Spartacus87 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I dunno what that above says ^^^^^ but someone posted a while back that the name was derived by a native American coach and he had 3 on the team that year as well..... Yeah, the story of William "Lone Star" Dietz...problem with that is he wasn't a real Native American and his back story is a lie, he took the name from a guy named James One Star...http://www.aistm.org/lonestar.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunBunch7 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 This was taken from the above posted article... Daniel Snyder, who owns the Washington NFL franchise, has said the team name will never be changed because "what it means is tradition, what it means is competitiveness, what it means is honor." He said, "It is not meant to be derogatory." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerald362 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 So let me get this straight. If one person finds a word offensive, then that word should not be used? Let's then edit all the dictionaries, encyclopedias, sports teams, names we call each other and eliminate the word. That will surely make publishing costs much less, since we will eliminate 90% of descriptive terminology. I tend to agree with George Carlin on this "There are no BAD word, only bad PEOPLE". If you treat a word with respect, use it to show respect, then it is a respectful word. Show me where the Washington Redskins use the name with disrespect. Neither the Washington Redskins, or we as fans control how other people treat the word, nor should we. Oh really, well I worked for the Gila River Tribe and Casino a few years back and most of the Natives there stated that they like to call themselves skins when talking about each other but "redskin" is offensive but why complain ? Nothing will be done about it ...Will it ?and you know what they say....If one person finds a slur offensive... ITS OFFENSIVE...... Don't try to add numbers to it and use that as validation of it not being a Racial Slur....It is and you all know it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CM916 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Let's not forget that it was a genuine Native American chief that submitted our logo to the team. Any time someone brings this stuff up I tell them to talk to Cleveland first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsSuperBowl21 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I can see why alot of hairy bushed college liberals full of angst would see it as a problem but all they say if I bring up the subject is "Would it be appropriate to name a team the Whiteskins or Blackskins?" The answer is obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The 12th Commandment Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 There's all kinds of native americans around here navajos, apaches and pueblos. I think NM has the highest percentage of reservation land of any state. They have casinos and ski areas and mountain lakes to fish in. Their scalping white boys around here now a days, including me :laugh: , right in the wallet. I've been on the res a lot of times. I see the indians, specially the apaches, wearing more skins gear than any other team. The only other team you see represented pretty well is the chiefs. So in my personal experience I'd say the vast majority of them don't mind one bit. Maybe eastern indians are different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFanPA Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Christians may take offense to "Demon Decons" or Blue Devils"...God is already under attack, what's next people. As a born-again Christian, I have ZERO problem with those two names... (although, as a Tar Heel fan, I have a problem with those TEAMS...:cool: ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borninblood Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Re: Do native Americans find the name "Redskins" offensive No, but white liberals on college campuses certainly do :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: white angst is a sad, sad thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemocystem Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 i'm native american & very passionate about my heritage however, while i find the term Redskin in & of itself to be offnsive i am not offended by the use of this term to represent a team name, ESPECIALLY when you consider the fact that a) the game of American football derives from a game created by native americans & the Redskins organization has been a staple of the NFL/NFC since the advent of organized football in america. this lends to the name being used in a revered way, in a sense of paying respects. you have to realize that this was not necessarily a widely used derogatory word at the time of the 'Skins origin...it was recognized but not used so much as terms like Indian which became Enjun, or savages, or the like. to me, personally the term Indian is more offensive & i'll tell you why. the term "Indian" was coined by Christopher Columbus & his spanish armada to describe what they believed to be actual Indians...FROM INDIA, of course believing that he had sailed around the world! later we would come to find that this simply wasn't true & that he had actually discovered what we so lovingly refer to as North America. the term Redskin is very simple...it describes the person by the color of their skin. one is an observation of skin color & the other is an INACCURATE label coined by a bunch of a-holes that brought, among many other ways of dealing death, smallpox & Christianity/Inquisition. at the end of the day, most native Americans could give two dingleberries what the white-man has to say about them. but inaccurate depictions, representations or portrayals for the purpose of amusement or entertainment are what really gets my/our goat. if you keep these two things in mind you'll be ok: 1) we detest the drunken indian & the term "indian" in reference to us. 2) we absolutely abhor, nay loathe the "tamahawk chop." while it sounds catchy, is pleasing to the ear & gets the whole crowd involved it is NOTHING like any chant we would ever perform & the hand-chop bit is like if they had a team called the "n----rs" (as if that wouldn't be bad enough) & then chanted some stupid vanilla ice rap & were pointing two fingers & thumb in unison as if they were "poppin' a cap in yo a**." tell me there wouldn't be a civil war over that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taylorcoreskin Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 most native americans do not find the name offensive.The University of Pennsylvania just did a study on it a few months ago and found that over 85% of native americans do NOT find the name offensive. However, they do hate the drunk indian on the Cleveland Indians logo. :applause: Now stop mentioning people's perception of the name. It will never be changed, nor should it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_cavalierman Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Does it really matter if Native Americans find the name personally offensive? The word redskin as defined by most reputable dictionaries as a slur and it should have been changed years ago. It is no kind of justification what so ever to ask native Americans if it is offensive because slurs should not be acceptable period. If a black guy purchased the Redskins and tried to change the name to the Washington (N-Word's) which is a slur I am sure we would not allow that. The word Redskin is about as close to the N-word as one can get as defined by most reputable dictionaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borninblood Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 If you feel that strongly about it, then why are you a fan? What would you have the name be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_cavalierman Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 If you feel that strongly about it, then why are you a fan?What would you have the name be? The Redskins franchise is owned by Dan Snyder and he is the only person with the power to change the name. The football team that all of us root for are a collection of players and coaches hired to do a job by Dan Snyder. People who do not choose to stick their heads in the sand about the slur of a name (as most reputable dictionaries will verify) can separate one non-football related issue from the football players and coaches playing/coaching the games. The issue with the name is one of right versus wrong. I can only hope that someday Snyder or someone else has the courage to do the right thing and change the name. Until then I will not be a fan of snyder but I will root for the players and coaches just like you do every Sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borninblood Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 My hat goes off to you..... For dodging the question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 We vacation on land owned and operated by native americans and talking to them, the vast majority I have spoken with don't even think about it, let alone do they think it's offensive. They feel just like everything, some people are more sensitive them others, they don't discount their fellow brothers, but they don't bother with worring about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teller Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Does it really matter if Native Americans find the name personally offensive?The word redskin as defined by most reputable dictionaries as a slur and it should have been changed years ago. It is no kind of justification what so ever to ask native Americans if it is offensive because slurs should not be acceptable period. If a black guy purchased the Redskins and tried to change the name to the Washington (N-Word's) which is a slur I am sure we would not allow that. The word Redskin is about as close to the N-word as one can get as defined by most reputable dictionaries. First of all, you're ignorning the opinions of American Indians (I, sir, am a native American) because you know the overwhelming majority of them find no offense in the nickname or logo whatsoever. And that's not convenient to your argument, so we'll just throw it out, right? An apples-to-apples comparison would be, say, calling the team the Washington African-Americans. Obviously, most African-Americans are not offended by that term, just as American Indians aren't offended by Redskins. BTW, I'm not going to type that word into any kind of a search, especially since I'm at work. But is the "n-bomb" really in reputable dictionaries? Care to link one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryman of the North Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 oh damn, here we go again. I thought this thread normally pops up in the off season.just for the record, I grew up knowing a large native american family and hell yea, they are offended by the name. That being said... Hail to the Redskins! I am native and most of us dont, and this quote (the first part) was EXACTLY what went through my head when I read the title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Pressure Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 The part of AZ where I go to school is around some of the largest groups of Native Americans there are. I have seen plenty of them actually wearing Redskins attire. I have asked a few of my friends who are 100% Navajo what they think about it and they don't really care because they don't really take offense to the term "Redskin" and don't mind the dignified portrayal they are given. They all collectively hate the Cleveland Indians logo though. They say using that is like if they started a baseball team named the Arizona Africans and used some guy wearing blackface makeup eating fried chicken as the logo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 More important question is: Is it offensive to Eagles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USS Redskins Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 What a silly and stupid argument. If the name is racist or insulting why would you apply it to your business? Obviously the term is seen by the owner and fans as one of pride, bravery and fighting spirit. If you dont like the name, dont say it and become a fan of another, non-racist team. BTW - if you are talking definitions, Native American is defined as anyone born in the Americas. I was and probably 90% of the people on this board are Native Amercians. American Indians are not even really Native Americans. They came to this land over the bering straight from Asia. The first people here were likely the Vikings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headexplode Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I've always felt that the Redskins are respectful in their portrayal of the American Indian (except, of course, when George Preston Marshall owned the team) as opposed to many other teams (Indians, Braves, etc.) that "caricature" their culture and heritage. I've always venerated the American Indian so I feel proud to be a "Redskin." To me, that stands for courage, honor, wisdom, connectedness to the earth. I understand, though, for some, it may be a racially insensitive term. I don't think it's meant to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Not offended by it at all. Nor are any members of my family, or any other Native American Indians that I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_cavalierman Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 First of all, you're ignorning the opinions of American Indians (I, sir, am a native American) because you know the overwhelming majority of them find no offense in the nickname or logo whatsoever. And that's not convenient to your argument, so we'll just throw it out, right?An apples-to-apples comparison would be, say, calling the team the Washington African-Americans. Obviously, most African-Americans are not offended by that term, just as American Indians aren't offended by Redskins. BTW, I'm not going to type that word into any kind of a search, especially since I'm at work. But is the "n-bomb" really in reputable dictionaries? Care to link one? If a word is defined as a slur by most reputable dictionaries then your opinions as well as those of your fellow native Americans do not matter on this subject. The actual meaning of the N-word is ignorance and it applies to everyone and not just blacks. Unfortunately the word has been exclusively targeted at blacks and thus built the racial history it carries to this day. While I am glad to hear native Americans are not offended by the name, that still does not change the fact that the word Redskin is a slur. A slur is a slur no matter how much history and tradition you attach to it. I guess we can agree to disagree on this matter.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenspandan Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 The word Redskin is about as close to the N-word as one can get as defined by most reputable dictionaries. really? go call a black guy the n-word, and then go call a native american a redskin, and see which one kicks the crap out of you, and which one looks at you quizzically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenspandan Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 If a word is defined as a slur by most reputable dictionaries then your opinions as well as those of your fellow native Americans do not matter on this subject. haha, wrong! what this actually means is the dictionary is incorrect! if the word is not offensive, it is not a slur, by definition! silly argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.