Early prediction for Baltimore.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Or, it's expressing some knowledge of football in that it's not about talent. It's about team. If you've ever played a sport you'll understand what that means.

Even though it is a horribly boring sports cliche, I can agree with the sentiment that it takes more than talent to win.

So either we have a lack of character or a lack of coaching.

And since apparently pedigree is everything, I was on a high school football team that finished ranked #23 in the Final USA Today poll. I did not play in college, but I did work for the athletic department and did sit in film sessions. My job on Saturdays was to track the drives in the press box with the offensive coaches. My work study job during the week was actually to videotape football practices, which is pretty much the most boring job in the history of the world, though you learn why the Defensive Tackle who is built like a Greek God can't play. The answer: He was Canadian. Also, it was better than working in the cafeteria.

Oh...this is neat. We had Lightweight Football. This was for guys 158 pounds or less. Which meant that offensive tackles weighed 145. This was not good football, and Army and Navy tended to dominate. During my first week of college, another guy and I had to keep stats during a 0-0 tie played in a tropical depression. And since we were idiots, we could not find the keys to the press box. So the final stats ended up being completely made up because our papers disintegrated. But since it was a 0-0 tie during a lightweight football game, no one cared. Ah, College.

Also, Pete Carril is a complete prick.

[gube79]

what kinda crowsh@t is this?...

[pjfootballer]

10-7 Redskins. Suisham kicks a 41 yarder.

[Art]

Ok, so we have top 10 talent at every position, a HOF Coach, the highest paid assistants of any 4 teams combined, yet we still don't know if we have a team and even if we did we could make excuses for the coaching.

Note: To Art, Beautiful is the 2nd round of the playoffs with no offensive production whatsoever.

But that's just what a "twit" saw.

What a twit sees is what makes one a twit.

Gibbs has made several crushing mistakes in the one area that most hurts us. He's allowed core guys who were the spirit of the team to depart in favor of new guys. And, just as he WON the team over and they bought in fully to him, binding to him, he revealed to them he didn't believe in himself and brought in Saunders.

Unquestonably these mistakes have hurt us more than any others. They are also the hardest kind to overcome and typically signal an end to a coaching staff when they infect a team. I have such respect for Gibbs, I hope he can turn that around.

As for your dismissive comment about what our 2005 team accomplished, I can only say you must have recently come to be a fan of the team. I was around that team for its run and playoff experience. That team became a Redskin football team in Seattle during a loss. It was everything people who follow this team remember. I was in that locker room. I talked to 20 players. I heard the becomming of one unit with one goal.

You lack all of this.

And you are such a dolt you think not knowing it makes others confused when you act like a twit. It doesn't. It just makes you look the fool. Remember -- and this goes for most of you who have something to say to me -- I always know this team better than you because I'm there. You're not. When I stop being there, feel free to think you have the slightest idea.

[Art]

Even though it is a horribly boring sports cliche' date=' I can agree with the sentiment that it takes more than talent to win.

So either we have a lack of character or a lack of coaching. [/quote']

I've said exactly what I think we lack. You chose to be snide about that, while now agreeing completely with it. When you are as clear about your viewpoints is the next opportunity you should take to question others. But, as you merely seem to thrive on the idea that you should take pot shots at every poster who says something you lack knowledge to speak on, it's difficult to actually know what you think on any topic. Perhaps you should improve your contribution to include your actual views instead of sitting in wait to pounce on people for views you actually misrepresent only to actually have no problem with.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I've said exactly what I think we lack. You chose to be snide about that, while now agreeing completely with it. When you are as clear about your viewpoints is the next opportunity you should take to question others. But, as you merely seem to thrive on the idea that you should take pot shots at every poster who says something you lack knowledge to speak on, it's difficult to actually know what you think on any topic. Perhaps you should improve your contribution to include your actual views instead of sitting in wait to pounce on people for views you actually misrepresent only to actually have no problem with.

I think my views are fairly clear. Teams that go 21-27 earn their records. Our chief problem is lack of depth. Our secondary problem is something that I can't remember right now. Probably something do with the draft. Good night.

[Die Hard]

As for your dismissive comment about what our 2005 team accomplished, I can only say you must have recently come to be a fan of the team. I was around that team for its run and playoff experience. That team became a Redskin football team in Seattle during a loss. It was everything people who follow this team remember. I was in that locker room. I talked to 20 players. I heard the becomming of one unit with one goal.

You lack all of this.

And you are such a dolt you think not knowing it makes others confused when you act like a twit. It doesn't. It just makes you look the fool. Remember -- and this goes for most of you who have something to say to me -- I always know this team better than you because I'm there. You're not. When I stop being there, feel free to think you have the slightest idea.

I was there in 2005... for 4 games and the Tampa game with you

If you thought the team came together after the Seattle loss.... then what were you saying at this time last year?

Last you told me.... you predict 16-0 for the Redskins every single season. Am I right?

[Art]

I was there in 2005... for 4 games and the Tampa game with you

If you thought the team came together after the Seattle loss.... then what were you saying at this time last year?

Last you told me.... you predict 16-0 for the Redskins every single season. Am I right?

I'll pick individual games for us to be 16-0 this year, like last and each year prior. That's a constant in the universe. My feelings on last year at this time were generally positive if I remember correctly. I was still on the high of really seeing the worm turn for us. The preseason, for me, was meaningless last year. I'd anticipated the element we lacked for so long -- true team unity -- had been found and true direction toward a single goal was present.

I didn't know, at this time last year, just how deeply betrayed some of the players felt about a couple of last year's moves -- i.e. Royal and Clark. Even as we finished last year's preseason, I generally thought the on button was waiting for the Vikings. It became quickly apparent it wasn't and something very bad was taking place. For me, last year was especially depressing and hard because in Seattle the guys in that locker room were Redskins I could be proud of. Finally.

For them to revert to the selfish, crybaby, whiners they'd been since Norv was hard to take. Still is for me, which is why despite the 16-0 performance I'll predict individually, overall I think we'll drop 10 games. We'll know pretty quick if the team aspect of our team is back or not and that will make us interesting if it's back because if it is, the overally balance of our talent level is a difficult matchup for most teams, assuming we're playing up to the whole.

[Die Hard]

I'll pick individual games for us to be 16-0 this year, like last and each year prior. That's a constant in the universe. My feelings on last year at this time were generally positive if I remember correctly. I was still on the high of really seeing the worm turn for us. The preseason, for me, was meaningless last year. I'd anticipated the element we lacked for so long -- true team unity -- had been found and true direction toward a single goal was present.

I didn't know, at this time last year, just how deeply betrayed some of the players felt about a couple of last year's moves -- i.e. Royal and Clark. Even as we finished last year's preseason, I generally thought the on button was waiting for the Vikings. It became quickly apparent it wasn't and something very bad was taking place. For me, last year was especially depressing and hard because in Seattle the guys in that locker room were Redskins I could be proud of. Finally.

For them to revert to the selfish, crybaby, whiners they'd been since Norv was hard to take. Still is for me, which is why despite the 16-0 performance I'll predict individually, overall I think we'll drop 10 games. We'll know pretty quick if the team aspect of our team is back or not and that will make us interesting if it's back because if it is, the overally balance of our talent level is a difficult matchup for most teams, assuming we're playing up to the whole.

So Art, at this time last year, despite the fact that Portis' suffered his injury.... and the team subsequently traded for Duckett.... you were guessing that Portis' injuries weren't long-term and the Duckett acquisition was more strategic than a fall-back plan in case Portis didn't recover in time for the regular season?

Because that would be pretty hopeful.... considering that and the preseason performances.

You wrote:

"overall I think we'll drop 10 games."

So, you think this team is going to go 6-10 this season. Despite that each week you're going to predict the Skins to win each matchup for any given week.

Did I interpret that correctly?

I'll follow up after your reply.

[Art]

So Art, at this time last year, despite the fact that Portis' suffered his injury.... and the team subsequently traded for Duckett.... you were guessing that Portis' injuries weren't long-term and the Duckett acquisition was more strategic than a fall-back plan in case Portis didn't recover in time for the regular season?

Because that would be pretty hopeful.... considering that and the preseason performances.

You wrote:

"overall I think we'll drop 10 games."

So, you think this team is going to go 6-10 this season. Despite that each week you're going to predict the Skins to win each matchup for any given week.

Did I interpret that correctly?

I'll follow up after your reply.

I think Duckett was acquired less for Portis than for Betts. If Portis couldn't play and Betts didn't pan out, Duckett was around. Turned out Portis couldn't play, but Betts was so damn good no one cared . After Betts had his first start people were crying for Duckett if I recall correctly.

But, yes, I was generally positive on last year for the reasons I stated. And, I don't believe you interpreted anything correctly. You didn't need to, as I said it openly, removing your need to interpret. As this is not a secret, I'm very curious to know what you intend to follow up on.

[Die Hard]

I think Duckett was acquired less for Portis than for Betts. If Portis couldn't play and Betts didn't pan out, Duckett was around. Turned out Portis couldn't play, but Betts was so damn good no one cared . After Betts had his first start people were crying for Duckett if I recall correctly.

But, yes, I was generally positive on last year for the reasons I stated. And, I don't believe you interpreted anything correctly. You didn't need to, as I said it openly, removing your need to interpret. As this is not a secret, I'm very curious to know what you intend to follow up on.

#1. Saunders was RAVING about Betts all last offseason. And Gibbs has been a huge supporter of Betts since arriving in 2004. I think you're insane if you think Duckett was acquired to alleviate any doubt about Betts.

Unless, of course, you believe the coaches were blowing sunshine up his butt.... because this coaching staff has been known to do that.

#2. Wow, 6-10. I'm stunned. My followup is fairly straight-forward and simple.

So please tell me.... tell us.... how in the world will the Redskins go 6-10 this season?

I'd just like to know the variables which will contribute to such an unsuccessful season. I'll give you the opportunity to say "I told you so" if/when it actually comes to fruition

I just want to see what you view as weaknesses on this football team.

[Art]

#1. Saunders was RAVING about Betts all last offseason. And Gibbs has been a huge supporter of Betts since arriving in 2004. I think you're insane if you think Duckett was acquired to alleviate any doubt about Betts.

Unless, of course, you believe the coaches were blowing sunshine up his butt.... because this coaching staff has been known to do that.

#2. Wow, 6-10. I'm stunned. My followup is fairly straight-forward and simple.

So please tell me.... tell us.... how in the world will the Redskins go 6-10 this season?

I'd just like to know the variables which will contribute to such an unsuccessful season. I'll give you the opportunity to say "I told you so" if/when it actually comes to fruition

I just want to see what you view as weaknesses on this football team.

Betts not panning out could have been because he was the "bust" many thought he was or because he got injured. I think you know that. I also believe you know I'd not actually want a "told you so" moment if we have a bad team this year. With hope I'll be as wildly wrong this year as I was last year.

I've already answered the question of why I think we'll struggle in this thread, and in past conversations with you and others. In this thread, go to post 94 or so. None of this is new. And it'll be great if we buck the trend.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

What I find odd is that I've never gotten the sense that the players have quit on Gibbs. When players quit on a coach, it is usually pretty dramatic. We've seen it here a few times this century.

I think Gibbs has at least projected a strong belief in the players' talents. And the players (with some exceptions) have expressed a strong belief in Gibbs. The issue is that they may both be delusional.

[Die Hard]

Betts not panning out could have been because he was the "bust" many thought he was or because he got injured. I think you know that. I also believe you know I'd not actually want a "told you so" moment if we have a bad team this year. With hope I'll be as wildly wrong this year as I was last year.

I've already answered the question of why I think we'll struggle in this thread, and in past conversations with you and others. In this thread, go to post 94 or so. None of this is new. And it'll be great if we buck the trend.

Then I'll take a look.

[Art]

What I find odd is that I've never gotten the sense that the players have quit on Gibbs. When players quit on a coach' date=' it is usually pretty dramatic. We've seen it here a few times this century.

I think Gibbs has at least projected a strong belief in the players' talents. And the players (with some exceptions) have expressed a strong belief in Gibbs. The issue is that they may both be delusional.[/quote']

They quit on Williams, not Gibbs. On Gibbs, they merely lost faith in what he wanted to do solely because they felt it was no longer his offense they were trying to do. They pulled away from the change and never fully embraced it.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

They quit on Williams, not Gibbs. On Gibbs, they merely lost faith in what he wanted to do solely because they felt it was no longer his offense they were trying to do. They pulled away from the change and never fully embraced it.

I agree completely that the O-line pulled away from Saunders's offense and simply killed the offense for the first half of last season. This is why I think our line is good and not great. It is very good at what it wants to do, which is beat up linemen and run the ball. It is completely hard-headed when it is told to do something else.

As many issues as I have with Williams, I still don't think the D "quit" on him last year. They probably sensed that his ego had put them in some impossible situations, but they played hard. They just weren't very good. We were rolling out undersized Lemar Marshall at MLB, overmatched Warrick Holdman at OLB, young Golston, the one-dimensional Andre Carter, and warm bodies like Reed Doughty. That's some pretty poor talent.

(Andre Carter would be a very good player on a good defense. If the defense is good this year, he will probably get some impressive numbers. Putting him on a bad defense does no one any favors).

[Die Hard]

They quit on Williams, not Gibbs. On Gibbs, they merely lost faith in what he wanted to do solely because they felt it was no longer his offense they were trying to do. They pulled away from the change and never fully embraced it.

Are you sure about that? I thought they embraced it in the TC leading up to preseason.... they were all speaking glowingly about opening up the passing game and giving the receivers opportunities to make plays.

In fact, probably moreso last year than this year. The only change has been at QB.... and the players seem to be embracing Campbell's progression of the very same playbook.

So was it a lack of faith of Saunder's playbook/playcalling?

Or was it a lack of faith in Mark Brunell to execute it?

[Art]

DH,

Pure and simple a lack of faith in the foundation of the offense. Unambiguously so. As is typical with our offensive line in particular, they tend to believe they know more about offensive football than people more qualified than they are. At some point we ought to hold them to account for being universally against any offense slightly more modern than 1980.

[illone]

I'm sure the players were just as stunned as I was once it sunk in that the team broke franchise records in Rushing and receiving in 2005, only to trade that offense in for the shinier model. The team believed in themselves and could have built from that. Instead Gibbs went the other direction, starting over, and while some fans might not think the team lost faith in Gibbs, I figure they did. Maybe not openly because of who he is, but secretly behind closed doors the players talked amongst themselves. :2cents:

It was evident the defense punished GW for letting a few core guys walk, only to replace them with high priced temps. But I think the avalanche started with Gibbs handing over the offense. But, alas, hindsight is 20/20. Gibbs did what he thought was right for the team at that point in time. He can't take it back and he knows that. Watching Gibbs talk last year compared to this year he appears much more focused and I think it shows in how the team has responded to last years abortion.

I doubt Williams will play any mind games with the team this year. Putting them in compromising situations is pointless. Especially now. They're trying to get swagger back, and every shred of confidence helps that.

Skins 13 Ravens 6.

[Pedro]

Agreed. Williams is trying to resurrect this unit.... trying to establish it's confidence and identity. It's a veteran unit. There's absolutely no need to undermine the unit to teach them a lesson.

This is a unit that's trying to redevelop itself... build some cohesiveness and confidence going into the regular season. Coming off a horrible season last year.

After 2 preseason games.... I hardly think Williams believes he has to something drastic to keep the unit hungry. 2 preseason games isn't enough to wash the stink off from last year.

I agree completely. We are too early to do anything other than put guys in a position to grow in confidence and start getting a bit of swagger, about themselves and the schemes.

[SkinsFTW]

As is typical with our offensive line in particular, they tend to believe they know more about offensive football than people more qualified than they are. At some point we ought to hold them to account for being universally against any offense slightly more modern than 1980.

Yeah, but maybe they were right. The team at the end of 05 was a great team. You said it.

Of course the OL liked the fact that they could run the ball down other teams throats. That is what won us the last 6 games of 05 going into the Seattle game.

Bringing in Saunders changed all that.

Then towards the end of the year Gibbs himself validated their complaint by changing the offense and it worked.

Wonder if this is what you mean about going 6-10 this year though since Saunders is now in control again.

[Campbell's_da_man]

The defense has played so well for two games, I'm going to guess Williams has a St. Louis moment as he did a couple years ago in the third preseason game. It'll be a little harder to pull off against the Ravens offense than the Rams at the time, but, Williams will identify the strengths of the Ravens offense and players and call plays that directly force our guys into their weakest abilities. The Ravens will shred us.

I highly doubt Williams will expose his teams weaknesses, in an attempt to motivate them to be more hungry when the season begins. If anything, I think the defense has been mostly vanilla so far, with the excepetion of a few stunts and blitzes sprinkled in.

We may lose this game though, but if we do, it will be because of the glaring weakness of our offensive line up to this point. The defenses will almost be equal, but our offense is not running on all cylinders just yet. It still needs to get into a rhythm and some fine tuning. So it might appear that their defense out muscled ours, even though we'll know that their defense didn't get tested as much as ours probably will. And we will miss Jason badly!

[Ant15fromNJ]

If our D plays like they have been we got a real deal defense.

[Warpath11]

Pure and simple a lack of faith in the foundation of the offense. Unambiguously so. As is typical with our offensive line in particular, they tend to believe they know more about offensive football than people more qualified than they are. At some point we ought to hold them to account for being universally against any offense slightly more modern than 1980.

QFT I wrote something like this a while back...

This O-line never bought into Al's system because they felt that they had a scheme/formula that worked at the end of last season (2005).

To be honest, their whole problem wasn't about not doing what they were good at, IMO, they gave up on Al and his system from the start because it was a change. Throw in the fact that everybody expected Al's offense to automatically produce huge numbers instead of giving it time and learning. Let's not forget that they were trying to run this offense with an old washed up QB. Al Saunders is a proven offensive mind just look at what he did when he adjusted the game plan for Brunell in the Texans game. Everybody seems to think that Al doesn't run the ball, however, if you look at KC the proof is in the pudding. The leadership on this team is so screwed up that they have allowed the players to revolt against a proven OC.

Although Al supposedly asked them (the OL) to do something that they were not used to, they still should have given 110% effort and at the very least be physical with the guy across from them. Football is football, where you have to beat the get across from you, period. They started doing that and attributed it to getting back to "Redskins Football" when all they did was just "Man-Up". They could have "Man'd-Up" in Al's scheme but they chose not to...

[SkinsFTW]

Retort:

What a twit sees is what makes one a twit.

Gibbs has made several crushing mistakes in the one area that most hurts us. He's allowed core guys who were the spirit of the team to depart in favor of new guys. And, just as he WON the team over and they bought in fully to him, binding to him, he revealed to them he didn't believe in himself and brought in Saunders.

Unquestonably these mistakes have hurt us more than any others.

The interesting thing here is that you kept putting out last year that the guys that left didn't matter since we upgraded. I always thought that Clark for 1.5M a year or so couldn't possibly be worse than paying AA a 10M signing bonus and a large contract. Most of this board said the same exact thing! You knew better though since you knew that Williams would make AA work. You were there, the rest of us weren't. :notworthy

This is the funniest thread ever with Art bragging about how smart our team is and that everybody is jealous: http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=149064&highlight=Archuleta

Forget the fact that all of those guys were very overpaid and led to the problem he mentioned above. Art will twist it into something different which means he was right the whole time anyway.

Art claimed here:

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=147751

that Lloyd was a good deal. It's not looking that way now, your low number of 20 catches is actually more than he had last year. :notworthy I couldn't be there for the contract signing, but of course you were there and approved of it. :notworthy

I see that in that same thread I said that if we were going to spend that kind of money we should get Javon Walker, a proven player.

You blame the Saunders signing now, but you had "access" then and still claimed that Saunders was a steal here:

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=141416&highlight=Saunders

Why is that a damning mistake on Gibbs' part now? You were there, right? :notworthy

As for your dismissive comment about what our 2005 team accomplished, I can only say you must have recently come to be a fan of the team. I was around that team for its run and playoff experience. That team became a Redskin football team in Seattle during a loss. It was everything people who follow this team remember. I was in that locker room. I talked to 20 players. I heard the becomming of one unit with one goal.

You lack all of this.

My bad, no access therefore I am a twit. Meanwhile your access didn't clue you onto the fact that we had a 5-11 team rather than the 14-2 team you saw bond a whole 9 months before the 06 season started. :notworthy

See, I'm just some guy with no access. I have no reason to know what I'm talking about. Thankfully you are here to ensure me that you "KNOW" because you were there, and that I am a dolt/twit with no clue. I couldn't possibly have something to say while Art is still in existence. Right? :notworthy

The kink in your delusion is that you still don't really know anything other than how to insinuate to us all here that you, in fact, do. :laugh:

You predicted a return to greatness in 06 and they go 5-11. :notworthy You were ****ing there man! Way to go! :notworthy

And you are such a dolt you think not knowing it makes others confused when you act like a twit. It doesn't. It just makes you look the fool. Remember -- and this goes for most of you who have something to say to me -- I always know this team better than you because I'm there. You're not. When I stop being there, feel free to think you have the slightest idea.

IOW: Art was there, therefore, anything anyone else thinks or believes is garbage. The fact that Art has been completely wrong is irrelevant as well. If you disagree with Art you will be taunted until you sit, cower and beg. He's there goddammit, that has to amount to something! Thankfully, in his own mind, it amounts to all this and more. The rest of us can just :laugh:

Art knew the team so well that he thought that since they "became a Redskin football team" and later added AA, Lloyd, Randel El, Duckett, and McIntosh that they'd be unstoppable LAST year. Art was there! Who can question that? :koolaid:

He saw the whole thing progress and we didn't! We weren't there, but fortunately, he was! :notworthy

How could he be wrong? 2006 Redskins SB Champs! Don't doubt Art for a second! :notworthy

Clark, Harris, Royal, etc. didn't matter at all according to Art in Pre-Season 06. He witnessed all this happen from his throne in the locker room therefore Saunders' new offense and the (hungry for dollars) new players would just be icing on the cake. Our 10-6 team of 05 would be the Beast of the East once again in 06! :2drunks:

If being a twit and a dolt is due to lack of team contact (Art said it) then where does Art stand on the Redskins idiot/genius meter?

Full access and completely oblivious=Team Tard?

Art knows a lot, he gets to see Redskin players run around wearing towels and all, he just lacks the ability to acknowledge the fact that despite all that, he still has no more clue than the rest of us.

Say what you want but remember that Art was there, you weren't and that is all that matters, apparently. :2cents:

Art:"Remember -- and this goes for most of you who have something to say to me -- I always know this team better than you because I'm there. You're not. When I stop being there, feel free to think you have the slightest idea."

Need anyone speak after hearing Art put this one out there? :laugh:

Why even have a board at all after that? Dude knows it all and saw it all too because he was there. :laugh: Forget the fact that the team went 5-11 though. :laugh: