VRIEL1 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 It will be interesting to see where QB Andy Dalton TCU ends up as we get closer to the draft but I'd give him a serious look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasthunder Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I mean, getting my favorite QB prospect (right now) in the middle of the first, without trading anything? And still having a mid-2nd to draft OG/OC/DE/OLB/WR? And bargaining chips in Haynesworth, Cooley, McNabb to add picks from rounds 2-4 (being optimistic)?Holy crap man...that would be ideal. Literally. Here it is, cry out of happiness: FA: OG Joseph OC Kalil NT Solai WR Rice (yeah right) or Braylon Edwards (also yeah right haha) WR Vincent Jackson (The icing on the cake) DRAFT: 1: Gabbert 2: Wisnewski/Hudson Fill in the rest with BPA at "need" positions from there on out, including the picks from traded players...OLB/WR/FS/DE. Whew. Oh hell yea, it would be like an early christmas/birthday all rolled into one. I would literley be counting the days till preseason !!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyvern Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 So is Mike Shanahan kicking himself for giving up on Jason Campbell and instead shipping two picks to Philly for Donovan McNabb? If so, would he ever admit it?I don't think he is kicking himself -- and I don't fault him for gambling that McNabb might give the Skins a 3 year solution for a 'franchise QB.'I suspect that Shanahan knew that Campbell wouldn't fit the system, and I am totally onboard with his decision to trade Jason for whatever we could get for him. As for McNabb, Shanahan suspected he had a pro-bowl talent who "might" be able to adjust to Shanny's system -- but at a minimum would provide an NFL-tested yardstick to assess his receiving corps, his new O-line, and the pass-catching abilities of his 'new' running backs. I also think McNabb was brought in to give the fans a faint hope that the Skins might be able to compete for a playoff spot. However, it became apparent that the 'gamble' didn't pay off -- McNabb simply didn't fit in, and (likely to health reasons) his passing touch and accuracy hasn't been what fans usually expect of Donovan. As for Grossman, I don't think that Rex is the long-term answer but he seems to be delivering better on what Shanahan expected of a veteran QB as the coaches assess the receiving corp's value. But I wonder how good a mentor he could be to any new QB we draft. If we draft a QB in 2010, we're going to need a veteran QB who can serve as a good model as the rookie develops into the eventual starting role. I'm hoping we can find one during the off-season, because Grossman wouldn't be my first choice as an example to emulate. I'm hoping we can pick up Sage Rosenfels for that role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I agree with you smurf86 and disagree with the 2 posts listed above yours from SkinsFTW and VetMinHere's my views (from someone that's seen more then 1 game) about Locker that i posted in the draft thread: Here's why i like Locker and my opinion of Locker remains unchanged after the game-(1st round QB) (a game where his WRs were owned by Amukamara and Dennard and Sark didn't have an answer other then Locker's running ability, yet Locker brought home the W, didn't make the big mistakes that prevented them from winning and made big plays to help them win long run, TD pass, coming back from a big hit) So you are saying that you believe that he's not a huge risk despite barely completing 50% of his passes and can't read defenses, or at best hasn't shown that he can read defenses and instead runs off because he's an athlete before being a QB. I don't really think thats the QB most want. If that's what we need though then we should go get Vince Young who should be coming available shortly, he already got experience too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasRoane Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I mean, getting my favorite QB prospect (right now) in the middle of the first, without trading anything? And still having a mid-2nd to draft OG/OC/DE/OLB/WR? And bargaining chips in Haynesworth, Cooley, McNabb to add picks from rounds 2-4 (being optimistic)?Holy crap man...that would be ideal. Literally. Here it is, cry out of happiness: FA: OG Joseph OC Kalil NT Solai WR Rice (yeah right) or Braylon Edwards (also yeah right haha) DRAFT: 1: Gabbert 2: Wisnewski/Hudson Fill in the rest with BPA at "need" positions from there on out, including the picks from traded players...OLB/WR/FS/DE. Whew. Oh hell yeah! Championship! What's clearly evident about DG's list is that this will be a QB rich draft. And our chances are outstanding that we can get the guy we want. You gotta think Seattle would take Locker with Pete's USC connection. Plus that would create a buzz for Seattle to have a home boy. I could see Wisenhunt taking Mallet with the size and toughness similiarities to Roethlisberger. Hopefully someone else jumps on Newton leaving Gabbert for us. (The ONLY thing I have against Newton is the one year body of work. Other teams can afford to take a risk but not us.) Gabbert has the mechanics to be an accurate passer. I'd like to have seen him drop back more but if Rex plays well today then you can park him for a year and coach him up. Or for half a year and bring him in as Shanny did with Cutler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 So you are saying that you believe that he's not a huge risk despite barely completing 50% of his passes and can't read defenses, or at best hasn't shown that he can read defenses and instead runs off because he's an athlete before being a QB. I don't really think thats the QB most want. If that's what we need though then we should go get Vince Young who should be coming available shortly, he already got experience too. Look dude. I'm all for a discussion. But you aren't even making a credible argument. He can't read defenses? You know this how? Honestly do you think any of the top level prospects can't read a defense? You assume he runs b/c you believe he can't read a defense, but it doesn't make it true. And most people consider the ability to run and makes plays with his legs is a good thing. You are over reacting to a game in which his team won. I'm sorry dude, but imo you have chosen a simplistic view and quite frankly i think you have no idea what you're talking about. I explained very clearly why i'm not bothered by his completion % and if you don't understand or accep tmy view that's fine but there's no other way for me to explain it too you. And i don't want to go back and forth in circles w/ you. BTW-You know who else had a similar college comp %? Jay Cutler. -Vince Young is a thin skinned overly sensative knuncklehead but if you look at his actual on the field play its hard to deny that he was having a good season and he's been a winning and productive QB. (2x pro-bowler) Edit: My tone is a bit stronger then i intended. But, my point is that i actually took time and watched several Locker game cut-ups before i came up with my breakdown. I would be all eyes and appreciate reading your complete breakdown of Locker. HTTR! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sz-14WN4AI4&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gw_dWX2dJPY&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhTOTTpJ4Qs&feature=related Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasRoane Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 DG is right about the 'reading defenses' argument. But there's a difference between reading a defense and reading progressions. None of us know for sure cause we don't know what was called. But you can get a good idea if you watch his head. Does it stay in one direction? Or does it switch off to another target? Check down's don't count. My 10 year old can throw a check down; well actually he can read progressions too and I can prove it lol. But that's not the point. If you watch a QB's head and see him move from one route to another then you can assume he's reading progressions. Reading a defense is what Brady and Peyton Manning do best. I'd guess on average they make the right decision (pre snap based on how the defense responded to motion or the fake snap) at least 80% of the time. They do get fooled once in a while or hurried. But more often than not they know what look they're going to get. Sometimes it's the receiver that messes up and doesn't see the same thing. I point this out because I doubt that even the best College QB's actually read defenses at the NFL level. You rarely see the exotic movements and coverage changes at the snap. I spent considerable time with Stoops the DC from William and Mary who improved their Defense from the 100's to the top 10. And he throws some crazy stuff at QB's. But guys like him are few and far between in the College ranks. So most College QB's are not really reading defenses. They're reading progressions. And if the kid can do that then he's got a chance to reach the next step of reading defenses and filtering out how the defense is really going to align at the snap. I was always against Campbell (even though I love his character) because he could never read progressions. It was almost always first option or check down. McNabb may be able to read defenses but he pretty much did the same thing. Deep ball or check down. So as you watch Luck and Tyrod tomorrow watch their heads. See what they're doing. (Tyrod can read progressions btw). Then watch Newton's head vs Oregon on the 10th. If you can get Youtubes of Gabbert's, Lockers, Mallet's games then watch them as well. That will give you a good idea on what potential they have. The most important ingredient for a QB though is leadership. That right there puts Dalton in the mix. Not saying we should draft him but the way that young man conducted himself last night and all year says a lot for his character. Locker came back for a year when he really didn't have to. Cost himself a lot of $. That means something. We need to find out more about the character of the other candidates as well. Talent isn't everything. Remember Ryan Leaf! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquariuzzz Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Draft a qb in the later rounds but, Give Mcnabb/Grossman 1 more year or get 1-2 picks for Mcnabb. get rid of beck... who is this guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasRoane Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Draft a qb in the later rounds but, Give Mcnabb/Grossman 1 more year or get 1-2 picks for Mcnabb. get rid of beck... who is this guy? Drafting a later round QB would the same logic as keeping Grossman and McNabb. You don't know what you're going to get and this draft is QB rich. You don't want average at the QB position. You have to have above average to win in the NFL. Get rid of Beck? Why? Do you know enough about his potential to make such a definitive statement? MS traded for him so there must have been something he liked. Those blanket statements without facts to back them up are what drives people crazy about our fan base. And that's why our roster was in in such bad shape. Cause for years we had Danny and his buddy Vinny making the same rash decisions that most fans complained about. Yet most of you are just like them! Fire this coach. Cut this guy. Don't draft xxxx. I dunno about other readers here but you guys make my head numb! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquariuzzz Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 im sure beck has not shown more than grossman or else shanny would still be considering giving him game time for this last game instead of jumping on the "only if injury comes into play" wagon. Id rather much have a younger qb from this qb rich draft. i understand shanny wants to win and win now but all our qb's are 30 or older.. we need some youth that will learn from all this veteran experience we seem to have at the qb position. its funny to think we would have been no worse off if we decided to make colt brennan or chase daniel our qb a few seasons ago.... at least if they came around we would have a qb that wont retire in 3-4 years as he is winding down his career clock.. I hope Shanny picks a young qb that he really likes and grooms him.. we need snyder and his "hire and fire" philosophy to allow shanny to build his qb.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 It makes me nervous having Rex Grossman as the only veteran QB around to have the rookie franchise QB learn from. And I just hope they like one of these other QBs besides Luck, cuz if they're lukewarm on all of 'em, it makes Grossman as the starter even less appealing than it already is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gorebd82 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 It makes me nervous having Rex Grossman as the only veteran QB around to have the rookie franchise QB learn from. And I just hope they like one of these other QBs besides Luck, cuz if they're lukewarm on all of 'em, it makes Grossman as the starter even less appealing than it already is. Actually, it might not be so bad having Grossman as the tutor. He knows how to run the system very well and can teach the rook a lot during practice. But his play is also streaky so Kyle can point out in film session what not to do. I think is would make the teachings of Kyle resonate stronger than his QB mentor. For instance, if McNabb were here, the rookie might actually pick up some bad habits and value the QBs opinion more than his OC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#98QBKiller Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 This team isn't going to be contending for anything until we find our franchise guy. I think it's obvious that Grossman is just a stop gap for now. IMO, if we're indeed drafting a QB in this draft we need to go big and do what it takes to get Andrew Luck. We've been unsuccessful drafting project guys for so long, it's time to get the closest we can possibly get to a "sure thing" franchise QB and Luck is the closest to that in this draft. If we can't move up and get into position to draft him, then we need to upgrade NT and C with the best players possible and wait another year to make a move for our franchise guy. Look at the playoffs. You need a franchise QB to be successful in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Actually, it might not be so bad having Grossman as the tutor. He knows how to run the system very well and can teach the rook a lot during practice. But his play is also streaky so Kyle can point out in film session what not to do. I think is would make the teachings of Kyle resonate stronger than his QB mentor. For instance, if McNabb were here, the rookie might actually pick up some bad habits and value the QBs opinion more than his OC. Yeah I'm not so sure about McNabb... I suspect he's not the most coachable guy. One thing he does know how to do is handle the media and get the guys in the locker room to respect him (excepting Terrell Owens). As far as a veteran QB "mentoring" a young one, I'm guessing it mostly has to do with showing someone how to handle yourself as a professional. The coaches do the real teaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 This team isn't going to be contending for anything until we find our franchise guy. I think it's obvious that Grossman is just a stop gap for now. IMO, if we're indeed drafting a QB in this draft we need to go big and do what it takes to get Andrew Luck. We've been unsuccessful drafting project guys for so long, it's time to get the closest we can possibly get to a "sure thing" franchise QB and Luck is the closest to that in this draft. If we can't move up and get into position to draft him, then we need to upgrade NT and C with the best players possible and wait another year to make a move for our franchise guy. Look at the playoffs. You need a franchise QB to be successful in this league. I thought NT was a weakness, but Bryant seemed to be playing very well at NT. NT might not be a huge need as once thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyriggins Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Maybe Arkansas's quarterback Mallett will fall to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsforlife101 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Maybe Arkansas's quarterback Mallett will fall to us. It's a possibility. If Seattle wins tonight we go up one spot to nine however you have to think that Carlina, and possibly SF will be looking for a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmchairRedskin Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Zero chance we go for Mallett. He's a huge lumbering awkward statue back there. Not mobile at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samhuff60 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 It's a possibility. If Seattle wins tonight we go up one spot to nine however you have to think that Carlina, and possibly SF will be looking for a QB. We will never beat the Giants if we draft a QB because we only have 1 offensive lineman. The Skins need offensive linemen...blockers..and DEFENSIVE LINEMEN...pass rushers. Its why the Giants beat us every single time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins3000 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I think the coaching staff will take Locker based on reports from last year if Locker had decided to come out. Personally, I prefer my qb to be a winner in college it tells me alot even though you can make the case for the Matt Leinerts of the world all in all most stud qb's were winners in college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 We will never beat the Giants if we draft a QB because we only have 1 offensive lineman. The Skins need offensive linemen...blockers..and DEFENSIVE LINEMEN...pass rushers. Its why the Giants beat us every single time. We need interior oline, but we won't use a top 10 pick for an OG or C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsforlife101 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 We need interior oline, but we won't use a top 10 pick for an OG or C. IMHO, I think we would probably go C in the Second round maybe Wisniewski if he is still around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Lloyd Christmas Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 so from now until april i can bang the "draft jake locker" drum all day. april needs to hurry up and get here!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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