Jason Campbell just not getting it done (Mega-merged)

[ALLWORLD]

Just for the record, Jason Campbell is not supposed to be good this year. IMO, we are already overachieving (even though we have looked like crap, we have been winning).

I expected a learning year for Jason. Anyone here who is already getting down on Campbell needs to chill out. We don't need to run every qb out of town after 15 games.

You are not super smart

[myzhi]

That one man can not make a team better if he does not have play makers around him. :doh:

Moss, Cooley, Portis and...? :doh:

[mAshparie36]

I tell you, I get so tired of this people that know JACK about football. Go read football for dummies before you post.

haha.. i think it comes down to people just reallly dont think before they make a thread. they dont use their brains. they dont look at a scenario from every angle, they just see numbers (53.2 PR) and their like "omg! i need to go make a thread about this!" :laugh:

[Fat Stupid Loser]

Just for the record, Jason Campbell is not supposed to be good this year. IMO, we are already overachieving (even though we have looked like crap, we have been winning).

I expected a learning year for Jason. Anyone here who is already getting down on Campbell needs to chill out. We don't need to run every qb out of town after 15 games.

Another year after this one? After this year he will have had 1 1/2 seasons starting. So far, no improvement. If he doesn't make large strides the last 8 games, we have to look to upgrade the position. 17 years of "give it time" has worn out its welcome.

[Lee55055]

They went in with a gameplan. That gameplan worked. They win the game.

Next...

No... actually the gameplan did not work.. We went into overtime with a 1-7 Jets, and almost lost.. We got lucky pulling out a win because that game was just disgusting to watch.

[laxpck]

I always have heard there is a 4 year curve for QB's in the NFL.

Starting or not it takes 4 years to adjust and internalize.

[Tomel]

I scanned a lot of the posts in this thread, but not all of them. I apologize if I repeat something that's already been said.

Looks to me like Campbell is very good on the short to intermediate "bullet-like" passes. However, he's not nearly as good when he has loft the ball and float it into a receiver's hands, whether intermediate or long. When I see a QB like Brady or Manning, it seems that they frequently get the ball to the receiver right on stride, not requiring any last minute adjustment by the receiver. However, Campbell's passes require a receiver to speed up, slow down, or perform a gymnastic type catch (maybe that's why Randel L has done well this year since he seems to be able to contort his body at the last minute to compensate for Campbell's throws.

Hopefully, Campbell will improve with more experience. Like many of you, I hate to think of starting over again with another "QB of the future."

[ALLWORLD]

Or we should do what you seem to be advocating and stick our head in the sand while we wave pom poms. :laugh:

Look, for whatever reason, the guy has shown little sign of improvement since starting. It seems he takes a long time to release the ball, his accuracy is suspect, and he has tunnel vision on the check down passes.

I totally agree, when the rest do not want to be blind homers they will see too. Granted, he is not that way 100% but for the most part it is how he plays this year.

Now, lets all hope he progresses...

[tone_dubbz]

I think we're being too prudent with him, but thats also the conservative playcalling. He does look bad at moments, and I think everyone is tired of making excuses for him. I think the coaches need to do more work with him on his mechanics and accuracy. They need to work harder on the timing for the receivers.

[[S.S.F. | Nero]]

Sorry, but good QB make the entire team better. What we have is a QB that needs the entire team to make him better. What does that say?

Sorry, but if Moss makes a catch in GB and if the team doesn't brain fart in the 2nd half vs. the Giants then nobody is saying squat abou JC.

That's just how it is.

The Oline is slowly coming around (Hurry Randy Thomas Hurry!) and you're going to see teams forced to defend Clinton.....which equals more wide open Moss and Randle Els.

JC won't have to check off and then we'll see what this offense is all about.

0/2 on deep shots isn't the end of the world.......James Thrash :doh: had a chance at a TD and JC missed Moss on a good shot at a TD. It will come....

[goldenster95]

Please don't insult our intelligence by making excuses over Campbell's continue inaccuracy with the deep ball. Moss was open by 2 yards...I guess that heal problem really slowed him down as he blew by the defender. Campbell missed him, just as he has been doing a lot of. And yes, we do expect the timing to be there. He was named the started for supposedly being able to throw the deep ball. Right now he looks a lot like Quincy Carter, that former dynamo who played for the Cowboys a few years back.

Incredible. Quincy Carter? Campbell does have a problem with accuracy, and he has missed Moss on three easy TD passes this season. But, of course, you're discounting the fact that he's hit more great passes to people like Cooley when they're covered. And that's not to say that other folks like Moss and Cooley themselves have dropped easy passes that would not only have bumped up Campbell's numbers, but would've probably meant that we would have won at least one game -- the GB game. And that was probably his best day as a pro, even better than the Detroit game.

Right now, Campbell has room to improve. But he's progressing, and the one thing that's keeping him back is the coaching staff. This comparison to Clemens is a joke. Clemens has come in with nothing to lose in a 1-8 season. The Jets coaching staff can simply let him play with very little on the line. If the Jets are 4-4, Clemens probably doesn't play at all.

Gimme a break.

[zoony]

maybe the QB play hasn't been good because the QB isn't being allowed to play?

The QB can only work with so much when the playcalling is sub-par.

I think Jason has slowed in his progress because they aren't calling plays for medium and deep passes enough. 1 or 2 a game isn't going to help him develop.

Right now the thing that's slowing Jason down, is our coaching staff.

When you run that play once every few weeks. Do you really expect the timing to really be there? Then you see that Moss has some sort of heal problem. Who knows? Maybe a healthy Moss would have caught that in stride. Maybe they are too busy practicing the tight formation with Thrash as the only WR so much, they never get to the deep passes.

Okay... what is it you're trying to say?

Are you guys saying that the coaching staff doesn't call pass plays? And that when they do, the WR's don't go out on pass routes?

Or are you saying that our WR's can't get open?

Because so far this year, Jason Campbell has really struggled to complete passes to anyone other than Chris Cooley or short slant routes to WR's.

So what you're both saying is... that the coaching staff won't let him do this.

I find it incredibly telling that you guys are so quick to blame the coaching staff, but after 15 starts in this league, you refuse to put any blame on Campbell.

What would Romo sits to pee look like in our offense? Do you think he'd be putting up similar numbers to Campbell? REALLY? is that REALLY what you're saying? If so, come out and say it. Say that Carson Palmer, Drew Brees, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Tony Romo sits to pee, etc. would be struggling in this offense just like JC.

Guys... it might be time to concede that JC doesn't see the field very well. He's got all the physical tools, but he looks utterly lost back there much of the time.

Jason Campbell's progression:

1. Look for #1 Receiver. If not OPEN,

(a)throw ball to Cooley (even if Cooley is covered)

(b)take sack

©throw incomplete

JC has looked good when his WR does get open. But as an NFL QB, if you wait for this to happen, you're not gonna be very good. You have to anticipate the play based on what the defense is doing, and throw the ball to where the play WILL be, not where it currently is. Safeties and corners are too fast in this league. Holes close too quickly.

The amount of times we've seen JC WAIT in order for a WR to get open, THEN throw the ball, are too many to count. With good QBs, the ball is thrown, then the WR gets open. OR... the QB goes thru his progressions and hits the 2nd or 3rd guy, anticipating where the defense will be when the ball gets there.

JC has shown a complete inability to do this.

And you guys blame the coaching 100%.

Discussions like this are good, because we as members of ES learn fairly quickly who to take seriously.

And how many easy Touchdowns will you see Jason Campbell overthrow/miss this season until the lightbulb goes off? Oh wait... I forgot... "that's not JC's fault because they don't call that play enough for him to establish his rhtyhm" :laugh: priceless, thanks for the laugh.

.......

[gjshipp]

Another year after this one? After this year he will have had 1 1/2 seasons starting. So far, no improvement. If he doesn't make large strides the last 8 games, we have to look to upgrade the position. 17 years of "give it time" has worn out its welcome.

When have we given anything time since Snyder took over?

I would agree we gave Norv too much time, other than that we have not had a rebuilding plan or been patient about anything....just get more free agents and win the offseason.

[goldenster95]

Okay... what is it you're trying to say?

Are you guys saying that the coaching staff doesn't call pass plays? And that when they do, the WR's don't go out on pass routes?

Or are you saying that our WR's can't get open?

Because so far this year, Jason Campbell has really struggled to complete passes to anyone other than Chris Cooley or short slant routes to WR's.

So what you're both saying is... that the coaching staff won't let him do this.

I find it incredibly telling that you guys are so quick to blame the coaching staff, but after 15 starts in this league, you refuse to put any blame on Campbell.

What would Romo sits to pee look like in our offense? Do you think he'd be putting up similar numbers to Campbell? REALLY? is that REALLY what you're saying? If so, come out and say it. Say that Carson Palmer, Drew Brees, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Tony Romo sits to pee, etc. would be struggling in this offense just like JC.

Guys... it might be time to concede that JC doesn't see the field very well. He's got all the physical tools, but he looks utterly lost back there much of the time.

Jason Campbell's progression:

1. Look for #1 Receiver. If not OPEN,

(a)throw ball to Cooley (even if Cooley is covered)

(b)take sack

©throw incomplete

JC has looked good when his WR does get open. But as an NFL QB, if you wait for this to happen, you're not gonna be very good. You have to anticipate the play based on what the defense is doing, and throw the ball to where the play WILL be, not where it currently is. Safeties and corners are too fast in this league. Holes close too quickly.

The amount of times we've seen JC WAIT in order for a WR to get open, THEN throw the ball, are too many to count. With good QBs, the ball is thrown, then the WR gets open. OR... the QB goes thru his progressions and hits the 2nd or 3rd guy, anticipating where the defense will be when the ball gets there.

JC has shown a complete inability to do this.

And you guys blame the coaching 100%.

Discussions like this are good, because we as members of ES learn fairly quickly who to take seriously.

And how many easy Touchdowns will you see Jason Campbell overthrow/miss this season until the lightbulb goes off? Oh wait... I forgot... "that's not JC's fault because they don't call that play enough for him to establish his rhtyhm" :laugh: priceless, thanks for the laugh.

.......

The coaching staff isnt' to blame 100% but it is to blame for a lot. That's in part due to Gibbs' run-first philosophy and his penchant for protecting a QB when there's even a whisper of trouble (e.g., a re-assembled right side of the o-line). As for this BS about JC overthrowing WRs for TDs, how many more have been dropped buy them that could've been TDs or set them up and how many other great deep passes has he made with pinpoint accuracy when there was good coverage? It's almost as if he thinks too much when the WR is wide open and blows it. If you get coverage on the WR, it's almost as if he focuses more and throws a nice pass.

[testrake]

If JC were cut from the team tomorrow how long until he is picked up? I think there are a lot of teams out there who would love to have him, that is to say, we have a good talented young qb, lets cut him some slack

[ALLWORLD]

Incredible. Quincy Carter? Campbell does have a problem with accuracy, and he has missed Moss on three easy TD passes this season. But, of course, you're discounting the fact that he's hit more great passes to people like Cooley when they're covered. And that's not to say that other folks like Moss and Cooley themselves have dropped easy passes that would not only have bumped up Campbell's numbers, but would've probably meant that we would have won at least one game -- the GB game. And that was probably his best day as a pro, even better than the Detroit game.

Right now, Campbell has room to improve. But he's progressing, and the one thing that's keeping him back is the coaching staff. This comparison to Clemens is a joke. Clemens has come in with nothing to lose in a 1-8 season. The Jets coaching staff can simply let him play with very little on the line. If the Jets are 4-4, Clemens probably doesn't play at all.

Gimme a break.

You know what, thats a good way to put things.. Haven't really looked at it like that. Good post dude. Maybe that will help clear my head on this a bit. :applause:

[zoony]

The coaching staff isnt' to blame 100% but it is to blame for a lot. .

Sincerely,

Patrick Ramsey

:yawnee:

[goldenster95]

I'll add this for yesterday. The Jets had a terrible run defense. We established a gameplan to exploit that and succeeded. That's an instance where putting the reins on the passing game is justified. Against teams like the Cruds, that isn't.

The problem is that Gibbs is so risk-averse, he's gonna stick to the ground game as much as possible. You've got to pick and choose your fights in this league, and when it comes down to a mismatch in your favor in the passing game, you've got to trust your QB.

[goldenster95]

Sincerely,

Patrick Ramsey

:yawnee:

You mean . . .

Sincerely,

Moose Johnston.

Oh yeah, you know more than him though right?

Forgot . . .

:laugh:

[goldenster95]

You know what, thats a good way to put things.. Haven't really looked at it like that. Good post dude. Maybe that will help clear my head on this a bit. :applause:

Well, it's the truth. I'm not saying that Campbell is a great QB or anything right now. He does have room to improve, and one of them is his accuracy on short passes. No need to gun it when the receiver is wide open on a short route. It's kind of like an infielder who wants to gun a throw to first base to get the runner by a mile. That will invariably lead to you "Steve Sax Syndrome", i.e., comical throwing errors. Just stay calm and relaxed, and throw the ball accurately. Campbell needs to learn that.

Of course, he did great in the GB game on virtually all of his throws. I can't tell you how many short passes he made that were not only dropped, but dropped for first down yardage on third downs that resulted in a three-and-out.

That was a great game he played that day and we gave that game away to the Pack.

[Santana_Fan]

Just for the record, Jason Campbell is not supposed to be good this year. IMO, we are already overachieving (even though we have looked like crap, we have been winning).

I expected a learning year for Jason. Anyone here who is already getting down on Campbell needs to chill out. We don't need to run every qb out of town after 15 games.

Every year, there's a new person to argue about :doh:. Earlier this year, everybody talked about how bad Portis was, and they thought it was the end for him. Now everybody's looking at Campbell...pitiful. Last year it was Archuleta. Next year will be ________ ________? There's a hell of a lot of worse teams in a worse position than we are. I think too many people are envious of other teams QB's, and not looking at the positives of our own.

[Blackest Eyes]

Why do all of these stupid threads appear every week? If you dislike Campbell, post it in one of the other 5,000 "Campbell isn't getting it done" threads. Threads like this should be marked *SPAM*

[BigRay]

Every year, there's a new person to argue about :doh:. Earlier this year, everybody talked about how bad Portis was, and they thought it was the end for him. Now everybody's looking at Campbell...pitiful. Last year it was Archuleta. Next year will be ________ ________? There's a hell of a lot of worse teams in a worse position than we are. I think too many people are envious of other teams QB's, and not looking at the positives of our own.

:doh: Some people are just plain clueless you would think that we were the Dolphins, The Rams or some one like that. You just can't please people win or lose as long as this team is winning who cares what it looks like. A win is a win and after that beatdown we received from the Patriots we needed a win.

A win like this can boast confidence the way our O-Line overpowered the Jets now they are going to have the attitude hey, maybe we can do this against everybody we play.

[goldenster95]

Every year, there's a new person to argue about :doh:. Earlier this year, everybody talked about how bad Portis was, and they thought it was the end for him. Now everybody's looking at Campbell...pitiful. Last year it was Archuleta. Next year will be ________ ________? There's a hell of a lot of worse teams in a worse position than we are. I think too many people are envious of other teams QB's, and not looking at the positives of our own.

Or looking why things are the way they are. It's pretty pathetic, and it's directly attributable to the instant gratification and what-have-you-done-for-me -lately persona that's infected this board. Hell, according to some here, we should cut Moss too cuz he only had one good year (2005).

Incredible.

[Chris Worthy]

How do you get a QB to get better? Have him throw the ball more than they are letting him.

Do you think they are giving him enough passing plays to develop? I sure dont. Might as well have Mark out there with what they are doing.

They are not giving him the control a 1st year starter should have. I get upset to see 2nd game starters get more control than Jason.

Dont tell him its his team and then handcuff him. Sort of like bringing in a OC to call the plays then handcuff him as well.