The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[FootballZombie]

58 minutes ago, WashingtonRedWolves said:

Why not just flip the script and draft MHJ at #2, get as close to a sure thing of a budding superstar as you can in this draft and really see what Sam is made of

 

Another 1st post.

Welcome to da fun bunch.

I advise you to steer clear of the plumbing.

 

 

I disagree w/ your post tho. Gotta take QB when your at where we are at.

[ThatNFLChick]

6 minutes ago, KDawg said:

He’s also got Matt Corral as #1 and he has Daniel Jones as the worst QB in that batch. 
 

He’s got misses and hits. And I bet a lot of people have a similar hit rate as he does. 
 

He goes out on limbs, that’s for sure. And his QB rankings shouldn’t be dismissed. But he’s just as right and wrong as anyone else.

 

Since Matt Corral was injured his rookie season and was on IR all season and then his 2nd season they had a full regime change because Matt Rhule got fired and then the Patriots picked him up and he quit football we can't really say what Matt Corral was or could have been? 

 

 

[ThatNFLChick]

25 minutes ago, KDawg said:

He’s also got Matt Corral as #1 and he has Daniel Jones as the worst QB in that batch. 
 

He’s got misses and hits. And I bet a lot of people have a similar hit rate as he does. 
 

He goes out on limbs, that’s for sure. And his QB rankings shouldn’t be dismissed. But he’s just as right and wrong as anyone else.

 

Since Matt Corral was injured his rookie season and was on IR all season and then his 2nd season they had a full regime change because Matt Rhule got fired and then the Patriots picked him up and he quit football we can't really say what Matt Corral was or could have been? 

 

 

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

Since Matt Corral was injured his rookie season and was on IR all season and then his 2nd season they had a full regime change because Matt Rhule got fired and then the Patriots picked him up and he quit football we can't really say what Matt Corral was or could have been? 

 

 

You’re not arguing that Matt Corral is the best QB of the bunch, right? Just making sure you’re not going to argue non sense.

[Est.1974]

3 hours ago, ThatNFLChick said:

Oh Louis Riddick's opinion is one I usually pay attention to. 

 

In fairness that seems to be the direction of travel in terms of opinion. Can’t say I disagree, Williams then Daniels would be my #1 #2

[redskinss]

3 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

In fairness that seems to be the direction of travel in terms of opinion. Can’t say I disagree, Williams then Daniels would be my #1 #2

Google 2024 nfl draft quarterback rankings and you'll find this to be inaccurate. 

Pff, pfn, Walter football , ESPN ,CBS sports etc the entire page all ranks maye ahead of daniels.

Now I'm not saying they're right but to suggest popular opinion is in favor of daniels is a bold statement. 

[FrFan]

2 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said:

If this is true, we should have hired him before he signed with the Pats.

 

 

Why hiring a "standout" Qb talent evaluator if you don't listen to him (Mahomes)?. He also traded up to get Matt Corral who didn't live up to the draft capital invested by the Panthers.

Edited February 6 by FrFan

[Rolo Tomasie]

Even though I support drafting a QB at #2 I am also intrigued by how Kingsbury will improve Howell, who is still younger than Penix and only weeks older than Daniels.

 

Howell through week 10 was doing really well, he had delivered only one stinker of a game - Buffalo. Aside from that game he had thrown 17 TDs to 5 INTs and was close to the league lead in yards. But there were already signs that things were going south. His feet were getting happy and he was starting to flee the pocket from phantom pressure. He was doubting himself on throws and it all went downhill from there. I don't want to build around him at this point but I would like to see if he can be coached back to that earlier headspace.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

13 minutes ago, Rolo Tomasie said:

Even though I support drafting a QB at #2 I am also intrigued by how Kingsbury will improve Howell, who is still younger than Penix and only weeks older than Daniels.

 

Howell through week 10 was doing really well, he had delivered only one stinker of a game - Buffalo. Aside from that game he had thrown 17 TDs to 5 INTs and was close to the league lead in yards. But there were already signs that things were going south. His feet were getting happy and he was starting to flee the pocket from phantom pressure. He was doubting himself on throws and it all went downhill from there. I don't want to build around him at this point but I would like to see if he can be coached back to that earlier headspace.

 

The draft capital that could be had with 1 to 2 trade-downs from #2 would be immense. Total team overhaul. Of course you'd have to hit on those draft picks, but on the surface I would be supportive if this FO decided to roll with Howell. I doubt that'll be the case though. 

[WashingtonRedWolves]

Since I know we won't take MHJ, I'm gonna make my case for Daniels at #2:

 

Saw JD twice live this year and he was ungodly. They weren't 2 games where he ran like a demon, he tore the opponents (AUB and Army for a half) apart with his passing, including a play where he weas forced from the pocket and threw a bomb sprinting to his right to a WR who read the play and broke deep. Don't watch the highlights and assume he just takes off when protection breaks down. He's a QB until he has to become a runner -- and, yes, there are a lot of called runs for him because he's the fastest MFer on the field (OK, maybe w/ the exception of Nabers). Presumably, his pro staff is going to dial down those risks, at least until he adds 10 more lbs of muscle to his frame (whcih will easily accept it.)

I watched him closely in warm-ups and every single ball he threw was perfect -- every route, every receiver, perfect hand-catches on or one step from the sideline/back of the EZ. Yes it was only warm-ups, but he was clock-work perfect, every single throw.

In case you don't believe me -- and objectively, there's no reason you should -- I dug into this over the weekend at PFF, and JD not only ranked the best of the 3 in '23, he did so in virtually measure, including intermediate throws and rating in pressure situations, which is going to matter until this line is fully rebuilt:

 

 

 

 

[Rolo Tomasie]

I don't think a lot of people appreciate how young Maye is. He is a full 9 months younger than Caleb, and a year and a half younger than Daniels. That's one full season less of playing than Caleb and 2 full seasons less of playing than Daniels. 

 

To compare their age 21 seasons, which were played for probably similar talent level teams that both finished with the same 8-5 record:

 

                CMP    ATT    CMP%    YDS    AVG    TD    INT    RTG
Maye        269    425    63.3    3,608    8.5    24    9    149
Daniels    197     301    65.4    2,380    7.9    10    10    136.2
 

Projection matters.

[Est.1974]

6 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

 

The draft capital that could be had with 1 to 2 trade-downs from #2 would be immense. Total team overhaul. Of course you'd have to hit on those draft picks, but on the surface I would be supportive if this FO decided to roll with Howell. I doubt that'll be the case though. 

Role with Howell, or Russell Wilson of course……

[illone]

20 minutes ago, Rolo Tomasie said:

Even though I support drafting a QB at #2 I am also intrigued by how Kingsbury will improve Howell, who is still younger than Penix and only weeks older than Daniels.

 

Howell through week 10 was doing really well, he had delivered only one stinker of a game - Buffalo. Aside from that game he had thrown 17 TDs to 5 INTs and was close to the league lead in yards. But there were already signs that things were going south. His feet were getting happy and he was starting to flee the pocket from phantom pressure. He was doubting himself on throws and it all went downhill from there. I don't want to build around him at this point but I would like to see if he can be coached back to that earlier headspace.

 

Howell basically made it through the "college" season, 12 games, and then ran out of gas. I was looking at the game logs the other day and it stuck out like a sore thumb. I literally think he just got worn out and wasnt physically and mentally ready for a 17 game slate yet. Never mind he had very little help in the play calling department, or defense for that matter.

 

These are things that can be resolved. I mean its not like he pissed down his leg all year.  He showed some splash plays and running ability for much of the campaign...

 

He seems like a hard working kid that is coachable enough to resolve them. Get him into a conditioning program this off-season. Learn Kingsbury's offense starting NOW. Film room. Diet. Maybe eat a little steak.

 

I could be dead wrong, but i think we have yet to see the best of Sam Howell.

[Professor_Nutter_Butter]

11 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Role with Howell, or Russell Wilson of course……

Do NOT roll with Russell Wilson. I refuse to hear him constantly say something like, "Let's Command."

Edited February 6 by Professor_Nutter_Butter

[HeHateMe75]

11 minutes ago, WashingtonRedWolves said:

Since I know we won't take MHJ, I'm gonna make my case for Daniels at #2:

 

Saw JD twice live this year and he was ungodly. They weren't 2 games where he ran like a demon, he tore the opponents (AUB and Army for a half) apart with his passing, including a play where he weas forced from the pocket and threw a bomb sprinting to his right to a WR who read the play and broke deep.

 

 

Auburn sucked last year, they went 6-6 and got blown up by Maryland in their bowl game.  And Army........ LOL.  You need to offer better arguments for Daniels than him beating Auburn and Army to convince me that he should be drafted at #2.

[ThatNFLChick]

54 minutes ago, KDawg said:

You’re not arguing that Matt Corral is the best QB of the bunch, right? Just making sure you’re not going to argue non sense.

 

I am saying we have no idea. He never played an NFL game. However we do know that both Ridder and Pickett were not good at all and Sam was slightly better but not by much. 

[HTTRDynasty]

14 minutes ago, WashingtonRedWolves said:

Since I know we won't take MHJ, I'm gonna make my case for Daniels at #2:

 

Saw JD twice live this year and he was ungodly. They weren't 2 games where he ran like a demon, he tore the opponents (AUB and Army for a half) apart with his passing, including a play where he weas forced from the pocket and threw a bomb sprinting to his right to a WR who read the play and broke deep. Don't watch the highlights and assume he just takes off when protection breaks down. He's a QB until he has to become a runner -- and, yes, there are a lot of called runs for him because he's the fastest MFer on the field (OK, maybe w/ the exception of Nabers). Presumably, his pro staff is going to dial down those risks, at least until he adds 10 more lbs of muscle to his frame (whcih will easily accept it.)

I watched him closely in warm-ups and every single ball he threw was perfect -- every route, every receiver, perfect hand-catches on or one step from the sideline/back of the EZ. Yes it was only warm-ups, but he was clock-work perfect, every single throw.

In case you don't believe me -- and objectively, there's no reason you should -- I dug into this over the weekend at PFF, and JD not only ranked the best of the 3 in '23, he did so in virtually measure, including intermediate throws and rating in pressure situations, which is going to matter until this line is fully rebuilt:

 

 

 

 

So we should only care about their final years?

 

I appreciate the case you made, but it’s a little weird that, from what I’ve seen, every Daniels’ fan wants us to ignore the seasons leading up to his final one. Or the fact that he was meaningfully older than the other guys during that season.
 

I mean, the dude’s going to be 24 years old before his rookie year is over. Name me the QBs that have lasted into their 30s playing JD’s style. At best, we likely have 5-7 years of high level play from him (if he hits). That needs to be factored into the evaluation. 

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

I am saying we have no idea. He never played an NFL game. However we do know that both Ridder and Pickett were not good at all and Sam was slightly better but not by much. 

We know Corral was on pace to get cut before he got hurt. 
 

This is wild. 

[ThatNFLChick]

14 minutes ago, HeHateMe75 said:

 

Auburn sucked last year, they went 6-6 and got blown up by Maryland in their bowl game.  And Army........ LOL.  You need to offer better arguments for Daniels than him beating Auburn and Army to convince me that he should be drafted at #2.

 

LOL. I won't even include his best year 

 

2019 as a true freshman in the Pac-10:

Beat #6 Oregon/outplayed Justin Herbert

Beat #15 Cal

Beat # 18 MSU

 

2022 (first season at LSU, new team, new school, new system, new offense, new coach):

Beat #6 Alabama/outplayed Bryce Young

Beat #7 Ole Miss

 

9 minutes ago, KDawg said:

We know Corral was on pace to get cut before he got hurt. 
 

This is wild. 

 

What? He got hurt in preseaaon of his rookie year in Carolina. He did get cut when they brought in Frank Reich (who got fired) and brought in Bryce Young and Dalton to back him up as the vet. They tried to bring him back on the practice squad but the Patriots picked him up. Then he walked away from the Patriots and they put him on the unavailable list because he left football all together. They basically confirmed they wanted to see if he could be the guy because they knew Jones and Zappe weren't. When he walked away they elevated Zappe again. 

Edited February 6 by ThatNFLChick

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

LOL. I won't even include his best year 

 

2019 as a true freshman in the Pac-10:

Beat #6 Oregon/outplayed Justin Herbert

Beat #15 Cal

Beat # 18 MSU

 

2022 (first season at LSU, new team, new school, new system, new offense, new coach):

Beat #6 Alabama/outplayed Bryce Young

Beat #7 Ole Miss

 

 

What? He got hurt in preseaaon of his rookie year in Carolina. He did get cut when they brought in Frank Reich (who got fired) and brought in Bryce Young and Dalton to back him up as the vet. They tried to bring him back on the practice squad but the Patriots picked him up. Then he walked away from the Patriots and they put him on the unavailable list because he left football all together. They basically confirmed they wanted to see if he could be the guy because they knew Jones and Zappe weren't. When he walked away they elevated Zappe again. 

So… you’re arguing that there is an argument that the guy who got cut for Andy Dalton and left football altogether could have been the best QB in that draft class?

 

 

[Ghost of]

30 minutes ago, Rolo Tomasie said:

I don't think a lot of people appreciate how young Maye is. He is a full 9 months younger than Caleb, and a year and a half younger than Daniels. That's one full season less of playing than Caleb and 2 full seasons less of playing than Daniels. 

 

To compare their age 21 seasons, which were played for probably similar talent level teams that both finished with the same 8-5 record:

 

                CMP    ATT    CMP%    YDS    AVG    TD    INT    RTG
Maye        269    425    63.3    3,608    8.5    24    9    149
Daniels    197     301    65.4    2,380    7.9    10    10    136.2
 

Projection matters.

 

You know who's even younger than that?! hehe

33 minutes ago, WashingtonRedWolves said:

In case you don't believe me -- and objectively, there's no reason you should -- I dug into this over the weekend at PFF, and JD not only ranked the best of the 3 in '23, he did so in virtually measure, including intermediate throws and rating in pressure situations, which is going to matter until this line is fully rebuilt:

 

 

Isn't there someone you're forgetting?

[ThatNFLChick]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

So… you’re arguing that there is an argument that the guy who got cut for Andy Dalton and left football altogether could have been the best QB in that draft class?

 

 

 

I am saying we'll never know where he would rank because he never played an NFL game. I've said this a few times, not sure whats confusing. Also the best QB in that draft class is a low bar. Not a single one of them will be a starter next season. 

[Ghost of]

1 minute ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

I am saying we'll never know where he would rank because he never played an NFL game. I've said this a few times, not sure whats confusing. Also the best QB in that draft class is a low bar. Not a single one of them will be a starter next season. 

I think Matt was rumored to have mental health issues. 

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

I am saying we'll never know where he would rank because he never played an NFL game. I've said this a few times, not sure whats confusing. Also the best QB in that draft class is a low bar. Not a single one of them will be a starter next season. 

What’s confusing is how absolutely absurd this conversation is. It’s wild you’re holding court for a guy who didn’t play in a game. He didn’t play in a game. Regardless of why, that answers the question. 

[HTTRDynasty]

Nvm

Edited February 6 by HTTRDynasty