WT: As usual, the Redskins' fix simply is a rush job

[Dirk Diggler]

While I don't normally agree with Daly, this is spot on. It's also sobering to know that we won't have our second rounder for the fourth time in six drafts. Statistically, that is the "sweet spot" of a draft: the best convergence of talent at fair $$ (i.e. cheap labor that is more than likely to succeed).

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/jul/22/as-usual-the-redskins-fix-simply-is-a-rush-job/

DAN DALY: As usual, the Redskins' fix simply is a rush job

Dan Daly (Contact)

Tuesday, July 22, 2008

There's no way to injury-proof an NFL team. Not even these days, with 53 players on the active roster and another eight wannabes on the practice squad. You just put a club together as best you can and hope you get lucky, hope the torn ACLs and ruptured Achilles don't happen at the positions you're thinnest.

The Redskins have been tempting the fates with their defensive line for some time now, ignoring it year after year in the draft. After all, the Nearly Perfect Patriots routinely use high picks on D-linemen; the Giants, Cowboys and Eagles - that is, the rest of the NFC East - also pay a lot of attention to that area. The Snydermen, on the other hand, have been content to cobble together defensive fronts out of retreads, late-round draft choices and the occasional pricey free agent (e.g. Cornelius Griffin, Andre Carter).

So when Phillip Daniels, their 35-year-old strong-side end, blew out his knee on the first day of training camp, the team, naturally, had no Plan B. There was nobody in the pipeline ready to step in, the way there is in the best organizations. I mean, come on, Daniels is a solid player - not to mention a clubhouse leader - but he's no Charles Mann. His loss shouldn't send Dan Snyder and Vinny Cerrato scurrying to eBay in search of a replacement.

But that's how it is with the Redskins.

[Truant]

Time will tell. For years we haven't addressed the defensive line. Now we're one of three teams with two double digit sack players from last year. We won't know how good or bad the trade was until JT's season is over.

I love the draft, but draft picks are overrated. You can manufacture additional picks easily by sliding down early in the draft. We started with one second rounder this draft and ended up with three second round picks.

[squatch66]

there is always trading down. especially if the league does not have a rookie cap in place by the next draft.

i also wouldnt exactly call this "scurrying to ebay" we did after all have catastrophic injuries to the starter and a guy who stood a good chance to make the team this year. if this happens to any team they still probably go out and make this deal.

[flexxskins]

Wow, a shoulda, coulda article from Mr.Daly; weak man, real weak.

[Warhead36]

He makes good points but trading for JASON TAYLOR isn't the same as trading for TJ Duckett....

[Mr. S]

its all speculative. We won't have a 2nd rounder for the 4th time in 6 seasons. However, due to this seasons draft, we have had 4 2nd round picks in 6 seasons basically.

Time will tell how they will all work out (obviously Rocky has looked good), but if it works out, 2 starting WR's, a starting LB, and a TE who probably could start on another team is not bad at all for 4 2nd rounders. I guess that also proves a point in the article that the 2nd round is usually the safest round to draft starting talent.

I'm normally not a fan of trading picks, but that's usually because we'd trade for average at best players. Duckett and Lloyd obviously. Brunell. Trading all we did to draft Rocky and Campbell as well. At least Rocky and Campbell could be long term solutions.

This time, we traded for a player who's been in the top 5 at his position for six seasons now. That is definitely wroth a 2nd rounder over a 3rd and 4th for Duckett (never in the top 32 for rushing) and a 3rd and 4th for Lloyd (worthless all around).

[TheLongshot]

There are always teams out there who have their blind spots. I mean, let's talk about Philly and Wide Receivers. They probably haven't drafted a great one since Mike Quick.

Even before Snyder we weren't that great at drafting DL. Casserly didn't really like drafting DTs (There is a big gap between Bobby Wilson and Delbert Cowsette) and most of the DEs he drafted didn't turn out.

Jason

[va_pimp4ya]

Of course it was a rush job... Both defensive ends (Daniels and Buzbee) got taken for the season during the first two days of camp. Personally, I think we made out pretty darn good given the circumstances. How can anyone disagree that Jason Taylor was the best "patch/fix" ANY team could use?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

I didn't know Griffin and Carter were considered "pricey free agents"...

And Mr. S is right...we've actually had four 2nd round picks in the last three drafts lol...

[Muzzah]

First we're ignoring the defensive line, then were in deep trouble because of injuries, then we're throwing away our future by addressing the defensive line. According to some media that is.

I'll admit when I first heard rumors about us going after Taylor I said "Oh no, please don't." because he had earlier said he only wanted to play one more year and the Dolphins originally wanted a first rounder. But I have warmed up to it after hearing that he does indeed intend on playing out his contract and that Vinny made a point of knowing he intended to from the beginning. I say good job. We now have two great play makers on either end of the defensive line and should finally be able to take advantage of 3rd and longs without having to sell out on a blitz.

I hope we play well and when the two years are coming to close he decides he wants to continue playing.

[illone]

Not that I expect every DC writer to drink the kool-aid here, but I am having a hard time faulting Vinny for this move.

This should be the tie that binds all Redskins fans together, we finally got a game breaking d-lineman!

After years of waiting, you're going to complain about it? Really?

[SteveFromYellowstone]

It's another case of damned-if-you-do and damned-if-you-dont.

He would have complained if we didn't trade for him and made Evans start.

We got a very good DE who happens to be actually younger than Daniels. Nothing to complain about here.

[Vicious]

Pro move. The sad thing is we no longer have our umbrella. Good thing are team has some pretty serious depth at most positions.

[CurseReversed]

Everyone seems to always be talking about our defensive line as if it were some rag tag unit of older and barely productive guys. Maybe not specifically in this article, which only directly referenced it as thin, which indeed it was. But I think the overall sentiment from analysts, writers, and skins fans alike is that it was the weak point in our defense. I have always looked at it as our strength.

This is why I think too high a value is placed on sacks, to me the far more important stat is rush yards allowed.

What fans and writers alike, seem so quick to forget, is the dominating performances our d-line performed stopping the run last season. The redskins were fourth in the league in rushing yards allowed per game, for some reason I dont think I have heard that statistic mentoned enough. They held adrian peterson, arguably the best running back all season long, in minnies house, with their playoff hopes on the line, to 27 yards. Later he was quoted as saying that our defense was the toughest he played all season. Which is saying a lot from a man who torched almost every defense he played.

Then the next week you all know what happend with dallas. Sheer domination, to an extent even we found ourselves in awe with.

This is a defense and a d-line that in the home stretch, against clutch players went out and dominated. That is impressive, they were impressive. In some ways I dont think they are given the credit they deserve for our success last season, especially in those two games. They came out and played as good against the run as I have seen any redskins team play in a stretch like that, against the quality of running backs and oppents they were facing. Granted we had a run stopping machine in fletcher, but he was still playing with a beat up LB core with one starter already gone. Its probably safe to say that the d-line deserves a good portion of the credit.

I think its only fair to note that after watching lots of tape from last season that GW's pickup of godfrey, initially for depth, turned out to to be a great move when rocky unfortunately went down. he was a beast against the run every down he played. Its a shame he wont be back this year. Every time I watched him on tape he was extremely physical and with his size, was usually the first to take on the lead blocker when he was in. I think that this was definitely an unforseen, often understated boost in our run D while he was playing

This was the strength of Gregg Williams game and his coaching style, He built a line designed to stop the run. This was the reason GW played the line backers 7 yards off the line in a large portion of his formations throughout the season. He knew that he could still stop the run or atlest limit it too short/medium gains, mainly because he had built it over the last four years TOO stop the run, not specifically to rush the passer.

Then of course he played everyone else back in coverage trying limit the big plays in the passing game. Which he was successful at many more games then not.

In my opionon, he was a war of attrition, bend but dont break type of coach, he would give and give and give just waiting for you to make the mistake or two needed to put you in a punt situation. While this is contrary philosophy to the some of the other successful, attack oriented defenses, which when extremely well coached, with talented players can be even more effective.

Although these teams often employ a defensive line that is more a hybride passrush/run stop group. Usually this is the result of having playmaking pro-bowl players that can do both exceptionally.

Case in point would be the ravens, who with suggs and others could get to the passer and still crush the run, They were one rank above us in rush defense I believe, and were an attacking defense.

But...his strategy, for all its weaknesses is also, what facilitated many of our late season runs.

While efficient and well orchestrated teams could occasionally combat his strategy. Late in the season, in the NFC east especially, when the temps gets cold and weather unpredictable, teams that can stop the run are the ones that succeed. With the primarily run stopped focus of our d-line's personnel, all we had to do is play our back seven a little closer to the line of scrimage, playing the run (so to speak). And our run defense almost always stepped up, specifically the d line. Putting up some rather dominating performances not only last year, in 04 and 05 as well.

You remember our performance in the last five games in 05 against the run, with that same, no sacking, yet pretty solid run stopping d line? I watch that TB playoff game from 05 all the time and the way we crushed cadillac still gives me chills.

Although over all teams that were prone to mistakes GW's strategies worked with great success. Those that were extremely efficent, or were maybe having one of those on game in terms of efficency, were able to methodically march down the field giving what we gave them, putting up some big points. For example a team like New england just passed underneath all game countering his strategy, destroying him.

But with what he had to work with talent wise I believe his particular strategy worked extremely well when given his total body of work, especially against the run. I think we were among the leagues best in three out of four years of his tenure against the run. And late in the season when run counted most is when he really excelled

[maskedsuperstar]

Everyone seems to always be talking about our defensive line as if it were some rag tag unit of older and barely productive guys. Maybe not specifically in this article, which only directly referenced it as thin, which indeed it was. But I think the overall sentiment from analysts, writers, and skins fans alike is that it was the weak point in our defense. I have always looked at it as our strength.

This is why I think too high a value is placed on sacks, to me the far more important stat is rush yards allowed.

What fans and writers alike, seem so quick to forget, is the dominating performances our d-line performed stopping the run last season. The redskins were fourth in the league in rushing yards allowed per game, for some reason I dont think I have heard that statistic mentoned enough. They held adrian peterson, arguably the best running back all season long, in minnies house, with their playoff hopes on the line, to 27 yards. Later he was quoted as saying that our defense was the toughest he played all season. Which is saying a lot from a man who torched almost every defense he played.

Then the next week you all know what happend with dallas. Sheer domination, to an extent even we found ourselves in awe with.

This is a defense and a d-line that in the home stretch, against clutch players went out and dominated. That is impressive, they were impressive. In some ways I dont think they are given the credit they deserve for our success last season, especially in those two games. They came out and played as good against the run as I have seen any redskins team play in a stretch like that, against the quality of running backs and oppents they were facing. Granted we had a run stopping machine in fletcher, but he was still playing with a beat up LB core with one starter already gone. Its probably safe to say that the d-line deserves a good portion of the credit.

I think its only fair to note that after watching lots of tape from last season that GW's pickup of godfrey, initially for depth, turned out to to be a great move when rocky unfortunately went down. he was a beast against the run every down he played. Its a shame he wont be back this year. Every time I watched him on tape he was extremely physical and with his size, was usually the first to take on the lead blocker when he was in. I think that this was definitely an unforseen, often understated boost in our run D while he was playing

This was the strength of Gregg Williams game and his coaching style, He built a line designed to stop the run. This was the reason GW played the line backers 7 yards off the line in a large portion of his formations throughout the season. He knew that he could still stop the run or atlest limit it too short/medium gains, mainly because he had built it over the last four years TOO stop the run, not specifically to rush the passer.

Then of course he played everyone else back in coverage trying limit the big plays in the passing game. Which he was successful at many more games then not.

In my opionon, he was a war of attrition, bend but dont break type of coach, he would give and give and give just waiting for you to make the mistake or two needed to put you in a punt situation. While this is contrary philosophy to the some of the other successful, attack oriented defenses, which when extremely well coached, with talented players can be even more effective.

Although these teams often employ a defensive line that is more a hybride passrush/run stop group. Usually this is the result of having playmaking pro-bowl players that can do both exceptionally.

Case in point would be the ravens, who with suggs and others could get to the passer and still crush the run, They were one rank above us in rush defense I believe, and were an attacking defense.

But...his strategy, for all its weaknesses is also, what facilitated many of our late season runs.

While efficient and well orchestrated teams could occasionally combat his strategy. Late in the season, in the NFC east especially, when the temps gets cold and weather unpredictable, teams that can stop the run are the ones that succeed. With the primarily run stopped focus of our d-line's personnel, all we had to do is play our back seven a little closer to the line of scrimage, playing the run (so to speak). And our run defense almost always stepped up, specifically the d line. Putting up some rather dominating performances not only last year, in 04 and 05 as well.

You remember our performance in the last five games in 05 against the run, with that same, no sacking, yet pretty solid run stopping d line? I watch that TB playoff game from 05 all the time and the way we crushed cadillac still gives me chills.

Although over all teams that were prone to mistakes GW's strategies worked with great success. Those that were extremely efficent, or were maybe having one of those on game in terms of efficency, were able to methodically march down the field giving what we gave them, putting up some big points. For example a team like New england just passed underneath all game countering his strategy, destroying him.

But with what he had to work with talent wise I believe his particular strategy worked extremely well when given his total body of work, especially against the run. I think we were among the leagues best in three out of four years of his tenure against the run. And late in the season when run counted most is when he really excelled

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

I am totally with you. Stopping the run is more important than putting the QB on the ground. Williams ran a zone blitz scheme, which means that a DE will sometimes fall back in pass coverage. 70% of the Skins fans and media don't seem to understand that. Williams really pressured the QB from the back 7. The Steelers run the same scheme, only from the 3-4 defense. Lebeau has been running the zone blitz for years. If you look at the Steelers, the back 7 pressures the QB. So, when I hear the Skins have to blitz to put pressure on the QB, I laugh. They ran a zone blitz scheme.

[btfoom]

Usually, when I hear the Skins brought in an 'older' player for draft picks, I cringe. The names listed above show why.

This time is much different, though. We had a BIG need at DL and addressed it fairly cheaply, if you take into account what you usually need to get a top notch pass rusher.

Daly (and most of the other sports columnists) delight in taking any shot at Snyder/Cerrato they can. This time, Daly is just wrong. Maybe someone should remind him how important a good Defensive line can be (it's not like it wins Super Bowls or anything ).

[Sarge]

Stating the obvious Dan.

We lucked up that Taylor was availible, but that still doesn't help our core issue that we don't draft any cannon fodder for the lines.

Last year we had massive injuries along the O-line, and it wrecked our season.

THis year we have the same O-line so far, but one year older. It may catch up with us again. I hope not.

THe D-line has been the same way. No/few linemen in the draft

[scruffylookin]

It's another case of damned-if-you-do and damned-if-you-dont.

He would have complained if we didn't trade for him and made Evans start.

We got a very good DE who happens to be actually younger than Daniels. Nothing to complain about here.

Not really.

The root of the problem would still be the same.

The Redskins have largely ignored the defensive line in terms of stocking it with young blue chip talent. They've depended on older players and journeymen. So either way they went, they would have been justifiably criticized.

Stand pat and go with Evans: That's the best we've got? Demetric Evans? We ignore drafting a defensive lineman in the first 3 rounds for the last decade because we've got Demetric Evans in reserve?

Making the deal: We're forced to give up a second rounder for a 34 year old player because we've ignored the lines and had no one we felt comfortable starting.

Either way, the Redskins attitude towards the line is what got them in the position they found themselves on Sunday. Hell, I don't even think Phillip Daniels is a legit starter anyway. We were weak to begin with.

This coaching staff, specifically Greg Blache since he's been the position coach, has saw fit to stock this line with projects, role players and pet players from other coaching stops (Daniels) instead of investing high draft picks in upgrading the talent.

The best players we've got are "blue chippers" from other teams.

Cornelius Griffin (2nd round NY Giants 2000)

Andre Carter (1st round SF 49ers 2002)

Jason Taylor (3rd round MIA Dolphins 1997)

See where our 3 best players were selected in the draft (by other teams of course)?

Notice how we have failed to use a single 1st, 2nd or 3rd round pick during that same time to find our own Griffin,Carter or Taylor?

So no, the Redskins would be and should be ripped either way they went. Their philosophy regarding the d line has become nearly laughable.

[kingdaddy]

What have we done that is drastically different than what New England does when it comes to filling holes? The Patriots are great at filling holes with veterans. Randy Moss, Rodney Harrison, Junior Seau, Corey Dillon, Donte Stallworth, etc.....

The fact is, as Joe Gibbs said, if you can get a proven player rather than hope a draft pick will pan out then you take the proven player.

I love the Jason Taylor move. I only wonder why another team didn't go after him. Just think if the Eagles, Giants or Cowboys ponied up a 2nd rounder and got him to add to their defenses.....and the Eagles typically have tons of draft picks, including next year, that they can afford to trade away. They have 2 first round picks next year.

Another thing, Taylor said he was influenced greatly by Trace Armstrong and some other guys when he was a young player. I would think he'll be great to put around our younger guys who are still learning the ropes of the NFL.

I'm excited to see this guy on the field pressuring McNabb, Manning and Romo sits to pee. Teams will have to game plan differently against us now, big time.

[DemSkinz]

Well we hit that sweet spot three times this year...

[SprintBomb]

In the eyes of the media, we cant do anything right. We could win the SB and the media would say something negative about us.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

What have we done that is drastically different than what New England does when it comes to filling holes? The Patriots are great at filling holes with veterans. Randy Moss, Rodney Harrison, Junior Seau, Corey Dillon, Donte Stallworth, etc.....

Actually it's quite a bit different. Unfortunately I get to see their system in action since I live in the middle of Patriots' Nation....

In this type of situation they would have had a young player ready to step in at the DE position. Maybe not a star player, but a young guy who was at least 75-80% of the player that the starter is. They would not go out and trade draft picks for an expensive, big-name starter.

The Patriots fill holes with a specific type of veteran.... guys who are willing to come to New England for less money and to become total team players with no personal ego whatsoever. If they're not willing to buy into the system completely, or if they want big $$$ the Patriots tell them to go away. It's been suggested that part of the Patriots' physical exam for all new players includes a lobodomy; because they're like robots out there in Foxboro.

[WARPATH '82]

As one poster said already... its damned if you do / damned if you don't! What Mr. Daly fails to realize that if we did have a decent backup behind Daniels, he probably would have been somewhere else to begin with. With FA the way it is, if a player is half as good as the starter or has potential that will bloom within a few years, that player will hit the bricks and get paid as much as he can as fast as he can. So Daly either dosen't get it or he has other hidden agendas. I guess he (Daly) missed this year's draft also.

[SWFLSkins]

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

I am totally with you. Stopping the run is more important than putting the QB on the ground. Williams ran a zone blitz scheme, which means that a DE will sometimes fall back in pass coverage. 70% of the Skins fans and media don't seem to understand that. Williams really pressured the QB from the back 7. The Steelers run the same scheme, only from the 3-4 defense. Lebeau has been running the zone blitz for years. If you look at the Steelers, the back 7 pressures the QB. So, when I hear the Skins have to blitz to put pressure on the QB, I laugh. They ran a zone blitz scheme.

Sign me up as well. Curse Reveresed>>>>then to OP, and the presser.

[Ernie5]

Name me a team that has depth at every position -- it doesn't happen. Having the cap room to sign an impact defensive end was smart. A quick fix? Yeah: sometimes you need quick fixes. This is just more bashing the team for the 2000 and 2006 off-seasons. Next.