The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

[Going Commando]

Harden does nothing to change Charlotte's situation in the short or long term. They'd have a 20 PPG wing with a couple years left on his contract instead of nothing. But he doesn't make them a playoff team by any stretch. They're better off just drafting Drummond because then you at least have the hope of a dominant big down the line.

[SuperBash]

Michael Kidd-Gilchrist believes the Wizards will be a playoff-caliber team if they select him with the third pick in the draft.

“I mean, with John [Wall] and Nene? I think it’s a playoff team,” Kidd-Gilchrist said, matter-of-factly, when asked how he would fit in Washington.

Next season? “I mean, I guess. I think it’s a playoff team,” Kidd-Gilchrist said.

Kidd-Gilchrist is no stranger to winning, having won a state title in high school, a gold medal at the FIBA Under-17 world championships and a national championship at Kentucky.

“I want to win games,” Kidd-Gilchrist said. “That’s what I’m about.”

Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/221536/Kidd_Gilchrist_Believes_Wizards_Are_Playoff_Team_With_Him_At_Small_Forward#ixzz1xsOoGIxt

[Going Commando]

I love reading the top prospects talk about the Wizards. It makes me giddy.

Tough choice between TRob, MKG, Beal, and Barnes.

---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 11:39 AM ----------

Beal is super smart. The guy knows basketball, that's for sure.

---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 12:16 PM ----------

Also, DX report.

Love what I see in that video. Love everything I've read the past couple days about him.

I think he ends up a better player than Barnes.

I'm really torn on who the best option at three is. I like TRob and Beal over Barnes. All of them fit immediate needs. TRob is the most special out of that group because of his size, speed, and position, but he doesn't help us immediately on offense.

Beal is a nice package of upside and immediate value. He'd probably start full time from day one. He'd give us a shooter and a perimeter defender which is probably our biggest weakness. He could push Jordan into the sixth man role, and he'd give us a really nice three guard lineup when we want to go small. I bet the rest of the team would love playing with Beal.

But then I don't know if you take him over MKG. MKG brings something intangibly special to the table that we're lacking. He'd also give us a great perimeter defender and rebounder and transition finisher. But he can't shoot so it hurts his ability to help us right away in comparison to Beal. But out of all the rookies, I think adding him to your locker room makes the biggest difference for your team complexion. He's so special.

I've been wanting TRob at three for a while, and rebounding and post presence are a big need that he could fill. It'd be so cool to root for a true Wizards fan.

But I'm wondering if we couldn't get lot of what he brings from signing Ersan Ilyasova or Kris Humphries and then having an extra year of development from Booker and Seraphin. Booker and Seraphin can play. The market is looking good for rebounding power forwards and we've got two quality tweener types already, plus Vesely is in the mix. You draft TRob and then you probably need to deal Booker. Draft Beal or MKG and we wouldn't have to do anything per se.

It's getting the point where I think we just need to bite the bullet and take Beal or MKG and use FA to fill those other needs. If Nene is a serious part of our future, drafting another big potentially overloads us at the position.

Ersan + Beal/MKG + Hollis Thompson is probably my revised wishlist. I don't know if Ersan is realistic, but if we could get him, the net improvement of Ersan + Beal/MKG is greater than just TRob IMO.

Things would be a lot simpler if we could trade for the Kings or Blazers pick.

Then I think the draft plays out:

1.) Davis

2.) somebody trades up for Drummond

3.) TRob

4.) Cleveland takes Barnes

5.) MKG

6.) Beal

Then we could get both of our guys and not have to worry about our unlikely ability to draw in a quality FA like Ersan.

[Skins199021]

Yea

Wall/Harden/Nene would get us into the playoffs, and if Seraphin could play some PF you got a dirty lineup with a lot of post presence.

I think it would be huge if Booker were able to play SF, and Seraphin PF. I believe both can do it just slight improvements to their range on their jumpshots.

This is something the Wiz should really look into though. I would trade 3, a 2nd and Singleton (they like having those defensive guys around scorers like KD and Westy)

[No Excuses]

Nene can play PF and it's apparently his position of preference.

We ran Nene/Seraphin lineups. This would be my preferred starting lineup as well. Seraphin was too consistent to be relegated to bench duty this coming season. He deserves to start at C.

[Going Commando]

Wonder who this year's Tristan Thompson is going to be?

---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 12:35 PM ----------

Nene can play PF and it's apparently his position of preference.

We ran Nene/Seraphin lineups. This would be my preferred starting lineup as well. Seraphin was too consistent to be relegated to bench duty this coming season. He deserves to start at C.

Makes sense. Nene can shoot and run but doesn't rebound as well. We probably played him at center because he's the biggest guy on the team.

Seraphin will always be a little undersized for a center though because of his height. He's heavy and athletic and strong, but length will always be a match up problem. Wish we could find a defensive seven footer to add to the mix.

---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 12:51 PM ----------

Both MKG and Beal could easily start and play 34-36 minutes a game for us next year. Lord we are bad on the wing.

Mike Schmidt's videos have been amazing. He keeps delivering.

MKG:

Austin Rivers:

[SuperBash]

Draft night can't get here soon enough.

[Samuels]

Steve, how in the world can you justify taking Beal at #3 thats insanity, you even said so last week.

Honestly for example what does he do better then Barnes?

Rebound? Put him on Unc doubtful. Beal did' nt rebound that well in high school and played Sf this year with shotjacking guards and no legit bigs.

I take all these guys over Beal without hesitation

Davis

Drummond

Barnes

Mkg

Trob

He is' nt a top 3 pick in any draft, period

[SuperBash]

Beal is easily in my top 3.

1. Davis

2a Trob

2b Beal

4. MKG

5. Barnes

6. Drummond

[Going Commando]

Steve, how in the world can you justify taking Beal at #3 thats insanity, you even said so last week.

Honestly for example what does he do better then Barnes?

Handles the ball better, takes better shots, passes better, and defends better. Beal is a better athlete than Barnes and has a better BBall IQ IMO. I think he's a better three point shooter than Barnes too.

He is' nt a top 3 pick in any draft, period

He's close enough to top 3 and fills a huge need that it doesn't matter that much if we take him at three or if we were sitting at five and took him.

Beal slumped early in the season, but came on strong late. If you take that latter part of the season as a better indication of what Beal is capable of, then he makes a lot of sense. He could be a lights out off ball shooter and perimeter defender. Higher upside than Barnes for sure.

The more I think about it, the less I think we should be the ones to draft Drummond. I just don't see him developing here. We need self starters and high motor players who can handle a ton of playing time early. Because whoever we draft at three, we pretty much need them to come in and start day one. I would take Beal over Drummond.

I don't think I'd take him over MKG. MKG is too good. But I'd take him over Barnes because I think Beal ends up being the better NBA player. I think Beal was already a better college player last season as a Freshman than Barnes was as a Sophomore.

Don't know about TRob. TRob was clearly the second best player in college BBall last year. But we probably need a SG or SF a lot more than we need a PF. If need comes into play, you can probably make a case for Beal over TRob.

[SuperBash]

It's like you're reading my mind, Steve.

[Going Commando]

It's like you're reading my mind, Steve.

I've come full circle on Beal. I loved him during the season, and if you go way back in the thread, I think I was the first to mention him. Then I watched Florida in the tourney and saw how stagnant their offense was when they weren't draining threes. Nobody could create anything for themselves. Their PG play was really, really bad in that loss. Offensive play was brutal, it left an impression. I didn't want to get trapped with a team full of guys who can't create. Only Wall and Crawford have any offensive creativity whatsoever as it is.

I didn't like Beal as much because I didn't think he could create his own shots but I've read DX's breakdowns and Beal was actually good getting into the paint and scoring around the rim, not bad. His handles aren't great, but they're good enough to get him good looks around the rim and he's legitimately dangerous in transition. I was underestimating his scoring ability.

So I'm back where I was on him before. Concerns about his handles and creativity have been eased. I already loved all of the other parts of his game. I don't see anyway he doesn't eventually become a terrific player for us if we draft him. Very little bust potential.

Another thing I like about Beal is his toughness and strength. I like that he played safety and quarterback and wide receiver. I like basketball players who were good football players before they settled on basketball because they bring an athleticism and ruggedness to their game.

[Mr Awesome]

Terrence Jones = Jeff Green.

Everyone on here was talking about signing Jeff Green...well, here's the younger and less risky version.

[Going Commando]

That Austin Rivers video gets ugly at the end.

Even Nick Young was impressed after watching that display of selfishness and shot jacking. Nobody wants to play with a guy like that.

His scoring ability is absolutely electric. During the Ohio State game he did something so crazy they pan into the crowd to where LeBron and DWade were sitting and even they were outwardly impressed. Wade had a look on his face like he just thought to himself, "Damn, this kid can score."

But Rivers is simply not the type of player we need to draft. We're just got rid of a bunch of our selfish players. We're just now getting to the point where we're playing ball like a real team. Rivers could be our best scorer by his first or second year but still make us worse.

[Skins199021]

Yea I want Beal or trade the pick for Harden

We need an actual outside threat and one that doens't just chuck the ball up (Young/Crawford)

[Going Commando]

We're not going to trade the pick for Harden.

For starters, we couldn't beat Charlotte's preexisting offer.

Second, Ted already said we're not trading the third pick for a veteran(s).

Also, I'm not convinced that would be our best move. Harden wouldn't necessarily be Harden here. For one thing, he'd be our starting 2G and #1 offensive option. By those two factors alone, he'd have a much different role here than he does in OKC where he's the third option and the sixth man.

[StillUnknown]

We're not going to trade the pick for Harden.

For starters, we couldn't beat Charlotte's preexisting offer.

Second, Ted already said we're not trading the third pick for a veteran(s).

Also, I'm not convinced that would be our best move. Harden wouldn't necessarily be Harden here. For one thing, he'd be our starting 2G and #1 offensive option. By those two factors alone, he'd have a much different role here than he does in OKC where he's the third option and the sixth man.

He'd be a massive roster upgrade for us though. Just because it would be a different role for Harden, doesn't mean he wouldn't be up to fulfilling the extra responsibilities.

[nuposse87]

Steve, how in the world can you justify taking Beal at #3 thats insanity, you even said so last week.

Honestly for example what does he do better then Barnes?

Rebound? Put him on Unc doubtful. Beal did' nt rebound that well in high school and played Sf this year with shotjacking guards and no legit bigs.

I take all these guys over Beal without hesitation

Davis

Drummond

Barnes

Mkg

Trob

He is' nt a top 3 pick in any draft, period

I already showed you a statistical breakdown of how Beal was a better played in his freshman year than Barnes has been in his 2 seasons. You haven't given one coherent argument other than explaining why Barnes is a better prospect. Do I have to give you the break down again?

---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 03:16 PM ----------

He'd be a massive roster upgrade for us though. Just because it would be a different role for Harden, doesn't mean he wouldn't be up to fulfilling the extra responsibilities.

He is also a FA after 2013, depending on who we draft will let us know if we're going to make a big run at him. As it stands now, I would see OKC paying up to keep him, even if that is near max money.

[Skins199021]

Well than Ted would be an idiot not to do so if the oppurtunity presented itself.

Harden averaged almost 17 points a game on 10 FGAs per game. He isn't the "6th man" because he can't start they just do it for the matchups I guess, but to think he cannot start is absurd. Plus ok he is a veteran.... but he is 22 that is not mortgaging the future at all..... that would just be enhancing it.

[Going Commando]

He'd be a massive roster upgrade for us though. Just because it would be a different role for Harden, doesn't mean he wouldn't be up to fulfilling the extra responsibilities.

True. Point is, you're paying a premium for OKC James Harden and you're not entirely sure what you'll be getting in return--other than the absolute fact that it won't be OKC James Harden.

These kinds of moves for veteran players--especially "systemy" guys like Harden--always carry far more risk than fans typically acknowledge.

I don't want to get stuck paying a premium for stats a guy produced for some other team.

Then there is also the matter of his contract.

Harden just isn't going to happen. I'm not sure I'd want it to, even if it were in consideration. I think that kind of move is short sighted and smacks of old Wizards and would cap us out at mediocre.

[Skins199021]

yes getting a top SG who is 22 is very short-sighted.....

I mean you probably do a trade based on him signing an extension like any trade involving a soon to be FA. He is not a systemy guy, he shot nearly 50%. We would be absolutely lucky if out draft pick becomes as good as harden.

He is one year older than Wall and much much better

Edited June 15, 2012 by Skins199021

[Going Commando]

It'd be ironic if we dealt away the third pick to acquire Harden, a player drafted the year we got ourselves in trouble for dealing away a top five pick for veterans who filled short term needs.

---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 04:43 PM ----------

yes getting a top SG who is 22 is very short-sighted.....

I mean you probably do a trade based on him signing an extension like any trade involving a soon to be FA. He is not a systemy guy, he shot nearly 50%. We would be absolutely lucky if out draft pick becomes as good as harden.

Harden is a marginal athlete and the third scoring option on his team PLUS he's a sixth man. If that doesn't scream system player to you then I don't know what to tell you.

There is simply no way he'd be as good for us as he is for OKC. Just going from the third to first option alone ensures that. He's a low touches jumpshooter and facilitator who brings a spark off the bench.

Wait a sec, I don't even know why I'm getting sucked into this argument, it's simply not going to happen.

[Skins199021]

It'd be ironic if we dealt away the third pick to acquire Harden, a player drafted the year we got ourselves in trouble for dealing away a top five pick for veterans who filled short term needs.

---------- Post added June-15th-2012 at 04:43 PM ----------

Probably not

But still i feel like thats nuts. So tell me you think Thabo is better than Harden, and thats why Harden is the "6th man"? If he plays say 37 minutes a game he averages over 20 points a game. He is no more a system guy than Westbrook is and he is a hell a lot more efficient than Westy.

Ur in the all draft pick trades for someone in the league is bad group. Yes thats was the skins did but they were just dumb, not because they traded draft picks, but because they traded its for players that were 30+ not 22.

If you wouldn't deal 3 and our 2 for Harden + an extension I am extremely glad you are not the Wiz GM.

Again you bring up that foye/Miller trade as if it has any bearing on this..... not Ernie was just ****ing stupid and that isn't hindsight everyone knew it then too. I wanted Derozan so bad and than we trade for scrubs.

Harden is a marginal athlete and the third scoring option on his team PLUS he's a sixth man. If that doesn't scream system player to you then I don't know what to tell you.

There is simply no way he'd be as good for us as he is for OKC. Just going from the third to first option alone ensures that. He's a low touches jumpshooter and facilitator who brings a spark off the bench.

Wait a sec, I don't even know why I'm getting sucked into this argument, it's simply not going to happen.

Edited June 15, 2012 by Skins199021

[Going Commando]

I feel like Harden's role as the sixth man is being misunderstood, and not by me.

Harden is a sixth man in the same way Manu is a sixth man.

Harden coming off the bench as the sixth man does not mean that Thabo Sefalosha is a better overall player than him.

It means that Thabo is a better fit in the starting lineup between Westbrook and Durant because he can defend.

BUT, having Harden come off the bench means he plays against the second line more often than a regular starter. It means his matchups are more favorable than a regular starter. And in addition to that, he's a secondary or tertiary offensive option at almost all times he's in the game. He's in his absolute ideal situation right now, a situation we can't replicate.

His efficiency would drop once he becomes a regular starter and a primary option. That's simply reality no matter where he ended up. Defensive pressure would be much higher for him. Efficiency is by far his greatest selling point.

Not to mention he'll no longer get to play alongside two top fifteen players, one of which is the pre-eminent scorer in the league.

[Skins199021]

Oh come on he doesn't play over 30 min per game and not play against starters. He did perfectly fine last night (actually extremely well) and he played 35 min against Miami's starters most of the time