakes out imo who our best QB to get would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Tris Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Another little known fact, Newton was a pocket passer in High School. He had to consciously decide to start running more as he always preferred to make the pass first. Recruited as the #2 dual threat QB in the country to a zone-read college offense. http://rivals.yahoo.com/footballrecruiting/football/recruiting/rankings/rank-rivalsdtqb/2007 I see a lot of running here. http://rivals.yahoo.com/video/recruiting-football/Cameron-Newton-Offense-Defense-Game-Highlights-9575;_ylt=AqoVkrVqoUznVgA4FdKgaflHPZB4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 He couldn't afford a laptop? Seriously that's what you take from his buying a stolen laptop?I don't think his buying a stolen laptop is the crime of the century and I would not be overly worried about it in terms of drafting him if that was the only thing on his resume. Call it a bad decision, hope he learned a lesson and move on. But it's not the only incident. 12 speeding tickets? Cash for playing? Cheating by handing in someone elses work to get his grades? There is a worrying pattern of either bad judgement or a sense he sees himself as above the rules. Now he is not the only young man who has done stupid things at College (clearly I was perfect) and maybe its just part of his maturing. Here is what worries me though - you say he worked really hard at College at practice and I believe you. My question is given all the flags about his character how hard is going to work when he becomes a multi millionaire? I worry that he and his family see football as means not an end - the feeling that his goal is getting drafted high and getting paid not getting drafted high, getting paid and then becoming the best pro QB he can be. So I do think the question 'how hard will he work as a Pro' is a legitimate question. It's a question you need to ask about all the prospects but I think there are more flags around Newton in this area than Gabbert for example. I think there are even bigger questions in this area around Mallet. I think you have those worries about anyone, especially us with our latest multimillionaire road raging, bar drinking 3 tech. What makes me think it's him and not just him trying to get a payday is the fact that he wins. Did you pay attention to Auburn this year? They really weren't better than Alabama, maybe the 4th or 5th best team in the SEC. But Cam put the team on his back and they won, every game. There has to be something said about that. It was enough to make Tebow a first rounder last year and Tebow honestly doesn't have the upside this kid has. As far as what's been said, he has the same desire to win and succeed. He came from a different background than Tebow so the personal intangibles will slide to Tebow, but Tebow wins that battle 1000 out of 1000 times with anyone. Again, the difference is that Cam is an actual QB. And you can't compare him to Mallet or Gabbert as far as those intangibles go. Why? Those national championships he won. Both at schools that wouldn't even be in the picture without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 But his playing style is not. That is far more important to me. Why play like a prototypical QB and not take full advantage of your assets. Michael Vick doesn't play like a prototypical QB, even the new mature Michael Vick that passes from the pocket. Even he still uses his feet when he needs to, and he can kill defenses with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 What makes me think it's him and not just him trying to get a payday is the fact that he wins. Hate to say this but imo this is honestly the worst possible reason to draft a QB that you could come up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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