Renegade7 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Momma There Goes That Man said: It can’t be his real daughter, she hasn’t aged and it’s clearly set in the future. She is a host running his fidelity test in the same way Delores ran Bernard’s when he was first created. I see, so your saying for stable version of a hybrid they have be started at an extremely important point in theit lives? Are all the memories after that point erased then after the fidelity test passed re-add? How far in the future you think that end of credits scene was? It only make sense if it's not too far, him coming back from the dead if gone for a long period won't fit the slow replacement process this is going into action. It might not be as far as we think, like if your right William isn't a host yet, then while he's still alive and in control of the company. I can't think of a reason to bring him back jus so the hybrid version of his daughter could say "I told you so". I wonder if they got the memory of him "killing her", because really really why would she of all people be involved in bringing him back if not needed? Quote As for the arm, he was going crazy. The arm checking thing was just a red herring becaus they played with the idea of him being a host all season, knowing it would be a big theory. It’s also just an indicator that he was losing grip of his realities. It was only around a year from the time his wife committed suicide to the beginning of season 1 anyway so it’s logical that event and going back into WW, killing Maeve and her daughter kinda set him on the course of season 1-2 as he continues spiraling further out of control, peaking in that moment after killing Emily and checking his arm while Delores finds him. That all makes sense on face value, people don't dig in their arms like that and take multiple gunshot wounds and keep it moving except video games. It looks like there may be a mutiple timeline in season 3 in regards to Williams character. It's clear the hosts side knows how to make a hybrid based on the son saying he was tasked to show Delores. I want to believe humans finally knew too at that point. I guess it depends on how bad I want to believe I got this figured out, knowing hosts would start replacing people made Hale less suprising. So is it Delores concuscness with Hale''s memories? I mean, if she's going to impersonate her she has to know what she knows, right? William went through how many trials with Delos? Gotta believe the hosts or somebody threw one out their before that control function showing as Delos son was so sure it would work. Edit: Westworld doesn't reopen in sequel, maybe they don't in this show and rebuilt characters try to put together what happened and find each other without tipping off they know too much. Safety features like hosts looking for odd behavior to report, hosts trouble trusting hosts, humans trouble trusting humans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Renegade7 said: I see, so your saying for stable version of a hybrid they have be started at an extremely important point in theit lives? Are all the memories after that point erased then after the fidelity test passed re-add? No that’s not what I meant if that’s how it came across. I just meant that Logan mentioned that particular moment for Delos as being extremely important to who he is as a human, his algorithm I think he called it. No matter what they tweaked when trying to get him just right, they always had to end up at that one point where he has the same conversation with Logan. A host Delos would still remember his entire life and all of his actions, but that seminal moment is crucial for ensuring that the host is where they need to be. That’s the way I understood it and I would imagine killing his daughter and some of the events of the past year would be of similar significance to William’s host. 1 hour ago, Renegade7 said: How far in the future you think that end of credits scene was? It only make sense if it's not too far, him coming back from the dead if gone for a long period won't fit the slow replacement process this is going into action. It might not be as far as we think, like if your right William isn't a host yet, then while he's still alive and in control of the company. I can't think of a reason to bring him back jus so the hybrid version of his daughter could say "I told you so". I wonder if they got the memory of him "killing her", because really really why would she of all people be involved in bringing him back if not needed? I suggested 75 just because I thought it was a long time based on the state of the forge. I just saw that Lisa Joy, the coproducer with Jonathan Nolan said tonight that Spoiler It was far far in the future Which makes sense for me. I don’t think it has anything to do with his daughter saying “I told you so” or anything else. I think whatever ****ed up state the future is in, has caused them to need to go and bring William back. I think they might need his help and he can have a protagonist role in upcoming seasons as he plays out the future timeline. I could see hosts messing things up and needing to correct their own mistakes somehow and bringing William back to help them. Or, humanity brings him back as a last ditch attempt to save mankind. Maybe they think he has the knowledge or a secret that can stop the hosts. They could go a lot of interesting ways with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Renegade7 said: That all makes sense on face value, people don't dig in their arms like that and take multiple gunshot wounds and keep it moving except video games. It looks like there may be a mutiple timeline in season 3 in regards to Williams character. Well, ghost nation kept him alive initially and then Emily had a big red med-kit when she took him to the relay point. She could have easily had one of those laser things that heals wounds and patches him up while he was knocked out. He did it himself episode one this season after being shot at the gala. Him surviving gunshots doesnt indicate he’s a host. All the hosts basically die from gunshots like normal except for Maeve and Dolores because they turned their pain thresholds down. That was my understanding anyway 1 hour ago, Renegade7 said: So is it Delores concuscness with Hale''s memories? I mean, if she's going to impersonate her she has to know what she knows, right? I think she just made a Hale host with one of the pearls she took. She knows Hale is an important person within the company and having a pawn on the inside would be pretty valuable to Dolores. I don’t see what else it could be. Only way she could merge consciousness would be like Bernard and Ford but I didn’t see a cradle or forge at Arnold’s to allow that. I guess that’s part of the mystery. I was pretty confident at some point somebody’s brain was going to be swapped into another hosts body once that tech opened open the ghost nation guy earlier in the season and just pulled it out. Feels like Bernard and Dolores could be set to have a megneto/x type of battle in the real world. Then maybe that’s the fallout that host William is dealing with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Where did Felix and Sylvester go between the time of the doorway scene and the end? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Some info in here: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thewrap.com/westworld-season-2-finale-questions-dolores-bernard-hale-lisa-joy/amp/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 36 minutes ago, visionary said: Where did Felix and Sylvester go between the time of the doorway scene and the end? It showed them creeping up on the cliff side. Once the door disappeared and all the hosts had been killed, they probably came down to the security teams and that’s how they ended up on the beach with extraction at the end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 7 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said: It showed them creeping up on the cliff side. Once the door disappeared and all the hosts had been killed, they probably came down to the security teams and that’s how they ended up on the beach with extraction at the end I guess. But it’s weird that they had been missing from the current timeline all season unlike Stubbs, Bernard, Hale, and others. Both them and MIB show up days? later in the timeline for the first time in that scene near the end of the season. Actually I’m not sure how much time passed between Halores leaving the furnace after killing Bernard and that scene either, so maybe even longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 @Momma There Goes That Man. The kit accounts for the outside wound but not internal organ bleeding and damage. Either way, the link @visionary posted from the co-creator says your right that he wasn't a host in 1-2, and that's a host, mot his daughter in post-credits scene. I got that malcom x / mlk vibe as well, article says she did that so that hosts had a choice to side with her or him instead of making that choice for them (they wouldn't be free even if she won if she didn't give her kind the choice). I can see her using everything she can to steer those to her cause by challenging her kind with the fact the humans are scared of them, inferior, and will wipe them all out if they think they can't co-exist. There are several means for a robot takeover, and even if this isn't the most plausible, it's put the most effort I've seen into what that conversation would look like from both sides of it if it was an android replacing humans type apocolypse. It's a similar fear to Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep, them blending until the numbers weren't what they thought. Not being able to tell if someone is a host or not easily is a setup for more suprises and bad news (I think humans lose, sort of like invasion of the body snatchers) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Now it's time to go back and rewatch the entire season. I also was confused "who" was in the Hale-Bot. At first I thought it was just Delores. But then you have the stuff at the end where they are both together outside of the park where Bernard wakes up.....again. With Bernard scattering his memories, that threw the "when" of this season for a loop. Need to watch again knowing this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 I just watched the post credit scene and...yeah I'm more confused now than ever. I did like the finale but overall found this season to be boring. Might just give up on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 I watched this season on a binge until the last two episodes. I like watching that way. One or two episodes a night until I’m done. I liked this season, but I do feel that it built up to something that will be difficult to move on from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinInsite Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 I wonder where Delores beamed all the host to in the real world, somebody is going get a big surprise on their AWS bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Is it possible that the “home” that Bernard took Delores too early in the season is actually a flash forward and the home that new Delores woke Bernard up in is actually a flash back in time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Hale would have been very young if she was even alive when Westworld was created. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 57 minutes ago, Springfield said: Is it possible that the “home” that Bernard took Delores too early in the season is actually a flash forward and the home that new Delores woke Bernard up in is actually a flash back in time? I guess it could be but it’s pretty evident that the Dolores/Bernard scene was the night of the Delos investment pitch with Angela to Logan. It wasnt finished when Bernard showed her early in the season and it’s finished and aged by the time we get to the end of season 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Season 1 for me struck a better balance of action/mystery/intrigue. Season 2 seemed to have the mystery on overdrive where every episode felt more about clouding things up than progressing the story. It felt like it took way too long to get where the finale took us. I'm still interested in what the show has in store, but I hope Season 3 reels things back in some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 I've been binge watching season 2 this week finishing up with the finale last night...Can somebody tell me what the hell was the point of the foray into Samurai land, or whatever that was? Seemed like gratuitous filler. I sort of get how the Indian bit eventually integrated into the final plot, but that one episode was dull. And was it Dolores in Hale's body that murdered the nice chick helping Bernard (forgot her name)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 12 minutes ago, Riggo-toni said: And was it Dolores in Hale's body that murdered the nice chick helping Bernard (forgot her name)? No that was Hale. Bernard sees that and it’s part of what makes him realize he made a mistake in confrontation with Dolores. Afterward,Hale and some goons take Elsie’s body down to the basement where the Dolores Hale kills her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 19 minutes ago, Riggo-toni said: Can somebody tell me what the hell was the point of the foray into Samurai land, or whatever that was? Seemed like gratuitous filler. I sort of get how the Indian bit eventually integrated into the final plot, but that one episode was dull. It was a fan treat that was hinted at in the season 1 finale. Also, I mean they just got lost looking for her daughter and used it as a chance to do some world building by showing us another park and a new cast of characters. The different language aspect of those hosts there was also key to Maeve discovering her override/admin ability. And I thought it was a really well done and emotional episode that also was pretty awesome. Having said that, I do feel like this season could have been cut down to 8 episodes. Also, while I love the mystery, this season it wasn’t as fun. Maybe it’s just never as fun as the first time around. I do like that they actually answer questions and give meaning to their plot unlike Lost which was unsatisfying to me. The creators did say that they would tone down the “mystery box” stuff in season 3. I could still see multiple timelines but just in a story telling perspective not with the intent to trick the viewer. Just one timeline showing Dolores continuing after season 2 and a future timeline showing host MIB. There can still be a lot of nice payoff even without the mystery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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