Game Day Thread - The Commanders @ The Jets ~ The One Where One Gets Grounded

[lovemaskins]

15 minutes ago, Llevron said:

This isn’t Twitter Doc go to bed lol

This is a social media platform bud. And like Twitter there are opinions that may not match yours.  When that happens you can either stand or run. I don’t run and I don’t waiver over nonsense, and I certainly don’t join group think.

[Conn]

58 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

You should go to game then, they’re rather fun. Great experience you should put on the bucket list…

I live in Boston but I’ve been to 4 games so far. My favorite being the home loss to the Panthers in 2012 that caused Shanahan’s  “evaluating for the future” presser after the game, which set off our run to the playoffs. 
 

I’ll attend more in the future when the staff is one that I respect, and the organization resembles an entity that respects my time and money. I think that will happen soon. 

[Captain Wiggles]

Well damn my entire reality is in question now. 🤯

 

[lovemaskins]

7 minutes ago, Conn said:

I live in Boston but I’ve been to 4 games so far. My favorite being the home loss to the Panthers in 2012 that caused Shanahan’s  “evaluating for the future” presser after the game, which set off our run to the playoffs. 
 

I’ll attend more in the future when the staff is one that I respect, and the organization resembles an entity that respects my time and money. I think that will happen soon. 

Nice! I must admit I’m one of the morons that has been a dozen times now and yell my lungs out in support, including this year v. Cardinals!  Unfortunately I had another awesome time. Even got a selfie with B. Mitch, incredibly stupid…

[KDawg]

2 hours ago, lovemaskins said:

I’m there with you brother, screw this nonsense of actually rooting for my team to lose because the draft mob decided it so.  Never been a crowd follower myself.
 

imagine sitting next to these fools in the stadium. They’re wearing Redskins gear, booing when we score touchdowns and cussing you cause you’re dumbass is celebrating… lunacy!

You know, there is a place where one could make an argument that losing is the better move for the team’s success.

 

And we all want this franchise to succeed. 
 

It’s easy to see “we have to lose” and think that the folks saying that don’t want this team to do well, but I think that’s false. We’re watching a football game on Christmas Eve and we’re watching the Commanders. 
 

Most of us probably wouldn’t waste our time watching a team we didn’t want to see find long term success.

 

A draft pick doesn’t necessarily mean long term success. But a meaningless win against the Jets most definitely doesn’t. 
 

The win we got in the Chase Young/Joe Burrow derby didn’t really help us much long term, either. We won, we got Young and now we’ve traded him for a third and we’re 4-11.

 

That didn’t help team success.

 

The bottom line is that many of us feel that meaningless wins are worthless. And any win down the stretch is absolutely meaningless. 
 

You could argue if this were a young team that these games matter. And I’d probably side with you. Wins help build a culture.

 

Here’s the thing here, though… We are cleaning house. This franchise is going to be an essential expansion team. 
 

In this circumstance, wins are absolutely worthless besides a few fans having the ability to cheer for one weekend in 2023.

 

I’d rather set up the future to cheer for this team for several extra weekends in the upcoming years rather than beating a bad team and us going home after week 18.

[Llevron]

4 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

Nice! I must admit I’m one of the morons that has been a dozen times now and yell my lungs out in support, including this year v. Cardinals!  Unfortunately I had another awesome time. Even got a selfie with B. Mitch, incredibly stupid…

Everyone has different things they value. I was at the same game. Lost my voice for a few days. Sat there pissed in the rain during the second half wondering why I wasted all that ****ing time cooking and money just to watch these dude lose to the worst team in the league. And then the clouds broke and they won. And I felt great. 
 

But I KNEW then, they were losers. I knew it. I lied to myself for a few weeks but it was obvious from the start. 
 

I am looking forward to the days I can go enjoy a home playoff game I KNOW we can win. I value that. These weak ass end of the season games mean nothing to me. Have your fun tho

[lovemaskins]

2 minutes ago, KDawg said:

You know, there is a place where one could make an argument that losing is the better move for the team’s success.

 

And we all want this franchise to succeed. 
 

It’s easy to see “we have to lose” and think that the folks saying that don’t want this team to do well, but I think that’s false. We’re watching a football game on Christmas Eve and we’re watching the Commanders. 
 

Most of us probably wouldn’t waste our time watching a team we didn’t want to see find long term success.

 

A draft pick doesn’t necessarily mean long term success. But a meaningless win against the Jets most definitely doesn’t. 
 

The win we got in the Chase Young/Joe Burrow derby didn’t really help us much long term, either. We won, we got Young and now we’ve traded him for a third and we’re 4-11.

 

That didn’t help team success.

 

The bottom line is that many of us feel that meaningless wins are worthless. And any win down the stretch is absolutely meaningless. 
 

You could argue if this were a young team that these games matter. And I’d probably side with you. Wins help build a culture.

 

Here’s the thing here, though… We are cleaning house. This franchise is going to be an essential expansion team. 
 

In this circumstance, wins are absolutely worthless besides a few fans having the ability to cheer for one weekend in 2023.

 

I’d rather set up the future to cheer for this team for several extra weekends in the upcoming years rather than beating a bad team and us going home after week 18.

I get the logic and understand draft positioning, but there is statistical evidence that supports having a healthy organization correlating to the success of not only the QB but overall player development.  In addition, we indeed have a very young football team, and I’d much rather watch them compete and put down good tape than “try” to lose, which I’d argue does NOT happen at the player and coach level.  Which will also help the next regime know who to keep and who to cut.
 

As for me the fan, who went to games at RFK as a kid, and felt the stadium rock, I cannot and will not ever actively root for the team I love to lose, which is the root of the argument and definitely a hill I’ll stand on. I think it’s such a laughable and weak position to root for demise in hope of a greater good. It’s a losing argument in every aspect of humanity, albeit sometimes it can lead to change.

 

But specific to football, a game, it’s an even worse of an argument, in my opinion, because I watch for pure entertainment and I will not spend my valuable time away from my family rooting to lose. Win or lose I root for them to win and have fun doing it. Always have always will, and I can still be irritated in April we won a meaningless game in December. But I’m not rooting for it in December.  

And most of the folks arguing this ridiculous point will be on pins and needles in two weeks cursing on this very site begging to beat Dallas! I certainly will, draft picks be damned.
 

WE WANT DALLAS!

[Llevron]

2 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

 albeit sometimes it can lead to change.

One more time for the stubborn people in the back of the room! 

[KDawg]

Just now, lovemaskins said:

I get the logic and understand draft positioning, but there is statistical evidence that supports having a healthy organization correlating to the success of not only the QB but overall player development.  In addition, we indeed have a very young football team, and I’d much rather watch them compete and put down good tape than “try” to lose, which I’d argue does NOT happen at the player and coach level.  Which will also help the next regime know who to keep and who to cut.
 

As for me the fan, who went to games at RFK as a kid, and felt the stadium rock, I cannot and will not ever actively root for the team I love to lose, which is the root of the argument and definitely a hill I’ll stand on. I think it’s such a laughable and weak position to root for demise in hope of a greater good. It’s a losing argument in every aspect of humanity, albeit sometimes it can lead to change.

 

But specific to football, a game, it’s an even worse of an argument, in my opinion, because I watch for pure entertainment and I will not spend my valuable time away from my family rooting to lose. Win or lose I root for them to win and have fun doing it. Always have always will, and I can still be irritated in April we won a meaningless game in December. But I’m not rooting for it in December.  

And most of the folks arguing this ridiculous point will be on pins and needles in two weeks cursing on this very site begging to beat Dallas! I certainly will, draft picks be damned.
 

WE WANT DALLAS!

But it’s not ridiculous. I watch to be entertained, too. This team is not entertaining and won’t be any time soon. The draft is a consolation prize. I love the draft. I want to be entertained there if our team stinks.

 

We all have our own ways of being a fan, but saying that hoping for a draft pick in this situation is ridiculous is certainly a take.

 

At the end of the day, I want to maximize my entertainment value for however many years I have left on this Earth. And hopefully I have more left than these last two weeks… I want the best for the future. The now is worthless.

 

Again, we aren’t really that young. We’re 15th in the NFL for “youngest team”.

 

And, a lot of this group is free agents and a lot of them are going to want out, new owner or not. They need a change, too. 
 

 

[Rufus T Firefly]

4 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

I get the logic and understand draft positioning, but there is statistical evidence that supports having a healthy organization correlating to the success of not only the QB but overall player development.  In addition, we indeed have a very young football team, and I’d much rather watch them compete and put down good tape than “try” to lose, which I’d argue does NOT happen at the player and coach level.  Which will also help the next regime know who to keep and who to cut.
 

As for me the fan, who went to games at RFK as a kid, and felt the stadium rock, I cannot and will not ever actively root for the team I love to lose, which is the root of the argument and definitely a hill I’ll stand on. I think it’s such a laughable and weak position to root for demise in hope of a greater good. It’s a losing argument in every aspect of humanity, albeit sometimes it can lead to change.

 

But specific to football, a game, it’s an even worse of an argument, in my opinion, because I watch for pure entertainment and I will not spend my valuable time away from my family rooting to lose. Win or lose I root for them to win and have fun doing it. Always have always will, and I can still be irritated in April we won a meaningless game in December. But I’m not rooting for it in December.  

And most of the folks arguing this ridiculous point will be on pins and needles in two weeks cursing on this very site begging to beat Dallas! I certainly will, draft picks be damned.
 

WE WANT DALLAS!

There is statistical evidence that winning 5 games rather than 4 is going to lead to success?

 

Well, don't hold back, I'm sure we would all love to see it!

 

[lovemaskins]

4 minutes ago, KDawg said:

But it’s not ridiculous. I watch to be entertained, too. This team is not entertaining and won’t be any time soon. The draft is a consolation prize. I love the draft. I want to be entertained there if our team stinks.

 

We all have our own ways of being a fan, but saying that hoping for a draft pick in this situation is ridiculous is certainly a take.

 

At the end of the day, I want to maximize my entertainment value for however many years I have left on this Earth. And hopefully I have more left than these last two weeks… I want the best for the future. The now is worthless.

 

Again, we aren’t really that young. We’re 15th in the NFL for “youngest team”.

 

And, a lot of this group is free agents and a lot of them are going to want out, new owner or not. They need a change, too. 
 

 

Since you seem to be the only other grown up in the room currently, I’ll respond. I am anxiously awaiting a competent front office to maximize personnel management. Would it be great to pick #1 or 2 in April, yup, and can I still enjoy the game today and cheer my arse off, you bet.  
 

But, the actual percentage of selecting a game changing QB anywhere in the top round is a crap shoot at best and history shows that number 1 and number 2 draft picks are not weighted to “find” that franchise guy.  Currently, the only QB I can think of in the league now who went 1, that is a stud franchise QB is Joe Burrow.  Every other QB, maybe I’m missing a couple, have been picked all over the first round or later.  Jalen went 2nd round, Dak 5th, Wilson 3rd, Jackson pick 32 to name a few.  
 

Overwhelming evidence supports competent team building and a plan combined with savvy coaching and player development.  So to get all in knots over a game or 2 just doesn’t statistically translate into organizational success.  Which is the basis of the opposing argument. 
 

on top of that, folks are rooting for it as if it does, which evidence doesn’t support. Instead, I choose to root for wins today. It’s like the guy who plays golf and gets stressed out he didn’t shoot his handicap. He spent $50 bucks and 5 hours to be more miserable n life instead of enjoying the fresh air, exercise, and beer with buds. That’s a waste of a round and a good beer!

[Warhead36]

The inability to think for the future has hampered this franchise and its permeated to some of the fans…

[TheItalianStallion]

The D has improved since JDR's departure; we spotted them some points and only really yielded 13. We do have some good pieces and that side of the ball. We also have good pieces on O; the big question is QB. I don't know if the answer is on the roster.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

13 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

Since you seem to be the only other grown up in the room currently, I’ll respond. I am anxiously awaiting a competent front office to maximize personnel management. Would it be great to pick #1 or 2 in April, yup, and can I still enjoy the game today and cheer my arse off, you bet.  
 

But, the actual percentage of selecting a game changing QB anywhere in the top round is a crap shoot at best and history shows that number 1 and number 2 draft picks are not weighted to “find” that franchise guy.  Currently, the only QB I can think of in the league now who went 1, that is a stud franchise QB is Joe Burrow.  Every other QB, maybe I’m missing a couple, have been picked all over the first round or later.  Jalen went 2nd round, Dak 5th, Wilson 3rd, Jackson pick 32 to name a few.  
 

Overwhelming evidence supports competent team building and a plan combined with savvy coaching and player development.  So to get all in knots over a game or 2 just doesn’t statistically translate into organizational success.  Which is the basis of the opposing argument. 
 

on top of that, folks are rooting for it as if it does, which evidence doesn’t support. Instead, I choose to root for wins today. It’s like the guy who plays golf and gets stressed out he didn’t shoot his handicap. He spent $50 bucks and 5 hours to be more miserable n life instead of enjoying the fresh air, exercise, and beer with buds. That’s a waste of a round and a good beer!

The Redskins beat the Seahawks in a meaningless game late in 2011 and that was basically the difference between drafting RG3 at 2 straight up and having to trade. 
 

I’m going to guess you cannot tell me anything about that game or how good that win made you feel. You’re entitled to your opinion but there’s no need for deep analysis on this. It’s better for the franchise to lose out. 70% of this team will not be on the next playoff roster here. If not much more. 

[lovemaskins]

12 minutes ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

The Redskins beat the Seahawks in a meaningless game late in 2011 and that was basically the difference between drafting RG3 at 2 straight up and having to trade. 
 

I’m going to guess you cannot tell me anything about that game or how good that win made you feel. You’re entitled to your opinion but there’s no need for deep analysis on this. It’s better for the franchise to lose out. 70% of this team will not be on the next playoff roster here. If not much more. 

And what did we “get” from drafting RG3?  Russell Wilson went 2 rounds later…  has 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 ring, and is playing right now. RG3 is now on ESPN..? 

Note: interesting. Since you brought up the 2012 draft, Ryan Tannehill went 8 that year and Nick Foles went after Wilson in the third round.  He currently has a statue outside the Linc!

🫠

Edited December 25, 2023 by lovemaskins

[Redd]

3 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

And what did we “get” from drafting RG3?  Russell Wilson went 2 rounds later…  has 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 ring, and is playing right now. RG3 is now on ESPN..?🫠

The draft picks lost to move up 

[dunfer]

I think we wan

[Warhead36]

4 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

And what did we “get” from drafting RG3?  Russell Wilson went 2 rounds later…  has 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 ring, and is playing right now. RG3 is now on ESPN..?🫠

Its about maximizing your chances. Nothing is guaranteed either way but a higher pick is always better than a lower pick. It gives you a wider field of players to choose from and more leverage for trades. There is no downside.

 

 

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

20 minutes ago, TheItalianStallion said:

The D has improved since JDR's departure

D still sucks. The worst offense in the league had 381 yards on us today. The only reason the Rams didn’t put up more on us last week is because they kept fumbling in the red zone.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

9 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

And what did we “get” from drafting RG3?  Russell Wilson went 2 rounds later…  has 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 ring, and is playing right now. RG3 is now on ESPN..? 

Note: interesting. Since you brought up the 2012 draft, Ryan Tannehill went 8 that year and Nick Foles went after Wilson in the third round.  He currently has a statue outside the Linc!

🫠

Happy holidays friend lol. We think very differently 

[lovemaskins]

Just now, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Happy holidays friend lol. We think very differently 

Merry Christmas. 
 

that’s what makes the world go ‘round brother. What fun would it be if we didn’t challenge each other and then cordially agree to disagree!

[Conn]

We all experience and act on our fanhood differently, that’s the beauty of it. But I know the people who are willing to lose for the greater good are “right” in this discussion because if every fan was of your variety @lovemaskins we’d be stuck with Snyder forever. The stands would be full week after week regardless of the context or whether the team deserves it, and Snyder never would have started leaking money and failing to get a stadium built. His scandals would have continued washing down his back like rainwater because the cash would’ve kept flowing for himself and the rest of the NFL owners, and we’d be as popular as ever despite not deserving it, morally or practically, at all. 
 

So while I respect your fandom and how you choose to spend your money and time, I’m personally satisfied and fulfilled standing with the fans who acknowledge that there is a time to root for losses and support the team less, and that yes, it can lead to change. The fruits of which I hope we all are about to spend the rest of our natural lives enjoying. Really looking forward to yelling beside you and rooting for W’s with you moving forward—but some fans had to do the dirty work of drawing the line in order for us to get here. I’m happy to be one of those, not having given a dime to Snyder, the Washington franchise, or the NFL since I experienced the last straw sometime around 2016. That’ll change very soon. 

Edited December 25, 2023 by Conn

[PolarExpress]

1 hour ago, lovemaskins said:

This is a social media platform bud. And like Twitter there are opinions that may not match yours.  When that happens you can either stand or run. I don’t run and I don’t waiver over nonsense, and I certainly don’t join group think.

That’s it…..it’s coal for you.  That or a Dallas jersey.

[lovemaskins]

22 minutes ago, Conn said:

We all experience and act on our fanhood differently, that’s the beauty of it. But I know the people who are willing to lose for the greater good are “right” in this discussion because if every fan was of your variety @lovemaskins we’d be stuck with Snyder forever. The stands would be full week after week regardless of the context or whether the team deserves it, and Snyder never would have started leaking money and failing to get a stadium built. His scandals would have continued washing down his back like rainwater because the cash would’ve kept flowing for himself and the rest of the NFL owners, and we’d be as popular as ever despite not deserving it, morally or practically, at all. 
 

So while I respect your fandom and how you choose to spend your money and time, I’m personally satisfied and fulfilled standing with the fans who acknowledge that there is a time to root for losses and support the team less, and that yes, it can lead to change. The fruits of which I hope we all are about to spend the rest of our natural lives enjoying. Really looking forward to yelling beside you and rooting for W’s with you moving forward—but some fans had to do the dirty work of drawing the line in order for us to get here. 

Your fallacy is trying to be “right.” This is a subjective argument thus “right” is impossible. Every year any given organization has to change their franchise by the discrete choices it makes. Can draft position play a factor? Of course, is it the be all end all? Nope.  
 

For example, In hindsight we stupidly took Chase Young over Tua and Herbert. Folks were arguing the same nonsense that year when we lost to the Giants. Some here wanted Tua, but the consensus was Young the generational pass rusher.  Missed the 6’6” Hollywood QB Herbert and Tua for a JAG pass rusher we just took a 3rd for.  I could play this “what if game” all night of should coulda.  what if the best scenario is Penix at 7 instead of Williams or the other guy, who knows.  That’s a FO decision, as it should be, but as for this guy, I had fun today rooting for a win and will continue.  Next up San Fran. 
 

You stand with whom ever you want, I stand for me.  I make choices for me, if that happens to align with others, okay, when it doesn’t, I stand unless I can be objectively swayed by evidence and facts.  It’s why your side of the argument is struggling to defend and resorting to passive aggressive name calling and the sort which is entertaining at best. 
 

For something simple like football, this is too easy…

 

edit: also, the Snyder stuff (boycott) and this argument are light years apart. I too boycotted that creep and celebrate his demise.  And sure, you ever sit near me at a game, beers on me!

Edited December 25, 2023 by lovemaskins

[PolarExpress]

6 minutes ago, lovemaskins said:

Your fallacy is trying to be “right.” This is a subjective argument thus “right” is impossible. Every year any given organization has to change their franchise by the discrete choices it makes. Can draft position play a factor? Of course, is it the be all end all? Nope.  
 

For example, In hindsight we stupidly took Chase Young over Tua and Herbert. Folks were arguing the same nonsense that year when we lost to the Giants. Some here wanted Tua, but the consensus was Young the generational pass rusher.  Missed the 6’6” Hollywood QB Herbert and Tua for a JAG pass rusher we just took a 3rd for.  I could play this “what if game” all night of should coulda.  what if the best scenario is Penix at 7 instead of Williams or the other guy, who knows.  That’s a FO decision, as it should be, but as for this guy, I had fun today rooting for a win and will continue.  Next up San Fran. 
 

You stand with whom ever you want, I stand for me.  I make choices for me, if that happens to align with others, okay, when it doesn’t, I stand unless I can be objectively swayed by evidence and facts.  It’s why your side of the argument is struggling to defend and resorting to passive aggressive name calling and the sort which is entertaining at best. 
 

For something simple like football, this is too easy…

You know our season is over right?!?!

 

Also, you say he’s trying to be “right”, but you type a dissertation on why you are right every time someone explains why they feel the way they do.  Have an eggnog and Merry Christmas!

Edited December 25, 2023 by PolarExpress