justice98 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 50 minutes ago, Skin'emAlive said: Matt Barnes!? **** no. He can spend the rest of the season stalking Fisher after late nights at the club. Don't want that clown near DC. He's always had a good reputation as teammate and good guy to coach. On the floor, he knows his role and plays it effectively. I dont care what he does with Derek Fisher. I guarantee he winds up on a contender cuz people value what he can bring on a team in that spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins199021 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Yeah people crapping on Barnes, yet would be the best scorer by far on our bench..... sadly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) Wojo incoming... Edit:. Or not. Edited February 21, 2017 by TryTheBeal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Barnes would steal minutes from Kelly. No thanks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRobi21 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor703 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Two years in a row we aren't going to have draft picks lmfao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Better be top 29 protected Lou Williams is not turning us into a legit contender. We're better off shooting for potential in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Yeah Lou Williams doesn't get us to beat the Cavs. The only way we beat the Cavs is if they're injured, in which case, we wouldn't need Williams. Mortgaging the future for marginal short term improvements just isn't smart for a team that's not a contender. We need to be patient and disciplined. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'emAlive Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Lou is not worth a first. Morris was worth a first. Marcin was worth a first. But Lou isn't pushing the needle. I sure hope that if we have to trade this year's first, it's for more than Lou Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBash Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 On the other hand, we are getting to the point where our first round pick isn't all that important. Once you get to the mid to late 20s in the first round, those things almost get traded like candy and aren't worth a whole lot. I get that it is a deep draft but really how deep? And Ernie is picking who doesn't have a great track record of picking outside the top 3, to be honest? What would you look for with that pick? A young athletic big with potential? Probably gone by pick 25. A bench scorer? You could get a proven bench scorer with Lou Williams. Im not saying trade the pick, but the value of it is a bit overstated. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOSKINS_08 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) Yeah count me in as being okay with a first round pick being traded for Lou Williams. Yeah Golden state will win the title and we're not better than them but we have a chance to get to the East Finals and play a very competitive series with Cleveland. I know a championship is the goal but getting to the East Finals goes a long way with players potentially coming here in the future and Lou Williams certainly helps that. He's averaging almost 19 a game, our entire bench doesn't score 19 in most games for us. Edited February 21, 2017 by GOSKINS_08 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Fight4RGIII said: On the other hand, we are getting to the point where our first round pick isn't all that important. Once you get to the mid to late 20s in the first round, those things almost get traded like candy and aren't worth a whole lot. I get that it is a deep draft but really how deep? And Ernie is picking who doesn't have a great track record of picking outside the top 3, to be honest? What would you look for with that pick? A young athletic big with potential? Probably gone by pick 25. A bench scorer? You could get a proven bench scorer with Lou Williams. Im not saying trade the pick, but the value of it is a bit overstated. I agree with this. However, I hope EG is exploring ALL options before giving up the pick. If the 1st rounder is given up as part of the package, it makes the 2nd round pick that much more important. We're now in a league where 2nd round picks not only make the 15 man roster, but a lot of guys are contributing in their rookie, 1st or 2nd years. *edit* I think I'd be OK w/ Barnes on the roster. He's a good defender and would be another body to throw at Lebron (to hopefully get under his skin, too) if we played them in the playoffs. Edited February 21, 2017 by RonArtest15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weganator Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) I'm not too excited about the idea of trading for Lou Williams. Between him over performing, the cost, and the fact that he won't get nearly the same number of foul calls in the playoffs / him outside of a Lakers jersey it just reeks of a move we regret later. Edited February 21, 2017 by Weganator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weganator Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Whatever move does get made, I hope it comes before Thursday. We have one easy (knock on wood) game against the 76ers before our schedule starts to pick up again. It would go a long way to have our acquisition hopefully get some good minutes with the bench on Friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Only thing for me is that the team for the first time in ages feel legitimately close. The core is 26, 23, 23, and our real window comes 3 to 5 years from now. What we need now is to either hit on multiple post 20 picks with solid contributors or get one stupidly lucky late pick in the mold of Leonard or Gorbert. I think post 20 picks still pan out at about 15% to 25% range, which is certainly a crap shoot, but when you throw 3 to 5 attempts at it, you are likely to hit at least one (but of course, there is the Ernie factor) From Zach Lowe's article today http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/18727231/zach-lowe-jimmy-butler-boston-celtics-latest-nba-trade-deadline-talk Quote The Clippers are still kicking the tires on everything, including their pipedream of snaring Carmelo Anthony from the Kazoos without giving up any of their core four guys. They've called about almost every available small forward type, but no one is in a rush to take Jamal Crawford, Austin Rivers, and a distant first-round pick. That won't get them Wilson Chandler, and the Wiz threw their phones on the floor when the Clippers inquired about Otto Porter, per league sources. I lol'd 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Good. They shouldn't even consider moving that dude and take it as a call to war that you think we are stupid enough to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Otto ain't going anywhere!* *some restrictions apply 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Fight4RGIII said: On the other hand, we are getting to the point where our first round pick isn't all that important. Once you get to the mid to late 20s in the first round, those things almost get traded like candy and aren't worth a whole lot. I get that it is a deep draft but really how deep? And Ernie is picking who doesn't have a great track record of picking outside the top 3, to be honest? What would you look for with that pick? A young athletic big with potential? Probably gone by pick 25. A bench scorer? You could get a proven bench scorer with Lou Williams. Im not saying trade the pick, but the value of it is a bit overstated. This was more true in yesterday's NBA. Not any more. When the cap jumped, rookie contracts didn't scale up proportionally. They are a market inefficiency now--the most efficient deals considering cost vs control and production outside of max contracts for the likes of LeBron. And the punitive luxury tax system that was created in 2011 is something to actually fear now, and you teams who are deep in the tax like Cleveland being squeezed on their benches because paying a bench guy making like 7 million a year will actually cost them like 15-20 million dollars and they end up losing revenue in a year they won the championship. Draft picks are the key to sustainable spending. They're the key to fielding a decent bench. That's why no one is willing to give them up this year. Two years ago Cleveland paid two firsts to get Mozgov. This year Sacramento gets a single protected first for DeMarcus Cousins. The value of draft picks has changed. Also this FO has a better draft record than we give them credit for. JaVale, NY, Seraphin, and Booker are all still in the league. Jordan Clarkson and Shelvin Mack are still in the league. Sato and Oubre were good finds for how late they were taken. Aside from that 2011 class, the FO has used the draft well since 2010 and it's the reason we're good today. Saying something to the effect of "well Ernie sucks at the draft anyway" is a poor rationalization for making short sighted trades. I look at the Warriors, Rockets, and Spurs today as examples of how valuable draft picks can be. Those organizations keep their picks and patiently develop their drafted talent and they are power teams whose rotations include a lot of late first and second rounders. That kind of sustainability and stability is what we need to be shooting for. I don't want us to only be good for like two years and then take a major step back because we lost guys like Oubre to free agency and had nobody in the pipeline after him. I want us to get to the point like Houston or San Antonio where a sub 40 win season is unheard of. Now speaking to who might be available at the 24th pick this year, a young athletic big with potential or an upperclassmen wing with an NBA ready body and skill set is exactly the kind of guy you're looking for, and who is often available. Montrezl Harrell was the 32nd pick in his draft. Draymond Green was the 35th pick in his. Jae Crowder went 34th. Malcolm Brogdon went 36th. These guys are out there every single year. This year I like Caleb Swanigan and Josh Hart to be that kind of gem. I would much rather draft Josh Hart at 24 than trade the pick for a season and a half of Lou Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 14 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said: I look at the Warriors, Rockets, and Spurs today as examples of how valuable draft picks can be. Those organizations keep their picks and patiently develop their drafted talent and they are power teams whose rotations include a lot of late first and second rounders. That kind of sustainability and stability is what we need to be shooting for. I don't want us to only be good for like two years and then take a major step back because we lost guys like Oubre to free agency and had nobody in the pipeline after him. I want us to get to the point like Houston or San Antonio where a sub 40 win season is unheard of. I dont know if I agree with that characterization of how those teams were built. Except for maybe the Spurs. But the Spurs are like the Patriots, often imitated, never duplicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popeman38 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Houston? Harden - Trade Gordon - UFA Nene - UFA Beverley - Trade Ariza - UFA Brewer - Trade Ennis - Trade McDaniels - Trade Brown - UFA Wiltjer - UDFA Onuaku - 2016 2nd Dekker - 2015 1st Harrell - 2015 2nd Of their entire roster, only 3 players were drafted by the Rockets. How exactly does Houston "value" their draft picks? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popeman38 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Warriors: Curry - 2009 1st Thompson - 2011 1st Green - 2012 2nd Durant - UFA West - UFA Livingston - UFA McGee - UFA Pachulia - UFA Iguodala - UFA Jones - 2016 1st McCraw - 2016 2nd Looney - 2015 1st Clark - UDFA McAdoo - UDFA Weber - UDFA The Warriors drafted 3/5 of their starting line-up. The other 3 draft picks on their roster are JAGs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 4 minutes ago, Popeman38 said: Warriors: Curry - 2009 1st Thompson - 2011 1st Green - 2012 2nd Durant - UFA West - UFA Livingston - UFA McGee - UFA Pachulia - UFA Iguodala - UFA Jones - 2016 1st McCraw - 2016 2nd Looney - 2015 1st Clark - UDFA McAdoo - UDFA Weber - UDFA The Warriors drafted 3/5 of their starting line-up. The other 3 draft picks on their roster are JAGs. Even 2 of the 3 in the starting lineup were in the lottery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Popeman38 said: Houston? Harden - Trade Gordon - UFA Nene - UFA Beverley - Trade Ariza - UFA Brewer - Trade Ennis - Trade McDaniels - Trade Brown - UFA Wiltjer - UDFA Onuaku - 2016 2nd Dekker - 2015 1st Harrell - 2015 2nd Of their entire roster, only 3 players were drafted by the Rockets. How exactly does Houston "value" their draft picks? I'll give them credit because Capela (you left him out), Dekker, and Harrell are solid contributors in their rotation. The Wiz would take any of them. But I still wouldnt hold on to those picks if I thought a move could be made. As far as the draft is concerned, the Wiz can be proud of their roster. Most good teams don't have 3 core players and a key bench contributor outta the draft. They're doing better than most. Edited February 21, 2017 by justice98 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 I think he is saying that they get value from their trades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 29 minutes ago, Popeman38 said: Of their entire roster, only 3 players were drafted by the Rockets. How exactly does Houston "value" their draft picks? The Rockets are one of the best drafting teams in the league. They use their picks to stockpile assets and value. This is the list of guys they've picked since 2010: 2010 1 14 Patrick Patterson USA PF Kentucky 2011 1 14 Marcus Morris USA PF Kansas 2011 1 23 Nikola Mirotić[w] ESP PF Real Madrid (Spain) 2011 2 38 Chandler Parsons USA SF Florida 2012 1 12 Jeremy Lamb USA SG Connecticut 2012 1 16 Royce White USA PF Iowa State 2012 1 18 Terrence Jones USA PF Kentucky 2012 2 44 Furkan Aldemir (from Los Angeles Clippers)[x] TUR SF/PF Galatasaray (Turkey) 2013 2 34 Isaiah Canaan (from Phoenix Suns)[y] USA PG Murray State 2014 1 25 Clint Capela CHE PF Élan Chalon (France) 2014 2 42 Nick Johnson (from New York Knicks)[z] USA PG/SG Arizona 2015 1 18 Sam Dekker (from New Orleans)[aa] USA SF Wisconsin 2015 2 32 Montrezl Harrell (from New York)[z] USA PF Louisville 2016 2 37 Chinanu Onuaku (from New York via Portland and Sacramento)[ab] USA PF/C Louisville 2016 2 43 Zhou Qi CHN C Xinjiang Flying Tigers (China) Jump up That's over a 50% hit rate and in that span their one lottery pick was Lamb--a part of the package that got them Harden. That is the way a good organization uses draft picks. They don't trade them off for the likes of Lou Williams. That's how you end up like the Clippers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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