Czabe on Skins 10/10

[thelarkascend1ng]

But please don't say one game is proof that rookie QBs can produce as well as veterans. Frerotte had an amazing first game as a rookie. So did Ramsey. Wait until defenses have some tape of these kids and see how they play before comparing them to vets.

:applause: :applause: :applause:

Gibbs has always been known to play vets over rookies for quite some time, and usually he has success when those rookies finally do get their chance.

[Buck812]

-You gotta realize that thats the whole point. The ONLY time Brunell is effective is when he has time. QBs in this league are not going to have all day to throw EVERY down. Sometimes, the pocket will collaspe and they're going to have to make plays on their own...whether it is scrambling, or (given Brunell's lack of mobility nowadays) stepping INTO the pressure--something I have yet to see Brunell do this year-- and making that clutch throw on 3rd down.

In that paragraph alone you showed that you understand something that Brunnell supporters will never understand.

I dont care how many superbowls you have won or how many years you have coached or anything else anyone wants to claim they or someone else knows about football, if your QB cant do these things then you cant win in todays NFL.

[skins4eva]

In that paragraph alone you showed that you understand something that Brunnell supporters will never understand.

I dont care how many superbowls you have won or how many years you have coached or anything else anyone wants to claim they or someone else knows about football, if your QB cant do these things then you cant win in todays NFL.

Every QB in the league is effective with time...With time, every QB in the league will cut you apart. Brunell is a terrible QB. He is the primary reason this offense struggles from week to week. He can't make plays when they must be made. To me, John Madden's statistic in week 1 said it all: Brunell has thrown less over the middle in 3 years than ANY OTHER qb in the league.

[bubba9497]

You mean like, say, John Riggins, Earnest Byner or George Rogers? :laugh:

Czaban likes to vent. He likes to tell those who like to vent what they want to hear. That doesn't make him particularly insightful.

he's a know nothing putz.

[FrFan]

Gibbs has not, does not and never will put a QB on the field until he's absolutely ready to start. He doesn't believe in having a QB learn on the job. He just doesn't.

If we want a coach that will throw his QB to the wolves, I hear both Norv Turner and Steve Spurrier are available.

If we want Gibbs. We should know by now, after 15 years of watching the man coach, that he doesn't work that way.

I got your point, and I don't question coach Gibbs decisions, but I would really like him to keep us posted about JC development.

Hail

[TomE]

Good thread guys, all points were pretty well made (what a relief) :applause:

[SittingBull]

Get back to me when Brunell ruptures a spleen or fumbles the ball 8+ times in 3 games.

[skinsmania123]

Exactly. And I believe Joe Gibb's blundered on this pick of JC. You are now seeing 1st round draft pick QB's starting in their second season. I am beginning to wonder if Mr. Campbell will even see the field. Either he is as dumb as a red brick and cannot digest the playbook or he blunders consistently on the field. Or it is a combination of both. Either way, I am not encouraged.

[skinsmania123]

And I want to say something else about our D. Think hard about it. Rumph, Wright, and Rogers, would be second stringers, maybe even third on every other team. I cannot stand to hear Williams says stuff like.." we can put anyone into our system and they can do the job." Bull****! It takes talent. We have been destroyed by WR's on other teams this year. And Archuleta...forget it. He seems lost and turned around a lot. Even Taylor has been beat bad this year. On both sides of the ball we suck!

[FrFan]

Exactly. And I believe Joe Gibb's blundered on this pick of JC. You are now seeing 1st round draft pick QB's starting in their second season. I am beginning to wonder if Mr. Campbell will even see the field. Either he is as dumb as a red brick and cannot digest the playbook or he blunders consistently on the field. Or it is a combination of both. Either way, I am not encouraged.

I'm starting having the same feeling, he proved he can adapt while working with four different offensive coordinators during his four years with the Tigers. I hope JC will not loose confidence, working hard for 2 years and not taking any action. I would really like to hear what coach Gibbs has to say about him not being ready.

About Adam Archuleta he obviously join the Redskins for the paycheck, Quote : "Chicago was primed to sign SS Adam Archuleta. He was the team’s No. 1 target in free agency. But Archuleta's link to Smith, who was on staff in St. Louis for Archuleta's first few seasons, wasn’t a strong enough bond to dissuade Archuleta from cashing in on a record deal for safeties from the Redskins." Jeff Reynolds

Players playing for the paycheck instead of the "jersey" are no good, and people who give them the money are even worst, because they waist their money and they hurt the team. Commitment, hard work, dedication, pride to wear our jersey, and will to succeed should be the key factors to select a player.

[KingGibbs]

Guys, I just want to say that this has been one of the best threads on this site in a long time. Everyone has compelling arguments and instead of the usual fill in the blank sucks, there has been mostly substance. It's good to see.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I could live - I guess - with Campbell not playing this year. I mean, Rivers sat his first two seasons and it doesn't seem to be affecting him. Granted, Brunell is not Brees in my opinion, but you can make the argument that it makes sense.

Here is where Gibbs loses me: Todd Collins.

I really don't understand why Campbell isn't at least the consensus back-up QB at this point. That tells me that Gibbs either has a pathological fear of young QBs or that Campbell is still not clearly better than the Todd Collinses of the world. And frankly, I think I am a better QB than Todd Collins.

[XxSpearheadxX]

It's goint to be interesting to watch some people on this board eat crow when Brunell finally gets replaced and we actually bear witness to a passing game that exists beyond the line of scrimmage.

I will not only eat it, I will shove it up my ass! If it means the Redskins can get 1st downs in the 4th quarter - I will be more than happy.

I don't get some sick perverse pleasure out of feeling this way, I don't get to choose how the team's play makes me feel - I just am.

I just am a fan.

And I want to say something else about our D. Think hard about it. Rumph, Wright, and Rogers, would be second stringers, maybe even third on every other team. I cannot stand to hear Williams says stuff like.." we can put anyone into our system and they can do the job." Bull****! It takes talent. We have been destroyed by WR's on other teams this year. And Archuleta...forget it. He seems lost and turned around a lot. Even Taylor has been beat bad this year. On both sides of the ball we suck!

Rogers wouldn't be less than a #2 CB on pretty much any team other than the Ravens and maybe the Bears.

[Henry]

I could live - I guess - with Campbell not playing this year. I mean' date=' Rivers sat his first two seasons and it doesn't seem to be affecting him. Granted, Brunell is not Brees in my opinion, but you can make the argument that it makes sense.

Here is where Gibbs loses me: Todd Collins.

I really don't understand why Campbell isn't at least the consensus back-up QB at this point. That tells me that Gibbs either has a pathological fear of young QBs or that Campbell is still not clearly better than the Todd Collinses of the world. And frankly, I think I am a better QB than Todd Collins.[/quote']

And here, we completely, totally and in all other ways agree.

My personal, unfounded, and baseless suspicion is that Campbell just isn't looking good at all, and two seasons in Gibbs is trying to figure out a way to keep him off the field and make it look logical. I fear the kid is a big Desmond-Howard-like bust.

It's one thing to not start a young guy. It's another thing to bring in Todd Collins and and put him ahead of the young guy on the depth chart.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

And here, we completely, totally and in all other ways agree.

My personal, unfounded, and baseless suspicion is that Campbell just isn't looking good at all, and two seasons in Gibbs is trying to figure out a way to keep him off the field and make it look logical. I fear the kid is a big Desmond-Howard-like bust.

It's one thing to not start a young guy. It's another thing to bring in Todd Collins and and put him ahead of the young guy on the depth chart.

And I think this is the essence of the QB debate...and the big gorilla in the living room that no one wants to talk about.

Those in favor of Campbell are assuming that he is at least as good as most decent QBs are in their second season. Not Roethlisberger (of last year) level but maybe Chris Simms (of last year) level. Say what you will about him, but Simms was good enough last year to get a decent team to the playoffs.

And I think most of us are operating under the assumption that Campbell is better than Simms and the Redskins are better than last season's Bucs.

However, if it turns out that Campbell is actually Akili Smith, then this debate is pointless and the franchise is in a little bit of trouble. And the presence of Collins makes me a little worried that he is more Akili than Eli at this point.

[redskinsforlife]

what about his other points? I'd love to see someone argue his points on Duckett and paying our 3rd WR 30 million dollars.... stupid front office move, after stupid front office move...

After supid front office move, after supid front office move, after stupid front office move, .............and the beat goes on:(

[VegunN]

But all of them are playing due to injuries and stupidity. Duh? :doh:

[21KillzCowboys]

Correction, we have one #1 pick and a 3rd round pick invested in Campbell.

[Hauss]

Did good old czabe say that both of those Qb's lost their games. Did good old czabe say that the combined record of their teams is 1-8. And if you throw Vince Young into the mix the records are 1-13. Did good old czabe say that Rivers sat for 2 years and is doing very well.. That czabe, he's a smart guy.

[XxSpearheadxX]

Did good old czabe say that both of those Qb's lost their games. Did good old czabe say that the combined record of their teams is 1-8. And if you throw Vince Young into the mix the records are 1-13. Did good old czabe say that Rivers sat for 2 years and is doing very well.. That czabe, he's a smart guy.

Rivers didn't sit, he was at least active and played both his rookie year and sophmore year.

Plus Drew Brees was a much better QB and is a much better QB than Brunell is right now.

[TheLongshot]

And here, we completely, totally and in all other ways agree.

My personal, unfounded, and baseless suspicion is that Campbell just isn't looking good at all, and two seasons in Gibbs is trying to figure out a way to keep him off the field and make it look logical. I fear the kid is a big Desmond-Howard-like bust.

It's one thing to not start a young guy. It's another thing to bring in Todd Collins and and put him ahead of the young guy on the depth chart.

Wow, I expected better of you, Henry.

It is pretty simple why Collins is the #2 QB: he's a vet who knows the offense.

Answer this question: if Brunell got hurt in the middle of a game, who would you rather have in there? The guy who has lived and breathed this offense for years, or the guy who has never taken a regular season snap and only just started learning this offense this year?

I'd take the guy who knows the offense.

Also, Gibbs explained quite clearly this at the beginning of the season. Campbell is the guy who would probably go for the long haul if Brunell was out for an extended time, but in the middle of a game, you want the vet.

Jason

[Pocono]

we traded ONE 1st round pick and a 3rd round pick to take get a 2nd 1st rounder in 2005. - We didn't trade 3 picks for Campbell.

I agree we seem afraid to start Campbell, but I'm not sure about "ashamed".

Broncos-Redskins

Redskins get: Denver's first-round pick (No. 25), which is used to select QB Jason Campbell.

Broncos get: Washington's third-round pick (No. 76) they used to select CB Karl Paymah, and first- and fourth-round picks in next year's draft.

[XxSpearheadxX]

I wonder what part of Todd Collins' experience taught him to throw the ball at a defensive end.

Twice.

In one game.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Wow, I expected better of you, Henry.

It is pretty simple why Collins is the #2 QB: he's a vet who knows the offense.

Answer this question: if Brunell got hurt in the middle of a game, who would you rather have in there? The guy who has lived and breathed this offense for years, or the guy who has never taken a regular season snap and only just started learning this offense this year?

I'd take the guy who knows the offense.

Also, Gibbs explained quite clearly this at the beginning of the season. Campbell is the guy who would probably go for the long haul if Brunell was out for an extended time, but in the middle of a game, you want the vet.

Jason

That's all well and good except for the little problem that Todd Collins is not and has never been a good quarterback. He could know the offense in Sanskrit; I still wouldn't trust him because he's just not that good.

And before the Jacksonville game - when it looked like Brunell may miss it - Collins was getting the reps.

So, Gibbs approach seems to be that Collins is the backup at least until such point that Brunell goes on IR.

[Henry]

Wow, I expected better of you, Henry.

It is pretty simple why Collins is the #2 QB: he's a vet who knows the offense.

Answer this question: if Brunell got hurt in the middle of a game, who would you rather have in there? The guy who has lived and breathed this offense for years, or the guy who has never taken a regular season snap and only just started learning this offense this year?

I'd take the guy who knows the offense.

Also, Gibbs explained quite clearly this at the beginning of the season. Campbell is the guy who would probably go for the long haul if Brunell was out for an extended time, but in the middle of a game, you want the vet.

Jason

As a mod I often get accused of towing the company line. Maybe today I'll get a cookie.

he's a vet who knows the offense is the company line. Now, I'm not saying that's a lie. I just have a gut feeling it's more than that. I said before I have no proof of this. It's just a feeling. Collins getting the #2 spot over Campbell at this point just doesn't seem right. Even on a Gibbs team.

But hey, I'd love to be wrong.