Spurrier back to "old style"?

[Oldskool]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=1695295

Sunday, December 28, 2003

ESPN.com news services

ASHBURN, Va. -- If Steve Spurrier returns next season as coach of the Washington Redskins, he will attempt to revert to his college ways and demand more discipline and greater accountability.

"Hopefully I can get back to my old style a little bit more," said Spurrier, referring to his successful 12-year run at the University of Florida.

Spurrier's comments came after several Redskins described an atmosphere of lax discipline on the team under the coach, who declined to answer questions about whether he will return.

Asked if that means becoming more demanding of his players, Spurrier replied: "A little bit more. Don't let the inmates run the asylum."

Spurrier also said there will be announcements regarding "players, coaches and so forth" within the next two weeks as he heads for vacation.

There has also been speculation that Spurrier would not be back. ESPN's Chris Mortensen reported Saturday that Spurrier is contemplating stepping down after talking it over with his wife. Also Saturday, Redskins officials told ESPN.com's Len Pasquarelli privately that the status of Spurrier for next season remains uncertain.

Spurrier didn't answer questions about his future Sunday, referring to previous statements that stop short of a firm declaration. Two weeks ago he said: "Right now, that's the plan."

The comments came from players taking physicals the day after a 5-11 season ended with Saturday night's 31-7 loss to Philadelphia. Linebacker Jeremiah Trotter spoke at length about discipline being a "big time" problem.

"Our problems go way beyond the field," Trotter said.

"It starts with guys walking in late, cell phones ringing, all that type of stuff. We play the same way we practice. If we practice half-speed, then we get out there and play half-speed. We makes mistakes in practice; we get out there and make mistakes in the game. If you don't make the corrections during the week, it's going to carry over 'til Sunday. ... There's got to be some type of structure."

Trotter said he was surprised that it took 16 games before there was a significant crackdown. Darrell Russell and Zeron Flemister were made inactive for Saturday's game for arriving late for the Christmas Day practice, and Antonio Pierce was also inactive after breaking an unspecified team rule.

But one look at a Redskins practice during the season was enough to tell there wasn't a strict regimen. Even during stretching, some players would stand, talk or joke while others worked their muscles.

"It's mind-boggling to me, how guys approach the game," Trotter said. "You don't find too many professionals on this team. ... When you do make a mistake and you've got a nonchalant attitude about it, that does nothing for the team. Guys see that, and it just shows you don't care."

Spurrier denied Trotter's accusations about tardiness and cell phone abuse.

"We haven't had that problem," Spurrier said. "That's not true."

But other players backed Trotter up. LaVar Arrington, Champ Bailey and John Jansen all cited off-the-field discipline as a team-wide problem.

"It's always been an issue, but it's a matter of guys taking ownership of what they do," Jansen said. "If somebody was in a business meeting, they wouldn't necessarily take a lot of cell phone calls in their business meeting."

Even Russell, one of the recipients of Spurrier's first real disciplinary actions, indicated it was something long overdue.

"If you don't reprimand your players, you're not going to be respected," Russell said. "The fact that he took a stand and put his foot down, that's a step in the right direction."

The players tried delicately not to criticize Spurrier directly for the lack of discipline, but Trotter said: "It starts at the top and works its way down."

Jansen also offered a warning: If Spurrier suddenly cracks the whip next season, the players might not respond.

"In my opinion, it's always easier to loosen it up than it is to tighten up," Jansen said. "It'll be a challenge."

It appears Spurrier will give it a try, although it's hard to tell. He was evasive during his final news conference, which followed a season-ending team meeting that lasted all of two minutes. He told reporters that on-field -- not off-field -- discipline was a problem, and that he probably should have benched some players for blowing assignments.

But most of his comments were generic.

"We need some help in some areas, obviously, maybe coaching and player-wise, that could get us over the hump," Spurrier said.

Spurrier met with owner Dan Snyder following Saturday's game, but the front office is still unsure of the coach's plans. Changes appear imminent to Spurrier's inexperienced coaching staff, but it's clear Spurrier also wants more input in player selection, an area over which he has no contractual control.

Should there be an impasse in talks with Snyder, Spurrier could depart. For now, though, he's heading to Florida on Monday for a vacation, much needed after compiling a 12-20 record in two years as an NFL coach.

"I could sit here and talk about a lot of things I wish I'd done differently," Spurrier said. "But if I did, it would sound like excuses, and I'm not an excuse-maker."

Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.

[codeorama]

Talk is just talk, but I've often wondered where Spurrier's fire was on the sidelines like he had at UF.

I know and understand that one of the things that EVERY analyst said when Spurrier was hired was that his "act" wouldn't work with Pro athletes... But in hindsight, he probably should have just continued on just as he had in college.

While I still think Spurrier can get the job done, I think his only mistake has been to change himself because of the "professional players". I think the players need someone to kick their asses.

[luckydevil]

I think the players need someone to kick their asses.

It is too late for Spurrier to become a disciplinary coach, the players will tune him out.

[BG]

SOS needs to bring in Seargent Heartman from Full Metal Jacket.

[skinsblitz]

Why bother now? Snyder's door is always open isn't it? If some player doesn't like what Spurrier says to him, well they can just go run and cry to Danny-boy. Just ask Bruce Smith about that.

[Art]

Originally posted by skinsblitz

Why bother now? Snyder's door is always open isn't it? If some player doesn't like what Spurrier says to him, well they can just go run and cry to Danny-boy. Just ask Bruce Smith about that.

Yeah, and have Danny boy tell them to go talk to the coaches. That's what Snyder did with Smith. As Maske said, he was present during some of that conversation and to him it looked like Snyder was PISSED at Bruce. And we know Snyder told Bruce he needed to deal with the coaching staff about playing decisions.

Again though, let's continue to make up reasons to knock Snyder. Perhaps it's theraputic or something.

[Oldskool]

Originally posted by Art

Again though, let's continue to make up reasons to knock Snyder. Perhaps it's theraputic or something.

its OK to knock Snyder... He doesnt have far to fall

Seriously, id love to see Spurrier crack heads next year. Id also love him to bring in some assistants with NFL experience.

[skinsblitz]

Yeah, it does make me feel somewhat better bashing little Danny-Boy. To think I actually defended this dope for the longest time. Well, I'm done defending the guy. Yes, he does spend money on he team. Where has it gotten us? This isn't an internet company, it's a professional football franchise. Get someone in the front office that actually has a clue.

[Art]

Originally posted by skinsblitz

Yeah, it does make me feel somewhat better bashing little Danny-Boy. To think I actually defended this dope for the longest time. Well, I'm done defending the guy. Yes, he does spend money on he team. Where has it gotten us? This isn't an internet company, it's a professional football franchise. Get someone in the front office that actually has a clue.

And, again, SB, what moves did Cerrato make that showed a lack of clue? He DIDN'T make some moves to improve us along the defensive line as many of us were screaming for in the offseason. Myself included. But, what moves did he make that seemed to be made without any idea as to precisely how it fit within this team's needs in the offseason?

Cerrato can't do a better job in an offseason than he did this past one. NO one had a stronger offseason. No one felt better about the direction of the team in the offseason than we did. Now we're done with a terrible year and we're pretending it's the fault of the guys who made us feel good in the offseason?

I'd like to have done a poll and have people account for themselves in August about how positive they felt about the personnel moves we made. Remember, Cerrato largely put together the roster BEFORE the NFL draft. He got guys in quick, signed and ready to not miss a practice. We had a couple of injuries and the Wilkinson release that necessitated some bail out moves of the sort we've had to make the last couple of offseasons. Some have worked out very well (Gardener, Hasselbeck, even Dalton). Others have failed miserably (Stai, Russell).

Though I'm not a Cerrato fan and despite the fact that I was among the LOUDEST in calling for defensive line help throughout the offseason, how come I can remember just how good an offseason we ACTUALLY did have despite that where so many now want to revise it in their minds and forget?

You judge things when they happen. We did the right things to help the team and show a plan toward the future this offseason. We felt good about it. We probably would be overjoyed to feel that good again.

[skinsblitz]

Look I'm not going to sit here and get into a big argument over Snyder with another 'Skins fan. I understand that some of us are still behind the guy and some of us, like me, are getting more and more frustrated with what he's doing to our beloved team. They knew after letting Gardener go that it made our D-Line considerably weaker. Then they get frugal all of the sudden and decide to cut Big Daddy. Now we have a big hole right in the center of the D-Line, but do they fix it? Nope, they go out and trade away draft picks and sign guys that are no better than 2nd or 3rd stringers on other teams. Great job guys!! They fix one problem and make another one, that's been the story of this front office and they just don't get it! One step forward, two steps back.

As far as the great Vinny Cerrato goes what did he do to ever deserve the job he got here? As far as I know he was partly responsible for putting the 'Niners into cap hell. Looks like he's continuing the same pattern over here. How many damn times does Lavar have to restructure his first contract? There is no wonder we can't keep a good core of players around. They continue to overpay everyone they get, and in turn have to get guys to restructure or get cut. Great money management guys!! I guarentee that Lavar will have to restructure this new deal in like 3 years or get cut. One step forward and two steps back....

[jbooma]

Originally posted by Art

Again though, let's continue to make up reasons to knock Snyder. Perhaps it's theraputic or something.

We will see how is revenue continues to grow by always putting out crap on the field. We will not be good until the Synder and Vinny show is over. We need a GM to come in if you don't see it then you are just blinded by the money Snyder is making from all of us.

Just look at the record under Snyder. A lot of potential GM's wouldn't want to come here until something is done with Vinny. I wonder why that is the case :doh:

[inmate running the asylum]

Originally posted by skinsblitz

They knew after letting Gardener go that it made our D-Line considerably weaker. Then they get frugal all of the sudden and decide to cut Big Daddy. Now we have a big hole right in the center of the D-Line, but do they fix it?

In all fairness, most of us hoped but knew the FO couldn't plug all the holes in just one season. Keeping Big Daddy wouldn't have saved the season and his play in Detroit confirms that. He was always one of the problems, not the solution, and it wasn't about frugality. The Skins offered him more money then he wound up signing for in Detroit, but they certainly weren't going to overpay him $4 mil again.

And where was the FO supposed to get DL help after the draft? No one is going to give you a starting quality DT or DE. Unfortunately, we had too many holes to fill and ran out of putty.

[mcgraw238]

If the players tune him out, one way to get their attention is to start cutting people. Maybe they will tune in.

[Hog Fever]

Originally posted by IAMBG

SOS needs to bring in Seargent Heartman from Full Metal Jacket.

Hartman : Are you quitting on me? Well, are you? Then quit, you slimy ****ing walrus-looking piece of ****! Get the **** off of my obstacle! Get the **** down off of my obstacle! Now! Move it! I'm going to rip your balls off, so you cannot contaminate the rest of the world! I will motivate you, Private Pyle, if it short-***** every cannibal on the Congo!

----------------------

Wonder if he would ask for a say in personnel?

[Frunobulax]

Originally posted by IAMBG

SOS needs to bring in Seargent Heartman from Full Metal Jacket.

R. Lee Ermey as coach?

I like it!

[The Sisko]

Art what you say regarding the last offseason is partially true. I fully agree that Coles, Thomas, (and to a somewhat lesser degree) Hall were great pickups and helped shore up areas of weakness. The jury is still out on Morton and Noble. However, the Canidate trade has been a bust and not even attempting to fix the DL with gum, spit and mud until the eve of the regular season is NOT a move any GM of any consequence makes on a regular basis. Same thing with the OL the year before.

We were all calling for DL help last offseason. I remember well you saying that it could very well be our undoing and in fact it was. Now tell me, the blame for that falls where ? I myself did say that Rome wasn't built in a day and that it was an area that would have to be addressed this offseason. However, a savvy GM would have been working to fix our weak DL FROM THE BEGINNING!! This situation didn't develop overnight and the fact that we last drafted a DL in the Jurassic period would seem to be something you've forgotten about.

As for the lack of discipline, now that we have quotes from a named source backed up by LaVar and others does anybody still believe this story is just more media bashing ? Sometimes, just sometimes, things reported are actually true and aren't in fact some grandiose plan on the part of certain reporters to find new and different ways to bash the Skins. Sometimes I swear Dale Gribble...'er Rusty Shackleford is posting on this board.

Oh well, if SOS does decide to come back for another season at least we'll probably be looking at another top 10 draft pick.:doh:

[Newera]

Couple of things about this year.

To an extent Art I agree with you. However, I do think where we have seen the biggest drop off this year has been from the play of our defense. They literally became pathetic. It was hard watching them play like pansies. Defense is so bravado.

After watching the Ravens and Steelers defense last night, I realized how far we have to go. For instance, the Ravens just have flat better players then we do on defense. They get after it. It was so evident. Likewise with the Steelers. Sure Lewis has a lot to do with that. But Ozzie Newsome knows how to bring in cheap talent. He's a very good gm. Maybe we need to bring in Ernest Byner his co-hort now.

That teams just does a better job of evaluating talent then we do. Then it is backed up with better coaching. Both are funamental issues that come from the top.

The Ravens were getting pressure on the quarterback with a bunch of guys I've never heard of. With a coach named Nolan. Sound familiar. He seems to be working out up there.

Whereas we go spend a lot of money on past name players (Wyne, Upshaw, Russell, Dalton, Zellner) and give up draft picks for average players (Chase). And the defense is still bad. That catches up to you after awhile. I mean what have Wynne and Upshaw done since they've been here. I mean what does Wynne have one or two sacks over sixteen games.

The Ravens have lapped us twice since Danny has owned the Redskins. In that time, they've won a Super Bowl and have rebuilt themselves again within a four year period. By far the Ravens are not a great team, but they are a more sound organization. They drafted Priest Holmes. They let him go and still drafted Jamel Lewis. That's pretty good.

Perhaps Danny and Vinny will get it right. It's a learning curve. I do think if Vinny was really any good we would be better or further along in this department then we are, but I think he and Danny only average thus far.

Spurrier does have to take some blame. Vinny wanted Doss and Spurrier Jacobs and we see where that decision got us. Certainly Taylor may turn out to be okay, but that was purely an emotional decision to draft him.

For instance, because Spurrier was upset over the decision to keep Sutan over Watson, Sutan literrally got no playing time this season. And, I think the guy can play. Obviously there is a rift between Spurrier and management that has to be worked out. This is a road we've been down before.

We as fans are suffering in the process. What's so ironic is that Danny will be patient with his blunders, but is impatient when it is done by others. The benefits of owning the team, I guess.

It's in Snyders best interest for Spurrier to work. Because no other top notch coach will take this job. However, Spurrier was a Danny hire. Marvin Lewis was a Danny hire knowing he may only be good for one year. There's Dion (wasted money where still paying for). Bruce Smith (not bad just a prima donna). Still paying a part of Marty's salary.

These just aren't sound business decisions. Since Danny has owned this team we have made great news in the offseason but have produced nothing on the field to show for it. We have the second highest payroll in the NFL. Thank God we make the most money off the field, but that has nothing to do with putting together a football team.

Danny should leave the football operations to people that know what they're doing and he should concentrate on what he knows best -- marketing. Then imagine! Geat football organization with the best marketing in the league.

Our problem is we have an owner that is a wannabe gm. Plus, football is how how he makes his living. For Cooke, the Redskins were simply a toy.

Some of our moves were based on common sense . . .

Obviously in a desire to keep continuity, we hired George Edwards. Now we know he was in over his head. Of course, we were all happy with that decision three months ago.

It's was imperative we keep the same defensive system for at least two years in a row because that is what this team needed. Well, we see where that has gotten us.

Perhaps the mistake was that Marvin should have been the head coach and Spurrier the offensive co-ordinator.

Evidently continuity is also overrated when you don't have great coaching and motivation -- and we don't. A good gm would have surounded Spurrier with the right coaches to help him in his learning curve. I understand why we blew it with Edwards. We decided to give him a chance and he failed. Thus the fifth new defensive co-ordinator in five years.

Sure, we will eventually get it right. Even a clock is right twice a day. However, when you bring in the right person or person's the change can be almost immediate. Look what the Fridge has been able to do with Maryland football. Parcells. The basketball coach at Georgia Tech. You know when you get the right person. Marty would have have righted the ship. But Danny wasn't happy. That's water under the bridge now.

The fundamental problem with this team starts at the top. We have a meddlesome owner with a side kick. Neither really have any football pedigree. Vinny has had modest success. By no means is he high on anyone list.

Otherwise, he would have been scopped up by another team when Marty fired him. Instead his buddy Kiper got him a job at ESPN. We have no one that is proven running the show. Not the owner, the assistent gm, or the coaches -- and the players know this.

Listen, when the coaches can't figure out what a team is doing to you, you can't expect the players to figure it out. That's the job of the coaches. The Cowboys said we did nothing different in the second game that we did in the first. That's why they were so successful jumping plays.

Gibbs would run the same plays from different formations just to throw off the defense. We now realize how good of coaches Gibbs, Pettibone, Bellechik and Parcells really were and are in the hey day of the Redskin/Giant rivalarly.

Wow! When will it return!

NewEra

[Tarhog]

I totally agree with Art here. Spurrier should've ignored the critics, and stuck to whats worked for him in the past. Canidate is exactly the kind of back that COULD thrive in a wide-open, stretch the field pass-oriented attack. The problem primarily has been that our Offensive Line play early in the season was SO POOR that Ramsey had no time to effectively stretch the field. Our lack of a deep passing threat, something that should have been a huge strength this year, really hurt us. What we lack in terms of RBs is a straight ahead pounder. I like Rock, don't get me wrong. But I'm not convinced he's going to be a dependable 3rd down back in the long-term.

And I think its pretty hilarious when you've got veteran players accusing SPURRIER of running a loose ship!!!!

Well, wtf have YOU been doing about your peer's lack of discipline Mr. Jansen, Mr. Arrington??? Give me a ****ing break! Spurrier might not be a disciplinarian, but if the supposed 'leaders' on this team can't corral their distracted and unmotivated teammates and enforce some team discipline, theres no way in hell Spurrier can do it. What a bunch of self-serving crap!

[Hog Fever]

Originally posted by Tarhog

Well, wtf have YOU been doing about your peer's lack of discipline Mr. Jansen, Mr. Arrington??? Give me a ****ing break! Spurrier might not be a disciplinarian, but if the supposed 'leaders' on this team can't corral their distracted and unmotivated teammates and enforce some team discipline, theres no way in hell Spurrier can do it. What a bunch of self-serving crap!

Great point.

[Bang]

By my count this is the fourth time this season Spurrier has vowed to get back to what he did in the past. This is also like the fifth time he's made promises that changes were going to be made.

He waffles too much.

Bashing Snyder is easy, but the guy can only give the team what the team asks for. The team asked for speed and offensive linemen, and he went out and got it.

If you look at the needs of the team, they clearly were too numerous to fix in one offseason. Ceratto, I thought, did a fine job of targetting players to help the cause. I can't find fault with any of the decisions, really.

I believed then, and still believe that Chad Morton was a misdirection ploy that we were forced to eat, but so be it.

Personally, I think the front office has stayed out of the coach's way, allowed him to surround himself with assistants he THOUGHT would do well, and gave him the leeway he needed to coach the team.

Spurrier's just not done a very good job of it, whether it's his assistants being outclassed or not, it's ultimately him who must bear the brunt of this season.

~Bang

~Bang

[Art]

Originally posted by jbooma

We will see how is revenue continues to grow by always putting out crap on the field. We will not be good until the Synder and Vinny show is over. We need a GM to come in if you don't see it then you are just blinded by the money Snyder is making from all of us.

Just look at the record under Snyder. A lot of potential GM's wouldn't want to come here until something is done with Vinny. I wonder why that is the case :doh:

JB,

As I see none of the money Snyder makes, it's probably unlikely I'm blinded by the sight of it, don't you think. In an effort to come up with something clever, attempt in the future not to produce something that enjoys mild retardation please.

Of course a lot of potential GMs wouldn't want to come here with Vinny here. Vinny is essentially the GM so there's no job available here for them. And, the point remains, Vinny has done HIS job well. Not only by identifying players we needed and executing the plan, but by having the trust and faith of the owner which in sports is more important than just about anything else.

There's little friction here because there's a belief in Cerrato from our owner and there's probably an awareness from him that he's the one aspect of the team's functioning that is doing things professionally and well. Our record under Snyder has not been good including 1999 and it's been bad excluding that. The prime reason for that has been the constant state of change this team has undergone each year. We're now in the third year of this coaching regime and have the potential to enjoy relative stability in this league for having built up the team over the last two years. We have areas to upgrade and we have to hope we do.

There's nothing Cerrato failed to do that would lead you to believe he doesn't know this. Again, some folks thought we could fix every area of concern overnight. In the last two offseasons we've gone about fixing many of them. We have a few more. My guess is they know this to be so.

[Art]

Yusuf,

I think it's impossible for a fourth round pick in a trade to be a bust. But, even if it is possible, the bust would have to be because Canidate simply didn't perform at all on the field and we know he did run pretty well when healthy. Injuries allow a softer scale of judgement I think. Maybe you disagree.

You remember well what I wanted to see us do last offseason, though that was in the draft more than free agency. I wanted us to draft seven defensive lineman and hope two stuck. Now, to say we didn't attempt to fix the defensive line at all until the eve of the season is a bit false. We did sign Noble and Upshaw early. Noble got hurt and Upshaw was slow to recover. This is NOT to say either was the answer, but both were starting level players who play hard and could have helped us and were signed the opening weekend of free agency. Haley was added pretty early and looked to be a nice backup.

We also made a run at a couple of guys late who might have worked out pretty well here, like Gilbert Brown to some degree, and we tried to pry guys like Traylor or Washington and maybe even Jackson away to give a beefy presense up front. The line was hardly our undoing, though, despite just how weak it was.

But, pretending that it was, the point for those -- including myself -- who wanted defensive line help last offseason is WHO. Of ALL the comments screaming for more help now, NONE have come up with any names whatsoever. Well, except me, and I'm actually one who's ultimately happy with how productive the offseason was.

We tried to bring Gardener back at a deal that didn't hamstring the team. A big deal, but not the one he ultimately signed with Denver that essentially gives him $20 million guaranteed over the first three years. That's CRAZY money for a guy with his history. As good as Gardener was for us, it was actually a smart decision, if not a good football move, not to cave to his demands.

We offered Wilkinson more to stay with us than he got from Detroit, but he wanted to make a point after the team made its point by cutting him. As it turns out his loss wasn't that big an impact for us and was actually smart as a demonstration that when we try to force the hand of a player we're serious about it.

A saavy GM, you say, would have been working to fix the defensive line from the beginning. So, who. Obviously you know who we should have gotten. You can easily outline the plan of attack we needed to have taken and you can demonstrate which players we could have had and which we wouldn't have now.

Remember, I was generally against the Coles move, though I understood the merits of it, because I wanted a defensive lineman in the draft at ALL costs. You want to show how incompetent Cerrato was, then do your due diligence and demonstrate it by pointing out names we missed out on and showing who we shouldn't have signed.

As for a lack of discipline on this team where we have quotes from players and backup support from other players, you ask whether we believe the story or whether it's just more media bashing. With hope, by now, you understand the difference between a news story and the typical sort of bashing the media gives this team.

But, since you seem confused, a news story has named quotes and support. Media bashing quotes the janitor in an unnamed fashion with no support whatsoever. You know a true story right away. It's right before your eyes. You can't miss it. Just like you can't miss the creations either.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I agree with an earlier post that we have to keep some of these holes on our team in perspective.

We KNEW before the preseason ended that we had no Defensive Line. We made moves to shore up our offensive firepower and we heard that we would spend this coming off-season improving our defense.

As for our offense becoming less consistent, it's most likely due to starting a young QB all 16 games, having no running game to lean on, and becoming a very easy team to blitz.

I think that if we stick to our plan and improve our D this off-season, we should be ok.

Other than TE and possibly a RB, I don't see any personnel issues that remain on offense. We have a promising QB, good WRs, and good OL.

[Phat Hog]

“old style”? has he been doing her the past 2 years… are we witnessing the “new style” Spurrier? Oh, let me see, we brought you in so you could be the “new” Steve Spurrier… forget about all the successful programs you have built at the college level. There’s no time for that now, this is the NEW NFLized Spurrier.

Maybe we should change your name from OBC to NBC…

Idiot ! :stfu: !

[bulldog]

But one look at a Redskins practice during the season was enough to tell there wasn't a strict regimen. Even during stretching, some players would stand, talk or joke while others worked their muscles.

__________________________________________________

all of the apologists, please read the above comments and then tell me why Spurrier is the man to lead this team to a trip to a donut shop for a Krispy Kreme :laugh: :laugh: