A Good Argument as to Why Mike Shanahan Should Evaluate his Coaches and Play Calling, Not His Players.

Hear me out and please add and debate what you are noticing different in the last few weeks.

We have all watched this team for half the season now. We have all agreed that just 3 weeks ago, this team could and should have been 7-1 or 6-2 before the Steelers game. This team was exciting to watch even after the injuries to our star players, for the exception of this defense.

This team was not only in every game, but some games they started blowing pretty good teams out, Tampa and the Vikings, until our defense let them back in the game. My point and the truth is, if these players weren't any good, then we would have been playing like we are now this entire season.

What has changed so much to make our head coach start looking forward to the offseason. What has changed for this offense to go from scoring 30+ points a game to 13? Have the players given up? No! Has RG3 lost his speed or arm? No! Besides a BAD GAME by our receivers in PA, They are getting open every game, so what has changed in the last few weeks to make this offense and team look like last year's?

Plain and simple our play calling. We started the season attacking defenses! We went after them through the air, on the ground with Morris, and especially with RG3 sneaking up the middle. We were a north and south offense and we took the shots short and deep, but took them into the endzone. Our receivers have no problem getting open, and RG3 has no problem finding them. We started off making 1st downs with 12 - 15 yards to go, and we would gain 25 yards and make it look easy. We would get inside the 20 and red zone, and we would put 7 on the board way more then we would 3.

We would hammer Morris or RG3 up the middle when inside the 10, or play action and zip it to a wide open TE or FB. Here lately we do none of the above. How many bombs have you seen us throw before a desperate miracle comeback? How many shots do we really take, how many times do we throw into the endzone a game?

Inside the 10 yard line twice yesterday and instead of hammering Morris or sneaking RG3, we got fancy. For freaking real? a 5 to 7 yard pitch backwards inside the 5 yard line? That is not what we do and thats why we came out with 3 points each time. Our players didn't call these plays Mike, your son did. Get back to attacking after this bye and rest! Take your shots into the endzone, throw some deep balls and you will keep these defenses on their heels just like you did when you started the season.

And for the Love of God don't ever talk about the offseason again only down 2 games from 1st place with half a season to go:doh:

While I agree the playcalling this week, especially in the Redzone, was bad; last week's poor offensive performance was caused by a horrendous epidemic of dropsies - not something to blame coaches for.

The offense looked better in previous weeks because teams have tape of the Redskins offense and we are missing Fred Davis and Garcon. After Garcon there is literally no one on this team that can get separation. Basically when the Pistol PA is basically a slant toward the center of the field and teams have taken that way. Teams have realized that the redskins can sustain drives running option/read-up consistent enough without shooting themselves in the foot

Couldn't agree more with the entire post. I was at the game Sunday and the first pass of the entire game that had any air under it, came with 3:40 left in the game. I think the aspect that is plaguing us most on offense is ego. In the beginning the shannahans devised a system that uses all of RGIII's abilities, and Robert rose to the challenge and played exceptional, that was great. Now because there are a few missing pieces on offense the coaching staff has mentally retreated.

They are trying to force a compact WCO onto this team now because they are not able to let loose of the reins and let our players play. Kyle and Mike see a few games slip and think they have to tailor the play calling for a depleted offense. This in itself represents a defeatist attitude.

It's crippling them; instead of letting it fly they have confined our offense to a depth of fifteen yards. Dink and Dunk drives require so many things to go right and precise execution from all eleven players. 14 play drives are great for establishing a tempo, but to sustain that type of execution throughout an entire game requires near perfection.

The reason I say ego is part of our downfall right now is because I believe our coaching staff has been restraining this offense. They do not trust our quarterback right now to play beyond the playbook. And to allow their young quarterback to play outiside of the playbook would be an admission that their coaching talents our secondary to Roberts on field talents. So as a response, they have confined his play style to a condensed version of the offense which requires impossible execution. In this way the coaches recieve personal validation that they still have something to teach him.

Mike wants Robert to play in his Sandbox.

I think people need to sit back and realize what any other team would look like if they lost their top two pass catchers. That is a huge blow. Would Green Bay and New England still function? Certainly, but not nearly as well. Other teams like the Bengals and Lions would be absolutely crippled. Injuries have decimated our season. Our offense would look sharper, but don't even get started on defense. Our defense would probably look competent if we had all our starters reasonably healthy. I don't think any other team has sustained worse injuries than us. It always seems like we have bad luck with injuries though.

Yeah, I hate to say it but losing Davis has crippled the offense.

Kyle still has to do a better job calling more passing plays for RGIII. I don't see why the offense can't be a sick mixture of dropbacks AND option plays.

I would like to see the Redskins just line up and play football on offense for the most part. Too many cute plays and too much out thinking themselves.

In my opinion, Shanahan has been out coached most games. The team typically starts slow. The other teams seem to make good half time adjustments. We seem to get out scored in the second half all too often. Shanahan's clock and time out management have been so poor, we have lost chances to win too often. He doesn't seem to have a feel for the game, and is a poor game manager overall.

When he came here, many people in Extremeskins touted his disciplinarian style. It didn't work. Who knows what his style is these days. The team shows great lapses in discipline, including Shanahan.

He doesn't seem to accept enough responsibility.

In a back-handed way, he accused players of packing it in. My take on it was that he was packing it in. I don't think that was a misinterpretation.

Oh, and the horrible home record. A real leader would figure out how to take home field advantage. He seems oblivious.

The buck stops with Shanahan.

Green Bay won a Super Bowl with a laundry list of injured players, the difference ..., our players are waiver wire has beens and free agent failures. Cooley is done,Merriwether is only there for a check,Garcon is conveniently hurt after one game,Cedric Griffin is only good for two plays a game, Niles Paul can't catch, Josh Wilson has no clue and even if he did he hasn't the speed, you let Carlos Rogers slip through your hands and keep DeAngelo Hall!., and Evan Royster and Roy Helu are your idea of running backs.....come on man.....please!

The salary cap nightmare of 18 million for this season and next coupled with the fact that we now have no draft picks only means at least four more seasons of garbage to endure at best. As good as RG3 is we should have passed and started to acquire some real talent while settling for Tannehill or someone else to get murdered back there.

Run RG, run.......run like a fricking deer for your life because this sorry ass organization will destroy you if you let it.

The blame starts at owner. Once Shottenhiemer got screwed by Snyder,the whole league started using us as a pay only pit stop to somewhere better.....anywhere but here.

Should Shanny take the blame and his play calling?......your damn right! Trying to run RG behind little Evan Royster on 4th and goal in the Panther game was atrocious.

Sorry for ranting and I know this is not the thread,but I can't get behind this team anymore folks.......I am done......after 46 years of this S#@* I am done!......Good luck RG...so long D.C.!

The offense looked better in previous weeks because teams have tape of the Redskins offense and we are missing Fred Davis and Garcon. After Garcon there is literally no one on this team that can get separation. Basically when the Pistol PA is basically a slant toward the center of the field and teams have taken that way. Teams have realized that the redskins can sustain drives running option/read-up consistent enough without shooting themselves in the foot

Morris is a very big pleasant surprise at RB, and if not for RGIII being on the team, would be the most highlited player on the team. The guy runs hard, and is 4th in the league. 4th !!! We finally have a QB who can throw accurately and deep, but now our receivers seem lost; one particular play a few weeks ago saw a deep pass, and the WR turned 3 times trying to find where the ball is, and eventually lost the ball. That is high school crap play.

One thing to watch is how other receivers have the mentality that when the ball is in the aire, it belongs to them. They actually jump up attacking the ball, where our receivers seem to want the ball to softly fall into their awaiting brick hands. Its so frustrating to see a WR watch as a DB or safety can come up and jump up to knock the ball away when the WR had plenty of room to jump for it and make the catch, but I guess pretty and making a play are 2 different things in their mind.

Kyle has seemed to resort to gimmick plays more, when the QB wants to be a classic pocket QB, give him the chance. Quick slants, screens, help alot.

Don't even get me started on defense; Haslett sucks and we all know it, and why he wasn't fired is beyond me. His 3 years to master the defense crap has shown once again how he can ruin a defense in 3 years, just like he's done everywhere else he's been; guess thats the reason he's not on those other teams, huh...

Plain and simple, when 4 are beating 5, yet we continue to call plays that expose that, refuse to adapt, its clearly on coaching.

We have a uber mobile QB, and uber mobile OL.Why not roll out RG3, move the pocket, and buy the receivers time to get some throws down field? No DB can cover receivers forever. Its how teams with thin WR corps get WR open. They need time. We have all the time to give. But we don't have pocket protection because we insist on light on their feet linemen.

Not every big play has to be RG3 improvising on a jailbreak. But not every must pass, passing play has to be thrown from the pocket.

Adding to that, he needs to look at his personnel moves. We are very thin at RB. We have no one to spell Morris. When he gets gassed or dinged, we are using BANKS!!

Its laughable.

It's crippling them; instead of letting it fly they have confined our offense to a depth of fifteen yards. Dink and Dunk drives require so many things to go right and precise execution from all eleven players. 14 play drives are great for establishing a tempo, but to sustain that type of execution throughout an entire game requires near perfection. Mike wants Robert to play in his Sandbox.

Football focus, the thread is on extremeskins right now -- has our receivers ranked in the 60s or lower compared to the rest of the league. Hankerson, Robinson, heck even Moss catch a relatively low percentage of passes thrown their way compared to the rest of the league. We've seen Hankerson lumber out there and just look flat out awkward trying to catch a deep ball -- the one he did catch this year was right in his hands and he almost dropped it anyway. Robinson seems to have butter fingers too. It's not like its lets give these studs more chances.

Maybe I get perhaps the mindset of yeah Robinson might have shown bad hands so far but lets keep throwing it to him and things will change or Hankerson might learn to get separation and do the basics and at the very least stretch his hands for the deep ball -- meaning perhaps through the process of testing these guys repeatedly they could learn how to play maybe we will get some interceptions and perhaps lose a game for it but it will help long term. I focus on Hankerson and Robinson because we know Morgan isn't a deep threat and Moss at his age (not that his hands are super reliable) isn't a deep threat anymore period.

But I do get Shanny's mindset of not trusting Hankerson and Robinson going deep, neither guy IMO has earned the confidence, not even close.

There are three major reasons we're struggling at the moment:

1) Injuries

2) Playcalling/Coaching

3) Personnel

All of these issues carry a large multiplier with them.

Let's take a look at the key players on our injured list:

-Jammal Brown

-Fred Davis

-Roy Helu

-Chris Neild

-Brian Orakpo

-Adam Carriker

-Brandon Merriweather

-Pierre Garcon

Granted, Garcon and Merriweather aren't "out for the season" but they have had significant injuries. We're missing two top pass catchers, a right tackle (who, despite my criticism is a large upgrade to Polumbus), a decent third down back, a decent strong safety, a solid defensive end, a key cog to our pass rush and decent depth at nose.

Our defensive playcalling is too bland and too predictable. We don't move our key pieces around and we don't utilize our personnel efficiently enough. Offensively, I think we're getting a little gimmicky and not trusting Griffin to drop back and on a typical 3,5, or 7 foot drop. That said, that may be because our offensive line isn't doing a great job in pass protection. I also don't like how we have, week in and week out, abandoned the run in the second half. Morris being hurt this week probably contributed to that, and Royster doesn't look too good running the ball.

Personnel wise, I don't think we have the horses right now. Injuries contributes to that, for sure. But our safety unit (Jackson and Merriweather) isn't great (but it's not bad). Our ILBs aren't good in coverage and our overall depth is lacking.

I think people need to sit back and realize what any other team would look like if they lost their top two pass catchers. That is a huge blow. Would Green Bay and New England still function?

Funny you should mention that, because Green Bay just played a game without either Greg Jennings or Jordy Nelson. How'd they do against a pretty decent Arizona team (top 10 defense)? They scored 31 points.

Funny you should mention that, because Green Bay just played a game without either Greg Jennings or Jordy Nelson. How'd they do against a pretty decent Arizona team (top 10 defense)? They scored 31 points.

Let's be honest, though (and I'm not saying injuries are our lone concern, or even our biggest) Green Bay's receiving corps is unreal. Jennings, Nelson, Driver, Jones, Cobb. Unreal.

Funny you should mention that, because Green Bay just played a game without either Greg Jennings or Jordy Nelson. How'd they do against a pretty decent Arizona team (top 10 defense)? They scored 31 points.

He was talking about two good teams,something the Redskins are not.

Let's be honest, though (and I'm not saying injuries are our lone concern, or even our biggest) Green Bay's receiving corps is unreal. Jennings, Nelson, Driver, Jones, Cobb. Unreal.

Absolutely correct, but then, they have a real GM too. We have Shanahan's massive ego convincing himself that he can be both coach and GM, when no one else has successfully filled both those roles before.

Absolutely correct, but then, they have a real GM too. We have Shanahan's massive ego convincing himself that he can be both coach and GM, when no one else has successfully filled both those roles before.

Pete Carroll is doing a pretty good job right now in Seattle. Bill Belichick has done it in New England. It's happened and worked before. The problem is, I'm not sure how good Shanahan is at talent evaluation on an entire team level. He's great at running backs and quarterbacks. I think Alex Gibbs was the reason his lines were solid.

Pete Carroll is doing a pretty good job right now in Seattle. Bill Belichick has done it in New England. It's happened and worked before. The problem is, I'm not sure how good Shanahan is at talent evaluation on an entire team level. He's great at running backs and quarterbacks. I think Alex Gibbs was the reason his lines were solid.

You know KD I posted it several times and nobody has addressed it, Shanahan claimed to have the best depth since coming here before the season, I think this verifies what you just stated. His talent skills must be looked at, while good to great on skill areas of offense I don't think they are good in the areas of Coaching and Defense and ST's. The kicker issue was stupid from the beginning. Two kickers in camp, one kept then dump for a guy nobody should have signed. The D meeting with the Coach should go something like this, Jim what you are doing is not working, what are you going to change? (deadly silence) Then this week he should be on notice, if not fired, if the D does not adjust he is gone at the end of the season, period. If Jim Haslett does not go after this season, it surely indicates a flaw in Shannylogic. But I think it is already there, he kept Danny Smith, he kept Brandon Banks for what, short returns and failed end-arounds?

Pete Carroll is doing a pretty good job right now in Seattle. Bill Belichick has done it in New England. It's happened and worked before. The problem is, I'm not sure how good Shanahan is at talent evaluation on an entire team level. He's great at running backs and quarterbacks. I think Alex Gibbs was the reason his lines were solid.

Belicheck hasn't won a Super Bowl since Scott Pioli left, but I'll grant you that the Patriots have still been very good. I think a lot of that is because of Tom Brady - it's hard to be awful with a HOF QB - but that's another thread. Pete Carroll has surprised me, but I'd like to see sustained success before I make a final judgment. He's been both lucky and good. Lots of coaches start hot (Mangini? McDaniels?) and then fade. The good ones sustain their success.

As for Shanahan, I think his player evaluation skills are mixed at best. He thought this team was far better than it actually was when he got here, and for every Griffin/Morris acquisition, there's a McNabb/Brown/Galloway counterpoint. It's clearly not working so far.

I agree to a point. I think that the coaches on the offensive side are coaching scared. I think they are scared of three things:

1. They are afraid of running RGIII too much and getting him hurt. I HOPE that they are not being reactionary to the public outcry after the concussion, but I think they realize that with RGIII on the sidelines, this team would be just awful on offense. Morris and RGIII have a symbiotic relationship, neither would do as well without the other. I think they were a little more aggressive early in the season, then they saw what could happen, then they backed off.

2. They are afraid of putting games on the WRs to go and win. For good reason, they haven't shown the ability to really do it all season. All of the passing has been short to medium stuff off of play action, a lot to the TEs, some to the RBs, but when they do go down field, they are not being very successful at it. And they don't want to get behind the chains. Because when you get behind the chains, then you have to throw deeper, and they're just not very good at that yet. They miss Garcon and Davis so much because they bring dimensions to the offense, some consistency, and oposing teams have to game plan for them. Right now, the defenses can game plan for RGIII, Morris, the option game, and really not worry too much about anything else.

3. They are afraid to just drop back and throw it because the OL is not built that way, and RGIII isn't as good at that yet. They need to use trickery, option stuff, zone read stuff, etc. to move the football. They can't just put RGIII under center and drop back and read the defense. When they try, they get pressure. Also factors into #2, that the WRs can't get quick separation. So they're afraid of sacks and negative plays.

I just see an offensive coaching staff looking for options to cover up deficiencies. And they keep trying to trick opponents because they can't just line up and beat them.

---------- Post added November-6th-2012 at 08:52 AM ----------

There are three major reasons we're struggling at the moment:

1) Injuries

2) Playcalling/Coaching

3) Personnel

All of these issues carry a large multiplier with them.

Let's take a look at the key players on our injured list:

-Jammal Brown

-Fred Davis

-Roy Helu

-Chris Neild

-Brian Orakpo

-Adam Carriker

-Brandon Merriweather

-Pierre Garcon

Granted, Garcon and Merriweather aren't "out for the season" but they have had significant injuries. We're missing two top pass catchers, a right tackle (who, despite my criticism is a large upgrade to Polumbus), a decent third down back, a decent strong safety, a solid defensive end, a key cog to our pass rush and decent depth at nose.

Our defensive playcalling is too bland and too predictable. We don't move our key pieces around and we don't utilize our personnel efficiently enough. Offensively, I think we're getting a little gimmicky and not trusting Griffin to drop back and on a typical 3,5, or 7 foot drop. That said, that may be because our offensive line isn't doing a great job in pass protection. I also don't like how we have, week in and week out, abandoned the run in the second half. Morris being hurt this week probably contributed to that, and Royster doesn't look too good running the ball.

Personnel wise, I don't think we have the horses right now. Injuries contributes to that, for sure. But our safety unit (Jackson and Merriweather) isn't great (but it's not bad). Our ILBs aren't good in coverage and our overall depth is lacking.

Injuries happen. I know, it's a reason but not an excuse. This is year 3 and they have had some time to find some depth. They've been good at finding some, and there's always a drop off when a starter goes out, and the injuries are horrendous.

The only thing that I can use to defend the talent and the depth was the 18 million salary cap hit. I'm pretty sure that there would have been a few additional pieces on defense that they would have gone after, and maybe another RT as well. But they couldn't. And they won't really be able to next year.

But they also have a bunch of starters who are not playing as well as expected: Kerrigan has disappeared, Wilson is not playing up to standard. Fletch can't cover TE anymore. We knew the deficiencies at safety and with Hall. I don't think that we expected some of the starters to regress the way they have. That hurts a lot.

But the coaching, not just the play calling, on defense has been atrocious. The reason that you run a 3-4 is to create confusion up front for the opponent's OL. I don't see any of that happening. You scheme that during the week. Now, if Haz is trying, but his guys can't execute it, I don't know. But that damn quote from the Bengal's game still sticks with me, where the Bengals SAID OPENLY that they knew that when they went to wildcat, the 'Skins would go cover 0. YOU CAN'T HAVE THAT. Let alone, that the 'Skins then said they didn't realize the guy could throw the ball as well as he could. That's missed preparation.

So, I think that they have to evaluate everything. Coaching, preparation, game planning, in game coaching, players, personnel, who they want to get, how they want to get them.

The only piece of good news is that the Eagles might be the only team in a worse mental state than this team. And they are next up on the schedule. A loss next week to Dallas, and they might just fold the franchise. The opportunity to have a growth moment is there. The 'Skins CAN compete with the Eagles, Dallas, Giants and Ravens. They CAN compete with them. But they have to get over feeling sorry for themselves, become get some mental toughness, and be more accountable.

You know KD I posted it several times and nobody has addressed it, Shanahan claimed to have the best depth since coming here before the season, I think this verifies what you just stated.

There are certain spots where Shanahan is absolutely golden. But I don't think he's a great personnel guy in general.

Belicheck hasn't won a Super Bowl since Scott Pioli left, but I'll grant you that the Patriots have still been very good. I think a lot of that is because of Tom Brady - it's hard to be awful with a HOF QB - but that's another thread. Pete Carroll has surprised me, but I'd like to see sustained success before I make a final judgment. He's been both lucky and good. Lots of coaches start hot (Mangini? McDaniels?) and then fade. The good ones sustain their success.

Don't be fooled. Pioli scouted and helped to suggest players to Belichick, for sure. But Belichick absolutely had final say. In many coach + GM team structures, the coach doesn't have full say. That's why Parcells left New England, and he said famously that he wanted to shop for his own groceries. Kraft then hired Carroll and he shared power with two other guys and was often outvoted. Kraft learned and hired Belichick and gave him full say over his roster. Belichick is smart enough to know, though, that a good personnel guy can help even if you have the ability to shop for their own groceries. Pioli certainly helped, but Belichick had final say.

Pete Carroll is doing a pretty good job right now in Seattle. Bill Belichick has done it in New England. It's happened and worked before. The problem is, I'm not sure how good Shanahan is at talent evaluation on an entire team level. He's great at running backs and quarterbacks. I think Alex Gibbs was the reason his lines were solid.

I do wonder how much better it would have been this year if they hadn't lost 18M of cap space the day before free agency.

I do wonder how much better it would have been this year if they hadn't lost 18M of cap space the day before free agency.

I think that's absolutely a part of it. The other part is how we spent the money that we did have. Hindsight is a mother ****er, but I think we would have been better off trying to find a corner or a RT with some of the money we spent on Morgan. But yes. The cap hit hurt us fairly badly. Eric Winston would have been an excellent addition to this roster.