Wentz Traded to Washington for 2 3rd Rounders per Bleacher Report

[Llevron]

I think the best thing the Wentz deal does for us is that it allows us to go BPA in the draft and in general allows us to build the team around the quarterback position as we have been. We really didn't have to sell out for this, and so we can just keep building the squad and hope that either Wentz is the guy or be in position for the next if he's not. 

 

I really wanna get another Qb.....but im coming around to the idea that we just keep building the squad and making the team as a whole better. 

[Renegade7]

7 minutes ago, Llevron said:

I think the best thing the Wentz deal does for us is that it allows us to go BPA in the draft and in general allows us to build the team around the quarterback position as we have been. We really didn't have to sell out for this, and so we can just keep building the squad and hope that either Wentz is the guy or be in position for the next if he's not. 

 

I really wanna get another Qb.....but im coming around to the idea that we just keep building the squad and making the team as a whole better. 

 

I'll have to accept that this isn't the plan but only option left because of our cap space situation now.

 

I just...I don't get how we have this little cap space despite not being over .500 in 6 years and last time we won 10 games was nearly a decade ago.

 

For the record, if we don't go QB with first rounder (which is what it looks like now), I'd like us to look at FS or trade down.

[PlayAction]

BPA in the draft is probably not another QB.  There is no need to use a first-round pick on the available QBs if the QBs would be 3rd round picks in any other draft year.  I don't think the Skins/Team/Commanders have been one QB away from a Superbowl in Snyder's entire tenure.  Except the first year when he inherited the roster!  They should continue to build the roster using BPA and wise trades of excess until they can find the elusive franchise QB. 

 

The Commander's roster IMO isn't as good as the most competitive teams - and I mean almost across the board not just at the QB position.  It's important to upgrade the OL, both in free agency for immediate benefit, and in the draft for the long-term.  We don't want Wentz to be taking a lot of hits and he has an injury history (some his own fault). It seems every vet QB suffers a career ending injury here.      

[CommanderInTheRye]

2 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

You got me!  Totally my M.O. - big homer making up excuses for this franchise.

 

I’m still waiting for your proof that for every teammate that likes him, two hate him.

 

 

 

 

 

Somebody needs a pretzel day!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 11, 2022 by CommanderInTheRye

[Jabbyrwock]

14 hours ago, Jabbyrwock said:

That's a lot of ginger bread.

 

1 hour ago, ZarG3 said:

I'll say it once. Expecting wentz to go into the season with a 28 mil cap hit is not only short sighted, it's stupid.

 

What would really be stupid is taking the ginger comments that are gonna be freckled all over the board this year seriously. 😉

[Ghost of]

14 minutes ago, PlayAction said:

BPA in the draft is probably not another QB.  There is no need to use a first-round pick on the available QBs if the QBs would be 3rd round picks in any other draft year.  I don't think the Skins/Team/Commanders have been one QB away from a Superbowl in Snyder's entire tenure.  Except the first year when he inherited the roster!  They should continue to build the roster using BPA and wise trades of excess until they can find the elusive franchise QB. 

 

The Commander's roster IMO isn't as good as the most competitive teams - and I mean almost across the board not just at the QB position.  It's important to upgrade the OL, both in free agency for immediate benefit, and in the draft for the long-term.  We don't want Wentz to be taking a lot of hits and he has an injury history (some his own fault). It seems every vet QB suffers a career ending injury here.      

 

We would have at least gone to SB in 2005 if Gibbs stopped playing Brunell whose knee was injured late in season. Or if Brunell were healthy (as in we were a qb away) 

[Tress Is The Way]

33 minutes ago, redskinss said:

All true, but still has no bearing on whether or not it's a good deal.

To use the same analogy, if I buy a 50 thousand dollar used truck and pay 20 cash and put 30 on an interest free credit card the fact that I'm getting a raise next year doesn't mean I got a good deal on the truck, it just means I maybe can afford it.

 

I understand where you are coming from, in my opinion what makes it a good deal is that he isn't hurting the team cap wise in the long run. If he plays as well as he did earlier in his career it makes it a great deal. At the end of the day, his contract isn't going to hamstring the team and allows us to go BPA in the first round this year because the QBs that are going to be selected in the first round aren't worth a first rounder. Wentz is also 29 years old (30 in december), and may have a chip on his shoulder about the eagles who now he will face twice a year. Upgrade for sure over our current crop, and still able to maneuver the cap to help the team.

[pcbothwel]

2 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Wentz at the minute is on a borderline top 10 QB contract. Behind him you have a couple of players due big money deals this offseason plus half a dozen excellent QBs still on rookie deals. 
 

To me, it’s a wash. He’s effectively on a mid tier veteran QB deal. The best will all soon be on 40mi plus per year and the Trubiskys of this world will soon be on 10-12mil per year.

 

We have an out after one season. To get a true starting quality QB, which he is, the contract is reasonable enough to me.

 

Well said.

A couple things about Wentz/trade that people need to realize in the financials/draft picks:

1) Because of the drastic difference in compensation compared to other positions, overpaying on a 1 year deal for a FA QB would offset the potential 3rd we will receive for losing Scherff. That needs to be included in any trade calculation. 

2) While Wentz is paid a salary commensurate with his productivity (10-15th ranked QB in production and salary), his contract structure allows us to the ability to A) Retain him if he delivers; and/or B.) restructure his deal with a signing bonus to lower his cap hit. Flexibility has to have a premium.

 

In regards to his ability/production/etc. I have seen a few things that give better context to his Indy stint / Jim Irsay that give me hope:

1) Broken Foot: In his first few minutes of his first training camp practice, Wentz felt discomfort in his (Left) foot. The Indy Docs looked at it afterwards and found a small break that appears to be traced back to HS. Initially they estimated that he would miss the first month of the season and supposedly Irsay was PISSED. Thought this was something that should of been found/dealt with earlier.

Wentz did not miss ANY games last year, but Irsay was already a little pissed.

2) Vaccine: I dont want to turn this into a COVID discussion, but Wentz was hesitant to get the vaccine which obviously caused issues with the team. Say what you will, but with the benefit of hindsight it appears him, and many others, were right in their hesitancy to get a Vaccine without approval that did not appear to provide the protection many spouted off.

Once again, Irsay was pissed.

3) Sprained Ankles: In week 2 against the Rams, Wentz sprained both his ankles in the 4th when down by 3. While replay showed the sprains to be legit and violent (one ankle looked like it completely snapped/dislocated), it was said some people upstairs *Cough* Irsay.. were upset that Wentz didnt come back in to try and win the game on a final drive.

 

To me, much of the issue with Wentz appears to be hyperbolic, childish, spoiled, drug addict owner. Jim Irsay's father bought the Colts and provided his spoiled brat son anything he wanted. Jim Irsay was named VP and GM just 2 years after graduating SMU with a broadcast degree. Please re-read that sentence and try not to be sick about the nepotism.

Irsay was AWFUL a ran the team into the ground, resulting in the number 1 pick in the 1998 draft. Irsay, 37, became the youngest owner in football when his father had a stroke and his 1st year was given a 15 year run with Manning. At the end of that run he was gifted Luck until he got sick of it and just retired.

 

Again, I know there is plenty of smoke about Wentz, but if there is more petulant, unqualified owner in the entire league than Snyder... Its Irsay.

He was gifted Manning and Luck and thought he was 'Owed' success simply by sending a few picks to the Eagles. When that slipped away in week 17, he threw a fit and Ballard/Reich threw Wentz under the Bus to save their own jobs.

[Llevron]

29 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

I'll have to accept that this isn't the plan but only option left because of our cap space situation now.

 

I just...I don't get how we have this little cap space despite not being over .500 in 6 years and last time we won 10 games was nearly a decade ago.

 

For the record, if we don't go QB with first rounder (which is what it looks like now), I'd like us to look at FS or trade down.

 

In all honesty, you wont find many teams going over .500 with their starting QB down two years in a row. Alex and then Fitz for us was a really rough stretch. We were never even able to play the game we planned on. And the QB contracts with literally zero production have just killed us. Availability is the most important stat smh. 

 

It is kinda shocking how fast that cap space dried up though. I didnt think Wentz would take that much. Taking his whole contract on kinda sucks. 

[Spaceman Spiff]

40 minutes ago, Llevron said:

I think the best thing the Wentz deal does for us is that it allows us to go BPA in the draft and in general allows us to build the team around the quarterback position as we have been. We really didn't have to sell out for this, and so we can just keep building the squad and hope that either Wentz is the guy or be in position for the next if he's not. 

 

I really wanna get another Qb.....but im coming around to the idea that we just keep building the squad and making the team as a whole better. 

 

It does allow us to go BPA.  

 

I'm expecting this team to be better under Wentz, although not significantly better.  Maybe like...3 games better.  Maybe we're a 10-7 team and somehow make the playoffs.

 

I'm not sure what we do from there.  Keep Wentz?  Obviously that depends on how well he's played.  But if he's not the guy, we're still in the middle of the first round of next years draft and if there's a QB there, we'd have to trade up.

 

We didn't have to sell out for this but I'm thinking at some point we'll have to give up picks to move up in the draft to take a guy we want...or Wentz ****s the bed, so does the team and we're in the top 10 next year anyway.  

 

I digress.  Any which way you cut it, Wentz isn't a long term option for us.  He's here from 1-3 years.  

[Llevron]

1 minute ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

We didn't have to sell out for this but I'm thinking at some point we'll have to give up picks to move up in the draft to take a guy we want...or Wentz ****s the bed, so does the team and we're in the top 10 next year anyway.  

 

Exactly. If he's not the guy....which I don't think anyone really believes he is....we stay in position to sell out and get the guy if we get the chance. Which I don't think is a bad move. I just wish we could have done better. But, eh. Its done now. 

[Renegade7]

8 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 

In all honesty, you wont find many teams going over .500 with their starting QB down two years in a row. Alex and then Fitz for us was a really rough stretch. We were never even able to play the game we planned on. And the QB contracts with literally zero production have just killed us. Availability is the most important stat smh. 

 

It is kinda shocking how fast that cap space dried up though. I didnt think Wentz would take that much. Taking his whole contract on kinda sucks. 

 

It's fair to point out injuries to Alex and Fitz, but the end of your post makes me believe you get where I'm going with this.

 

Even if Alex and Firz were healthy, the 2020 and 2021 teams were likely fringe playoff teams at best, still nowhere near contenders for a championship.  

 

To in 2022 be having these type of cap shortages is jus mind-numbing...I'm still trying to process this.

 

I mean, what else do we have to do with the incoming 2022 roster to be considered a contender for a ring? This in context that I don't believe we are right now this very moment and don't see free agency as an option to help fill those holes.

Edited March 11, 2022 by Renegade7

[88Comrade2000]

If Wentz's alleged issues of not listening to coaches and unable to handle criticism; surfaces here; he will wilt under Ron.

 

All we can do is wait and see. I won't consider him the guy until he shows it on the field for 2 years.

2022 - A 9 or 10 win season and playoff appearance. I am not expecting much more than that.

2023 - A 11 or greater win season, in contention for the division again, at least one playoff win.

 

He does that; you can tear up his final year and give him a long term deal. Minimum of 40 million/year.  Eventually all QBs will be paid that.

 

I just don't believe Carson will live up to that.

[Koolblue13]

52 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

You got me!  Totally my M.O. - big homer making up excuses for this franchise.

 

I’m still waiting for your proof that for every teammate that likes him, two hate him.

 

 

 

That's you alright. Always making excuses for this franchise and supporting everything they do 100%.   

 

This has got to be a first.

[Llevron]

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

 

It's fair to point out injuries to Alex and Fitz, but the end of your post makes me believe you get where I'm going with this.

 

Even if Alex and Firz were healthy, the 2020 and 2021 teams were likely fringe playoff teams at best, still nowhere to contenders for a championship.  

 

To in 2022 be having these type of cap shortages is jus mind-numbing...I'm still trying to process this.

 

I mean, what else do we have to do with the incoming 2022 roster to be considered a contender for a ring? This in context that I don't believe we are right now this very moment and don't see free agency as an option to help fill those holes.

 

Oh I agree with you, I am just making excuses lol. We are treading water and slightly above average at best. I know the media is selling us as a QB away but i don't really believe that. I think we are a QB and at least one more difference maker on both sides of the ball away. 

 

Its why in my heart I want a QB now. Get someone young, with cheap 5 years on the contract. Let him sit and learn while you build the team. Once Wentz is done, drop him and his contract, let the young guy play and with the money you save fill whatever hole you can with the best playmaker you can and then see what happens. But I don't think we actually take that long term approach. 

[Spaceman Spiff]

3 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

If Wentz's alleged issues of not listening to coaches and unable to handle criticism; surfaces here; he will wilt under Ron.

 

All we can do is wait and see. I won't consider him the guy until he shows it on the field for 2 years.

2022 - A 9 or 10 win season and playoff appearance. I am not expecting much more than that.

2023 - A 11 or greater win season, in contention for the division again, at least one playoff win.

 

He does that; you can tear up his final year and give him a long term deal. Minimum of 40 million/year.  Eventually all QBs will be paid that.

 

I just don't believe Carson will live up to that.

 

Yeah, you're right.  He's washed out of two places now.  Philly is kind of whatever, but he washed out hard in Indy where Frank Reich went to bat for him in a big, big way.  Thats a big red flag to me.  

 

Odds are it doesn't happen for him here and you're right he will wilt under Ron if he can't take criticism.  

 

He'd have to be absolutely lights out for two to three years to make me a believer.  And when I say lights out, like...indisputably a top 5 quarterback in the whole game, not just the NFC.  If he does that, I'd have no problem with a long term deal.   

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

Nobody is worse than Dan. Stop that talk right now. It’s only too bad that this isn’t the Worst Owner League. We’d be perennial world champions.

Imagine if in a few years Dan had a son with a drug problem graduating college and then he gave the team to him to run and do what he wants. That's Irsay.

 

and coincidentally my lifes goal to be that son.

[BC-Redskins]

I think RR has been smart with this trade..

 

* QB young enough and vet experience 

* 28m salary (potential make better) isn’t the worst considering what others are getting as going rate..

* no guaranteed money after yr 1 so easy cut 

* if he’s a success then we have 2 more years at 28-30m.

 

* we can now trade back and get 3rd and future 1st.
So option to have 2 1st next year to go get our guy (QB) and throw in wentz as sweetener 

 

i honestly think we couldn’t have got anyone better and he has the potential to be top 10 in this league !!!!

 

I don’t love any of the rookies this year and I think RR doesn’t either…

it’s a risk as always but let’s hope he proves a success

 

looking forward to eagles game more now !!!!

 

[88Comrade2000]

10 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

It's fair to point out injuries to Alex and Fitz, but the end of your post makes me believe you get where I'm going with this.

 

Even if Alex and Firz were healthy, the 2020 and 2021 teams were likely fringe playoff teams at best, still nowhere near contenders for a championship.  

 

To in 2022 be having these type of cap shortages is jus mind-numbing...I'm still trying to process this.

 

I mean, what else do we have to do with the incoming 2022 roster to be considered a contender for a ring? This in context that I don't believe we are right now this very moment and don't see free agency as an option to help fill those holes.

Ring? We aren't contending for a ring in 22. We aren't evening wining the division.

 

The NFC is between LA and Green Bay.

 

 

The only way Carson wins a title here, is he's been here 3 years or longer. He's not winning a title in his first 2 years.

[Koolblue13]

6 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Ring? We aren't contending for a ring in 22. We aren't evening wining the division.

 

The NFC is between LA and Green Bay.

 

 

The only way Carson wins a title here, is he's been here 3 years or longer. He's not winning a title in his first 2 years.

Thank you! I am even more excited now. Hello championship!

[Renegade7]

7 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Ring? We aren't contending for a ring in 22. We aren't evening wining the division.

 

The NFC is between LA and Green Bay.

 

 

The only way Carson wins a title here, is he's been here 3 years or longer. He's not winning a title in his first 2 years.

 

If you honestly believe that, them you helping make the case that we shouldn't of traded for Wentz in the first place.

 

 I don't totally agree with you, we can beat Dallas right now at least a split, but I had a similar concern when the trade was announced about us having a roster to be a contender within the next 3 years.

[Jabbyrwock]

3 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Thank you! I am even more excited now. Hello championship!

 

Little early to be hittin' the sauce, ain't it?

[Koolblue13]

Just now, Jabbyrwock said:

 

Little early to be hittin' the sauce, ain't it?

NO

 

and pretty much the opposite of everything 2000 says, happens. It's pretty amazing how perfectly wrong he generally is.

[CommanderInTheRye]

Just had an epiphany: We traded for Wentz  to buy one to two years to develop a long term solution at qb that they know is not ready to start this year; while still being competitive for the playoffs this season.

 

 

I'm going to go out on a limb here and make an ironclad guarantee:

 

1. If Willis is available at 11 the Commanders will draft him. Period. Full stop.

 

2. If they think Willis will go before then they will try to trade up to get him.

 

3. If he's gone at 11 they will either draft the next best qb on their board or trade back with the goal of drafting a qb later in the first round or early in the second.

 

I'm on this limb for the duration (at least until the draft) and I'm certain it will hold...

 

 

 

 

 

.

Edited March 11, 2022 by CommanderInTheRye

[OMacAttack]

12 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Ring? We aren't contending for a ring in 22. We aren't evening wining the division.

 

The NFC is between LA and Green Bay.

 

 

The only way Carson wins a title here, is he's been here 3 years or longer. He's not winning a title in his first 2 years.

Stafford just won a Superbowl so I get where you're coming from.  Rogers is itching to get back to the Superbowl but hamstrung the Pack by taking that huge deal, could it work? Absolutely Rogers is damn good.

 

Our division isn't that tough, the Giants are still hitched to Jones, the eagles currently have hurts as the starter and I believe he is not taking them anywhere. 

That leaves the Jerruhs , and I believe with a QB who can keep them honest by threatening them deep we will at the very least keep it competitive. We have the easier schedule this year as well, a division title isn't so far out of reach.

Anything can happen in the playoffs Wentz is talented enough to win vs Stafford or Rogers with some help from the team. Not saying it's probable but it could happen, hell if Foles can get hot in the playoffs or little brother manning can why can't Wentz?