Ignatius J. Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 quit getting carried away you redneck conservatives. Great idea. Let's stop getting carried away defending our country from invaders. Let's stop getting carried away enforcing our laws. Let's stop getting carried away trying to follow the model our Founding Fathers set forth for us. Yep. Let's stop getting carried away with all those things, so that we can turn into Canada, the UK, or some other panty-waisted European country where Right and Wrong no longer mean anything. Where borders, patriotism, and everything good in the world are thrown out the window. Because that's where allowing this sort of crap to happen without serious reprecussions leads us. Anyone else get the feeling this was an Alley oop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 This issue is simple - raising the flag of another nation over a federal building here is wrong. It should not be tolerated and that should be made clear. Any objections to this? once the Latinos do to this country what they did to theirs.Could you point me to "Latinoland" that was destroyed by evil Latinos? I see a lot of corruption in Latin America, but I also know the cold war and western interests played, and continue to play, a major role in much of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 I'd be lying if I said I was surprised by this, at the same time I extremely pissed off. This is what happens when there is no assimilation, I'm so sick and tired of hearing about this culture and that culture and we need to respect this and that yet they have no respect for our culture. "If Mexico is so great why are you here?" Simple as that. I don't post here in the Tailgate but I do come by for a visit to see what everyone is talking about but I did want to add my 2 cents on this topic. I tend to be on the left side of the political spectrum on almost all issues but here, I'm in near lockstep with the Pat Buchanan's of the world. Past immigrants (my parents being two of them) have always tried to assimilate into the American culture. Past immigrants embraced this country and the opportunities it provided them. This no longer appears to be the case. We've been so busy "accepting" other cultures and embracing the diversity of others that we've allowed people to stop embracing this culture and being proud to be an American. I have a very "Italian" name. So whenever I introduce myself, I always get the "so you're Italian?" comment and my pat response is "No, my parents are Italian, I'm an American." I get very strange looks from some people (mostly non-Americans who I guess wonder why don't I embrace my "Italian heritage"). What pisses me off is seeing and reading about people like me, children of immigrants who were born here and grew up here but instead of identifying themselves as American, they choose to embrace the "culture" of their parents. This is not only bad for this country, it's a dangerous path to follow. Soon we'll have a country filled with folks who were born here, are citizens and yet are loyal to another country/culture. How can this be good for this country? Sorry for the vent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfitzo53 Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Past immigrants (my parents being two of them) have always tried to assimilate into the American culture. Past immigrants embraced this country and the opportunities it provided them. This no longer appears to be the case. We've been so busy "accepting" other cultures and embracing the diversity of others that we've allowed people to stop embracing this culture and being proud to be an American. How would you define American culture? Or, put another way, what aspects of it must immigrants embrace in your view? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 How would you define American culture? Or, put another way, what aspects of it must immigrants embrace in your view? I won't speak for the poster you directed the question at, but how about these.... Speaking ENGLISH as a primary language. Becoming a Citizen at the earliest possible time. Maintaining allegiance to the United States first, and solely. Obeying the laws of the United States. Maintining an America First mentality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Judges Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 If you think this is an act of war you are no better than people who are willing to kill over a cartoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasRedskinFan Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 I'm pretty embarrassed to be a Mexican right now.... The things we do is just unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 How would you define American culture? Or, put another way, what aspects of it must immigrants embrace in your view? Tough question and I'm sure there are others here who are far better equipped to give you a fuller answer. But this is what it means to me. They should learn our language and not expect the US to adopt their language. They should learn the history of this country. But more than anything, it's not so much a specific thing but rather something you feel. They should love this country like the immigrants of the past loved this country. If you're born here, you are an AMERICAN not something else. Embrace that. The hyphenization (is that a word? ) of this country has focused on the word before the hyphen rather than after the hyphen. Pride seems to be only achieved by our differences and not our common bond as citizens of this country. I am an American. Not an Italian-American. I don't think I answered your question very well. Best way I can express it is that I want people who live here and are either citizens or are trying to become citizens to love this country (warts and all) and pledge loyalty to improving it rather than just "looking out for their own". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 If you think this is an act of war you are no better than people who are willing to kill over a cartoon. Who has ever indicated that I WOULDN'T be willing to kill over a cartoon? I wouldn't over the one I believe you're refering to, but then again I believe Patriotism/Nationalism is more important than religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Past immigrants (my parents being two of them) have always tried to assimilate into the American culture. Past immigrants embraced this country and the opportunities it provided them. This no longer appears to be the case. We've been so busy "accepting" other cultures and embracing the diversity of others that we've allowed people to stop embracing this culture and being proud to be an American. Nothing wrong with venting. But I must point out that this particular attitude towards immigrants has been around for 200 years. It used to be Germans and Irish coming in and insisting on converting the US to Catholicism. Now it the Mexicans and their language. As long as we've been a nation, immigrants have come here, apparently refusing to assimilate, and several generations later their last name is Smith. That's what so great about this country. That said, I have no tolerance for anyone who would raise a foreign flag on Federal property. If this really did happen, it should be a bigger deal than some snippet in a blog somewhere, and some people should be going to jail for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnLockesGhost Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Multiculturalism is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Nothing wrong with venting. But I must point out that this particular attitude towards immigrants has been around for 200 years. It used to be Germans and Irish coming in and insisting on converting the US to Catholicism. Now it the Mexicans and their language. As long as we've been a nation, immigrants have come here, apparently refusing to assimilate, and several generations later their last name is Smith. That's what so great about this country. Fair point Henry. The bigger issue I have isn't with the immigrants themselves (illegal or legal) but rather their children and childrens children who are citizens of this country and yet seem to have a stronger affinity and allegiance to the country and nationality of their parents/grandparents rather than the country of their birth. But I do see your point about the past and I probably am "sugar coating" how well immigrants assimilated in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slateman Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 I think I'm more embarrassed by the fact that the police couldn't pull down the flag :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtbasye Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 It was an act of war BY Mexico against the United States. As a U.S. Marine you understand that flags have meaning and that flying them in certain manners has very specific meanings. Flying the flag of a nation over a piece of property is the equivelant of claiming that property for the nation whose flag is flying. A foreign government claiming a piece of U.S. Federal Property is an act of war so far as I am concerned. Ummm.... perhaps a falicy in your arguement- I'm pretty sure those folks raising up the Mexican flag were not sent there to do so by the Mexican Gov't. I'm P.O.'ed about the immigration issue also but that doesnt mean that it is an act of war.... that being said lets hurry up and build us a freggin wall on the border!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xameil Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Tough question and I'm sure there are others here who are far better equipped to give you a fuller answer.But this is what it means to me. They should learn our language and not expect the US to adopt their language. They should learn the history of this country. But more than anything, it's not so much a specific thing but rather something you feel. They should love this country like the immigrants of the past loved this country. If you're born here, you are an AMERICAN not something else. Embrace that. The hyphenization (is that a word? ) of this country has focused on the word before the hyphen rather than after the hyphen. Pride seems to be only achieved by our differences and not our common bond as citizens of this country. I am an American. Not an Italian-American. I don't think I answered your question very well. Best way I can express it is that I want people who live here and are either citizens or are trying to become citizens to love this country (warts and all) and pledge loyalty to improving it rather than just "looking out for their own". Well, Scruffylookin, I quoted this ne, but your other would have worked as well...we as Americans almost always refer to where our ancetors are from...it's kind of the melting pot train of thought. I guess a better way to ask the question would be where were your ancetors from, but it's never asked that way. I actually had this discussion about 10 years ago when my college hosted an Irish rugby team. Whenever someone told them they were from Ireland, it made them quite irate when they couldn't tell them from which part of Ireland, and that if they were going to say what country their ancestors were from, they couldn't tell them which part of the country. Towards the end of their stay they started having fun with it, because they realized out of all the people they asked where they were from, not one said America. The only people they never yelled at were the ones who could tell them what city/village their ancestors came from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinz4evr Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Could you point me to "Latinoland" that was destroyed by evil Latinos? I see a lot of corruption in Latin America, but I also know the cold war and western interests played, and continue to play, a major role in much of it. See Mexico, for starters. You know, where there are barbed wire fences around factories because too many homeless people try to sleep on the loading docks. Blame it on corrupt governments if you will, but ILLEGAL immigration, FAILURE to pay taxes, and INSISTENCE upon FREE health care and social services which TAXPAYERS do not even receive are all forms of corruption and lawlessness. It is blatantly evident that a hispanic population numbering in the millions is commiting these crimes with no regard to the laws, foundations, and welfare of this country and its citizens. This same reckless disregard for the law and any ethics whatsoever has ruined much of Central America and will ruin the USA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Ummm.... perhaps a falicy in your arguement- I'm pretty sure those folks raising up the Mexican flag were not sent there to do so by the Mexican Gov't. I'm P.O.'ed about the immigration issue also but that doesnt mean that it is an act of war.... that being said lets hurry up and build us a freggin wall on the border!! It doesn't matter. They aligned themselves with the Mexican government by even having the Mexican flag to begin with. There's no reason for ANY American to have the flag of another nation in their possession, unless they're acting in the interest of THAT nation, not the United States. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 [big Deal]: Theres a rally of people with an agenda. They manage to raise a flag over a post office. None of the employees has an automatic weapon on hand: rare... Nobody was killed Nobody really harmed. Cut it down and put the stars and stripes back up in an hour.... [/big Deal] If they killed all the empolyees to get to the pole to put up the flag then its a big deal. other than that its no biggie... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 See Mexico, for starters. You know, where there are barbed wire fences around factories because too many homeless people try to sleep on the loading docks. Blame it on corrupt governments if you will, but ILLEGAL immigration, FAILURE to pay taxes, and INSISTENCE upon FREE health care and social services which TAXPAYERS do not even receive are all forms of corruption and lawlessness. It is blatantly evident that a hispanic population numbering in the millions is commiting these crimes with no regard to the laws, foundations, and welfare of this country and its citizens. This same reckless disregard for the law and any ethics whatsoever has ruined much of Central America and will ruin the USA.You seem to be spitting out talking points without any knowledge to back it up. Let me first hit your weakest point. You say "commiting these crimes" after pointing out "INSISTENCE upon FREE health care". How exactly is something that government provides a crime? I'm sure you are against the poor being granted the basic human right of health care and yes I'm sure you don't consider it a right. But just answer the question - how is something the government willingly provides a crime? Second point, tax payers do indeed have the same access to so called free health care. It comes from the idea that sick people can not be turned away from emergency rooms even if they can't afford treatement. Everyone has the same access to this. You are wrong. Thrid you blame a "hispanic population" for these crimes. I'm hispanic and I'll have you know I've never done anything but work and pay my taxes. I certainly don't appreciate you claiming that the entire hispanic population is all for law breaking. If you want to pretend most hispanics are border hopping illegals go ahead (you would be wrong). Feel free to check the polls - most native born and legal hispanc immigrants consider immigration a problem and support laws to crack down such as denying drivers licenses to illegal immigrants. Forth - "blame it on corrupt government if you will" as opposed to blaming what? I sense a little racial bias there. Are you trying to imply the problems in these countries are caused by hispanics generally being lawless? It seems to fit the tone of your post. Feel free to back off and accuse me of playing the race card now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Well, Scruffylookin, I quoted this ne, but your other would have worked as well...we as Americans almost always refer to where our ancetors are from...it's kind of the melting pot train of thought. I guess a better way to ask the question would be where were your ancetors from, but it's never asked that way. I do concede that this may be my own personal issue and that to identify oneself by your ancestory is normal and has been the case for a long time. I'm not big on tracing my family tree and all that stuff. I'm more concerned with the here and now. I just don't "get" why people try to identify themselves by their ancestory. Where my great grandfather came from or what he did, has nothing to do with who I am now. I did enjoy your story about the Irish Rugby team "calling out" people who tried to claim Ireland as their own and then didn't know the first thing about their roots in Ireland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zguy28 Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 This whole thing angers me. The Postmaster should be fired if he was complicet. :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xameil Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 I do concede that this may be my own personal issue and that to identify oneself by your ancestory is normal and has been the case for a long time.I'm not big on tracing my family tree and all that stuff. I'm more concerned with the here and now. I just don't "get" why people try to identify themselves by their ancestory. Where my great grandfather came from or what he did, has nothing to do with who I am now. I did enjoy your story about the Irish Rugby team "calling out" people who tried to claim Ireland as their own and then didn't know the first thing about their roots in Ireland. As I said, we tend to be more about the melting pot mentality. I know when I grew up the teachers always asked what we were, obviously in those grades, and where I'm from, we were American, but it was to know our heritage. Heritage and knowing your roots has always been big for us. Our heritage is passed down from generation to generation. People I have met that don't know where their ancestors are from generally regret it. So what part of Italy are you from? My grandfather is from Palermo, and my grandmother is from a small village just south of the Alps. She doesn't remember which one though. And yes since I knew, the Irish ruggers had no problem with me saying my ancestors were from Italy :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Want some more fuel for the fire? Why do we have elected officials speaking at LaRaza gatherings? How much of a outcry would there be over elected officials speaking at a all white rally with the same goals? :laugh: ps; that group includes Rove ,though he is unelected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsOrlando Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Xameil, I don't think anyone was suggesting forgetting where you came from but to embrace where you actually are? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 It's technically an act of war, but I doubt the fools who did this understood the rammifications. This is however, very disgusting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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