BRAVEONAWARPATH Posted July 9, 2017 Author Share Posted July 9, 2017 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 I think the difference is, we knew Wall had superstar potential and Beal had All Star potential. I don't think Porter is at that level. I think at best he'll be a really good #3 option but more likely he's the 4th best player on a championship contender. Is that worth $100 Mil over 4 years? Honestly in today's NBA, yeah it probably is. Salaries are just absurd. We'd be fine if we didn't lock ourselves into that horrible Mahimi deal and didn't keep throwing draft picks away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 25 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: We'd be fine if we didn't lock ourselves into that horrible Mahimi deal and didn't keep throwing draft picks away. True. ****ing Mahinmi. ****ing Grunfeld. We're going to have to trade our 2018 pick to dump Mahinmi. At least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 6 hours ago, BRAVEONAWARPATH said: You ain't lyin... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 13 hours ago, BRAVEONAWARPATH said: kinda removes all context, but ok Wall was more of an injury concern, not many seriously doubted his skillset Beal was also injury related, but more concerns about his play. He had "playoff Beal" to fall back on though to prove his ultimate worth Otto has been durable, with minor spots here and there. He's a super efficient roleplayer who has the good fortune of timing. Nothing about his play makes him a max, meaning elite, player. His vaunted efficiency would nosedive if he ever had more responsibility. this is not an "i hate Otto" post either. I'm pretty indifferent on Otto overall, I hate the situation more than anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 Wall absolutely had his detractors in the fanbase and it wasn't really about his injury. It took Wall too long to gain the respect and confidence of the fanbase. Our fans are fairly ****ty TBH. And the anti-Beal sentiment was way stronger last year than the anti-Otto sentiment this year. Makes sense as Otto is coming off a 9 win share season and is more of a proven commodity than Beal was at the same point last year. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 9 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said: Wall absolutely had his detractors in the fanbase and it wasn't really about his injury. It took Wall too long to gain the respect and confidence of the fanbase. Our fans are fairly ****ty TBH. And the anti-Beal sentiment was way stronger last year than the anti-Otto sentiment this year. Makes sense as Otto is coming off a 9 win share season and is more of a proven commodity than Beal was at the same point last year. as a person who was unsure of Wall and anti-Beal, I agree. I don't think that makes us "fairly ****ty" though. I did not root against either player, and I don't think anyone else did. I was not sure Wall would ever put it together because of hte mess of this organization, and Beal's dribbling bothered me (and still does). But they showed they up for it. I also agree that Otto is not getting it anywhere near as bad. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 1 hour ago, BenningRoadSkin said: as a person who was unsure of Wall and anti-Beal, I agree. I don't think that makes us "fairly ****ty" though. I did not root against either player, and I don't think anyone else did. I was not sure Wall would ever put it together because of hte mess of this organization, and Beal's dribbling bothered me (and still does). But they showed they up for it. I also agree that Otto is not getting it anywhere near as bad. Fair enough. And don't get me wrong, I 100% understand where the pessimism in the fan base comes from. Any honest look at this franchise over the last 30 years concludes that it's been one of the worst in the NBA. Probably bottom three. The pessimism is a natural defense mechanism for fans who have always been disappointed when setting positive expectations. This particular rebuild has been different though. I know I'm a homer, but this team has been rewarding homers. Wall and Beal have been fulfilling their potential and I think Porter will too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wizards-insider/wp/2017/07/08/five-observations-from-the-wizards-summer-league-debut/?utm_term=.bc5eb0917f5f Quote The Wizards consider McCullough to be their 2017 first-round draft pick. He came over from Brooklyn in a trade deadline deal, and though he has technically been in the league since 2015, he’s still a bit of a mystery. the word has come down from on high Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 17 minutes ago, StillUnknown said: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wizards-insider/wp/2017/07/08/five-observations-from-the-wizards-summer-league-debut/?utm_term=.bc5eb0917f5f the word has come down from on high The off season version of "moral victory." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRobi21 Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 53 minutes ago, StillUnknown said: word has come down from on high We all saw that one coming. Wall and Tim Frazier sitting courtside together at SL game vs MIA. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 2 hours ago, StillUnknown said: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wizards-insider/wp/2017/07/08/five-observations-from-the-wizards-summer-league-debut/?utm_term=.bc5eb0917f5f the word has come down from on high I'm telling you, man, if you don't laugh, you'll cry. You maybe coulda sold me on Bogs being our 1st round pick, I'm not falling for this Looney Tunes nonsense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins199021 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 The anti Beal and Wall made no sense. They were worth maxes but some people, especially with Wall's case acted like we are some prestigious franchise and had this way better option. We have also had the tendency to ignore all positive aspects of someone game and focus on the negatives. Beal was certainly worth a max, I know it can be difficult for some to accept, but guys usually don't put up insane numbers their first couple of years. Beal showed a lot. One of the best shooters in the game with a nice playmaking ability. I was pro beal for a max, seemed like one of the few. Porter is not a max type player. He can lack confidence at times, he apparently just doesn't hit the gym. Very good spot up shooter (made better by Wall), with some decent defense,... but other than that was is he good at? He doesn't really ever make for himself, or others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Beal was paid on expected future potential and when he received a max deal he was a major gamble IMO. Let's no rewrite history because he finally put together a good season, after he received his max extension. Prior to this season he couldn't stay healthy, didn't put up impressive sustained season-long numbers, and had some serious personal clashes with John Wall on the court. That's not the resume of a player that would normally be considered a safe bet. The market is what earned him a max extension. He did have one thing that made a max deal feel like it made sense; he could create his own offense. Otto Porter is basically the opposite of Beal. He has significantly better advanced numbers than Beal did on both sides of the ball and is a better shooter. The problem with Otto is that he's missing that key component, he does not create his own offense. There aren't a lot of star wings that can't create their own offense. Can anyone think of a current all star wing that can't create his own shot? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 I admit I was against giving Beal the max. I'm glad to be wrong but at the time it just didn't seem smart to me to max out a guy who never made the All Star game and never even averaged 20 PPG. I always liked his talent but just didn't think it was smart. Like I said, glad to be wrong. You just can't look at the raw total dollar figure anymore. Salaries are just absurd. In today's NBA a player like Porter is absolutely worth $100 Mil+. And remember Porter is only, what, 23? He could still get better. Paul George didn't really become PAUL GEORGE until after 3 or 4 years. Not saying Porter will become that good, but you gotta give young talent a chance to develop. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 I was anti Beal for the same reasons @Warhead36listed and on top of that, he couldn't stay healthy. Salaries are indeed ridiculous right now. It's going to take awhile to shake out what's fair market value for someone like Otto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRobi21 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 Sheldon Mac looked decent today our 2017 1st Round pick did not. Lack of PG play isn't helping him, but I expected to at least see a flash or two from him, so far, nothing through 3 summer league games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 43 minutes ago, StillUnknown said: Sheldon Mac looked decent today our 2017 1st Round pick did not. Lack of PG play isn't helping him, but I expected to at least see a flash or two from him, so far, nothing through 3 summer league games Not a problem, just tell yourself that Sheldon Mac is really our 2017 1st round pick. Mental gymnastics are how we do things here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 McCullough had 11&10 yesterday in 23 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 11 hours ago, Destino said: Otto Porter is basically the opposite of Beal. He has significantly better advanced numbers than Beal did on both sides of the ball and is a better shooter. The problem with Otto is that he's missing that key component, he does not create his own offense. There aren't a lot of star wings that can't create their own offense. Can anyone think of a current all star wing that can't create his own shot? No, but you know what, I was impressed by the growth in Beal's handles and off ball movement last year. Is it that far fetched to say Otto can't do the same? I'll tell you what I really want to see: Wall moving without the ball to get open for jumpshots. He's starting to hit those, why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: No, but you know what, I was impressed by the growth in Beal's handles and off ball movement last year. Is it that far fetched to say Otto can't do the same? I'll tell you what I really want to see: Wall moving without the ball to get open for jumpshots. He's starting to hit those, why not? Yep Beal improved a lot. He wasn't as good a ball handler in years past. Helps to have legit coaching. I do expect a jump in Porter's game. What are the chances he's an All Star in an East that is so bare bones now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, Warhead36 said: Yep Beal improved a lot. He wasn't as good a ball handler in years past. Helps to have legit coaching. I do expect a jump in Porter's game. What are the chances he's an All Star in an East that is so bare bones now? Good question. Looking at all star roster, I don't think he'll be better then Greek Freak or LeBron, but I can see him either sneaking in or getting eeked out last minute like Melo did Beal. PG and Butler moving west definitely opens it up for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Renegade7 said: Good question. Looking at all star roster, I don't think he'll be better then Greek Freak or LeBron, but I can see him either sneaking in or getting eeked out last minute like Melo did Beal. PG and Butler moving west definitely opens it up for him. Yeah I figure no George and Milsap is West too. Butler was a G anyway so no competition there. Obviously Lebron has one F spot on lock and you gotta put Giannis in as well. Maybe he can get in as a reserve. Forgot though Heyward is in the East now too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: Forgot though Heyward is in the East now too. Ya, I forgot that, too. My dad swears its a push between him and Otto, I keep telling him he didn't see Heyward play enough, he demolished us not once, but twice, watched him do it. Edit: NBA.com has Butler and Greek Freak as G/F, I always thought of them as SF, but its whatever Edited July 12, 2017 by Renegade7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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