twa Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 You do realize that the President, Vice President, and the Cabinet are all part of the executive branch, right? ("Dick" Cheney's preposterous claims notwithstanding.) The alloction of responsibility within the branch does nothing to increase its power or independence. I thought that was what i said? Originally Posted by twa View Post Can you explain how you feel the VP can change it's legislative duties? Can't and won't happen,except shepherding legislation....Not even Cheney could pull that off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dockeryfan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 twa, don't you think this shows a lack of understanding on Palin's part? VPs do not spend their time in the Senate. Technically the "president of the Senate", but they delegate the authority to the President pro temp, and practically never even go to the Senate while it is in session. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboDaMan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I thought that was what i said? Originally Posted by twa View Post Can you explain how you feel the VP can change it's legislative duties? Can't and won't happen,except shepherding legislation....Not even Cheney could pull that off Because the Constitution says the VP is the President of the Senate. Palin has told us repeatedly she believes that places her in control of the Senate. What about her character and demeanor leads you to believe she would shrink from attempting to take charge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Palin thinks the VP is in charge of the Senate? I mean, seriously, it's a position that has no power. It's like she has no idea how the Senate actually works. The power in the Senate lies with party leaders and individual senators. The VP would cast a tie vote, but that's it. Guess how many days Cheney presided over the Senate? I bet you could count them on one hand, or just a few fingers. Again we seem to be trying to get a 'gotcha" moment with semantics The VP "presides" over the Senate. That is what John Adams did. He actually sat in there, reading a newspaper as the Senate debated twa, don't you think this shows a lack of understanding on Palin's part?VPs do not spend their time in the Senate. Technically the "president of the Senate", but they delegate the authority to the President pro temp, and practically never even go to the Senate while it is in session. Never really need to unless they need to cast a tie breaker. But it is one of the duties outlined in the Constitution "President of the Senate" So to me saying "in charge of" is no biggie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dockeryfan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Because the Constitution says the VP is the President of the Senate. Palin has told us repeatedly she believes that places her in control of the Senate. What about her character and demeanor leads you to believe she would shrink from attempting to take charge? She can't take charge, because the Senators would not allow it. But the bigger problem is that she doesn't even understand Robert's Rules of Order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 twa, don't you think this shows a lack of understanding on Palin's part?VPs do not spend their time in the Senate. Technically the "president of the Senate", but they delegate the authority to the President pro temp, and practically never even go to the Senate while it is in session. VP's do not typically do so,however the executive branch does propose and push legislation...perhaps she sees this as her future role? The more likely answer is she was just spouting off bs though:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dockeryfan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Again we seem to be trying to get a 'gotcha" moment with semanticsThe VP "presides" over the Senate. That is what John Adams did. He actually sat in there, reading a newspaper as the Senate debated So haw many days do you think any recent VP has spent in the Senate while it is in session? Ballpark it for me. 75% of the time, 25% of the time, whatever you think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 A more interesting question is how many Senators actually spend time in the senate....at least to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 So haw many days do you think any recent VP has spent in the Senate while it is in session?Ballpark it for me. 75% of the time, 25% of the time, whatever you think. Who cares. Less then .5 percent Trying to get a "gotcha" on Governor Palin on THIS is rather stupid when there are so many other things you can The VP "presides over the Senate" That is what the Constitution says regardless of what is practiced Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Again we seem to be trying to get a 'gotcha" moment with semantics Good god, now second graders are asking "gotcha" questions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Good god, now second graders are asking "gotcha" questions? LOL This thread is a "gotcha" thread, and a really bad one in fact At least 57 states was really incorrect. What Governor Palin said isn't "incorrect" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Biden said he didnt even want the job, the VP doesnt do anything on Ellen Degenris' show Because he is right. Unless you are Dick Cheney and set up a shadow presidency, the VP does nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 LOLThis thread is a "gotcha" thread, and a really bad one in fact At least 57 states was really incorrect. What Governor Palin said isn't "incorrect" I mostly agree. It was just poorly worded. There is a lack of presumption of innocence here mainly due to Cheney. Cheney has tried to expand the role of the Vice Presidency and the Executive. So as the vp heir apparent, we are filtering what she says through Cheney. That's probably not fair to her. Mostly, it was a clumbsy and inaccurate (although possibly not incorrect) defining of the VP role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 So haw many days do you think any recent VP has spent in the Senate while it is in session?Ballpark it for me. 75% of the time, 25% of the time, whatever you think. Its really irrelevant. She could if she wanted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 From the Constitution "The Vice President of the United States shall be President of the Senate, but shall have no Vote, unless they be equally divided." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Mostly, it was a clumbsy and inaccurate (although possibly not incorrect) defining of the VP role. Clumsy? Yea I wouldn't exactly say inaccurate though. But again, it just depends what side you are on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toe Jam Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Well there's always the porn film coming out called "Nailin Paylin". Yes it's true.....:doh: . Google it. I've seen it. It is great.:laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Clumsy? YeaI wouldn't exactly say inaccurate though. But again, it just depends what side you are on Here's where I sort of see it. The VP's role as Pres of the Senate is tiebreaker. VP's usually don't rule the Senate or guide or control the actions or direction of the debates or even what is allowed to come to the floor. So, what she said is inaccurate. On the other hand, Presidents and VPs do call Senators to propose ideas and to try to gather support for ideas they back or feel they need, so to that extent... she will be constantly engaged in legislative activity... so what she said is not really incorrect either... but it was inaccurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dockeryfan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Who cares. Less then .5 percentTrying to get a "gotcha" on Governor Palin on THIS is rather stupid when there are so many other things you can The VP "presides over the Senate" That is what the Constitution says regardless of what is practiced Less than 0.5%. And you think this is good answer to the question "what does the vice president do"? You don't think that you would pick something you do a MAJORITY of the time to characterize a job description to a 3rd grader? WTF. There were 190 days in the last session. 0.5% would be less than one day. So ZERO days of presiding over the senate is a good to put as the FIRST THING you list in terms of job description? That's great. I'd love to see how you pad your resume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 There is a lack of presumption of innocence here mainly due to Cheney. I disagree. I think it's because she has never coherently explained what the VP's job/role. She has repeated this explanation of the role of the VP on more then one occassion including in the Debate. These are the two different explanations of the VP job. "Well, our founding fathers were very wise there in allowing through the Constitution much flexibility there in the office of the vice president. And we will do what is best for the American people in tapping into that position and ushering in an agenda that is supportive and cooperative with the president's agenda in that position. Yeah, so I do agree with him that we have a lot of flexibility in there, and we'll do what we have to do to administer very appropriately the plans that are needed for this nation. And it is my executive experience that is partly to be attributed to my pick as V.P. with McCain, not only as a governor, but earlier on as a mayor, as an oil and gas regulator, as a business owner. It is those years of experience on an executive level that will be put to good use in the White House also." "A vice president has a really great job because not only are they there to support the president's agenda, they're there like the team member, the teammate to the president," Palin continued. “But also, they're in charge of the United States Senate, so if they want to they can really get in there with the senators and make a lot of good policy changes that will make life better for Brandon and his family and his classroom. And it's a great job and I look forward to having that job.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Less than 0.5%. And you think this is good answer to the question "what does the vice president do"? You don't think that you would pick something you do a MAJORITY of the time to characterize a job description to a 3rd grader? WTF.There were 190 days in the last session. 0.5% would be less than one day. So ZERO days of presiding over the senate is a good to put as the FIRST THING you list in terms of job description? That's great. I'd love to see how you pad your resume. Again "The Vice President of the United States shall be President of the Senate, but shall have no Vote, unless they be equally divided." I will continue to point to that KEY phrase over and over and over again. My defense in this argument is the US Constitution. Yours is, well honestly I am not sure what it is, or what argument you have Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Here's where I sort of see it. The VP's role as Pres of the Senate is tiebreaker. VP's usually don't rule the Senate or guide or control the actions or direction of the debates or even what is allowed to come to the floor. So, what she said is inaccurate. On the other hand, Presidents and VPs do call Senators to propose ideas and to try to gather support for ideas they back or feel they need, so to that extent... she will be constantly engaged in legislative activity... so what she said is not really incorrect either... but it was inaccurate. Fair enough. I just think the US Constitution makes it clear that the VP is President of the Senate Now is it in title only? Probably. But it is in there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoot Point Really Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 If McCain were to win... and if I were Sarah Palin... I'd show up and be "President of the Senate" every damned day just to laugh at Obama and Biden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMK9973 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I love when everyone makes comments without hearing or reading the whole thing. If she said that the VP was in charge of the senate - I have no issue with that. President - in charge..... talking to a 7 year old. No problem. Now - The REST of her comments bother me somewhat.... "But also, they're in charge of the United States Senate, so if they want to they can really get in there with the senators and make a lot of good policy changes ..." She wants the VP to "Get in there" with senators and make a lot of policy changes? Once again - she didn't say this in a vacuum. Just those comments alone might make me to a double take, and move on. But I combine it with her debate answers... "Of course we know what a vice president does, and that's not only preside over the Senate, and we'll take that position very seriously, also, I'm thankful that the Constitution would allow a bit more authority given to the vice president also if that vice president so chose to exert it in working with the Senate...." So, we combine those two quotes and it becomes pretty clear what she plans to do. She plans that the VP becomes a Active member of the senate, and while she can not vote unless tied, she plans on basically becoming a shadow senator. I'm not sure this would be illegal mind you - Just a different way to doing things and one that becomes a legitimate campaign question. Do we want that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 If McCain were to win... and if I were Sarah Palin... I'd show up and be "President of the Senate" every damned day just to laugh at Obama and Biden. That is what VP John Adams did He just chilled in the "President's chair" in the Senate reading the paper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.